Salvation in the Last Days: Working Your Way to Heaven?

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Behold

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Even if Paul were the greatest Christian who ever lived, I follow Jesus.

All Christians try to follow Jesus.
But the NT tells you that Paul is your example.......and to follow it.., Him.
This is not a request.
But you do what you like, as that is your mind.
 

Behold

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Jesus is my Lord, not Paul.

Paul is not anyone's Lord.
But He is our NT teacher and example, and when He told YOU to be a follower, he was not speaking about being a worshiper.

"follow me, as i follow Christ".
There is a reason we are to do this, and its VITAL.....regarding lifestyle, doctrine, and example.... but i see that the bible is not your final authority, so, i'll leave you to your opinions regarding what Paul teaches.
 

Bob Estey

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Paul is not anyone's Lord.
But He is our NT teacher and example, and when He told YOU to be a follower, he was not speaking about being a worshiper.

"follow me, as i follow Christ".
There is a reason we are to do this, and its VITAL.....regarding lifestyle, doctrine, and example.... but i see that the bible is not your final authority, so, i'll leave you to your opinions regarding what Paul teaches.
No, Paul wasn't meant to be anybody's Lord.
 
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Gospel Believer

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Jesus is my Lord, not Paul.
Duh......

Nevertheless......do you want to obey the Bible or not”

Paul said , “ Follow *ME* as I Follow Christ”.....
Who do you think told Paul to say that ?

Paul said that we are to be “ imitators of HIM”......Jesus was God .....how are we going to imitate “ Him?” .....when ordered to pay your taxes , are you going to get a fish and get a gold coin out of his mouth ? If you get attacked by a mob, threatened with being thrown off a cliff, do you have the ability to just vanish? Your response sounds real “ Holy”—— it ain’t realistic and it ain’t Biblical
“ Be ye Followers Of ME! “ —— that’s in the Bible and it’s Paul speaking .....speaking under the influence and inspiration of the Holy Spirit....
 

Bob Estey

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Duh......

Nevertheless......do you want to obey the Bible or not”

Paul said , “ Follow *ME* as I Follow Christ”.....
Who do you think told Paul to say that ?

Paul said that we are to be “ imitators of HIM”......Jesus was God .....how are we going to imitate “ Him?” .....when ordered to pay your taxes , are you going to get a fish and get a gold coin out of his mouth ? If you get attacked by a mob, threatened with being thrown off a cliff, do you have the ability to just vanish? Your response sounds real “ Holy”—— it ain’t realistic and it ain’t Biblical
“ Be ye Followers Of ME! “ —— that’s in the Bible and it’s Paul speaking .....speaking under the influence and inspiration of the Holy Spirit....
God is not a book.
 
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Enoch111

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People treat the Bible as if it were God. But it is not.
When you read the Bible the words in the Book are the words of God. So God speaks to you through His Holy Word. Paul is an outstanding example for Christians. but Christ is our supreme example, so just follow Christ. He too will speak through His Word.
 

Bob Estey

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When you read the Bible the words in the Book are the words of God. So God speaks to you through His Holy Word. Paul is an outstanding example for Christians. but Christ is our supreme example, so just follow Christ. He too will speak through His Word.
Back to the obvious: God is not a book.
 

robert derrick

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And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge; And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness; And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.

For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.

Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall: For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Faith without works is dead, and without doing these things added to faith, nothing is sure about being saved at the end.

Grace is for help in time of temptation, not to sin. Grace is not help in time of sinning, not to be judged.
 

Behold

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So there are many different kinds of works and there is no Bible verse that eliminates all works of all kinds...

Salvation is based on the Cross, alone.

John 14:6

Discipleship is based on works, alone.

You can't be born again by doing works, so, that ends the stupid argument.
Works are not required for Salvation.
Works are what the born again produce because they are saved and have God's Righteousness, already.

A deceived person, believes that their works are required by God so that He will accept them.
This is the "error of CAIN".
A Saved person, who has real faith, understands that only JESUS SAVES and keeps you saved.

A heretic does not understand or comprehend this vital difference, between discipleship and salvation.... so, they will teach them as one.
They are not.

God provides Salvation ON THE Cross..... 2000 yrs ago.
You have it, or you dont.
Jesus is in you, or He's not.
You are born again, or you are hell bound.
Period.!


The person provides works.., and you can provide them being unsaved or saved and they are meaningless regarding salvation in BOTH Cases.
 
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DJT_47

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The process is the process; it doesn't change. It requires belief and faith, confession of your belief, repentance, and water baptism for the forgiveness of your sins. That's the process.
 

robert derrick

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The process is the process; it doesn't change. It requires belief and faith, confession of your belief, repentance, and water baptism for the forgiveness of your sins. That's the process.
I agree.

There is a process we must do to be saved and justified with Christ: As with all sinners, If we sin, we must come to Jesus and confess to be forgiven of sinning, and be washed clean.

And there is also the process to insure we do not sin: To add these things of virtue, knowledge, temperance, charity, etc.. to our faith, that if we do them, we shall never fall. (2 Peter 1)

Romans 7 is for the double hearted, that continue in the process of sinning and confessing, which can be for 70x7, while Romans 8 is them who go on to make their calling and election sure, by repenting of sinning once for all.

So long as we are in Romans 7, it is not sure that we will be found of Him clothed in white at His appearing.

We can still be found in the white of forgiveness, so long as we are not sinning in works of the flesh at the end, but it's just not sure.

That 70x7 is not guaranteed to be 700x7, since God is not mocked, and if He does not draw us to Himself to confess, then we cannot come to Him at all to be forgiven.

And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.

Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;

Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright.

For ye know how that afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears.