Satan the Arch-deceiver

[Questor]

Terry, Raeneske, please stop arguing…you are both correct.


15 I Daniel was grieved in my spirit in the midst of my body, and the visions of my head troubled me.
16 I came near unto one of them that stood by, and asked him the truth of all this. So he told me, and made me know the interpretation of the things.
17 These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth.
18 But the saints of the most High shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, even for ever and ever.
19 Then I would know the truth of the fourth beast, which was diverse from all the others, exceeding dreadful, whose teeth were of iron, and his nails of brass; which devoured, brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with his feet;
20 And of the ten horns that were in his head, and of the other which came up, and before whom three fell; even of that horn that had eyes, and a mouth that spake very great things, whose look was more stout than his fellows.
21 I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them;
22 Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.
23 Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces.
24 And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

Dan 7:15-24 (KJV)



Kings = Beasts = Kingdoms

Kings have a tendency to equate themselves with the Kingdom under their power, and one must recall that when Daniel and John were writing their prophecies, they were describing how the Kings themselves referred to their kingdoms as equivalent with their person.

In addition, when kingdoms were described by the word ‘Beast’, they were often referring to the Kingdom's heraldry on their banners, particularly by those that did not respect that Kingdom, or King.



Q

 

[tgwprophet]

Questor, in case you have not understood our differences... Rae believes the beast that was and is not and yet is.. are actually 3 or 2 different kingdoms different leaders. I contend they are one. We cannot both be right.

League of Nations Beast the was
League of Nations Beast that is not Rae's idea (and some others)
United Nations Beast that yet is

8th beast
beast that was the big or little horn - the Beast that received the wound
beast that is not... Beast that received the wound taken out of his body as Satan takes it So... Beast w/o a body
beast that yet is .... Image of the beast that had the wound given life of this beast that was.

In my contention... This leaves Satan in the physical body of the Beast that received the mortal wound. And his name counts to 666 of course. Moreover this gives a valid reason the Image of the beast is built and where the life comes from that Satan gives this Image.

 

[Raeneske]

Terry, Raeneske, please stop arguing…you are both correct.


15 I Daniel was grieved in my spirit in the midst of my body, and the visions of my head troubled me.
16 I came near unto one of them that stood by, and asked him the truth of all this. So he told me, and made me know the interpretation of the things.
17 These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth.
18 But the saints of the most High shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, even for ever and ever.
19 Then I would know the truth of the fourth beast, which was diverse from all the others, exceeding dreadful, whose teeth were of iron, and his nails of brass; which devoured, brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with his feet;
20 And of the ten horns that were in his head, and of the other which came up, and before whom three fell; even of that horn that had eyes, and a mouth that spake very great things, whose look was more stout than his fellows.
21 I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them;
22 Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.
23 Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces.
24 And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

Dan 7:15-24 (KJV)



Kings = Beasts = Kingdoms

Kings have a tendency to equate themselves with the Kingdom under their power, and one must recall that when Daniel and John were writing their prophecies, they were describing how the Kings themselves referred to their kingdoms as equivalent with their person.

In addition, when kingdoms were described by the word ‘Beast’, they were often referring to the Kingdom's heraldry on their banners, particularly by those that did not respect that Kingdom, or King.



Q

In a sense I agree, but I will not agree that Beast = King specifically. I understand that a King has much to do with a Kingdom, being a leader. I understand that you can talk about the leaders in a Kingdom using the term beast. The leaders actions effect the beast (kingdom), hence why you can say that 4 kings arose. They are four kingdoms, with kings who had the power to arise above all other nations in the world. But the specific definition of those leaders, which would be a horn, as defined in Daniel 7:24. A beast is a Kingdom. Yes, there are Kings that arise with the Kingdoms, but that's not saying "Beast = Man". It still means Kingdom, it's just that it refers to a nation exalting itself, it can be the nation, it can be the nation and the king, etc.

Questor, in case you have not understood our differences... Rae believes the beast that was and is not and yet is.. are actually 3 or 2 different kingdoms different leaders. I contend they are one. We cannot both be right.

League of Nations Beast the was
League of Nations Beast that is not Rae's idea (and some others)
United Nations Beast that yet is

8th beast
beast that was the big or little horn - the Beast that received the wound
beast that is not... Beast that received the wound taken out of his body as Satan takes it So... Beast w/o a body
beast that yet is .... Image of the beast that had the wound given life of this beast that was.

In my contention... This leaves Satan in the physical body of the Beast that received the mortal wound. And his name counts to 666 of course. Moreover this gives a valid reason the Image of the beast is built and where the life comes from that Satan gives this Image.

Actually, the beast that was, is not, yet is, is one single beast entity. However, this single beast entity changed over a period of time, hence the reason, that beast changes. So it can appear as three different entities, but it's one single power. Papacy & State, Then just Secular, then Papacy and State again, which then becomes a head of the world with other kings. And that's why that beast is of the 8th.

 

[tgwprophet]

Ok Q... npw that you dove in head first...good luck with that.... my conviction remains firm.

666=Breast=Satan the closest individual he shares power with is the Beast who gives his body to Satan after this Beast receives a mortal wound and is healed. Not a semi-kinda-mortal wound, but rather a real mortal wound.

Hey Rae, maybe Colonel George Arnstrong Custer was the Beast who is the big and small horn? He did lose his life at the battle of little big horn righ - though he won that battlet? lol... just some humor.

 

[tgwprophet]

Perhaps i can give a visual to help the understanding....

..............................................
t..........................................
h k ...............................
e i B ..................................
n e Image k ..............
P g a of i Satan
e d s Beast n ................
o of the kingdom o t .................................g
p m.................................
l ........................................
e............................................

The Blue is where Rae stops and the red is where I stop.

Furthermore, I tend to believe this king will be a king without a "kingdom" and here is how....
A King in his Kingdom can say...( this land or that land - of course within his kingdom )... " I can do anything I want with it. " And the kings military will assist the king. However, A "king" - leader... say as the leader of the United Nations or the NWO... though they may be called a king... actually has no land they can say the same as a king with a kingdom. Is it not true that if the Leader of the NWO decided it wanted to completely uproot the land of North America called USA and completly re-structure it for the needs of the NWO and without consequence of the Government of the USA andits people... the the USA government would leave the NWO, denying any futher membership and stopping the NWO from the chance it desired. So the leader (King) of the NWO is a king without a kingdom.

Of course this "king" without a kingdom will certainly desire the authority and power to be able to say about this land or that land... " I can do with this or that land as I see fit. " And have that be truthful. However, achieving that as truth is a most difficult task. Also, I should venture to say... when I stated a King without a Kingdom.. that - at least for now... speculation.

 

[Mercy777]

Terry, see this:

Revelation 13:18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

Does this say, the Beast is a man? No, it does not. The number of the beast (kingdom) is the number of a man. That man is part of that beast (kingdom). That man's number is 666, the man is not the beast. That man is part of the beast, but that man is not the beast.

I understand it is the same beast, but you are making beast = man. This is an error. Beast = kingdom. So, when the Beast receives the mortal wound by the sword, the beast is taken out of commission by the military.

When that Kingdom receives a miracle healing, that Kingdom comes back to power. That is what is meant by such statements in Revelation.

Pardon? I'm a little confused by what you're saying regarding Rome, because that does not imply that at all.

The heads are mountains, according to Revelation 17:9. So, those are 7 mountains, which the beast (Kingdom, not a person) sits upon. Secondly, a horn is a king, which is also mentioned by Daniel.

Daniel 7:24 And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

A horn is a king. I know that Daniel 7:23 refers to the 4th Beast. But what is a Beast defined as? A kingdom! So, then this applies where there are beasts, as they are kingdoms. Kings are horns, according to Daniel 7:24.

Terry, the reason God attributes such words in His prophecies, is so that they are cloaked prophecies. They are protected so the wicked cannot understand, but a revelation to those who do understand. Your understanding on the Mortal Wound has brought you to suggest a beast is a man. This understanding is an error. You have suggested, because you do not understand what the mortal wound is. But I have proven from scripture, a beast is a kingdom. To assert it to mean something else, after having seen, is to place your belief over that which scripture gives. In such cases, you cannot be right. I would like you to please view this understanding again. The mortal wound, is the description given for the Kingdom that was taken out of commission, much like such a wound would take a human out of commission. This happened to that kingdom. Then, that Kingdom was again miraculously healed, by being reinstated back to their power, and thus the healing of the wound has begun. When it is fully healed, it will rule the world, with othwr kingdoms.

How have I attempted to send someone to hell for not believing what I have? -- Accusation.

My beliefs are to the best of my understanding as scripture has it Terry. You say one thing, scripture says another. I'm not the one running on opinions.

I apologize if I am telling you what you "feel". But I do not apologize for telling you to look at scripture, and reread it. Scripture says Kingdom, you say man. I will not sugarcoat it. You are in error if you continue to assert such a belief.

I understand you are adamant about your beliefs, many are. But even being adamant, why do we not admit when we are wrong? For example, my opinion on Hebrews 4 appears very wrong, I stopped preaching it, til I can understand it better. This is what we must do. For as long as you assert a beast is a man, that's how long I will assert you are in error. Prophecy and understanding do not come by the will of man, but by God.

Some Bibles state differently;

Revelation 13:18
This calls for wisdom. If anyone has insight, let him calculate the number of the beast, for it is man’s number. His number is 666.


Revelation 13:18
Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man;

Greek;

here the Wisdom is The one-having The Mind
Let-Pebble The NUMBER OF-THE WILD-BEAST for OF-human it-IS
(let-him-calculate!)

God Bless,
Mercy

 

[tgwprophet]

Raeneske...

You wrote: " How have I attempted to send someone to hell for not believing what I have? -- Accusation. "

There was a passage ending in " calling God a liar " I looked as I was certain you posted that, but I found I was mistaken, and for that I appologize.

You wrote " My beliefs are to the best of my understanding as scripture has it Terry. You say one thing, scripture says another. I'm not the one running on opinions. "

That is an error on your part... for I do not deviate from scripture, but rather... your opinion of scripture Though we have two different understandings of this aspect of scripture - both are OUR opinions. when you attempt to disclude the ability of you being in error here - you then claim you will know who that beast is better than I will... and that is just not possible,

That Beast will be known by the evil ones working with him, next the Two Witnesses will know that Beast... then everyone else at best. I teach these Two Witnesses and I will know immediately when they know... that is just a fact. If anyone ever comes up with a proper test for the Two Witnesses and I reveal them... then, when they of course pass the test... then you will understand why I can claim this. But please do not think that because this is true that I consider myself above anyone... I do not... God chose where he wants me - I never earned it, I never deserved it. I merely accept it with all Glory to God.

Now consider my understanding of this matter, then consider what I told you is my position then ask why I would be in the position of knowing who that Beast is before the rest of the world, then tell me why God would have selected me for that yet I know nothng of it? - Meaning my understanding from God is in error? Does not make sense. Also notice my understanding is already different than the rest of the world's especially about the body Satan takes over and where the life for the image is obtained.

Yes, Immediately when the Two Witnesses know who the Beast is... I will also know. period

 

[tgwprophet]

Revelation 13:18
Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man;

Extremely easy would have been for it to be written.... " Here is wisdom, Let him that hath understanding count the number of the Beast, for it iss the number of a Kingdom. " Alas - it does not say that. Now to back that up,,, we have how many figuring that I am in error - yet it should be understood the bulk of the people will understand it wrongly - just as the learnered men at the time of Christ Jesus's birth understood in-correctly. However, for the sake that better understanding and wisdom can pre-vail... I will go to my tool box - seek out my crow barr and pery my mind open and hope you all do the same.

Dang, by that i meant you go to your tool box and get out your crow bar and pry your mind open... not mine. lol