should women wear hair covering veil or is that unspiritual

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An Apologetic Sheepdog

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Well it needs to be noted that specifically the church at Corinth was noted even then as "sin city" (even the Romans viewed it as extreme) with a heavy population of Aphrodite and Artemis (Diana the wiccan goddess in other cultures is thought to also be her) cults so its pretty expected that new gentile converts carried a lot of that into the church when it was in its infancy and Paul probably had to go to extremes to straighten them out.

Notice in context that nowhere does Paul "mandate" these things and he even makes a point in V16 that no such customs exist in Christ's church.

It is a reasonable argument that these comments were specific to the situation on the ground there and not meant as absolutes or mandates especially since they are not mentioned elsewhere with a heavy precedent.

Nowhere does Jesus mention any dress code, hair code or head covering- even when teaching the disciples how to pray.
 

robert derrick

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Does God contradict himself? What about Nazarites?

Long hair on men is not written as a shame in the old covenant; otherwise, God would be contradicting Himself to forbid cutting of men's hair to fulfill the Nazarite vow.

There is a difference between the Law of Moses in the Old Covenant, and the Law of Christ in the New.
 

Truman

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But I don't know everything.

That's true, since the only things you have to say here are what you think.

And if any man think that he knoweth any thing, he knoweth nothing yet as he ought to know.

But you certainly do know how to falsely judge others that give Scripture, for what they believe.

Tolerance is very loving to the world.

In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

Scripture is not.
Whatever.
 

Wynona

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You are expressing a preference... NOT a conviction. Conviction is with regards to sin and the heart.

It's a conviction for me. It's an expression of my personal conscience. I don't expect everyone to agree.

 

Addy

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It's a conviction for me. It's an expression of my personal conscience. I don't expect everyone to agree.
So then... if you do not wear the head covering you are sinning then. That is what you have expressed.
 

robert derrick

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Well it needs to be noted that specifically the church at Corinth was noted even then as "sin city" (even the Romans viewed it as extreme) with a heavy population of Aphrodite and Artemis (Diana the wiccan goddess in other cultures is thought to also be her) cults so its pretty expected that new gentile converts carried a lot of that into the church when it was in its infancy and Paul probably had to go to extremes to straighten them out.

Notice in context that nowhere does Paul "mandate" these things and he even makes a point in V16 that no such customs exist in Christ's church.

It is a reasonable argument that these comments were specific to the situation on the ground there and not meant as absolutes or mandates especially since they are not mentioned elsewhere with a heavy precedent.

Nowhere does Jesus mention any dress code, hair code or head covering- even when teaching the disciples how to pray.
But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the churches of God.

And so the previous 15 Scriptures about the Headship of God and the covering of the head with hair means nothing.

To be contentious about what is plainly written is not to be a custom in the churches of God.

Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him? But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a covering.

Contentiousness would be coming up with ways and means to deny what is written plainly that any child can read.

If any say that a man with long hair is a shame, and a woman with long hair is a glory given by God, then the simple truth of Scripture is confirmed.

To say otherwise is men's own thinking and arguments passed off for teaching of God, in contradiction to the written words of God.

Such as: It is a reasonable argument that these comments were specific to the situation on the ground there and not meant as absolutes or mandates.

And so, the Scripture as written for all to read, does not mean what is written for all to believe and obey.

Such 'reasoning' would put any Scripture in doubt from one church to another, because it wasn't written to that church specifically, and since there are no more such churches today, then all such epistles were meant only for others long dead in Christ.

the church at Corinth was noted even then as "sin city" (even the Romans viewed it as extreme)

God doesn't teach culture, neither is His Word taught according to culture of men. He teaches against sins of any culture, by declaring what sin is.

Nowhere does Jesus mention any dress code, hair code or head covering- even when teaching the disciples how to pray.

And so the writings of the apostles were not Jesus' words.

They were not given by inspiration of God to be written as Scripture of Christ for His people to believe nd obey.

Every man praying or prophesying, having his head covered, dishonoureth his head. But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head.

Head covering while praying and ministering.

In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel.

Dress code.

And if any man think that he knoweth any thing, he knoweth nothing yet as he ought to know.

Arguing from our own minds without Scripture is what we think, not what God says to be true.

Which is fine. I think many things in my own life, but I don't then try to pass off my thinking as the truth of God.
 

robert derrick

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And their faces were as the faces of men. And they had hair as the hair of women. (Rev 9)

What is Scripture saying that makes for hair of women to God?

When God sees it, He calls it the hair of women?

Curly? Straight? Dyed? Wet? The dry look? Frizzy? Smooth? Natural roots? Bangs?
 

An Apologetic Sheepdog

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Coming from a JW, your views on scripture carry little weight but lets look at a few to drive that point home

Such 'reasoning' would put any Scripture in doubt from one church to another, because it wasn't written to that church specifically, and since there are no more such churches today, then all such epistles were meant only for others long dead in Christ.

No, many different circumstances covering many different scenarios. Scripture is letters to churches for specific things- not an owners and maintenance manual.

And so the writings of the apostles were not Jesus' words.

No, they were the individuals words as the SPIRIT gave them

Which is fine. I think many things in my own life, but I don't then try to pass off my thinking as the truth of God.

That's probably best
 

Wynona

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So then... if you do not wear the head covering you are sinning then. That is what you have expressed.

This is what I said:

"I don't remember thinking my prayers were hindered. I just would cover my head with a scarf during prayer and still do. I just knew I wanted my hair longer because I think it looks better that way. I also don't want to look like Im a woman trying to be masculine, which I think is not from God."

I think its a sin to, as a woman, try to look masculine intentionally. I never said it was a sin not to wear a head covering but that it was a sign for the angels.
 

Addy

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"I don't remember thinking my prayers were hindered. I just would cover my head with a scarf during prayer and still do
We have a different perspective on the word conviction... I call your wanting to wear a head covering a choice... you are stating it is more than simply that... which is fine if it makes you feel holier or whatever it does... I call it a choice... as to me... being convicted is a warning.
 

robert derrick

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Coming from a JW, your views on scripture carry little weight but lets look at a few to drive that point home



No, many different circumstances covering many different scenarios. Scripture is letters to churches for specific things- not an owners and maintenance manual.



No, they were the individuals words as the SPIRIT gave them



That's probably best


No, many different circumstances covering many different scenarios. Scripture is letters to churches for specific things- not an owners and maintenance manual.

Then ignore what you want and continue to think what you want and take your own advice not to put it out as true of God.

No, they were the individuals words as the SPIRIT gave them

But they are not Jesus' words about head coverings and dress code. The Spirit is giving things apart from Him.

But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me.

All I have seen is personal opinion and taste, but no effort to address the Scripture given and the reasoning I offer.

I would welcome it. Even from a JW.

In the meantime, you are a waste of time.
 

Wynona

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We have a different perspective on the word conviction... I call your wanting to wear a head covering a choice... you are stating it is more than simply that... which is fine if it makes you feel holier or whatever it does... I call it a choice... as to me... being convicted is a warning.

That is okay, some things we won't agree on. I meant no offense.
 

Truman

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J.W. I recall once reading about half of a paragraph of J.W. literature. I had to stop because it felt like an invisible hand was trying to grasp control of my brain! Man, you should really reconsider what you're involved in.
 

Addy

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That is okay, some things we won't agree on. I meant no offense.
I was not offended in the least... I have never heard of Christian women wearing head coverings ... other than NUNS... and well
their entire body from head to foot with exception of eyes.. nose and mouth are covered...

To me this topic is simply another attempt at adding to the already long list of legalistic do's and don'ts.... Wearing a head covering does not purify the heart... and Christ is only interested in that kind of offering. That is my opinion... Not trying to bash yours.
 

robert derrick

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Your reasoning is flawed, that's why. I gave you the context and even historical understanding yet you still don't see.
As I said. You've done nothing but offer culture and history.

Nothing from the Scriptures I gave and the understanding of them I offer.

And you don't even understand the difference.

Useless.