Sound Doctrine

[Marymog]

Oh boy! Here we go again—round and round and round....

Fed-up Freda

Ummmmm......Getting dizzy from going round and round and round?

It would all stop if you could only articulate a legitimate response.

Mary

 

[Marymog]

You’re telling me that EVERYTHING the apostles ever said are written in those documents? Everything?

Tisk, Tisk PW......I answered your question and your response is by asking me ANOTHER question???......All the while refusing to answer my questions???

Oh goodness....what is a girl to do? I will be patient and trust in the Lord that you will eventually be able to defend your beliefs instead of continuously asking me to defend mine.

Patient Mary

 

[Prayer Warrior]

Ummmmm......Getting dizzy from going round and round and round?

It would all stop if you could only articulate a legitimate response.

Mary

LOL

 

[Marymog]

no offense Mary but it would be pointless, like Quoting a Scripture verse to you that denies your pantheon, or etc. they just can't be seen by you right now. Why do you subject yourself to the comments of Christians, i gotta wonder?

Why aren't you on a Catholic site where you would be accepted?
Do you really expect to turn anyone Catholic here?

Hi Creepy.

Why are you on a Christian site?

Curious Mary

 

[bbyrd009]

Hi Creepy.

Why are you on a Christian site?

Curious Mary

ah, you're on auto-deflect now i guess
ok manana

 

[Marymog]

LOL

Wow....."LOL"....You finally did it. A legitimate response and it took only three letters....

Since I am patient I will gladly give you more time to meet with your fellow true bible believers that you sit around with and exhort. Maybe, between the 10-15 of you, ONE of you will come up with a logical, legitimate, scripture based answer to my questions since you have failed.

It was good chatting with you though.

Patient Mary

 

[Prayer Warrior]

no offense Mary but it would be pointless, like Quoting a Scripture verse to you that denies your pantheon, or etc. they just can't be seen by you right now. Why do you subject yourself to the comments of Christians, i gotta wonder?

Why aren't you on a Catholic site where you would be accepted?
Do you really expect to turn anyone Catholic here?

The Catholic Church [in the U.S.] began to drop in membership a while back, so they revved up their attempts to proselytize Protestants. The problem is a lot of us Protestants are ignorant to their errant doctrine. Catholics use Bible verses to support their positions, but they don't tip you off that their interpretation of those verses is completely different from Protestant interpretations. Catholic interpretations are based on an unwritten "Tradition" that supposedly includes all that the apostles ever said but was not recorded in the Bible....
.

 

[Prayer Warrior]

Wow....."LOL"....You finally did it. A legitimate response and it took only three letters....

Since I am patient I will gladly give you more time to meet with your fellow true bible believers that you sit around with and exhort. Maybe, between the 10-15 of you, ONE of you will come up with a logical, legitimate, scripture based answer to my questions since you have failed.

It was good chatting with you though.

Patient Mary

So, where do you intend to proselytize next???

 

[Marymog]

ah, you're on auto-deflect now i guess
ok manana

No sir...not on auto-deflect. I just want to know why a person who isn't a Christian is on this website?

To answer your LEGITIMATE question. I do not expect to turn anyone on here Catholic. I only expect of myself what God expects of me. To tell the Truth. So that is what I am doing.

Do you, BBYRD, know what happens to those that reject the Truth?

Curious Mary

 

[Marymog]

So, where do you intend to proselytize next???

Hey PW....I hope I didn't hurt your pride. I know I ask tough, thought provoking questions. You were not the 1st to fail at answering them.

Where to next? I think I will stay here and continue to stump people like you and continue to spread the Truth which is revealed thru Catholic doctrine. (see how I answered your question instead of dodging it. that's how a CONVERSATION works)

How about you kiddo? Where do you intend to proselytize YOUR doctrine?

Curious Mary

 

[Prayer Warrior]

Hey PW....I hope I didn't hurt your pride. I know I ask tough, thought provoking questions. You were not the 1st to fail at answering them.

Where to next? I think I will stay here and continue to stump people like you and continue to spread the Truth which is revealed thru Catholic doctrine. (see how I answered your question instead of dodging it. that's how a CONVERSATION works)

How about you kiddo? Where do you intend to proselytize YOUR doctrine?

Curious Mary

Mary, if Catholic doctrine was based on the Bible, I wouldn't be concerned about your spreading it all around. But I'm concerned for Christians who don't have a clue how unscriptural Catholic doctrine is. I'm also concerned about your soul. How can you end up in heaven when you base your faith on so many unbiblical doctrines?

From the heart, Deborah

 

[bbyrd009]

not

ok Mary, fwiw i only meant why subject yourself to us if you are not here to learn, we are hard enough on Protestants as it is?

 

[Enoch111]

So, EVERY WORD that the apostles ever spoke is in writing at the Vatican???

Sorry, Holy Tradition would include the Codes of Canon Law as well as the proceedings of the various Councils (21 Ecumenical Councils).

Codes of Canon Law - The Holy See - Archive

The 21 Ecumenical Councils of the Catholic Church

 

[Nancy]

So, you’re back to “Curious Mary”? Since you and I have already had a lengthy discussion, I’m just going to cut to the chase. Show me the teachings of the apostles supposedly handed down to the Catholic Church called the “Tradition” in the CCC. It’s important that we SEE all of these “teachings” so that we can compare them with the Bible since the Catholic Church claims they have equal authority with the Bible.

Are the following Catholic doctrines suported in these unbiblical mystery teachings?
—Immaculate conception
—Transubstantiation
—Supreme papal authority and infallibility
—Maybe Indulgences?

IMHO, I think in ICor. the word "Tradition" is better translated as "Ordinances" and BTW-is the doctrine of purgatory still practiced today in the CC?

 

[Prayer Warrior]

IMHO, I think in ICor. the word "Tradition" is better translated as "Ordinances" and BTW-is the doctrine of purgatory still practiced today in the CC?

Hi, Nancy! Yes, the Catholic Church still teaches that there is purgatory. The Catholic Encyclopedia has this to say:

Purgatory (Lat., "purgare", to make clean, to purify) in accordance with Catholic teaching is a place or condition of temporal punishment for those who, departing this life in God's grace, are, not entirely free from venial faults, or have not fully paid the satisfaction due to their transgressions.
​

The main problem I have with this doctrine is the part that says "have not fully paid the satisfaction due to their transgressions." I believe that Jesus fully paid with His blood. I couldn't possibly add anything to that.

Hebrews 9:12--"He entered once for all into the holy places, not by means of the blood of goats and calves but by means of his own blood, thus securing an eternal redemption."

Ephesians 1:7--"In him we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of his grace,..."

 

[CoreIssue]

Purgatory is pagan in origin, just like Christmas, Easter, holy water, prayer beads, Marionology, the pope, Cardinals and a host of other things.

The Pagan Origin of Purgatory

 

[brakelite]

Thank you. I am not sure what I am being disingenuous about. It is a simple question: Would you agree that one scripture passage does not cancel out the other? I sure would love an answer.....

Maybe you can get some help from @Nancy or @Bygrace to answer the following questions since they "like" your response

The RCC teaches what scripture says: that we are to hold fast to our traditions whether they be passed down in the written form or given to us orally.

First, I agree that one scripture passage does not cancel out any other. If there appears to be a contradiction in scripture, then we continue to compare scripture with scripture until full understanding develops.
I also agree that Paul recommended that the church should continue in those traditions begun in earlier times...as in the primitive apostolic church. However, just as scripture must agree with scripture, then tradition must also agree with scripture. For if tradition contradicts scripture, we have the quandary of which to follow...I think you would agree that the word of God ought always take the prime seat when it comes to authority. I know of no tradition that Paul observed that contradicted scripture. I can think of many tradtions that the RCC observes that is neither taught in scripture, neither hinted at or even suggested...yet is claimed as mandatory in Catholic catechisms as being essential to faith and practice.
So then we come to certain church ordinances and teachings that we may disagree on. The Catholic church would teach that they differ because they take into account certain traditions and oral teachings handed down from the church fathers...the protestant would say that those teachings cannot be correct, because they contradict scripture. Mary comes along and says the protestant has no right to claim right or wrong, because they are usurping church authority. So if the church says scripture means such and such, (because tradition says so) and such teachings must be adhered to and is Truth (dogma), then Mary, I have news for you.
It isn't scripture that has any authority in Catholicism. Nor is it tradition. It is the church. No longer in Catholic tradition is it that the scriptures have authority over faith and practice. It is now Catholic tradition that the Catholic church has sole authority on declaring what scripture means, its understanding, its interpretation, its significance in church life. Thus the church, and ultimately the pope, becomes a false idol and a god.

 

[Nancy]

Hi, Nancy! Yes, the Catholic Church still teaches that there is purgatory. The Catholic Encyclopedia has this to say:

Purgatory (Lat., "purgare", to make clean, to purify) in accordance with Catholic teaching is a place or condition of temporal punishment for those who, departing this life in God's grace, are, not entirely free from venial faults, or have not fully paid the satisfaction due to their transgressions.
​

The main problem I have with this doctrine is the part that says "have not fully paid the satisfaction due to their transgressions." I believe that Jesus fully paid with His blood. I couldn't possibly add anything to that.

Hebrews 9:12--"He entered once for all into the holy places, not by means of the blood of goats and calves but by means of his own blood, thus securing an eternal redemption."

Ephesians 1:7--"In him we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of his grace,..."

Agreed. Especially this: "have not fully paid the satisfaction due to their transgressions."
Yes, how can any mere human being - creation OF God - even entertain the thought that they could ever possibly "pay" for ANYTHING?? Not close, God's standard is perfection.

 

[farouk]

Agreed. Especially this: "have not fully paid the satisfaction due to their transgressions."
Yes, how can any mere human being - creation OF God - even entertain the thought that they could ever possibly "pay" for ANYTHING?? Not close, God's standard is perfection.

The combination of faith in "it is finished" and "Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many", and similar verses, means there is nothing left to pay.

 

[Enoch111]

The main problem I have with this doctrine is the part that says "have not fully paid the satisfaction due to their transgressions."

Purgatory -- just like the Mass -- makes a mockery of the finished work of Christ.