Speaking in Tongues a Cessationist View

[Dave L]

Again I believe you are wrong for making this a rule. Certainly sometimes people are following their own flesh... but not always. You say it is nothing like the originals but since you were not there and have never experienced the "originals" how could you know what they are? You presume that everyone else had only the "buzz" of your own experience. I don't get a buzz. I talk to God. At the first it was a babble, but the babble became a language...

Give God the glory!

I used to think the same as you but too many questions kept popping up along the way. One of the hardest for me was why tongues were spontaneous and unexpected in Acts, and today people must learn and be coached how to speak in them. We also claimed they were unlearned human languages but after years, we had no proof. I also wondered why just a couple of obscure sects and not the whole church, world wide? Many more inconsistencies I found by trying to answer these questions through independent study.

 

[Dave L]

Again with your negative proof.

Neither does it eliminate any other way.

If God does not say it, you are adding to his word.

 

[Jeff Wiebe]

About 25 years ago a friend took me to his Church. I had no idea what kind of Church it was but I trusted my friend. I sat in the back of the very full Church, maybe 200 people. Towards the end of the sermon the preacher wanted everyone to pray in gibberish so satan would not understand. I thought, what would satan be doing in the house of God?, so that freaked me out. Then they all started there gibberish. That's when I sensed the evil, got freaked out and left. That gibberish is NOT a gift from God. People call it tongues, it is not. People want communication with God so bad they manifest in themselves this false feeling and satan is just soaking it up thinking he's winning. People get overwhelmed and start shaking and falling down thinking the Holy Spirit is empowering them. That is not Biblical and is not from God and I stay far away from it. Even the subtle quite gibberish people think and feel is communication with God I feel is from satan. Its the same just not as physical. The gift of tongues is the ability to speak and understand where there is a language barrier in order to spread the Gospel. That's what the Bible teaches. Anything else is man made. God understands all language and Jesus gave us a prayer if we don't know what to pray. I've never not know what to pray but sometimes start with the Lords prayer. This world needs so much prayer we could pray for days. No need to manifest another way that could be demonic.
In the same way, the Spirit helps us in our weakness. We do not know what we ought to pray for, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us through wordless groans.
groan
[ɡrōn]
VERB
groans (third person present)

1. make a deep inarticulate sound in response to pain or despair.
   

Matthew 6:7-13 New International Version (NIV)
And when you pray, do not keep on babbling like pagans, for they think they will be heard because of their many words Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him.

“This, then, is how you should pray:

“‘Our Father in heaven,
hallowed be your name,
your kingdom come,
your will be done,
on earth as it is in heaven.
Give us today our daily bread.
And forgive us our debts,
as we also have forgiven our debtors.
And lead us not into temptation,
but deliver us from the evil one.

 

[CoreIssue]

If God does not say it, you are adding to his word.

That is a negative proof of claim.

Just because something is not said does not make it false or true.

 

[amadeus]

I’m trying to understand everyone’s perspective. When you speak to God in tongues, does he respond in tongues?

No, God responds in different ways. Recall for the still small voice with which He spoke to Elijah [I King 19:12]? To him God did not speak through the wind or the earthquake or the fire... at least not at that time, but He does use those and probably a multitude of other ways to communicate with men or with His sheep. Are we not His sheep?

"And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice." John 10:4

Jesus communicated in parables, but who was able to hear and understand Him? Who was not?

 

[Dave L]

That is a negative proof of claim.

Just because something is not said does not make it false or true.

But what is said limits it to the two outpourings or the hand's of an apostle.

“And when Simon saw that through laying on of the apostles’ hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money,” (Acts 8:18)

“For I long to see you, that I may impart unto you some spiritual gift, to the end you may be established;” (Romans 1:11)

 

[CoreIssue]

But what is said limits it to the two outpourings or the hand's of an apostle.

“And when Simon saw that through laying on of the apostles’ hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money,” (Acts 8:18)

“For I long to see you, that I may impart unto you some spiritual gift, to the end you may be established;” (Romans 1:11)

The Bible says nine gifts are given to the church. Not a single word that any gift ends while the church is on the earth.

So gifts are still given but just not as an outpouring.

 

[Dave L]

The Bible says nine gifts are given to the church. Not a single word that any gift ends while the church is on the earth.

So gifts are still given but just not as an outpouring.

But, you need apostles to pass them around. The non charismatic gifts remain.

 

[CoreIssue]

But, you need apostles to pass them around. The non charismatic gifts remain.

No you do not. You need the Holy Spirit.

 

[Dave L]

No you do not. You need the Holy Spirit.

People do not speak in tongues today. They only think they do. They are nothing like the originals. Even voodoo practitioners speak in tongues today and it has nothing to do with the Holy Spirit.

 

[amadeus]

I used to think the same as you but too many questions kept popping up along the way. One of the hardest for me was why tongues were spontaneous and unexpected in Acts, and today people must learn and be coached how to speak in them. We also claimed they were unlearned human languages but after years, we had no proof. I also wondered why just a couple of obscure sects and not the whole church, world wide? Many more inconsistencies I found by trying to answer these questions through independent study.

My gift was not learned or coached into me. They tried that and it did not work. When everyone had given up with all of their foolishness, God gave me a gift. I don't claim that mine is in any human language although I know from experience with others and the scripture and God that sometimes they are.

As to finding them in some obscure sects, why do you question God on this? If yours was foolishness and counterfeit, don't presume that what was so for you is so for everyone else. The Body of Christ has a great many parts with many different functions.

The proof is in the heart of a man where God alone has put it. That proof is shared with others when God is in the sharing.

 

[Dave L]

My gift was not learned or coached into me. They tried that and it did not work. When everyone had given up with all of their foolishness, God gave me a gift. I don't claim that mine is in any human language although I know from experience with others and the scripture and God that sometimes they are.

As to finding them in some obscure sects, why do you question God on this? If yours was foolishness and counterfeit, don't presume that what was so for you is so for everyone else. The Body of Christ has a great many parts with many different functions.

The proof is in the heart of a man where God alone has put it. That proof is shared with others when God is in the sharing.

I doubt if you would be exercising what you think is a gift had you not had prior involvement with those advocating it. In Acts, they knew nothing of it. And if it were not because of your indoctrination, the whole church would be doing it. Not just what began as a few obscure sects.

 

[Dave L]

The Bible says nine gifts are given to the church. Not a single word that any gift ends while the church is on the earth.

So gifts are still given but just not as an outpouring.

The ministerial gifts remain. The Charismatic gifts ceased with the apostles.

 

[rockytopva]

Ministry gifts remain.... Testifying of the miraculous power of God....

 

[rockytopva]

Ministry gifts remain.... Testifying of the miraculous power of GOD.....

 

[rockytopva]

Ministry gifts remain.... Testifying of the miraculous power of GOD..... Followed by RW Schambach testifying that every hair on his head was Pentecostal.... Or he would pull it out!!!

 

[Dave L]

Ministry gifts remain.... Testifying of the miraculous power of GOD..... Followed by RW Schambach testifying that every hair on his head was Pentecostal.... Or he would pull it out!!!

Who will you believe, false prophets like Shambaugh or the Bible?

 

[Dave L]

Ministry gifts remain.... Testifying of the miraculous power of GOD.....

The prayer of faith heals. But it is not one of the Charismatic gifts now expired.

 

[Dave L]

Ministry gifts remain.... Testifying of the miraculous power of God....

You confuse the prayer of faith with the now expired Charismatic gifts. If the gifts are for today, go raise some dead people and restore some amputated limbs.

 

[rockytopva]

Who will you believe, false prophets like Shambaugh or the Bible?

Testimonies told it all! And he does preach out of the Bible....