The Catholic Church gets put down a lot, but it was all that could help

[tom55]

The Lord said that you would be judged by your fruit, and so you are.

the good news is that there are some that are alive in the RCC, and these, if they aren't excommunicated by the leadership, will help to guide you into all truth.

I am glad to read your "good news" that there are some in the RCC that have the truth and they will guide me to the truth.

What is the biggest lie that the RCC has told me that these other Catholics (who have not yet been excommunicated) would guide me to the truth about?

 

[michaelvpardo]

I am glad to read your "good news" that there are some in the RCC that have the truth and they will guide me to the truth.

What is the biggest lie that the RCC has told me that these other Catholics (who have not yet been excommunicated) would guide me to the truth about?

Those who are in Christ don't typically lie, but some do when following their old nature.

Maybe you can tell me what this "catholic" web site is about:
http://www.mostholyfamilymonastery.com/news/threatening-body-bags-war-russia-us-way/#.V_Kx68L6uM8

 

[tom55]

Those who are in Christ don't typically lie, but some do when following their old nature.

Maybe you can tell me what this "catholic" web site is about:
http://www.mostholyfamilymonastery.com/news/threatening-body-bags-war-russia-us-way/#.V_Kx68L6uM8

That website is not an official Catholic website and has been condemned by the Catholic Church.

Sooooo....once again what is the biggest lie (or doctrine) that the RCC teaches?

 

[michaelvpardo]

That website is not an official Catholic website and has been condemned by the Catholic Church.

Sooooo....once again what is the biggest lie (or doctrine) that the RCC teaches?

Convenient for the RCC to condemn its own, been doing that for nearly 2000 years. If there was a barfing smiley face icon to use here, I would. Tell me tom, what exactly do you think a church is?

 

[michaelvpardo]

Sooooo....once again what is the biggest lie (or doctrine) that the RCC teaches?

I forgot to answer your question. Biggest lie? That there is no salvation without the RCC (that's straight out of hell.)

 

[tom55]

I forgot to answer your question. Biggest lie? That there is no salvation without the RCC (that's straight out of hell.)

The Catholic Church does not teach that. Here is what it teaches:

Those who.....seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience—those too may achieve eternal salvation. (#847 Catechism)

Since your fist belief about the RCC has just proven to be fallacious how about we move on to the next big lie or doctrine that you believe the RCC teaches?

 

[michaelvpardo]

The Catholic Church does not teach that. Here is what it teaches:

Those who.....seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience—those too may achieve eternal salvation. (#847 Catechism)

Since your fist belief about the RCC has just proven to be fallacious how about we move on to the next big lie or doctrine that you believe the RCC teaches?

This is simply untrue. You either don't know anything about the RCC or you're lying intentionally. Its interesting that your Catechism has reversed what was declared by the RCC and reiterated on this very web site by members of your own church. I guess the catechism doesn't come from the Pope directly as he is infallible.

 

[tom55]

This is simply untrue. You either don't know anything about the RCC or you're lying intentionally. Its interesting that your Catechism has reversed what was declared by the RCC and reiterated on this very web site by members of your own church. I guess the catechism doesn't come from the Pope directly as he is infallible.

http://ccc.usccb.org/flipbooks/catechism/index.html#242/z

Since your fist belief about the RCC has just proven to be fallacious how about we move on to the next big lie or doctrine that you believe the RCC teaches?

 

[michaelvpardo]

http://ccc.usccb.org/flipbooks/catechism/index.html#242/z

Since your fist belief about the RCC has just proven to be fallacious how about we move on to the next big lie or doctrine that you believe the RCC teaches?

Only in your mind, but I can recommend a pill for that. I checked out your web site and it states what I just said, but gives a reinterpretation of a church father. Good try though.

http://ccc.usccb.org/flipbooks/catechism/index.html#242/z

 

[tom55]

Only in your mind, but I can recommend a pill for that. I checked out your web site and it states what I just said, but gives a reinterpretation of a church father. Good try though.

http://ccc.usccb.org/flipbooks/catechism/index.html#242/z

It's not in my mind. It is written before your eyes and it is preached and practiced by the Catholic Church. Just because you don't accept it doesn't make it true.

I suspect you are talking about #846 in the alleged reinterpretation of a Church Father?

Would you agree that once you have been given the Truth and you have learned the Truth and even practiced the Truth and then you reject the Truth you would loose your Salvation?
Scenario: Devout Christian becomes an devout Atheist or devout Muslim. Would they loose their salvation if they don't repent before they die?

PS.....YOU should read the Church Fathers. They were clearly Catholic in their teachings.

 

[epostle1]

This is simply untrue. You either don't know anything about the RCC or you're lying intentionally. Its interesting that your Catechism has reversed what was declared by the RCC and reiterated on this very web site by members of your own church. I guess the catechism doesn't come from the Pope directly as he is infallible.

The Church hasn't reversed anything but reformulated a paragraph that applied to the 14 century when there was only one church. "No salvation outside the only church that existed at the time." It's a no brainer. The Church includes all baptized as Christians, but nothing the Church does will ever be good enough for some people. She hands out an olive branch and you spit on it.

Infallibility does not come from popes, bishops or councils. It comes from the words of Jesus and His promise He would always be with us. It is a charism that prevents the Church from teaching error. The pope alone is not infallible.

Matt. 10:20; Luke 12:12 - Jesus tells His apostles it is not they who speak, but the Spirit of their Father speaking through them. If the Spirit is the one speaking and leading the Church, the Church cannot err on matters of faith and morals.

Matt. 16:18 - Jesus promises the gates of Hades would never prevail against the Church. This requires that the Church teach infallibly. If the Church did not have the gift of infallibility, the gates of Hades and error would prevail. Also, since the Catholic Church was the only Church that existed up until the Reformation, those who follow the Protestant reformers call Christ a liar by saying that Hades did prevail.

Matt. 16:19 - for Jesus to give Peter and the apostles, mere human beings, the authority to bind in heaven what they bound on earth requires infallibility. This is a gift of the Holy Spirit and has nothing to do with the holiness of the person receiving the gift.

Matt. 18:17-18 - the Church (not Scripture) is the final authority on questions of the faith. This demands infallibility when teaching the faith. She must be prevented from teaching error in order to lead her members to the fullness of salvation.

Matt. 28:20 - Jesus promises that He will be with the Church always. Jesus' presence in the Church assures infallible teaching on faith and morals. With Jesus present, we can never be deceived.

The sola scriptura mindset causes a kind of scriptural blindness, necessitating re-definitions or straw man opposition against the true meaning of infallibility. Sola scriptura MUST reject what the Bible teaches about infallibility.

The Bible repeatedly teaches that the Church is indefectible; therefore, the hypothetical of rejecting the (one true, historic) Church, as supposedly going against the Bible, is impossible according to the Bible. It is not a situation that would ever come up, because of God’s promised protection.

What the Bible says is to reject those who cause divisions, which is the very essence of the onset of Protestantism: schism, sectarianism, and division. It is Protestantism that departed from the historic Church, which is indefectible and infallible (see also 1 Tim 3:15).

Only in your mind, but I can recommend a pill for that. I checked out your web site and it states what I just said, but gives a reinterpretation of a church father. Good try though.

http://ccc.usccb.org/flipbooks/catechism/index.html#242/z

Why don't you give your "correct" interpretation of Augustine, Cyprian and Ambrose as they apply to the relevant paragraphs? You judge the catechism based on one page? I can recommend a pill for that.

 

[Mungo]

That website is not an official Catholic website and has been condemned by the Catholic Church.

It's not even an unofficial Catholic web site. It's a bunch people who have left the Catholic Church.

We politely call them sedevacantists but a better name is protestants.

The Cathiolic Church cannot be held responsible for what protestants put on their web sites.

 

[Mungo]

This is simply untrue. You either don't know anything about the RCC or you're lying intentionally. Its interesting that your Catechism has reversed what was declared by the RCC and reiterated on this very web site by members of your own church. I guess the catechism doesn't come from the Pope directly as he is infallible.

The Catechism has reversed nothing.

The problem with protestants is that do the same with Catholic statements as they do with scripture - they snip bits out of context and thereby distort the meaning.

 

[Born_Again]

The Catechism has reversed nothing.

The problem with protestants is that do the same with Catholic statements as they do with scripture - they snip bits out of context and thereby distort the meaning.

Yea, because the RCC has never done that........ *Detect the sarcasm.

 

[Mungo]

Yea, because the RCC has never done that........ *Detect the sarcasm.

No, just ignorance.

 

[michaelvpardo]

The Catechism has reversed nothing.

The problem with protestants is that do the same with Catholic statements as they do with scripture - they snip bits out of context and thereby distort the meaning.

Yes, and pigs fly, there is a Santa Claus, and the check is in the mail.

 

[heretoeternity]

The Church hasn't reversed anything but reformulated a paragraph that applied to the 14 century when there was only one church. "No salvation outside the only church that existed at the time." It's a no brainer. The Church includes all baptized as Christians, but nothing the Church does will ever be good enough for some people. She hands out an olive branch and you spit on it.

Infallibility does not come from popes, bishops or councils. It comes from the words of Jesus and His promise He would always be with us. It is a charism that prevents the Church from teaching error. The pope alone is not infallible.

Matt. 10:20; Luke 12:12 - Jesus tells His apostles it is not they who speak, but the Spirit of their Father speaking through them. If the Spirit is the one speaking and leading the Church, the Church cannot err on matters of faith and morals.

Matt. 16:18 - Jesus promises the gates of Hades would never prevail against the Church. This requires that the Church teach infallibly. If the Church did not have the gift of infallibility, the gates of Hades and error would prevail. Also, since the Catholic Church was the only Church that existed up until the Reformation, those who follow the Protestant reformers call Christ a liar by saying that Hades did prevail.

Matt. 16:19 - for Jesus to give Peter and the apostles, mere human beings, the authority to bind in heaven what they bound on earth requires infallibility. This is a gift of the Holy Spirit and has nothing to do with the holiness of the person receiving the gift.

Matt. 18:17-18 - the Church (not Scripture) is the final authority on questions of the faith. This demands infallibility when teaching the faith. She must be prevented from teaching error in order to lead her members to the fullness of salvation.

Matt. 28:20 - Jesus promises that He will be with the Church always. Jesus' presence in the Church assures infallible teaching on faith and morals. With Jesus present, we can never be deceived.

The sola scriptura mindset causes a kind of scriptural blindness, necessitating re-definitions or straw man opposition against the true meaning of infallibility. Sola scriptura MUST reject what the Bible teaches about infallibility.

The Bible repeatedly teaches that the Church is indefectible; therefore, the hypothetical of rejecting the (one true, historic) Church, as supposedly going against the Bible, is impossible according to the Bible. It is not a situation that would ever come up, because of God’s promised protection.

What the Bible says is to reject those who cause divisions, which is the very essence of the onset of Protestantism: schism, sectarianism, and division. It is Protestantism that departed from the historic Church, which is indefectible and infallible (see also 1 Tim 3:15).

Why don't you give your "correct" interpretation of Augustine, Cyprian and Ambrose as they apply to the relevant paragraphs? You judge the catechism based on one page? I can recommend a pill for that.





,



Save your red pill for Revelation 18 when God puts an end to the false Roman religious organization..
The infallible religious organization, run by an infallible mortal, and they do not honour God by keeping His commandments...they abandon the first four commandments to which is a direct flaunting of God and His creation....their reasoning seems to be their infallible leader in Rome is the only one they need to follow....

 

[Mungo]

The infallible religious organization, run by an infallible mortal, and they do not honour God by keeping His commandments...they abandon the first four commandments to which is a direct flaunting of God and His creation....their reasoning seems to be their infallible leader in Rome is the only one they need to follow....

Been though that. I answered all your points and you ignored my answers.

[removed]

You make claims you cannot back up. When they are proved false you go quiet and then make the same claims later in another thread.

 

[heretoeternity]

Nice talk for a so called "christian"..but then again you are a product of the Roman religious system so it is not surprising, as they have blinded you to the truth...you need a lot of prayer to get your eyes opened to the truth, and the real word of God, the Holy Bible.

Been though that. I answered all your points and you ignored my answers.

You are just a big windbag.

You make claims you cannot back up. When they are proved false you go quiet and then make the same claims later in another thread.

 

[Mungo]

Nice talk for a so called "christian"..but then again you are a product of the Roman religious system so it is not surprising, as they have blinded you to the truth...you need a lot of prayer to get your eyes opened to the truth, and the real word of God, the Holy Bible.

You are the one who is avoiding answering questions and doesn't quote scriptures.