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Featured The Gospel was changed by God:

Discussion in 'Christian Theology Forum' started by H. Richard, Oct 19, 2019.

  1. Enoch111

    Enoch111 Well-Known Member

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    There is nothing false about that since it is clearly revealed in Scripture. Indeed Romans 11 says exactly that.

    26 And so all Israel [the twelve tribes of Israel] shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion [Jerusalem] the Deliverer [Christ], and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob [the restoration of Israel]:

    27 For this
    is my covenant [the Abrahamic Covenant] unto them, when I shall take away their sins [the redemption of Israel].

    And the Church will reign with Christ from Heaven, and stated in many Scriptures.
     
  2. Davy

    Davy Well-Known Member

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    Rev 5:10
    10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.
    KJV

    Rev 20:6
    6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
    KJV


    No, you've just been deceived by men's leaven added to Scripture. Christ's Church is who that Rev.5:10 verse is about. And Zechariah 14 and Acts 1 is proof for His Church where He is going to return to, and where He will reign from along with His elect Church, i.e., in Jerusalem on earth.
     
  3. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Paul did indeed preach the law as a schoolmaster to lead men to Christ (Galatians 3:24-25) and that the righteousness of the law will be fulfilled in the heart of those who really believe (Romans 5:5; Romans 13:8-10, Galatians 5:14; Romans 8:4; Romans 8:7).

    He also said this about his style of ministering to people:

    1Co 9:19, For though I be free from all men, yet have I made myself servant unto all, that I might gain the more.
    1Co 9:20, And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law;
    1Co 9:21, To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law.
    1Co 9:22, To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some.
    1Co 9:23, And this I do for the gospel's sake, that I might be partaker thereof with you.


    In context, the story continues to have Paul show by his behaviour that he was not opposed to Jewish people adhering to the law. Actions speak louder than words, most often. So Paul showed by his actions that he was not opposed to the law of Moses being preached and obeyed; he showed to all of them that he himself kept it.

    Consider this:

    Rom 8:7, Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

    If you consider this inversely you will discover that the spiritual mind is at peace with God, for it is subject to the law of the Lord and cannot be otherwise.

    These things, even written by Paul.
     
  4. Doug

    Doug Active Member

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    Paul preached the gospel revealed to him by the Lord Jesus Christ to the Jew also.....the fact that he preached to the Jew does not establish what he preached.

    Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
     
  5. FollowHim

    FollowHim Active Member

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    This is a gnostic view of faith. I do not believe Jesus taught this, rather physical sin condemns us to hell, while faith with obedience in behaviour brings us eternal life, Praise the Lord.
     
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  6. Preacher4Truth

    Preacher4Truth Well-Known Member

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    The Gospel of Christ and the Gospel of Paul are one in the same. :)
     
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  7. BARNEY BRIGHT

    BARNEY BRIGHT Well-Known Member

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    I was just replying to something FHll said.
     
  8. Davy

    Davy Well-Known Member

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    What Paul preached to Israel most definitely does... establish what he preached to the Gentile. If he had preached a different gospel to either one, he would have made himself guilty of what he said below...

    Gal 1:6-8
    6 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:
    7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.
    8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.

    KJV


    That Romans 1:16 verse actually establishes that Paul preached the same Gospel to both, and not two different gospels.

    The idea of the gospel that Paul received was only in that Jesus personally appeared to Paul and revealed the one Gospel to him. And Jesus did this apart from the other Apostles. However, the Book of Acts shows at first the disciples at Jerusalem didn't believe that Paul had been converted, until Barnabas brought him to the Apostles and told them how Jesus had appeared to him, and how Paul had preached Christ boldly at Damascus (Acts 9). Paul preached then even to both Jews and Gentiles, same Gospel of Jesus Christ, for there is only one Gospel.
     
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  9. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Just playing devil's advocate here (because I personally believe that there is only one gospel)...

    What do we make of the following scripture:

    Gal 2:7, But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter;

    It appears to be saying that there is one gospel to the uncircumcision (preached by Paul) and another gospel to the circumcision (preached by Peter).

    Thoughts or comments?
     
  10. Doug

    Doug Active Member

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    Paul preached the same gospel to both Jew and Gentile but it was not the same gospel that the twelve preached.

    Jesus and the twelve preached the gospel of the kingdom to the Jew (Matthew 4:23 Luke 9:2 Luke 9:6). The coming of the kingdom on earth to fulfill the promises made to the fathers (Mark 1:15 Romans 15:8).

    Paul preached the gospel revealed to him by the risen Lord Jesus Christ (Galatians 1:12); the gospel of the grace of God (Acts 20:24 1 Corinthians 9:17).

    Paul's gospel did not pervert the gospel. The gospel of the kingdom was given to the twelve to preach and Paul never was against it or God's purpose for Israel.
     
  11. Davy

    Davy Well-Known Member

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    Yeah it was the same Gospel throughout, even what the 12 Apostles preached. The idea of Christ's coming Kingdom is PART of The Gospel of Jesus Christ. And Apostle Paul definitely preached Christ's coming Kingdom also. Who can read Matthew 8 about the centurion (a Gentile), and say our Lord Jesus wasn't speaking about him when saying many will come from the east and west and sit down in His future Kingdom???

    The Gospel of Jesus Christ automatically... includes His coming literal Kingdom to be established here on earth, beginning at His return. That is what the symbolic marriage feast in Matthew 8:11 is about that He was pointing to, which is to include the believing Gentiles. There are several Old Testament passages in the prophets that declare this, especially in the Book of Isaiah.

    In Acts 10 God showed Apostle Peter that His Salvation was also open to the Gentile, and Peter himself preached Christ crucified to the small group of Gentiles gathered in that chapter.

    So did the other Apostles preach the same Gospel of Jesus Christ, and even also to Gentiles! Peter was actually first to preach The Gospel to the Gentile (Acts 10). Men's traditions try to create their own doctrines on all that, but they're just men's leaven doctrines, not actually based on written Scripture.

    And let's get it straight per God's Word who all Apostle Paul was 'sent' to preach The Gospel to, as I have already shown but those here on men's false traditions just skate over, which is actual rejection of God's written Word...


    Jesus declared this about Apostle Paul's commission in The Gospel...

    Acts 9:15
    15 But the Lord said unto him, "Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto Me, to bear My name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel:

    KJV

    So if Paul preached a different gospel to Gentiles, then that would mean he preached another... gospel to those kings and to the children of Israel. That thinking of course is men's lie. Paul preached the same Gospel to all three groups.

    The gospel of the kingdom was NOT a perversion of The Gospel of Jesus Christ. It's Biblical ignorance to even think such an idea! The ones in Galatians that Paul was against, and warned against that were perverting the one Gospel were Judahizers that crept in and were trying to preach salvation by the law! That was the 'another gospel' that Paul warned the Galations against!

    It's amazing how especially, brethren will instead follow a bunch of Pre-trib Rapture scholars into the pit of hell with their false traditions against Christ's future Kingdom to come on earth.
     
  12. FollowHim

    FollowHim Active Member

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    The idea of two gospels is appealing when you think of things culturally.
    Jesus was saying behaviour matters, Paul is saying faith matters.

    Superficially this appears true, except Paul is arguing about the change Christ does in our hearts, while Jesus talks about following Him and His ways. Without the Holy Spirit in our hearts, what Jesus taught would literally have be condemnation for those who heard Him, as without God we are powerless to know victory or the true depth of love God has for us.

    Jesus being God sharing with man, is good, but then God has been sharing with different people for thousands of years. For Jesus to become the cornerstone of Israel, something extraordinary had to be done. No one could imagine the idea of God submitting to the execution by man was the way of righteousness. Hints with the prophets being men driven by justice and truth at the sacrifice of an easy life, and often giving their lives to the cause. But God was going to come in victory and proclaim His Kingdom by taking control, and showing His authority by domination.

    Until Jesus died, all His words did not make sense. The essential nature of the Kingdom, can be seen in Pauls life, and the way of life in Jesus's words. But as Paul says this is the way of the Spirit and not the flesh. Before Jesus's death the way of the Spirit was not possible, because only John the Baptist was filled with the Spirit all his life.
     
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  13. BARNEY BRIGHT

    BARNEY BRIGHT Well-Known Member

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    This goes back to Abraham I believe. Those who are saved are saved by faith. This is the Gospel of Grace. Which was preached to both Jews and Gentiles or uncircumcised and circumcised. Those who would be saved would be those who had a faith like Abraham. Abraham showed that he had faith when he was uncircumcised then because he showed such faith before he was circumcised God commanded him to circumcised all males that belonged to him whether they be family or servants. This made Abraham the Father of everyone who had a faith like him whether they be circumcised or uncircumcised
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2019
  14. Episkopos

    Episkopos Well-Known Member

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    This is an unfortunate choice of words in the English translation. The Greek makes no inference to it being the gospel OF one or the other. It could be implied but it is not definitive, So again the vagueness of the bible leads people to jump the gun and interpret it with the carnal mind.

    There is but one gospel....the fact that Paul himself says that there is no difference in Christ between Jew or Greek...should be enough to bring clarity to vaguenesses elsewhere.

    Unless there is a religious agenda involved!
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2019
  15. Doug

    Doug Active Member

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    Please allow me to address below this statement first if you will:
    "Yeah it was the same Gospel throughout, even what the 12 Apostles preached."

    Here are the differences in preaching between the twelve and Paul:

    1)The name of Jesus

    The twelve preached whosoever believed only in the name of Jesus were saved with no mention of the cross..... John 1:12 John 3:18 John 20:31 Acts 10:43

    Paul preached salvation in the name of Jesus and the cross......Galatians 6:14 1 Timothy 1:16

    2)Baptism....the twelve preached salvation upon baptism Acts 2:38 Mark 16:16

    Paul was not sent to baptize......1 Corinthians 1:17

    3)The Holy Ghost.....receiving the Holy Ghost upon baptism.....Acts 2:38

    Holy Ghost received upon belief......Ephesians 1:13

    4)The kingdom...the twelve preached the kingdom gospel of the earthly Davidic kingdom.... Luke 9:2 Luke 9:6

    Paul spoke of a heavenly kingdom.....2 Timothy 4:18

    5)Forgiveness...the twelve preached forgiveness at the coming of Christ....Acts 3:19

    Paul preached forgiveness now in Christ.....Colossians 1:14

    6)Salvation...the twelve preached salvation at the coming of Christ....Acts 3:19 1 Peter 1:5 1 Peter 1:7

    Paul preached salvation now.....Ephesians 2:8

    7)Destination.....The twelve were inheriting the Davidic kingdom on earth.....Luke 22:30

    Paul preached the heavenly places for the body of Christ....Ephesians 2:6

    Here are the similarities between the twelve and Paul:

    1)The name of Jesus...The twelve preached the name of Jesus....John 1:12

    Paul preached the name of Jesus....Acts 9:29 Romans 1:5 1 Corinthians 1:2

    2)Jesus the Christ, the Son of God....The twelve preached Jesus as Messiah, the Son of God....Matthew 16:16

    Paul preached Jesus as the Christ, the Son of God....2 Corinthians 1:19

    3)The gospel of Christ....the twelve preached the gospel of Christ....Mark 1:1

    Paul preached the gospel of Christ (but with further revelations)....Romans 1:16

    You can decide if they preached the same gospel based on comparing scripture.
     
  16. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    No need to compare scriptures.

    If the twelve preached a different gospel than Paul, then they are accursed (Galatians 1:6-9).

    I don't believe that this is the case; for they will sit upon twelve thrones judging the tribes of Israel.

    And this means that they are not accursed; but blessed.
     
  17. Doug

    Doug Active Member

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    Look at Galatians 2:7-8.....God worked effectually in both Peter and Paul...neither was accursed for their gospels or ministries; they were separate dispensations.
     
  18. Doug

    Doug Active Member

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    If Matthew 8 speaks of the Gentiles entering the kingdom that would not be unexpected since Gentiles would enter the kingdom as can be seen in Matthew 25:32-46.

    I am glad you acknowledge Christ will reign over a literal kingdom on earth as many deny this.

    I also have not studied it out but was wondering if the marriage supper was in connection to the kingdom.

    In Acts 10 the Gentiles believed and this may be the related to the diminishing of Israel.....The Gentiles who believed were always blessed and could be proselytes.

    Good discussion
     
  19. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Which indicates that Peter's gospel was not different from Paul's; for if it had been he would have been accursed (Galatians 1:6-9).

    btw, both preached during the dispensation that occurred with the New Testament...so they were not preaching out of different dispensations.
     
  20. Davy

    Davy Well-Known Member

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    Jesus is God, come in the flesh. Your personal philosophy has you confused, and nor does it follow God's Holy Writ. God's plan of Salvation is ONLY through His Son Jesus Christ Who died on the cross for the remission of sins of those who believe. There is no other way of Salvation. This was the purpose of God being born in the flesh and called Immanuel (means 'God with us'), for to defeat death and the devil for us on His cross. And that is The Gospel, there is not another gospel.
     
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