The Lottery

[lforrest]

You're a fan of Stand By Me too eh?

I used to love that movie.

 

[April_Rose]

I used to love that movie.

Lol I thought that's where you got the holler train part. XD

 

[Taken]

Moral dilemma come along all the time.

And I heard of a new one but in reality it's an old one. Very very old.

You are walking along one day and come across a set of railroad tracks and a switch. You see a train coming down the tracks. On one set there are 5-20 people tied to the tracks and on the other just a single person tied to the track.

There's no time to cut anyone free from the tracks you only have time to pull the switch or not.

If you pull the switch you are going to kill one person but save the others. You will be guilty of killing one person. If you do nothing the group of others are going to die but you won't have any culpability in their death.

So...this is where the lottery comes in.

There are lots of people who need organ transplants. Hearts, lungs, liver, kidneys, and etc so they can live. If we were to have a mandatory lottery of healthy people that we kill and harvest their organs many people will live for 20+ years or more. Sure that one healthy person will die but the other people will live...they will die without the organs.

By either voting for or against the lottery...or even doing nothing you are making a definitive choice in this dilemma.

Which one do you choose. Do you pull the switch and kill someone? Do you do nothing and kill the others?

Probably do a bit of preaching on accepting the Lords offering of Salvation ... then
go looking for the ones who tied them to the tracks, find them, preach the Lords offering to them, and turn them over to authorities.

 

[JohnDB]

Probably do a bit of preaching on accepting the Lords offering of Salvation ... then
go looking for the ones who tied them to the tracks, find them, preach the Lords offering to them, and turn them over to authorities.

So...
Considering your dodging the question...
I'm guessing that you really don't have an answer...but you know you should.

It's a morality question.
And you should have an answer.

 

[Taken]

So...
Considering your dodging the question...
I'm guessing that you really don't have an answer...but you know you should.

It's a morality question.
And you should have an answer.

I gave an answer pertaining to cause,
it just wasn't the answers you gave as a choice, pertaining to effect.

 

[JohnDB]

I gave an answer pertaining to cause,
it just wasn't the answers you gave as a choice, pertaining to effect.

Exactly.
That's Confuciousism. Not a Christian perspective.
There is a Christian answer to the question on morality. (Scriptures are complete)

You might not know it though.

 

[Taken]

Exactly.
That's Confuciousism. Not a Christian perspective.
There is a Christian answer to the question on morality. (Scriptures are complete)

You might not know it though.

Confucisosism ... is your claim, not mine.

Scripture teaches to Spread the Lords Word.
Scripture teaches ALL body's SHALL die.
Scriptures teaches don't worry about the Death of Body's...
Scriptures teaches a man receiving the Lords Gift of Salvation Trumps, the saving of ones BODY.

MORAL -
hinges on what is RIGHT VS WRONG.

You may be looking for the response to SAVE the ONE, as Jesus taught, saving ONE that has wandered off.

None of these are Wandering. They are all tied, captured.
And there is no notice ANY are Spiritually Saved, which Scripture teaches Salvation IS the key to RIGHT and eternal life.

 

[JohnDB]

Confucisosism ... is your claim, not mine.

Scripture teaches to Spread the Lords Word.
Scripture teaches ALL body's SHALL die.
Scriptures teaches don't worry about the Death of Body's...
Scriptures teaches a man receiving the Lords Gift of Salvation Trumps, the saving of ones BODY.

MORAL -
hinges on what is RIGHT VS WRONG.

You may be looking for the response to SAVE the ONE, as Jesus taught, saving ONE that has wandered off.

None of these are Wandering. They are all tied, captured.
And there is no notice ANY are Spiritually Saved, which Scripture teaches Salvation IS the key to RIGHT and eternal life.

I didn't say or imply what the correct/Christian moral answer was. I was asking. You haven't answered except with an almost identical answer as Confusious would answer with.

And you haven't answered me with anything yet except to complain about the scenarios presented.

I gave my wife the biblically based answer that I think is correct and why.

And when you finally figure out an answer I want to know YOUR reasoning as to why you either pulled the switch or not.

 

[Taken]

I didn't say or imply what the correct/Christian moral answer was. I was asking. You haven't answered except with an almost identical answer as Confusious would answer with.

And you haven't answered me with anything yet except to complain about the scenarios presented.

I gave my wife the biblically based answer that I think is correct and why.

And when you finally figure out an answer I want to know YOUR reasoning as to why you either pulled the switch or not.

No I did not complain about the scenario.
No I did not say I considered Confusiousism.
No I did not say I would pull the switch.

Yes I did give a Scriptural answer.

Yes preaching the Lords gift of Salvation to receive forgiveness, save the soul, quicken the spirit, quicken the body, supersedes saving an earthly body...IS Scripturally and Morally correct.

Yes my answer was in line with Scripture -
* Preach the truth - allow individuals their own freewill choice concerning their own lives.
* Hold accountable the parties responsible for threatening or causing physical death of others.

I don't know anything about pulling a train switch, completely, half way, or derailing trains, or me making a split decision of which strangers should physically live and which strangers should physically die.

I do know Scripture. Eternal life is a choice made by the individuals, while they ARE Earthly alive. And Scripture expressly teaches to spread the Word of God, that others may know and freely choose eternal life for themselves...or not.

In your scenario, people are aware of death at their door step, not unlike a person lawfully sentenced to death...knowing they shall die...and having opportunity to be given the Word of God, and confess their Acceptance of Belief...or not.

 

[JohnDB]

No I did not complain about the scenario.
No I did not say I considered Confusiousism.
No I did not say I would pull the switch.

Yes I did give a Scriptural answer.

Yes preaching the Lords gift of Salvation to receive forgiveness, save the soul, quicken the spirit, quicken the body, supersedes saving an earthly body...IS Scripturally and Morally correct.

Yes my answer was in line with Scripture -
* Preach the truth - allow individuals their own freewill choice concerning their own lives.
* Hold accountable the parties responsible for threatening or causing physical death of others.

I don't know anything about pulling a train switch, completely, half way, or derailing trains, or me making a split decision of which strangers should physically live and which strangers should physically die.

I do know Scripture. Eternal life is a choice made by the individuals, while they ARE Earthly alive. And Scripture expressly teaches to spread the Word of God, that others may know and freely choose eternal life for themselves...or not.

In your scenario, people are aware of death at their door step, not unlike a person lawfully sentenced to death...knowing they shall die...and having opportunity to be given the Word of God, and confess their Acceptance of Belief...or not.

So...
In simplistic fashion tell me...

Are you pulling the switch or not?

And WHY?

 

[Taken]

So...
In simplistic fashion tell me...

Are you pulling the switch or not?

And WHY?

Already expressly answered quite clearly.

No switch was pulled.
Saving a body is secondary to one choosing to save their soul.
Split decision. I expressly revealed, knowing how one can save their soul, was paramount to saving their body.

 

[JohnDB]

Already expressly answered quite clearly.

No switch was pulled.
Saving a body is secondary to one choosing to save their soul.
Split decision. I expressly revealed, knowing how one can save their soul, was paramount to saving their body.

You do understand that the train is moving fast and you likely won't get a message of salvation spoke completely. They will probably be saying "What?" Just as the train hits them.

So you will let the 5 die without even being able to give them a message of salvation?

 

[Taken]

You do understand that the train is moving fast and you likely won't get a message of salvation spoke completely. They will probably be saying "What?" Just as the train hits them.

So you will let the 5 die without even being able to give them a message of salvation?

Your implication is an unspecified time...
Time to go to the switch? Or did the person happen to have the switch handle in his hand at the same time he notice people tied on the tracks....

Hypotheticals rarely have a complete set of hypothetical facts.
What to do, What to do....pick and choose body's to save...or tell them all of Gods Salvation for all of them?
Believe, Confess, and y'all are saved.
End of story.

 

[amadeus]

Now where you might not want to consider this... you already have probably made this choice in multiple ways... multiple times.

Organ donor? Ever been one?

Butterfly effects are very real too.

So... what choices have you made?

Did you choose the same as Judas or the High Priest did?
Or did you choose the same as John and just watch at a distance.

If we have decided in our heart to live for God and follow Him, then the answer is His to give to us when and if it is needed.

Hypothetical questions do not give us God's answers in each real case. The Holy Spirit leading us does... but who is listening to God now and for every "now" that lies before him?

@amigo de christo already gave the correct answer here. Here are a couple of verses to consider in this:

"Pray without ceasing." I Thess 5:17

"Rejoice in the Lord always. Again I will say, rejoice!" Phil 4:4

Are we doing those things or are quenching the Holy Spirit of God in us?

Is it possible to pray without ceasing and to rejoice in the Lord always?

"And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible." Mark 10:27

Is God in us leading us... or not?