The many errors and contradictions found in Amillennialism.

[WPM]

Is the Lord Jesus Christ sitting as King over in Jerusalem/Israel right now?

Where the "surviving nations" are to come every year to worship Him during the Feast of Tabernacles.

Yes. True Jerusalem - the New Jerusalem. Not Christ-rejecting Jerusalem that is in bondage with her children.

 

[Truth7t7]

Rev 21 does not take place until Rev 19 and Rev 20

The book of Revelation is seen in "Parallel" teachings of same events, not chronologically as dispensationalism falsely teaches

Examples: The 7th vial and 7th Trump represent (The End) in "Parallel" teachings

Revelation 11:18 & 20:11-15 represents the final judgement in "Parallel" teachings

Revelation 16:12-17 & Revelation 20:7-8 represent the very same nation's being gathered to the same final battle, that will see the 7th vial and fire from heaven (It Is Done/The End)

Jesus Is The Lord

 

[David in NJ]

Yes. True Jerusalem - the New Jerusalem. Not Christ-rejecting Jerusalem that is in bondage with her children.

Zechariah ch14 takes place on earth - NOT in Heaven.

 

[ewq1938]

The fact is, all scripture that you believe is a millennial kingdom on this earth, Isaiah 11, 65, 66, Zechariah 14, is actually the New Heaven, Earth, Jerusalem, after the Lord's last day judgement by fire

The feast of tabernacles, new moons, sabbath days, will be observed eternally

There will be houses built, vineyards planted, rivers, fish, fishermen, fishing nets, land divided, animals dwelling in peace, lamb, lion, wolf, ox

So the eternity still means men will fish? Doesn't that mean the fish will be killed? That new world sounds very similar to this one.

 

[David in NJ]

The book of Revelation is seen in "Parallel" teachings of same events, not chronologically as dispensationalism falsely teaches

Examples: The 7th vial and 7th Trump represent (The End) in "Parallel" teachings

Revelation 11:18 & 20:11-15 represents the final judgement in "Parallel" teachings

Revelation 16:12-17 & Revelation 20:7-8 represent the very same nation's being gathered to the same final battle, that will see the 7th vial and fire from heaven (It Is Done/The End)

Jesus Is The Lord

Parts of Revelation has a repeating chronological order.

Chapters 19, 20 and 21 are distinctly chronological = they are not repeating or parallel

 

[WPM]

Zechariah ch14 takes place on earth - NOT in Heaven.

Jesus reigns over all the earth. This passage is portraying the great global expanse of the Gospel. God would no longer be limited to one small nation in the Middle East. Indeed “the LORD shall be king over all the earth.” When Christ came, He ushered the great evangelization of the nations. Nations that were once hopelessly outside of Christ and outside of hope would now, in this Gospel age, experience God in a very personal and living way. He is now the Lord of the nations. The heathen have been embracing Him in their millions for years. Jew and Gentile are all one in Christ now. There is no longer any division between the two. There is one Lord and Saviour of all the earth.

 

[WPM]

Chapters 19, 20 and 21 are distinctly chronological = they are not repeating or parallel

According to you. But this opinion contradicts numerous other climactic Scripture. Rev 20 is the beginning of the last recap in Revelation.

 

[Truth7t7]

So the eternity still means men will fish? Doesn't that mean the fish will be killed? That new world sounds very similar to this one.

Yes the "Eternal Kingdom" will have fish, fishermen fishing nets, the tree and river of life will be present, Yes that seen below is the very same place in "Eternity"

Read it again and again, a river, fish, fishermen, fishing nets, the tree and river of life "Eternal"

Ezekiel 47:7-12KJV
7 Now when I had returned, behold, at the bank of the river were very many trees on the one side and on the other.
8 Then said he unto me, These waters issue out toward the east country, and go down into the desert, and go into the sea: which being brought forth into the sea, the waters shall be healed.
9 And it shall come to pass, that every thing that liveth, which moveth, whithersoever the rivers shall come, shall live: and there shall be a very great multitude of fish, because these waters shall come thither: for they shall be healed; and every thing shall live whither the river cometh.
10 And it shall come to pass, that the fishers shall stand upon it from Engedi even unto Eneglaim; they shall be a place to spread forth nets; their fish shall be according to their kinds, as the fish of the great sea, exceeding many.
11 But the miry places thereof and the marishes thereof shall not be healed; they shall be given to salt.

(The River And Tree Of Life)

12 And by the river upon the bank thereof, on this side and on that side, shall grow all trees for meat, whose leaf shall not fade, neither shall the fruit thereof be consumed: it shall bring forth new fruit according to his months, because their waters they issued out of the sanctuary: and the fruit thereof shall be for meat, and the leaf thereof for medicine.

(The River And Tree Of Life)

Revelation 22:1-2KJV
And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.
2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.

 

[ewq1938]

The book of Revelation is seen in "Parallel" teachings of same events, not chronologically as dispensationalism falsely teaches

Examples: The 7th vial and 7th Trump represent (The End) in "Parallel" teachings

No. Once the 7th trump sounds the vials will pour. There is nothing parallel about that.

Revelation 11:18 & 20:11-15 represents the final judgement in "Parallel" teachings

Nope, not even close. Rev 11 shows the end of the GT and the 7th trump which is when the second coming happens. Rev 20:11-15 is over a thousand years later.

Revelation 16:12-17 & Revelation 20:7-8 represent the very same nation's being gathered to the same final battle

They are two separate battles at two separate places, with different armies and different ways of death. You might as well claim the civil war was the same war as WW2.

 

[ewq1938]

Yes the "Eternal Kingdom" will have fish, fishermen fishing nets

So fish die and people eat them?

 

[Truth7t7]

Parts of Revelation has a repeating chronological order.

Chapters 19, 20 and 21 are distinctly chronological = they are not repeating or parallel

We disagree, Revelation 16, 19, 20, are the very same battle in parallel teachings

Jesus Is The Lord

 

[Truth7t7]

So fish die and people eat them?

Read the scripture below and tell me if fish are dying and being eaten?

Smiles!

Ezekiel 47:7-10KJV
7 Now when I had returned, behold, at the bank of the river were very many trees on the one side and on the other.
8 Then said he unto me, These waters issue out toward the east country, and go down into the desert, and go into the sea: which being brought forth into the sea, the waters shall be healed.
9 And it shall come to pass, that every thing that liveth, which moveth, whithersoever the rivers shall come, shall live: and there shall be a very great multitude of fish, because these waters shall come thither: for they shall be healed; and every thing shall live whither the river cometh.
10 And it shall come to pass, that the fishers shall stand upon it from Engedi even unto Eneglaim; they shall be a place to spread forth nets; their fish shall be according to their kinds, as the fish of the great sea, exceeding many.

 

[David in NJ]

Jesus reigns over all the earth. This passage is portraying the great global expanse of the Gospel. God would no longer be limited to one small nation in the Middle East. Indeed “the LORD shall be king over all the earth.” When Christ came, He ushered the great evangelization of the nations. Nations that were once hopelessly outside of Christ and outside of hope would now, in this Gospel age, experience God in a very personal and living way. He is now the Lord of the nations. The heathen have been embracing Him in their millions for years. Jew and Gentile are all one in Christ now. There is no longer any division between the two. There is one Lord and Saviour of all the earth.

Zech 14 is not about the First Coming of the Lord but His Second Coming to EARTH.

 

[David in NJ]

According to you. But this opinion contradicts numerous other climactic Scripture. Rev 20 is the beginning of the last recap in Revelation.

No it does not.

But you can have a go at it and try and demonstrate that.

 

[Timtofly]

How can they have all risen?

The Resurrection cannot occur until Christ Returns = 1 Thess 4:13-18

Brothers, we do not want you to be uninformed about those who sleep in death,c so that you will not grieve like the rest, who are without hope. 14For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again, we also believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in Him.

15By the word of the Lord, we declare to you that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who have fallen asleep.
16For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a loud command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will be the first to rise.
17After that, we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord.

18Therefore encourage one another with these words.

If Jesus brings them with Him, they have all already risen. They certainly are not 6 feet under ground. That is not the direction Jesus is coming from.

 

[David in NJ]

We disagree, Revelation 16, 19, 20, are the very same battle in parallel teachings

Jesus Is The Lord

Rev 16 the Lord has not descended to the earth = only in ch19 does the Lord actually descend to the earth.

 

[Truth7t7]

Zechariah ch14 takes place on earth - NOT in Heaven.

Zechariah 14:12-15 represents (The End) as men are consumed by the Lord's fire in final judgement

Same Event Below In "Parallel" teachings

"When The Son Of Man Is Revealed"!

Zechariah 14:12KJV
12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

Revelation 20:9KJV
 9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

 

[David in NJ]

If Jesus brings them with Him, they have all already risen. They certainly are not 6 feet under ground. That is not the direction Jesus is coming from.

Jesus is bringing with Him the spirits of the saints which are in Heaven right now.

 

[David in NJ]

Zechariah 14:12-15 represents (The End) as men are consumed by the Lord's fire in final judgement

Same Event Below In "Parallel" teachings

"When The Son Of Man Is Revealed"!

Zechariah 14:12KJV
12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

Revelation 20:9KJV
 9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

Zech ch14 and Rev 20 are NOT parallel events = read more carefully.

Peace and Good Night

 

[WPM]

Zech 14 is not about the First Coming of the Lord but His Second Coming to EARTH.

Not so. Where is a millennium mentioned? where is any Rev 20 detail? Nowhere. If it is: your millennium is full of conflict, war and terror.

Zechariah 14 occurred 2000 years ago. Zechariah 14:1 declares, “Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.”

Hinneh Behold
yowm- day
baa' cometh
la-Yahweh the Lord
wªchulaq divides
shªlaaleek the spoils
bªqirbeek in the midst

This passage and especially its rendering in the King James Version has caused confusion to many Bible students over the years. However, a closer examination of the original dispels a lot of ambiguity surrounding the text. Firstly, the Hebrew does not actually say “the day of the Lord” as the King James Version renders it but ‘a day is coming for the Lord’.

There is no doubt, the phrase “the day of the Lord” normally relates to the second coming in Scripture, but Zechariah 14:1 does not state that in the original. We cannot therefore, with any certainty, insist upon the fact that this verse is referring to the day of the Lord. This places a completely different slant on the meaning of the whole chapter. Other versions translate the reading more accurate.

The NASB says: "Behold, a day is coming for the LORD when the spoil taken from you will be divided among you."

The YLT states: "Lo, a day hath come to Jehovah, And divided hath been thy spoil in thy midst."

A perusal of the Greek LXX Septuagint rendering of this passage supports this interpretation:

idou Behold
hmerai day
erxontai comes
tou the
kuriou Lord
kai even (or indeed)
diamerisqhsetai divides
ta the
skula spoils
sou you
en with
soi you

When we look at the usage of the Greek throughout the Old Testament (in the Greek LXX Septuagint) and our New Testament we find a definite pattern in relation to the wording and identification of the day of the Lord in the original.

In the New Testament:

Of the five “day of the Lord” passages in the New Testament, they read in the original:

Three are: “hemera kurios” (Acts 2:20, 1 Thessalonians 5:2, 2 Peter 3).

Two are: “hemera ho kurios” (1 Corinthians 5:5, 2 Corinthians 1:14).

In the Greek LXX Septuagint

Of the twenty “day of the Lord” passages in the Old Testament:

Eleven are: “hemera kurios” (Isaiah 13:6, 9, Ezekiel 13:5, 30:3, Joel 1:15, 2:1, 2:31, 3:14, Obadiah 1:15, Zephaniah 1:14, Malachi 4:5)

Four are: “hemera ho kurios” (Joel 2:11, Amos 5:18, 20, Zephaniah 1:7)

We can see, fifteen align precisely with the Greek New Testament wording and confirm that this would be the normal rendering of the coming of Christ in the Greek. That is 75%.

One reads: “hemera ekeinos kurios” (Jeremiah 46:10), also meaning day of the Lord.

One is: “hemera gar kurios” (Isaiah 2:12), literally meaning day for the Lord.

Finally, there are two references (one after the other in Zephaniah) that refer to the same climactic day. One says, “hemera thumos kurios” (Zephaniah 2:2), meaning a day of the Lord’s anger. The other reads, “hemera orge kurios” (Zephaniah 2:3), similarly meaning a day of the Lord’s anger. Plainly, they are both speaking of the same day in the same reading and in the same context.

That brings us to Zechariah 14:1, which is worded completely different from the rest, saying, “hmerai erxontai tou kuriou,” literally meaning “a day is coming for the LORD.” None of the other passages say this. It is not unreasonable to make a distinction between Zechariah’s description and that of the other nineteen references. The only similarity is the King James Version’s translation of the same in the English. Notwithstanding, regardless of how high one values the A.V. one cannot use this as conclusive proof for equating the day Zechariah is speaking of to the other nineteen. The original rendering supersedes any other translations.

Because this does not literally read “the day of the Lord” then we don’t have to understand it as “the day of the Lord.” If it were, it would have most likely read hemera kurios or hemera ho kurios in the Greek LXX Septuagint. Or failing that: hemera ekeinos kurios.

Whilst the wording of Zechariah 14:1 doesn't prevent it referring to the second coming of the Lord Jesus, the phrase ‘a day is coming for the Lord’ and ‘the day of the Lord’ are definitely not synonymous. It is therefore reasonable for us to question Premils identification of it with the second coming of the Lord and to consider the possibility that it relates to Christ’s first advent.