The sin of un-belief;

[H. Richard]

In the garden God told Adam and Eve that if they ate the fruit of a certain tree they would die. Then came Satan who said they would not die but become like God. Eve’s sin was not eating the fruit of the tree; it was her believing Satan instead of God; she committed the sin of un-belief. She believed Satan instead of God which leads into this question.

Question: Are there any religions that teach God has ALREADY provided a Pardon for ALL of man’s sins of the flesh. The scriptures below indicate that to me, how about you???

ALL SCRIPTURES FROM THE NKJV

Isa 53:5-6
5 But He was wounded for our transgressions, He was bruised for our iniquities; The chastisement for our peace was upon Him, And by His stripes we are healed.
6 All we like sheep have gone astray; We have turned, every one, to his own way; And the Lord has laid on Him the iniquity of us all.

Rom 3:24-25
24 being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,
25 whom God set forth as a propitiation by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His forbearance God had passed over the sins that were previously committed, NOTE: He did this because He knew their sins would be paid for on the cross.

Rom 5:8-9
8 But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.
9 Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him.

Eph 1:7-9
7 In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace
8 which He made to abound toward us in all wisdom and prudence,
9 having made known to us the mystery of His will, according to His good pleasure which He purposed in Himself,

Eph 2:13-16 -- Christ Our Peace
13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.
14 For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation,
15 having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace,
16 and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity. NOTE: The enmity was all the sins of the flesh.

Col 1:13-15
13 He has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son of His love,
14 in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins.

Col 1:21-23
21 And you, who once were alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now He has reconciled
22 in the body of His flesh through death, to present you holy, and blameless, and above reproach in His sight —
23 if indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel which you heard, which was preached to every creature under heaven, of which I, Paul, became a minister.

Did the ministry of Paul’s gospel of grace continue in the religions that man built???

 

[bbyrd009]

Question: Are there any religions that teach God has ALREADY provided a Pardon for ALL of man’s sins of the flesh.

strikes me as a central plank of Christianity, but UR (universal reconciliation, universalism, etc) is a Tentmaker forum thing, i found them after engaging with you a couple weeks ago.

Did the ministry of Paul’s gospel of grace continue in the religions that man built?

sure, you want hyper-grace, or judgement/righteous retribution? Which extreme are you interested in? We got plenty of both, see, but hardly no understanding that it doesn't matter how forgiven you are, if you are unrepentant, the forgiveness cannot be accepted, as Adam and Eve amply demonstrated.

 

[H. Richard]

strikes me as a central plank of Christianity, but UR (universal reconciliation, universalism, etc) is a Tentmaker forum thing, i found them after engaging with you a couple weeks ago.
sure, you want hyper-grace, or judgement/righteous retribution? Which extreme are you interested in? We got plenty of both, see, but hardly no understanding that it doesn't matter how forgiven you are, if you are unrepentant, the forgiveness cannot be accepted, as Adam and Eve amply demonstrated.

***
I see that you can not say yes or no but simple want to talk all around it by bringing up other issues. That mean your answer is no.

Maybe you could answer as to which of the scriptures given are wrong. They seem to be simple to understand.

 

[bbyrd009]

I see that you can not say yes or no but simple want to talk all around it by bringing up other issues. That mean your answer is no.

you weren't clear which reply you were referring to, so i gotta assume this one,

Did the ministry of Paul’s gospel of grace continue in the religions that man built?

and the problem imo with just answering "no" is that that would be ignoring how Grace does actually manifest in churches/religion, in response to all of the Law and Death that is preached--just like Grace is meant to do. Iow it comes across to us as rebellion and strife "in the body," but that is what Grace does, Grace abounds where sin abounds, which i know many will not be comfy identifying "church" as a place where sin abounds, but regardless the point is that Grace is opposed by some ppl, even as it is embraced by others. Grace causes problems wherever sin is, even if the "problems" uncover the sin and lead to solutions. Imo.

so yes, the ministry of grace continues in congregations, only it is not in the frame that we want to put it in.

 

[bbyrd009]

Maybe you could answer as to which of the scriptures given are wrong. They seem to be simple to understand.

You cannot be answered as long as you insist upon this frame though, see, any reply would be pointless, at least to you, at least right now, because of your mind-set at "which of the scriptures given are wrong." Iow you are advertising to me that any reply i give will be "wrong" to you, who has already made a decision

They are simple to understand, you are already forgiven for all of your sins, but that will not resolve the separation from God, as "Who told you that you were naked?" so vividly illustrates. Because of course Adam and Eve did not rebound from their sin at any time, right, they "hid." Yes, they were already forgiven, and no, it did not avail them a whit as far as healing the separation from God they now experienced. Hyper-grace is completely true imo, and completely unable to save anyone who does not rebound from sin herenow.

God's forgiveness will not save one, HR.
Maybe that is the way to discuss this, as it seems that lots of ppl currently believe forgiveness saves.

i started a thread on it, maybe you could state your case in that frame, and we'll see.

 

[H. Richard]

bb, in your first reply you tried to equate my belief as being universal reconciliation, universalism, and you know it is not. In the universal reconciliation, universalism, everyone will be saved. Under grace only those that put their belief, faith, trust and confidence in the work of Jesus on the cross will be saved. So your interjecting universalism is wrong. That is dishonest because I have never mentioned universalism.

If a persons sins have been atoned for, paid for, by God then that person is no longer condemned by their sins, period. You can go on and on with other comments if you wish but the truth is that Jesus paid for the sins of all mankind on the cross. Faith in that work saves a person. But that is not taught in religions. In religions mans works are necessary to complete a person's salvation. Your saying that religions teach that all sins have been atoned for is just plain wrong.

You said, "God's forgiveness will not save one, HR." You will have to explain this one.