The times and the season

[Prentis]

Hi brothers and sisters!

I was meditating on this today.
[sup]Matthew 16:[/sup][sup]2[/sup] He answered and said to them, “When it is evening you say, ‘It will be fair weather, for the sky is red’; [sup]3[/sup] and in the morning, ‘It will be foul weather today, for the sky is red and threatening.’ Hypocrites![sup][a][/sup] You know how to discern the face of the sky, but you cannot discern the signs of the times.

A brother was talking to me about following the Spirit. He was saying how we can read much of the scriptures, but if we do not have Spiritual discernment, spiritual eyes, we will not recognize the Lord when he comes.

I know, the last time we talked about the Spirit and about the Bible, it didn't go very well :)

But I wish to make an important point. Unless we have eyes to see, we will judge according to our eyes. We may even use the scriptures to do so! It is important to remember that even the devil uses the scriptures to battle, only his leading goes against the leading of the Spirit. The mistake we have made with the Bible is that we have taken it, and used it to say 'here, now we know what is good and what is evil'. That is true, but we are using it wrong. The Lord decides what is right in every situation and we cannot judge. We are walking in the way of the tree of good and evil when we do this. But we are simply to follow life, His life! Wherever the Spirit leads us we go. One day he says 'Go to these people, tell them of me, and speak the message I have given you.' Another he says 'be quiet, and wait upon me. The time is not come'.

The times and seasons of the Lord cannot be discerned by human reasoning or physical faculties. The Lord is Spirit, and by the Spirit do we discern the time and the season.

We must follow the Spirit, brothers and sisters. Seek him, in all things rejoice, and obey and surrender!

With much love to you all in our Lord Jesus Christ! :)

 

[veteran]

Prentis, I know you mean well, and that you wouldn't want to mislead any of the brethren. But the reason God sent His Holy Writ to us was so we could learn and come to understanding. He said in Isaiah 1 for us to come and reason together with Him. That does involve using our mind and common sense also, not just our heart.

When the devil uses Scripture, he always does things to change it, adding or taking away, which Luke 4 is our example. That's what the systems of men do; they change God's Word to fit their doctrine instead of letting God's Word interpret Itself.

The Holy Spirit is given as our Teacher and Comforter, and the way The Holy Spirit helps us to get understanding is through study of God's Holy Writ. The Holy Spirit is not our foundation only. People have visions, hear voices, and dream dreams, but how do we know those are of The Holy Spirit? The way to know is by checking it out in God's Word. God's Word was given by The Holy Spirit, so He will never go against His Word.

One of the things thorough Bible study in all of God's Word does is it allows The Holy Spirit to teach us using our spiritual mind instead of our fleshy mind. The way many Truths are laid out in God's Word is with a little bit here, and a little bit there, spanning the various Books of The Bible. Only once we've shown ourselves approved of God through that Bible study will The Holy Spirit cause us to remember and put it together in our mind and heart. God showed us how to study His Word in Isaiah 28, line upon line, precept upon precept, here a little, and there a little. It means discipline, and that's one of the requirements that makes a disciple of our Lord Jesus where His Truth will set us free.

 

[Prentis]

I know you mean well ;)

But that isn't the fact. The Bible is a great tool for the Lord to confirm what he's showing us, yes. But even for that to happen, the Spirit has to open our eyes to it. There was nothing in scripture to confirm to Ananias what the Lord told him when he said "Go to a street called Straight, there you will find Saul, and you will restore his eyesight". Our Spiritual senses must be trained and sharpened by our following the Lord so that we recognize his still small voice.

We can learn to follow the Spirit. We cannot learn to interpret the scriptures right. Only the Lord interprets in truth, and he can open that up to us.

The New Covenant is not of the Letter, but of the Spirit. Follow the letter and you will stumble. Only the Lord can keep you from stumbling, and he will do so when you follow his voice.

 

[veteran]

I know you mean well ;)

But that isn't the fact. The Bible is a great tool for the Lord to confirm what he's showing us, yes. But even for that to happen, the Spirit has to open our eyes to it. There was nothing in scripture to confirm to Ananias what the Lord told him when he said "Go to a street called Straight, there you will find Saul, and you will restore his eyesight". Our Spiritual senses must be trained and sharpened by our following the Lord so that we recognize his still small voice.

We can learn to follow the Spirit. We cannot learn to interpret the scriptures right. Only the Lord interprets in truth, and he can open that up to us.

The New Covenant is not of the Letter, but of the Spirit. Follow the letter and you will stumble. Only the Lord can keep you from stumbling, and he will do so when you follow his voice.

We're still talking about two different workings, for The Holy Spirit giving us understanding in His Word is one thing, and following The Holy Spirit like the Ananias example is another working, but both aligned together for the same cause. We are not to pefer one working over the other, for there's no adding of any new New Testament Books today by any new apostle. All is already written. I'm sure Ananias was well studied in God's Word too.

 

[Prentis]

I don't think you understood my point. I will try and be clear :)

I do agree that the scriptures are good to study. But we can't follow the scriptures. Yes, we must line up with them, but that is by following the Spirit. The ironic thing is that if you try to line yourself up with scripture by following scripture, it doesn't work. The scriptures point to the Spirit.

2 Corinthians 3

[sup]1[/sup]Do we begin again to commend ourselves? or need we, as some others, epistles of commendation to you, or letters of commendation from you?
[sup]2[/sup]Ye are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read of all men:
[sup]3[/sup]Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.
[sup]4[/sup]And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward:
[sup]5[/sup]Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;
[sup]6[/sup]Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life

We are to be living epistles, written by the Spirit. The Lord has not stopped sending his message through men. Still today, we can be God's workmanship if only we submit to him, seek him, trust him, and put him first in all things!

Isn't it glorious?

 

[veteran]

I don't think you understood my point. I will try and be clear :)

I do agree that the scriptures are good to study. But we can't follow the scriptures. Yes, we must line up with them, but that is by following the Spirit. The ironic thing is that if you try to line yourself up with scripture by following scripture, it doesn't work. The scriptures point to the Spirit.

2 Corinthians 3

[sup]1[/sup]Do we begin again to commend ourselves? or need we, as some others, epistles of commendation to you, or letters of commendation from you?
[sup]2[/sup]Ye are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read of all men:
[sup]3[/sup]Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.
[sup]4[/sup]And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward:
[sup]5[/sup]Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;
[sup]6[/sup]Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life

We are to be living epistles, written by the Spirit. The Lord has not stopped sending his message through men. Still today, we can be God's workmanship if only we submit to him, seek him, trust him, and put him first in all things!

Isn't it glorious?

You're confusing the "letter" idea Paul mentioned in Scripture like Rom.2:29, Rom.7:6, etc. Christ gave an example of that in Matt.5 when teaching the 'spirit' of God's commandments, vs. Mark 7:7 about the teachings of commandments of men.

In none... of those Scripture examples is our Lord Jesus or His Apostles teaching not to heed God's Holy Writ.

In other words, God's Holy Writ is not simply 'letters' like how the false scribes and Pharisees were treating It. The following of the 'letter' idea Paul was speaking of was in simply following something by 'rote', treating the following of God's Word like some ceremonial ritual method of worship, stuff like the pagans do. If that were not so Apostle Paul would not have told Timothy to "Study to shew thyself approved of God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.' By that we are actually to become a 'workman' in God's Holy Writ.

The Old Testament prophets still hold a whole lot of prophecy of events of our near future, into Christ's Millennium, and all the way past that into God's Eternity. It would be silly to think that Apostle Paul, who was a scholar in God's Word, was teaching that Holy Writ no longer has importance for Christians, especially when our Lord Jesus said by continuing in His Word is how to become one of His disciples, with His Truth making us free.

That reminds me of something else...

Rev 1:3
3 Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand.
(KJV)

From another thread you were on, I suspect you're heeding the 'Kingdom now' philosophy that's some have today, thinking that Christ's Millennium has already started today. If you believe that, then you're in grave danger.

 

[Prentis]

Veteran,

I did not say the scriptures were unimportant or not usefull. I said we must follow the Spirit. He will teach us. Here's what I said:

I do agree that the scriptures are good to study. But we can't follow the scriptures. Yes, we must line up with them, but that is by following the Spirit.

No, I do not believe the Millenium has started, far from it! Again, I do not think you understand the main point I am trying to make.

But I do believe that we can walk in the power of the Kingdom now, though the kingdom is not yet here on this earth. We can enter into it by the Spirit. Hebrews 6:[sup]4[/sup] For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, [sup]5[/sup] and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come...

You seem to study the scriptures so much, don't you know that the kingdom of God is not in word, but in power?

 

[veteran]

Veteran,

I did not say the scriptures were unimportant or not usefull. I said we must follow the Spirit. He will teach us. Here's what I said:


No, I do not believe the Millenium has started, far from it! Again, I do not think you understand the main point I am trying to make.

But I do believe that we can walk in the power of the Kingdom now, though the kingdom is not yet here on this earth. We can enter into it by the Spirit. Hebrews 6:[sup]4[/sup] For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, [sup]5[/sup] and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come...

You seem to study the scriptures so much, don't you know that the kingdom of God is not in word, but in power?

Yes, I well... know God's Kingdom is about Power. It's because The Word of God is Power...

Heb 4:12
12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
(KJV)

 

[Prentis]

So the word of God discerns us, not us the word of God.

You... know the kingdom of God is about Power, as you say. The word speaks of that power, we are to walk in it.

 

[Rach1370]

Hey Prentis. Are you saying that if we try to 'conform' to the scriptures by ourselves, we simply can't do it. It's like trying to 'save' ourselves. It's only through the Spirit guiding our lives and hearts that we have any real hope of making our life echo what the bible teaches.
This is a topic I'm very interested in at the moment. I feel that I don't understand the Spirit or His work very well, and it is causing a great lack in my Christian walk. I think that orthodox Christianity tends to overlook the Spirit too much, which may be a response to the over Charismatic branches. But we can't ignore Him. He is part of the Trinity, the third person of God who is at work in us today. That's huge! I know He's with me, I can feel Him working in my life, but I can't help but feel that He's got a lot more planned for me! And the only thing that can come from me understanding and submitting to Him more, is glory to God...and I so very want my life to be a testament to His glory!

 

[Prentis]

Yes! That's what I'm talking about, Rach! :)

Only HE can make us like him, so it's when we folloe Him, through the Spirit, that we are conformed to his word :)

I pray that the Lord would make this a reality in our lives

 

[ajdiamond]

Jesus said in John 5:39:40(ESV)--You search the scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life...yet you refuse to come to me that you may have Life.

We can overlook that passage because, hey, I accepted Jesus as my personal Lord and Saviour, so of course, I came to Him to have Life. But, when we want a practical effective walk in Spirit, we take heed of such warnings. Does life come from the bible and our interpretations and readings or does it come from Christ?

We are all familiar with I am the way, the truth and the life. In alot of religions the way is the Romans Road, the truth is the bible and the life is an after death experience. But, that is not so. Christ, now, in us, here and now, today; Christ formed in us, the mind of Christ in us, the Spirit of Christ in us, that is the kingdom and that is the Power; after all, where is the kingdom of God? (hint Luke 17:21)

 

[Prentis]

Jesus said in John 5:39:40(ESV)--You search the scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life...yet you refuse to come to me that you may have Life.

We can overlook that passage because, hey, I accepted Jesus as my personal Lord and Saviour, so of course, I came to Him to have Life. But, when we want a practical effective walk in Spirit, we take heed of such warnings. Does life come from the bible and our interpretations and readings or does it come from Christ?

We are all familiar with I am the way, the truth and the life. In alot of religions the way is the Romans Road, the truth is the bible and the life is an after death experience. But, that is not so. Christ, now, in us, here and now, today; Christ formed in us, the mind of Christ in us, the Spirit of Christ in us, that is the kingdom and that is the Power; after all, where is the kingdom of God? (hint Luke 17:21)

Amen! Good post brother! :)

We get to choose NOW between the tree of Good and Evil and the tree of Life, which is Christ. Eternal life is begins now.