The Trinity is NO lie.

[justbyfaith]

why du say the trinity is no lie?

In response to another thread in which the title is, "The Trinity is a Lie."

And also, because the doctrine of the Trinity (as I understand it) is sound doctrine.

 

[justbyfaith]

I would suggest really thinking about how the following verses apply together, according to the hermeneutic found in 1 Corinthians 2:13:

Eph 4:5, One Lord, one faith, one baptism,

Mar 12:29, And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:

1Co 8:6, But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.

Mat 11:25, At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes.

Luk 10:21, In that hour Jesus rejoiced in spirit, and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes: even so, Father; for so it seemed good in thy sight.

1Co 12:3, Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

 

[justbyfaith]

edited #6 (The Trinity is NO lie.)

 

[DoveSpirit05]

Well, then, kurios, also, can only refer to one Person in all of history...because of the following verses, which say that there is one Kurios:



These verses show that kurios does not refer to "anyone in authority," but to only one Person in authority, if what you say is true, and the capitalizations of letters in the translations of our current Bibles are not inspired.

There is one Kurios. That is what these verses teach us.

And therefore if the distinctions made by capitalizations are not valid, we have a problem.

Because of course in 1 Corinthians 8:5 it says that there are lords many.

But if capitalizations don't matter, you have to remember that there is only one lord; according to the verses that I have quoted above (in the quote box).

If they do matter, then the one Lord of scripture is different from what is being spoken of by lords many in 1 Corinthians 8:5.

It only fits if the capitalizations matter. Otherwise you have a contradiction: one lord, and lords many. or: one Lord, and Lords many.

If capitalizations do matter, then the accurate interpretation is: one Lord, and lords many.

Yeah but wat did jesus Christ say? 1st just 2 mention 1 john 5:7 says three persons not 3 Gods,
¶

Jhn 17:1 - These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:

Jhn 17:3 - And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
dats coming from jesus's own lips, he didn't say they may know us the only true God he said they might know you the only true God.

Jhn 17:4 - I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

who's was jesus praying too? the father right, he wasn't praying to himself right!

 

[justbyfaith]

who's was jesus praying too? the father right, he wasn't praying to himself right!

This is covered in the OP.

 

[justbyfaith]

Yeah but wat did jesus Christ say? 1st just 2 mention 1 john 5:7 says three persons not 3 Gods,

I'm in agreement that the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost are one.

This is not to say that God is three Persons; although I believe that He is.

It could be construed as saying that God is one Person.

He is also three; and I have explained how this can be in the OP; if you read carefully, you may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ.

 

[DoveSpirit05]

Ok, I hope 2 have a good discussion wiv u, wat is the op? and do u believe all 3 are God?

 

[justbyfaith]

wat is the op?

The first post in this thread (OP=Original Post)

 

[justbyfaith]

do u believe all 3 are God?

Yes.

 

[DoveSpirit05]

how so? where in the bible does he say he's 3 Gods?

 

[justbyfaith]

how so? where in the bible does he say he's 3 Gods?

Nope...I'm not promoting three Gods...I am preaching exactly one.

In fact, I have been lambasted by Tritheists (who thought that they were Trinitarian) over my emphasis on the Oneness in the Holy Trinity.

In this thread especially: (Trinity vs. Tritheism: Understanding the Trinity.)

But you have to understand what I'm preaching to get it...read what I've written and ask the Holy Spirit for illumination.

 

[DoveSpirit05]

but the trinity is a lie, there is only one God yes but 3 persons 1 john 5:7 and john 16:13-15 jesus is the (logos) and the holy spirit is Gods spirit both are part of God but separate beings and both are subordinate 2 the father. the trinity was started up by turtillian in 1st century just 2 describe the triune relationship between father, son, holy spirit. And now modern churches have taken it and run with it and have made a complete doctrine out of it.

 

[justbyfaith]

Consider that there is one Spirit (Ephesians 4:4) and that God (the Father) is that Spirit (John 4:23-24).

Have you considered that the Holy Ghost is also a Spirit (John 7:37-39)?

He is also a Person with a mind (Romans 8:27); who also makes intercession for us. That is not something that an active force normally does; normally those things are done by people.

 

[justbyfaith]

Please re-read the OP and also look at the thread that I linked you to above.

Here is the same link:

Trinity vs. Tritheism: Understanding the Trinity.

 

[DoveSpirit05]

As one who has been baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, but who did not (physically) continue with the Oneness Pentecostals to be indoctrinated by them, I nevertheless hold to a view of the Godhead that emphasizes His Oneness (although I do not deny the plurality within the Godhead).

I believe that, according to Isaiah 9:6-7, the son that was given shall be given the name of the everlasting Father; and that it is the zeal of the LORD of hosts that shall do this at a specific moment in history; which I believe is yet future (as I write this).

The Father did not vacate eternity when He descended to become the Son,

Eph 3:11, According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:

And thus, while the Father in flesh (Jesus Christ of Nazareth the Son of God) was on earth, He also remained behind in eternity and answered all of Jesus' prayers from that standpoint.

Isa 57:15, For thus saith the high and lofty One that inhabiteth eternity, whose name is Holy; I dwell in the high and holy place, with him also that is of a contrite and humble spirit, to revive the spirit of the humble, and to revive the heart of the contrite ones.

This would tell us that the Father dwells outside of time. He lived one eternal "moment" and then descended to become the Son.

Since One who dwells in eternity cannot vacate eternity (because He is not subject to time and therefore His existence in eternity cannot be spatially removed); therefore, when He descended to become the Son, the imprint of His nature remained behind in eternity; and this imprint is actually the Person of the pre-incarnate Jesus (the Father); while He also descended to take on human flesh; and that this Person in flesh, being the same Spirit and therefore the same Person, nevertheless assumed upon Himself human flesh which by necessity makes Him a different Person. Thus I speak forth the words of truth and soberness, that the Father is not the Son; but that the Son is the Father.

The one Spirit (see Ephesians 4:4) that dwells in the Son is the same Spirit (see 1 Corinthians 12:4-6) that inhabiteth eternity (Isaiah 57:15); even the Father.

Now comes the test...of whether you are willing to look at the scriptures that back up my pov.

Consider that John 4:23-24 tells us that the Father is a Spirit; that Ephesians 4:4 tells us that there is one Spirit; and that John 14:7-11 tells us that the Spirit that dwelt/dwelleth in Jesus Christ is the Father.

Therefore, it is clear to me from the holy scriptures, that Jesus Christ, in His Spirit, is the Father; but that He also left behind in eternity the distinct imprint of Himself (who is the Father, even a Person who is not only an imprint but the Person of the Father).

This is the One that Jesus prayed to. I have used terminology that is inadequate to explain my position; in all reality God the Father is not an imprint of God's nature but is God Himself. He both went forward to become the Son; and also stayed behind as the One who inhabiteth eternity. In this, the Father exists in eternity while the Son simultaneously exists on earth.

Now when Jesus rose from the dead, He rose to fill all things (Ephesians 4:10); while He continued to exist in a finite human body (1 John 4:1-3 (kjv), 2 John 1:7 (kjv)), which I believe is not subject to time. He ascended to exist outside of time, side-by-side with His pre-incarnate self. Thus, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." (John 1:1).

The Holy Ghost, who is also that one Spirit who dwelt/dwelleth in Christ, was also released by Christ back to the Father (Luke 23:46) into eternity. He is the same Spirit as the Father, and also has the experience behind Him of living the life of Jesus; and therefore He is the perfect One to come and dwell within us and to make intercession for the saints according to the will of God. He understands humanity; for He has been human.

Now there is one Spirit (Ephesians 4:4). That Spirit is the Father (John 4:23-24). But that Spirit is also the Holy Ghost (John 7:37-39).

The Holy Ghost proceeds from the Father (John 15:26); but He is also the same Spirit as the Father (1 Corinthians 12:4-6; also consider that there is one Spirit (Ephesians 4:4) and that this Spirit is both the Father (John 4:23-24) and the Holy Ghost (John 7:37-39).

All of this is in no way saying that God puts on hats or masks and puts on a different hat or mask for any occasion.

It is saying, however, that there is one God; even as the scripture teaches we would do well to believe (James 2:19).

The opposing viewpoint has the problem of being Tritheistic to a certain degree; in other words, you cannot get around the fact that they are preaching three Gods rather than the same God being all three members of the Trinity.

Why should it be surprising to you that I would make the statement that God is a Person?

The doctrine of the Trinity preaches that He is three-in-one; and the concepts that I place before you do not contradict this understanding.

Therefore, if you have a problem with what I am saying, go to the Lord about it. Seek Him. Ask Him if what I am saying is the case or not. And by all means, be a Berean (Acts 17:10-11).

Right on mannn!! we got off on the wrong foot, my mistake!! :)

 

[Nondenom40]

but the trinity is a lie, there is only one God yes but 3 persons 1 john 5:7 and john 16:13-15 jesus is the (logos) and the holy spirit is Gods spirit both are part of God but separate beings and both are subordinate 2 the father. the trinity was started up by turtillian in 1st century just 2 describe the triune relationship between father, son, holy spirit. And now modern churches have taken it and run with it and have made a complete doctrine out of it.

Tertullian didn't live in the first century but the late 2nd and early 3rd. He merely coined the term in his works; Against Praxis and On Modesty. Its always been a doctrine as it describes Gods nature. The trinity can be found in over 700 verses from Gen 1 through Rev 22.

 

[justbyfaith]

Right on mannn!! we got off on the wrong foot, my mistake!! :)

And here, I thought you might be a JW.

I take it you're Oneness?

 

[DoveSpirit05]

And here, I thought you might be a JW.

I take it you're Oneness?

No, just born Again Christian

 

[DoveSpirit05]

Tertullian didn't live in the first century but the late 2nd and early 3rd. He merely coined the term in his works; Against Praxis and On Modesty. Its always been a doctrine as it describes Gods nature. The trinity can be found in over 700 verses from Gen 1 through Rev 22.

ok yeah 2nd cent... wat 700 verses stating dat there are 3 Gods? or 3 persons? 3 persons maybe!

 

[justbyfaith]

No, just born Again Christian

Have you been baptized in Jesus' Name?

If you want, you can answer me by PM.