Twisted Verses: weapons of oppression?

[VictoryinJesus]

That's fine. But, you cannot change that Eve was deceived and Adam wasn't.

Stranger

Agree. Eve was deceived. Adam was not. It seems the place we disagree is, if I understand you correctly you are dividing out all men as if under Adam and lumping women as a whole under Eve. Eve is the mother of all living. Sin and deception go hand in hand. Adam not being deceived, foreshadows Christ. Christ was not deceived but rather joined His bride to redeem her from deception and a lie. We can’t see or even acknowledge our sin until God opens our eyes and shows it to us. We are all blind until we are born again from above. God has to wake us up and bring us out of darkness. That means we are all deceived by the world until God says otherwise. Deceived is deceived. The same measure. The same darkness across the whole. Yet, it seems you want to say men as a gender are only a little deceived. His word seems to say different in referencing bold words as adulteress, whore, fornication and Harlots...as a whole we are either as Eve was: deceived. or we are as His bride...walking in the path of light created by the Son. There is one bride. It isn’t based off gender otherwise you wouldn’t be a part of that bride. There is one king, one Lord, one husband and that is God.

1 Corinthians 6:11
[11] And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

Ephesians 5:25-27
[25] Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; [26] That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, [27] That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy nd without blemish.

That ‘he’ : cleanses it with the washing of water by the Word.

His bride. He washes ‘her’. His chruch. That includes you and I. To Him...we are the same. Both dependent on what only He can give.

When you say men ‘the gender’ are not as deceived. Again, using God as a means of promoting some superiority when: Acts 10:34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:

Yet He has respect for His. Those of the same degree of light and favor. Not half in or half out. washed clean by the blood of the Lamb. God’s covenant of peace is the same to all of His bride(body).

Leviticus 26:9-12
[9] For I will have respect unto you, and make you fruitful, and multiply you, and establish my covenant with you. [10] And ye shall eat old store, and bring forth the old because of the new. [11] And I will set my tabernacle among you: and my soul shall not abhor you. [12] And I will walk among you, and will be your God, and ye shall be my people.

 

[Truth7t7]

This thread is for any verses you feel have seriously been twisted and used as weapons. One I would like to contribute is:

Proverbs 21:9
[9] It is better to dwell in a corner of the housetop, than with a brawling woman in a wide house.

Twice in Proverbs, these exact words are spoken. (Proverbs 25:24) I'm confident God doesn't and never meant; an individual woman with her nagging. It is better to be on the rooftop than inside the house.

First: "corner"

Leviticus 19:9-10
[9] And when ye reap the harvest of your land, thou shalt not wholly reap the corners of thy field, neither shalt thou gather the gleanings of thy harvest. [10] And thou shalt not glean thy vineyard, neither shalt thou gather every grape of thy vineyard; thou shalt leave them for the poor and stranger: I am the Lord your God.

There are other verses; I won't post them all, but "corner" is significant.

Isaiah 11:12
[12] And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.

Grass on housetops: Psalm 129:6
[6] Let them be as the grass upon the housetops, which withereth afore it groweth up:

Does grass grow on rooftops? Had to look this one up.
Psalm 129:6 Commentaries: Let them be like grass upon the housetops, Which withers before it grows up;

Matthew 10:26-28
[26] Fear them not therefore: for there is nothing covered, that shall not be revealed; and hid, that shall not be known. [27] What I tell you in darkness, that speak ye in light: and what ye hear in the ear, that preach ye upon the housetops. [28] And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

Now Peter:

Acts 10:9-14
[9] On the morrow, as they went on their journey, and drew nigh unto the city, Peter went up upon the housetop to pray about the sixth hour: [10] And he became very hungry, and would have eaten: but while they made ready, he fell into a trance, [11] And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel descending unto him, as it had been a great sheet knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth: [12] Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air. [13] And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat. [14] But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean.

Acts 10:15
[15] And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.


A Wide house:
Jeremiah 22:13-17
[13] Woe unto him that buildeth his house by unrighteousness, and his chambers by wrong; that useth his neighbour's service without wages, and giveth him not for his work; [14] That saith, I will build me a wide house and large chambers, and cutteth him out windows; and it is cieled with cedar, and painted with vermilion. [15] Shalt thou reign, because thou closest thyself in cedar? did not thy father eat and drink, and do judgment and justice, and then it was well with him? [16] He judged the cause of the poor and needy; then it was well with him: was not this to know me? saith the Lord . [17] But thine eyes and thine heart are not but for thy covetousness, and for to shed innocent blood, and for oppression, and for violence, to do it .

Proverbs 21:9
[9] It is better to dwell in a corner of the housetop, than with a brawling woman in a wide house.

It is better to dwell in a corner of the housetop with "the poor" and "the stranger", then in a WIDE house (a WIDE house of "unrighteousness", "chambers of wrong", "covetousness", "innocent blood", "oppression", and "violence").

Luke 6:20
[20] And he lifted up his eyes on his disciples, and said, Blessed be ye poor: for yours is the kingdom of God.

James 1:27
[27] Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.

Don't reduce Proverds 21:9 to a sexist comment made by the Father, when it never was meant as one. The wide house is the harlot. Jezebel. (Proverbs 7:1-27). It is better to be with the Father-less and widows.

Luke 12:43-44
[43] Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing. [44] Of a truth I say unto you, that he will make him ruler over all that he hath.

I think those two verses always used?

1. Cleanliness is Next To Godlines?
2. God Helps Those Who Help Themselves?

 

[Coffee2018]

The OP asks if there are any verses that we think have been used as weapons and to list them. Since I have come to this site I have delved into the lgbt subject. Here is one verse that has been mistaught for many,many, years. Two words in this verse that Apologists on this issue are very aware have been deliberately been mistranslated but Christians in general are still in the dark about. The verse is 1Corinthians 6:9

"Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind..

We already know that the Koine Greuek word for 'fornicator' cannot be taken out of the 1st century and brought into today because it's meaning would change like the weather. The 2 words that the novice Christian tries to use as weapons are effeminate (malakos) and abusers of themselves with mankind. (arsenokoites).
The scholars who did the translating from the Greek into the English had words that were commonly used for the meanings of both. The slant that they wanted to portray to the readers by translating malakos as effeminate was that the verse was describing the passive male in a male/male sexual relationship. Knowing full well that if the Apostle Paul was describing that he would have used the word at the time for it (pathikos)- the passive penetrated partner.

The next word mistranslated (arsenokoite) is a word that the Apostle's Jewish audience would have immediately recognized, but his Gentile audience may not have. The Jews would have understood the word hearkening back to Leviticus 18:22 describing the Canaanite priest and priestesses>male/bedders.
Had the Apostle wanted to describe a man that is sexually attracted to other men he had some words that we're used at that time for that meaning: (paiderasste) which meant mad after or boy crazy. (arrenomanes) which meant sexual behaviour between males.

 

[Enoch111]

It is better to dwell in a corner of the housetop, than with a brawling woman in a wide house.

Not sure what you mean by "twisted" for this verse, since the meaning appears to be quite plain. It is not a "weapon" against all women, but is specific about the type of woman who should be dreaded.

A "brawling woman" is a contentious woman, always stirring up strife (possibly even a nagging woman), either within the household, or with the neighbors. Since strife is the opposite of harmony and peace, it would appear that such a woman is never at peace, and does not wish to see others at peace.

So for the potential husband, or for the current husband, this is a most unpleasant prospect. Therefore the proverb says that the man would be better off escaping to a corner of a housetop, than to live in a mansion ("wide house") with such a woman. Good advice if you ask me.

 

[quietthinker]

Agree. Eve was deceived. Adam was not. It seems the place we disagree is, if I understand you correctly you are dividing out all men as if under Adam and lumping women as a whole under Eve. Eve is the mother of all living. Sin and deception go hand in hand. Adam not being deceived, foreshadows Christ. Christ was not deceived but rather joined His bride to redeem her from deception and a lie. We can’t see or even acknowledge our sin until God opens our eyes and shows it to us. We are all blind until we are born again from above. God has to wake us up and bring us out of darkness. That means we are all deceived by the world until God says otherwise. Deceived is deceived. The same measure. The same darkness across the whole. Yet, it seems you want to say men as a gender are only a little deceived. His word seems to say different in referencing bold words as adulteress, whore, fornication and Harlots...as a whole we are either as Eve was: deceived. or we are as His bride...walking in the path of light created by the Son. There is one bride. It isn’t based off gender otherwise you wouldn’t be a part of that bride. There is one king, one Lord, one husband and that is God.

1 Corinthians 6:11
[11] And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

Ephesians 5:25-27
[25] Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; [26] That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, [27] That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy nd without blemish.

That ‘he’ : cleanses it with the washing of water by the Word.

His bride. He washes ‘her’. His chruch. That includes you and I. To Him...we are the same. Both dependent on what only He can give.

When you say men ‘the gender’ are not as deceived. Again, using God as a means of promoting some superiority when: Acts 10:34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:

Yet He has respect for His. Those of the same degree of light and favor. Not half in or half out. washed clean by the blood of the Lamb. God’s covenant of peace is the same to all of His bride(body).

Leviticus 26:9-12
[9] For I will have respect unto you, and make you fruitful, and multiply you, and establish my covenant with you. [10] And ye shall eat old store, and bring forth the old because of the new. [11] And I will set my tabernacle among you: and my soul shall not abhor you. [12] And I will walk among you, and will be your God, and ye shall be my people.

The texts quoted ViJ have jumped out at me. The washing with water and Leviticus 26. A deeper level of understanding. (10) and ye shall eat old store and bring forth old because of the new.

 

[Stranger]

The OP asks if there are any verses that we think have been used as weapons and to list them. Since I have come to this site I have delved into the lgbt subject. Here is one verse that has been mistaught for many,many, years. Two words in this verse that Apologists on this issue are very aware have been deliberately been mistranslated but Christians in general are still in the dark about. The verse is 1Corinthians 6:9

"Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind..

We already know that the Koine Greuek word for 'fornicator' cannot be taken out of the 1st century and brought into today because it's meaning would change like the weather. The 2 words that the novice Christian tries to use as weapons are effeminate (malakos) and abusers of themselves with mankind. (arsenokoites).
The scholars who did the translating from the Greek into the English had words that were commonly used for the meanings of both. The slant that they wanted to portray to the readers by translating malakos as effeminate was that the verse was describing the passive male in a male/male sexual relationship. Knowing full well that if the Apostle Paul was describing that he would have used the word at the time for it (pathikos)- the passive penetrated partner.

The next word mistranslated (arsenokoite) is a word that the Apostle's Jewish audience would have immediately recognized, but his Gentile audience may not have. The Jews would have understood the word hearkening back to Leviticus 18:22 describing the Canaanite priest and priestesses>male/bedders.
Had the Apostle wanted to describe a man that is sexually attracted to other men he had some words that we're used at that time for that meaning: (paiderasste) which meant mad after or boy crazy. (arrenomanes) which meant sexual behaviour between males.

More horses..t.

Tell me, what does (1 Cor. 6:9) mean?

Stranger

 

[Stranger]

Agree. Eve was deceived. Adam was not. It seems the place we disagree is, if I understand you correctly you are dividing out all men as if under Adam and lumping women as a whole under Eve. Eve is the mother of all living. Sin and deception go hand in hand. Adam not being deceived, foreshadows Christ. Christ was not deceived but rather joined His bride to redeem her from deception and a lie. We can’t see or even acknowledge our sin until God opens our eyes and shows it to us. We are all blind until we are born again from above. God has to wake us up and bring us out of darkness. That means we are all deceived by the world until God says otherwise. Deceived is deceived. The same measure. The same darkness across the whole. Yet, it seems you want to say men as a gender are only a little deceived. His word seems to say different in referencing bold words as adulteress, whore, fornication and Harlots...as a whole we are either as Eve was: deceived. or we are as His bride...walking in the path of light created by the Son. There is one bride. It isn’t based off gender otherwise you wouldn’t be a part of that bride. There is one king, one Lord, one husband and that is God.

1 Corinthians 6:11
[11] And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

Ephesians 5:25-27
[25] Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; [26] That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, [27] That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy nd without blemish.

That ‘he’ : cleanses it with the washing of water by the Word.

His bride. He washes ‘her’. His chruch. That includes you and I. To Him...we are the same. Both dependent on what only He can give.

When you say men ‘the gender’ are not as deceived. Again, using God as a means of promoting some superiority when: Acts 10:34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:

Yet He has respect for His. Those of the same degree of light and favor. Not half in or half out. washed clean by the blood of the Lamb. God’s covenant of peace is the same to all of His bride(body).

Leviticus 26:9-12
[9] For I will have respect unto you, and make you fruitful, and multiply you, and establish my covenant with you. [10] And ye shall eat old store, and bring forth the old because of the new. [11] And I will set my tabernacle among you: and my soul shall not abhor you. [12] And I will walk among you, and will be your God, and ye shall be my people.

Men seldom are deceived. The woman is more easily deceived. God being no respecter of persons doesn't matter in this. It is the way God made man and woman.

Stranger

 

[Enoch111]

Men seldom are deceived. The woman is more easily deceived.

This is what Scripture reveals whether women like it or not. Since Eve knew exactly what God had told Adam (even though she tried to play around with God's words) in the end she chose to be deceived. The context makes it clear. Thus the Holy Spirit (not Paul) reveals that this is the underlying reason why God does not allow women to preach, teach or assume authority within the local church (1 Tim 2:12).

The Christian woman who is submitted to Christ will not argue with this but accept it as God's command. But the rebellious woman will resist this and find every reason why we should think this was Paul's *mysogyny* coming through.

Adam -- on the other hand -- was not deceived by was plainly disobedient. He is also held responsible for the disaster he brought upon the human race.

 

[quietthinker]

(even though she tried to play around with God's words)

What do you mean? It was the Serpent who played around with God’s words!

 

[Enoch111]

What do you mean? It was the Serpent who played around with God’s words!

They both did. Please note what Eve said, and her *clever* choice of words:

THE COMMANDMENT
And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

EVE'S MISREPRESENTATION
1. "Every tree" and "freely eat" omitted -- And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:
God's generosity diminished.

2. "Tree of the knowledge of good and evil" obfuscated --
But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden
[There were two trees in the midst of the garden -- "the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil"]

3. God's commandment made into a mere suggestion --
"God hath said"
[But Scripture says And the LORD God commanded the man. Had she chosen Eve could have easily reproduced the whole commandment verbatim. She chose not to.]

4. Eve added to the Word of God -- "neither shall ye touch it"
[God had said nothing about touching that tree. They could have touched it all day and nothing would have happened]

5. Eve tampered with the Word of God (changed it to mean something else) -- "lest ye die"
[God had said -- Ye shall SURELY DIED. "Lest" (after a clause indicating fear) because of the possibility of something undesirable happening; in case.]

So now it should be perfectly clear that just as Satan twisted God's words, Eve was his accomplice in doing the very same thing. We should be cognizant that both Adam and Eve were perfect specimens of humanity. So the issue of a faulty memory cannot even be considered.

 

[quietthinker]

It is possible to covey a message accurately without quoting verbatim. She understood the message and so did the serpent (she wasn’t out to fool the Serpent)
I don’t think her mistake was her choice of words, I think the mistake was parleying with the snake. She allowed herself to be engaged and thus enticed.
It was the Serpent who misrepresented God’s words by insinuating that God had said other than he had said.

 

[Stranger]

They both did. Please note what Eve said, and her *clever* choice of words:

THE COMMANDMENT
And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

EVE'S MISREPRESENTATION
1. "Every tree" and "freely eat" omitted -- And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:
God's generosity diminished.

2. "Tree of the knowledge of good and evil" obfuscated --
But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden
[There were two trees in the midst of the garden -- "the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil"]

3. God's commandment made into a mere suggestion --
"God hath said"
[But Scripture says And the LORD God commanded the man. Had she chosen Eve could have easily reproduced the whole commandment verbatim. She chose not to.]

4. Eve added to the Word of God -- "neither shall ye touch it"
[God had said nothing about touching that tree. They could have touched it all day and nothing would have happened]

5. Eve tampered with the Word of God (changed it to mean something else) -- "lest ye die"
[God had said -- Ye shall SURELY DIED. "Lest" (after a clause indicating fear) because of the possibility of something undesirable happening; in case.]

So now it should be perfectly clear that just as Satan twisted God's words, Eve was his accomplice in doing the very same thing. We should be cognizant that both Adam and Eve were perfect specimens of humanity. So the issue of a faulty memory cannot even be considered.

You are correct in that Adam and Eve both disobediently ate of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. You are incorrect in their intent and motive which you have been trying to paint.

Stranger

 

[bbyrd009]

ah, duelling oracles?

 

[Helen]

Men seldom are deceived.
Stranger

I think that is the funniest thing I have ever read on this Forum. LOL

Just look back at history.
Just look back at all the wars...
Just look around you...
Read the ( stupid) "news"

. . .

 

[Enoch111]

You are correct in that Adam and Eve both disobediently ate of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. You are incorrect in their intent and motive which you have been trying to paint.

Since none of us was there, we have to take what is recorded and examine it. Given the fact that God made them perfect in every way, and gave them a Garden of Eden which was perfect in every way, we need to dig beneath the surface to see why they did what they did.

 

[Helen]

Men seldom are deceived.
Stranger

I must say I am still getting a chuckle from this. Thank you.

My first thought was Sampson ..she totally hoodwinked him to losing his covenant Nazarene hair.

Then we have God's man of faith and power for the hour. Joshua!
Totally deceived.
Joshua 9
4 They ( Hivites) did work wilily, and went and made as if they had been ambassadors, and took old sacks upon their asses, and wine bottles, old, and rent, and bound up;
5 And old shoes and clouted upon their feet, and old garments upon them; and all the bread of their provision was dry and mouldy.
6 And they went to Joshua unto the camp at Gilgal, and said unto him, and to the men of Israel, We be come from a far country: now therefore make ye a league with us.
7 And the men of Israel said unto the Hivites, Peradventure ye dwell among us; and how shall we make a league with you?
8 And they said unto Joshua, We are thy servants. And Joshua said unto them, Who are ye? and from whence come ye?
9 And they said unto him, From a very far country thy servants are come because of the name of the Lord thy God: for we have heard the fame of him, and all that he did in Egypt,....
....15 And Joshua made peace with them, and made a league with them, to let them live: and the princes of the congregation sware unto them."

Totally against what God had said..in taking the Promised land.

Bless you!

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Since none of us was there, we have to take what is recorded and examine it. Given the fact that God made them perfect in every way, and gave them a Garden of Eden which was perfect in every way, we need to dig beneath the surface to see why they did what they did.

Ezekiel 28:15
[15] Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.

How can God call one perfect yet only ‘til inquity was found in thee’?

Is volition perfect?
The choice, iniquity.
Adam and Eve made a choice.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Job 31: 35
5. Oh that one would hear me! behold, my desire is, that the Almighty would answer me, and that mine adversary had written a book.

This has puzzled me: who is Job's adversary? "that mine adversary had written a book"

2 Timothy 2:25-26
25. In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth; 26. And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.

The other night I watched a documentary on the cult called "the children of God". It was shocking how the founder and his followers twisted bible verses to support sexual abuse against minors (as young as eleven, even the founders granddaughter). Thousands of images were published which can not even be posted here due to their obscene content. One was two daughters in bed with their father. A quote from their many beliefs of what the bible teaches "11. Masturbation is having sex with Jesus. When a man is having sex with Jesus, he is no longer a man, but Jesus's wife, so it's not actually male-on-male anymore, and therefore OK because not gay."

Song of Songs 5: 2-4
2. I sleep, but my heart waketh: it is the voice of my beloved that knocketh, saying, Open to me, my sister, my love, my dove, my undefiled: for my head is filled with dew, and my locks with the drops of the night.
3. I have put off my coat; how shall I put it on? I have washed my feet; how shall I defile them?
4. My beloved put in his hand by the hole of the door, and my bowels were moved for him.

Again: "that mine adversary had written a book." Man penned God's word. It is not until the Spirit gives life that the word of God reveals something entirely different from what 'man without God' says 'God said'. It is unreal how the word of God is twisted to serve: superiority, lust, greed, power, vengeance...just to name a few.

"A stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed." (1 Peter 2:8).

 

[Enoch111]

How can God call one perfect yet only ‘til inquity was found in thee’?

Lucifer was indeed perfect (physically and morally) until he sinned against God in his heart. Then iniquity was found in him, and he was banished from God's Heaven, along with his rebel angels. Paradise Lost by John Milton gives us much insight.

Adam and Eve made a choice.

Just like Lucifer, they were under no compulsion to make the wrong choice. Indeed, conditions were so totally ideal in Eden that they could have easily made the right choice. But iniquity was also found in them.

 

[Stranger]

Since none of us was there, we have to take what is recorded and examine it. Given the fact that God made them perfect in every way, and gave them a Garden of Eden which was perfect in every way, we need to dig beneath the surface to see why they did what they did.

Dig a little more.

Stranger