Two Resurrections of the Dead

[robert derrick]

Not quite!

Yes quite. 20:3-4 are in the same context. Afterall, they are 3-4 with nothing in between.

It was by His cross that Satan was bound to earth in the bottomless pit until TIME, symbolized a thousand years is finished.

Satan is not now bound in the pit, because he is still tempting men to sin. He is also still the prince and power of the air.

That's why John sees martyred faithful saints in heaven after death. Because in TIME they lived and reigned with Christ through His resurrection life, the first resurrection from the dead.

Rev 20 is the bodily resurrection of the saints only.

The devil is still the prince and power and of the air, and tempting people to sin.

That's when the saints will be called to meet the Lord in the air until the wrath of God by fire is over.

The Lord will come down Himself like lightning, to destroy the armies at Armageddon, by the brightness of His coming.

The Lord Himself comes down to destroy them. The Lord is not the fire of God, nor does He come the second time to burn all flesh and the earth with Himself.

The destruction at Armageddon by the Lord Himself coming as bright lightning, is not the fire of God from heaven come down to melt the earth.

That's when the saints will be called to meet the Lord in the air until the wrath of God by fire is over.

But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness.

The Lord will not be with His saints in the air, because that fire is melting all the stars with fervent heat, as well as the earth.

The fire from God is out of His heaven, to consume stars and the earth, not from the stars to consume the earth.

The day of the Lord's second coming to the earth, is not the day of the Lord's consuming the stars and the earth, with Gog and Magog on the earth.

They will be physically resurrected from the grave on the last day at the same hour the saints are physically resurrected.

Paul only speaks of those in Christ Jesus, as well as Rev 20, when speaking of the first bodily resurrection of the church.

Paul says nothing of any others being resurrected at that time. Rev 20 reveals those rest of the dead will only be resurrected after Christ's reign on earth.

but "the dead" will be physically resurrected for condemnation.

So, the Lamb's book of life is just a showpiece? Or is that just symbolic too.

No one will be judged to see of they are written in the Lamb's book of life, if all are resurrected just to cast into the lake of fire.

And yet, the Lamb's book of life is there to show who is written therein at that time of judgment.

Scripture never says Satan is bound so there will be no more deception or temptation for the saints of Christ on this earth.

Since all Satan does is tempt man to sin, then being shut up, is from tempting man to sin.

Being called that old serpent, from the garden, shows that lying and tempting to sin is all he is known for.

Satan is bound only to prevent him from holding those who believe in bondage to darkness and fear of death.

So now the devil is only half-shut up. He is shut up on earth against Christians only.

Why does this sound so suspiciously like the OSAS delusion, that there is no more condemnation for sinning on earth, against Christians only.

And why is it called bondage to 'darkness', rather than to sinning, which is what Scripture calls bondage:

While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.

Sinning is it's own bondage. Men hold themselves in bondage of sin and darkness, by sinning.

But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

Satan can only tempt men, to bring themselves into the bondage of sinning.

The teaching that Satan will be bound so peace will reign upon this earth is a lie from the pits of hell. You utterly misunderstand the purpose for which Satan was bound.

Well now. The very idea of Christ's earthly reign is bad enough, but to actually believe the Scripture saying it will be a reign of peace, is from the pit of hell. (There's only one pit of hell. It's called the bottomless pit.)

Once again, where does this feverish hatred against Christ's peaceful earthly reign come from?

Obviously, showing how Rev 20 cannot possibly have come to pass, since Satan is not yet shut up, has struck a really big nerve.

And it has to do with some strange teaching, that the devil is now half-shut up against Christians only.

I believe the more fanatical version of OSAS is lurking around in here. The 'pits of hell' zeal is akin to that of OSAS fanatics, when anyone dares teach Scripture saying we are just as condemned for sinning against God, as any one else sinning against God. And we are just as in need of godly sorrow confession to be forgiven by Jesus Christ.

And so what exactly is this bondage 'to darkness', that is not bondage to sin?

Is it the 'bondage' of believing we are condemned with the world, if we sin with the world?

It's the Holy Spirit that convicts man of sinning, and warns of being in bondage to sinning.

Is it the Holy Spirit that is being half-shut up, to only convict the world of sinning, and to warn the world against being in bondage to sinning, but not to Christians?

Yes, until they physically die Christ's saints are alive on this earth in TIME, which is what a thousand years indicates.

In our spiritual resurrection today on earth, a thousand years would still be like day one, which indicates the everlasting freshness of being with the Lord.

After our bodily resurrection and Christ's reign on earth, a thousand years is a thousand years to the day on earth.

How's that for TIME teaching.

What would be the purpose for physically resurrected saints reigning with Christ for a thousand years?

Well, if it's with peace on earth, then it's the pits of hell.

Scripture knows nothing of this imagined millennium you millennialists apparently long for? There is no purpose for another thousand years of TIME once Christ comes again, because He will not come again until His Kingdom is complete!

So says the Symbol Man's Bible and first principle:

There is absolutely no reason at all for the Lord to return to His earth to rule and judge over in equity and truth.

And all the Scriptures prophesying the Lord will do that very thing from Zion in Jerusalem, is symbol only.

The LORD also shall roar out of Zion, and utter his voice from Jerusalem; and the heavens and the earth shall shake: but the LORD will be the hope of his people, and the strength of the children of Israel.

It's like the man said to the groom about his wedding, in 'Rules of Engagement': No. Sorry. No cake.

Sorry folks, No roaring out of Zion by the Lord.

There is really something off about such animosity about Jesus Christ roaring out of Zion.

And we see OSAS is lurking around in it.

I say the main reason they don't want to believe the Lord will rule on earth, and judge all people on earth, is because they don't want to believe that He does so now from heaven, whether Christian or atheist.

 

[robert derrick]

The save are the only ones who rise from the dead at the Return. Over a thousand years later the rest of the dead, the unsaved, will rise, Rev 20.

Just giving the plain sense of the words of Scripture, is just so much easier. All summed up one one simple sentence.

It's a hallmark of false doctrine, when things get more complicated, because of having to write whole paragraphs of 'Scholarship', to teach what's not plainly written.

When I get to using too many words, I stop to see what's wrong with the teaching.

 

[WPM]

From what I understand there are three resurrections.

Resurrection of Unbelievers.
Resurrection of Believers. Perhaps Children.
Resurrection of believers but better than then normal one. Perhaps Sons or Daughters of God.

Do not know but there is only three, of course most people do not believe the white throne judgement or the judgement of those out of hell have come to be done yet. I do however believe they have passed, and we are judged but its different than what they experienced.

How about showing this in Scripture instead of presenting what you have been taught.

 

[WPM]

Yes quite. 20:3-4 are in the same context. Afterall, they are 3-4 with nothing in between.




Satan is not now bound in the pit, because he is still tempting men to sin. He is also still the prince and power of the air.





Rev 20 is the bodily resurrection of the saints only.

The devil is still the prince and power and of the air, and tempting people to sin.




The Lord will come down Himself like lightning, to destroy the armies at Armageddon, by the brightness of His coming.

The Lord Himself comes down to destroy them. The Lord is not the fire of God, nor does He come the second time to burn all flesh and the earth with Himself.

The destruction at Armageddon by the Lord Himself coming as bright lightning, is not the fire of God from heaven come down to melt the earth.




But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness.

The Lord will not be with His saints in the air, because that fire is melting all the stars with fervent heat, as well as the earth.

The fire from God is out of His heaven, to consume stars and the earth, not from the stars to consume the earth.

The day of the Lord's second coming to the earth, is not the day of the Lord's consuming the stars and the earth, with Gog and Magog on the earth.




Paul only speaks of those in Christ Jesus, as well as Rev 20, when speaking of the first bodily resurrection of the church.

Paul says nothing of any others being resurrected at that time. Rev 20 reveals those rest of the dead will only be resurrected after Christ's reign on earth.


So, the Lamb's book of life is just a showpiece? Or is that just symbolic too.

No one will be judged to see of they are written in the Lamb's book of life, if all are resurrected just to cast into the lake of fire.

And yet, the Lamb's book of life is there to show who is written therein at that time of judgment.


Since all Satan does is tempt man to sin, then being shut up, is from tempting man to sin.

Being called that old serpent, from the garden, shows that lying and tempting to sin is all he is known for.



So now the devil is only half-shut up. He is shut up on earth against Christians only.

Why does this sound so suspiciously like the OSAS delusion, that there is no more condemnation for sinning on earth, against Christians only.

And why is it called bondage to 'darkness', rather than to sinning, which is what Scripture calls bondage:

While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.

Sinning is it's own bondage. Men hold themselves in bondage of sin and darkness, by sinning.

But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

Satan can only tempt men, to bring themselves into the bondage of sinning.


Well now. The very idea of Christ's earthly reign is bad enough, but to actually believe the Scripture saying it will be a reign of peace, is from the pit of hell. (There's only one pit of hell. It's called the bottomless pit.)

Once again, where does this feverish hatred against Christ's peaceful earthly reign come from?

Obviously, showing how Rev 20 cannot possibly have come to pass, since Satan is not yet shut up, has struck a really big nerve.

And it has to do with some strange teaching, that the devil is now half-shut up against Christians only.

I believe the more fanatical version of OSAS is lurking around in here. The 'pits of hell' zeal is akin to that of OSAS fanatics, when anyone dares teach Scripture saying we are just as condemned for sinning against God, as any one else sinning against God. And we are just as in need of godly sorrow confession to be forgiven by Jesus Christ.

And so what exactly is this bondage 'to darkness', that is not bondage to sin?

Is it the 'bondage' of believing we are condemned with the world, if we sin with the world?

It's the Holy Spirit that convicts man of sinning, and warns of being in bondage to sinning.

Is it the Holy Spirit that is being half-shut up, to only convict the world of sinning, and to warn the world against being in bondage to sinning, but not to Christians?




In our spiritual resurrection today on earth, a thousand years would still be like day one, which indicates the everlasting freshness of being with the Lord.

After our bodily resurrection and Christ's reign on earth, a thousand years is a thousand years to the day on earth.

How's that for TIME teaching.

Well, if it's with peace on earth, then it's the pits of hell.



So says the Symbol Man's Bible and first principle:

There is absolutely no reason at all for the Lord to return to His earth to rule and judge over in equity and truth.

And all the Scriptures prophesying the Lord will do that very thing from Zion in Jerusalem, is symbol only.

The LORD also shall roar out of Zion, and utter his voice from Jerusalem; and the heavens and the earth shall shake: but the LORD will be the hope of his people, and the strength of the children of Israel.

It's like the man said to the groom about his wedding, in 'Rules of Engagement': No. Sorry. No cake.

Sorry folks, No roaring out of Zion by the Lord.

There is really something off about such animosity about Jesus Christ roaring out of Zion.

And we see OSAS is lurking around in it.

I say the main reason they don't want to believe the Lord will rule on earth, and judge all people on earth, is because they don't want to believe that He does so now from heaven, whether Christian or atheist.

Your MO is to ignore those who refute your error and think you stating your private interpretation makes it a fact. It does not. It makes it your extra-biblical opinion.

It is time to address the multiples Scriptures presented on each topic that blow apart your error.

 

[WPM]

It's a hallmark of false doctrine, when things get more complicated, because of having to write whole paragraphs of 'Scholarship', to teach what's not plainly written.

When I get to using too many words, I stop to see what's wrong with the teaching.

Lol. This sums up your posts and theology. Not only is it false but erroneous. You just exposed your own mode of presentation.

 

[MatthewG]

How about showing this in Scripture instead of presenting what you have been taught.

I did buddy, Paul talks about a resurrection that is outside of the normal resurrection in Philippians, also the writer of Hebrews talked about the better resurrection. Hope you will do your own search and find it. Also Jesus talked about the resurrection of those to life and those to condemnation. Which to me is the normal resurrection for believers and those who are unbelievers which seems they are having a loss. Still leaves the question is there a better resurrection?

 

[robert derrick]

Wrong. The rod of iron rule is only after Christ has returned. See the last part of Rev 2 where this is spelled out, as well as Rev 19 where ruling the nations is in the future tense in the Greek.

I don't disagree with the rod of iron being used by Christ and His resurrected saints, but now during our own spiritual resurrection with Christ in mortal bodies, we have and love His rod of iron, because we know He that loves us chastens us for our own good.

The rod of iron will be used in similar fashiopn for them seeking the law of the Lord to walk in His paths under His reign.

The rule of the Lord over all the earth will be double edged: shepherding for the obedient, and execution for the rebellious.

The kingdom reign will begin with all natural sheep, even as we began with Adam and Eve in the garden, but not all will remain so, even as Adam and Eve, nor all their offspring. There will be those believing and loving Him, as well as those rejecting and rebelling against Him.

It's no different than today, except the Lord will be reigning personally, and all nations will be subjects of His kingdom.

And Satan will be shut up from resisting the Lord and tempting man to sin against Him.

 

[ewq1938]

I don't disagree with the rod of iron being used by Christ and His resurrected saints, but now during our own spiritual resurrection with Christ in mortal bodies, we have and love His rod of iron, because we know He that loves us chastens us for our own good.

Scripture places the rod of iron rule given to the saints as happening AFTER the second coming, Rev 2.