Under the Law is a curse, not Doing the Law

[bbyrd009]

Thereis only One Immortal, Who dwells in unapproachable light

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Once we understand that the curse of the law is twofold: breaking the law, and doing the law without faith, then we understand how the law leads to receiving Jesus Christ.

This is not true.

Doing the law with or without faith has nothing to do with the curse of the law.

The curse of the law is the mere fact whoever does not obey every word is cursed. period.

We need to be careful and not add to the word of God

Since we must keep the law or die, then we must find the way to keep the law: Receiving Jesus Christ within the heart is the only way to keep the law by faith in Him: to do the righteousness of the law by keeping the letter outwardly from a purified heart within.

Gal 3:
For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.”

James 2:10
For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all.

The curse is for everyone who is not perfect..

The end of the law is not the law being ended and done away, but is the fulfillment of doing the law by the Spirit of Christ.

The lawless have neither the law nor Christ.

The end of the law is not transgressing the law while hypocritically celebrating grace.

The end of the law is the fact that law can not condemn us anymore. Because who who knew no sin was made sin for us. And he took the curse for us.

Gal 3:
13 Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree”), 14 that the blessing of Abraham might come upon the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

 

[farouk]

This is not true.

Doing the law with or without faith has nothing to do with the curse of the law.

The curse of the law is the mere fact whoever does not obey every word is cursed. period.

We need to be careful and not add to the word of God

Gal 3:
For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.”

James 2:10
For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all.

The curse is for everyone who is not perfect..



The end of the law is the fact that law can not condemn us anymore. Because who who knew no sin was made sin for us. And he took the curse for us.

Gal 3:
13 Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree”), 14 that the blessing of Abraham might come upon the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

@Eternally Grateful Paul speaks of 'obedience to the faith' and 'the obedience of faith' at the beginning and at the end of Romans. Law-keeping is something entirely different; reliance on law-keeping shows bondage.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

?

this is what started the conversation

For example, being caught under the old covenant as an adulterer the penalty was death. Not under the New Covenant Jesus Christ though.

Under the law. being caught in adultery demanded one be stoned. ie the penalty was death.

Under the new covenant, that is no longer true. as shown when the people brought the harlot to Jesus to be stoned, and Jesus said let he who has no sin cast the first stone

anyway, His statement was called absurd. see below

How absurd!
What an insult to the holiness of Jesus Christ!

to which @robert derrick made the statement which you and I are discussing, that he is tryign to relate stoning to spiritual death

The error is that of carnal mindedness.

The penalty for adultery is still death, which is spiritual death of the soul.
.

in the law. the penalty was physical death not spiritual.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

The teaching of Jesus to have mercy on them repentant, does not do away with the death penalty to the body.

Even for the repentant.

And the death penalty for sinning remains: death to the soul.

No one sinning is alive to Christ, but dead with the devil.

you were BORN DEAD.

the law did not MAKE YOU DEAD

 

[Eternally Grateful]

@Eternally Grateful Paul speaks of 'obedience to the faith' and 'the obedience of faith' at the beginning and at the end of Romans. Law-keeping is something entirely different; reliance on law-keeping shows bondage.

Amen,,,,the law was given to lead us to Christ, to expose our sin.

Not to teach us how to stop sin and live moral lives.

 

[farouk]

Amen,,,,the law was given to lead us to Christ, to expose our sin.

Not to teach us how to stop sin and live moral lives.

Dispensationally speaking, it's the Gospel that is the rule of the believer's life now, rather than the law, IMHO....

 

[Davy]

this is what started the conversation

Under the law. being caught in adultery demanded one be stoned. ie the penalty was death.

Under the new covenant, that is no longer true. as shown when the people brought the harlot to Jesus to be stoned, and Jesus said let he who has no sin cast the first stone

anyway, His statement was called absurd. see below


to which @robert derrick made the statement which you and I are discussing, that he is tryign to relate stoning to spiritual death


in the law. the penalty was physical death not spiritual.

Right, the penalty under the old covenant was the death penalty, death of one's flesh body, not their soul.

Under the New Covenant Jesus Christ, ALL... manner of sin can be forgiven, except blasphemy against The Holy Spirit (Matthew 12:31).

 

[Davy]

Not to teach us how to stop sin and live moral lives.

I definitely agree with your first statement. But that last, no, I do not agree. I think being aware of God's laws that Jesus did NOT nail to His cross is still important as Christian Doctrine. Otherwise Apostle Paul would not have taught about that in chapters like 1 Timothy 1, 1 Corinthians 6, and Galatians 5. It's not the attempt to keep God's laws that is the danger, it is putting one's Faith in law keeping for being saved that is the danger, for we are saved only by God's free gift of Grace through His Son's blood shed upon His cross, and that is by Faith, not works.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Dispensationally speaking, it's the Gospel that is the rule of the believer's life now, rather than the law, IMHO....

the abraham covenant came before the law.. It is the way we always should have lived..

Even david, when he was confronted with sin. Showed how it was not the law God desired. it was his heart (sacrifice and burnt offering you did not desire)

 

[farouk]

the abraham covenant came before the law.. It is the way we always should have lived..

Even david, when he was confronted with sin. Showed how it was not the law God desired. it was his heart (sacrifice and burnt offering you did not desire)

@Eternally Grateful I do fail indeed to see how after reading Psalm 51 ppl can think that they need to assert law-keeping............

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I definitely agree with your first statement. But that last, no, I do not agree. I think being aware of God's laws that Jesus did NOT nail to His cross is still important as Christian Doctrine. Otherwise Apostle Paul would not have taught about that in chapters like 1 Timothy 1, 1 Corinthians 6, and Galatians 5. It's not the attempt to keep God's laws that is the danger, it is putting one's Faith in law keeping for being saved that is the danger, for we are saved only by God's free gift of Grace through His Son's blood shed upon His cross, and that is by Faith, not works.

The law had one purpose. and one purpose only

Gal 3;
19 What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator. 20 Now a mediator does not mediate for one only, but God is one.

21 Is the law then against the promises of God? Certainly not! For if there had been a law given which could have given life, truly righteousness would have been by the law. 22 But the Scripture has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. 23 But before faith came, we were kept under guard by the law, kept for the faith which would afterward be revealed. 24 Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.

The law is not a means to show us how to live. Jesus tried to show us on the sermon on the mount.. The law says this, But I tell you.. We can live our whole life having never committed adultery according to the law. Yet according to the spirit. have sinned thousands of time.. because we have looked with Lust.. which is not breaking the law per say..

Jesus said be perfect as your father in heaven is perfect.. According to the law. that is what you must do..

We live under the law of Christ, or the law of love.. that is where our focus should be. Not the law of moses..

 

[farouk]

The law had one purpose. and one purpose only

Gal 3;
19 What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator. 20 Now a mediator does not mediate for one only, but God is one.

21 Is the law then against the promises of God? Certainly not! For if there had been a law given which could have given life, truly righteousness would have been by the law. 22 But the Scripture has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. 23 But before faith came, we were kept under guard by the law, kept for the faith which would afterward be revealed. 24 Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.

The law is not a means to show us how to live. Jesus tried to show us on the sermon on the mount.. The law says this, But I tell you.. We can live our whole life having never committed adultery according to the law. Yet according to the spirit. have sinned thousands of time.. because we have looked with Lust.. which is not breaking the law per say..

Jesus said be perfect as your father in heaven is perfect.. According to the law. that is what you must do..

We live under the law of Christ, or the law of love.. that is where our focus should be. Not the law of moses..

@Eternally Grateful While up to a point I appreciate the Reformed writers, yet it is hard not to part company with them when they sometimes try to assert that the law (rather than the Gospel) is the rule of the believer's life (according to the 1689 Confession); an earlier Baptist confession does not say this; it's as if the Israel/church blending of Presbyterianism was inserted into the 1689 Baptist Confession.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

@Eternally Grateful While up to a point I appreciate the Reformed writers, yet it is hard not to part company with them when they sometimes try to assert that the law (rather than the Gospel) is the rule of the believer's life (according to the 1689 Confession); an earlier Baptist confession does not say this; it's as if the Israel/church blending of Presbyterianism was inserted into the 1689 Baptist Confession.

I am not sure. I try not to get into all the reformed/baptist/catholic calvin etc discussions.

I would rather just talk about the word and what it says.

 

[farouk]

I am not sure. I try not to get into all the reformed/baptist/catholic calvin etc discussions.

I would rather just talk about the word and what it says.

@Eternally Grateful I'm reminded of the words of the preacher Robert Murray M'Cheyne: "It is God's Word, and not man's comment upon God's Word, that saves souls".

 

[Davy]

The law had one purpose. and one purpose only

Gal 3;
19 What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator. 20 Now a mediator does not mediate for one only, but God is one.

21 Is the law then against the promises of God? Certainly not! For if there had been a law given which could have given life, truly righteousness would have been by the law. 22 But the Scripture has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. 23 But before faith came, we were kept under guard by the law, kept for the faith which would afterward be revealed. 24 Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.

The law is not a means to show us how to live. Jesus tried to show us on the sermon on the mount.. The law says this, But I tell you.. We can live our whole life having never committed adultery according to the law. Yet according to the spirit. have sinned thousands of time.. because we have looked with Lust.. which is not breaking the law per say..

Jesus said be perfect as your father in heaven is perfect.. According to the law. that is what you must do..

We live under the law of Christ, or the law of love.. that is where our focus should be. Not the law of moses..

Like I said, if God's laws no longer have an application in Christian society, then Apostle Paul would NOT have taught they still do per the 1 Timothy 1, 1 Corinthians 6, and Galatians 5 chapters. Lord Jesus did NOT nail all of God's laws to His cross. God's laws against murder, rape, theft, perjury, seditions, adultery, etc., are still in effect today for Christian society, only that the penalty for breaking them in today's society can be different, even though 1st degree murder can still have a death penalty administered in many western nations.

1 Tim 1:8-11
8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;

9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,

10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;

11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.
KJV

All... of those sins Paul points to are from God's laws.

Notice how in the 11th verse he associates THAT teaching with "the gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust."

HOW then does this fit with Christian doctrine and The Gospel of Jesus Christ?

Simple, like Paul said, God's law was not made for the righteous, but for the sinner. The law of Christ is about following Christ by The Holy Spirit. The sinner and ungodly doesn't seek to do that, but instead follows after lawlessness.

This means much of God's law is STILL IN EFFECT TODAY among Christian society in order to PROTECT GOD'S PEOPLE FROM CRIMINALS AND THE UNGODLY. So who... in their right mind would want to do away with that protection?? The devil would of course, and thus the false doctrine all of God's law is now dead is from the devil's children, his workers of iniquity.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Like I said, if God's laws no longer have an application in Christian society, then Apostle Paul would NOT have taught they still do per the 1 Timothy 1, 1 Corinthians 6, and Galatians 5 chapters. Lord Jesus did NOT nail all of God's laws to His cross. God's laws against murder, rape, theft, perjury, seditions, adultery, etc., are still in effect today for Christian society, only that the penalty for breaking them in today's society can be different, even though 1st degree murder can still have a death penalty administered in many western nations.

1 Tim 1:8-11
8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;

9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,

10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;

11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.
KJV

look at what you just posted.

The law is NOT for a righteous man.

Who are the righteous? The saved,

Who are the lawless, The lost.

The law is for the lost. Those who have yet to be led to Christ as the tutor or schoolmaster.

All... of those sins Paul points to are from God's laws.

Notice how in the 11th verse he associates THAT teaching with "the gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust."

HOW then does this fit with Christian doctrine and The Gospel of Jesus Christ?

Simple, like Paul said, God's law was not made for the righteous, but for the sinner. The law of Christ is about following Christ by The Holy Spirit. The sinner and ungodly doesn't seek to do that, but instead follows after lawlessness.

This means much of God's law is STILL IN EFFECT TODAY among Christian society in order to PROTECT GOD'S PEOPLE FROM CRIMINALS AND THE UNGODLY. So who... in their right mind would want to do away with that protection?? The devil would of course, and thus the false doctrine all of God's law is now dead is from the devil's children, his workers of iniquity.

The law can not help you. Once again, at best it can give you a false sense of security, that you do not OVERTLY commit those sins.

If you seek to obey the law of love (love God, then everyone else) then you will by practice be a law keeper..

If you do not obey thye law of love. then the law of moses can't help you. Because you have to get to the root issue which causes you to break a command. before you can be healed.

 

[farouk]

look at what you just posted.

The law is NOT for a righteous man.

Who are the righteous? The saved,

Who are the lawless, The lost.

The law is for the lost. Those who have yet to be led to Christ as the tutor or schoolmaster.



The law can not help you. Once again, at best it can give you a false sense of security, that you do not OVERTLY commit those sins.

If you seek to obey the law of love (love God, then everyone else) then you will by practice be a law keeper..

If you do not obey thye law of love. then the law of moses can't help you. Because you have to get to the root issue which causes you to break a command. before you can be healed.

It's 'the obedience of faith...obedience to the faith' (Paul to the Romans...)

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

 

[Davy]

look at what you just posted.

The law is NOT for a righteous man.

Who are the righteous? The saved,

Who are the lawless, The lost.

The law is for the lost. Those who have yet to be led to Christ as the tutor or schoolmaster.

So, do you believe you still slip up at times and sin? Or do you believe you never sin anymore?

And if you do realize that you still sin at times, what is it that you do about it?