Was the Sabbath kept prior to the Commandments at Sinai?

[Scott Downey]

You call the Ten Commandments the law of Moses implying Moses gave the Law. Perhaps you have forgotten who actually gave the Ten Commandments? Wasn't it Jesus pre his incarnation? So all your jumping around saying the Law of Christ is different to the Law Jesus gave on Sinai is a moot point.

What the truth of the matter is BBJ, is that you are opposed to the Sabbath as stated in the Ten Commandments and are using 'the Law of Christ' argument to negate it, even justify breaking it. That's where the rubber hits the road in this matter!

God through Christ changed His own commandment when Christ instituted the NC
HE wiped out the Sabbath commandment as Paul wrote here

Colossians 2

11 In Him you were also circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body [h]of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, 12 buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead. 13 And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses, 14 having wiped out the [i]handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. 15 Having disarmed principalities and powers, He made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them in it.

16 So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a [j]festival or a new moon or sabbaths, 17 which are a shadow of things to come, but the [k]substance is of Christ.

 

[Scott Downey]

The requirement of the sabbath commandment God erased through Christ. HE wiped it out.
Argue all you want about this, anyone who ways you must keep the sabbath is against what God is saying today through Christ.

Anyone who teaches differently is a false teacher in the church.

2 Peter 2
But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. 2 And many will follow their destructive ways, because of whom the way of truth will be blasphemed. 3 By covetousness they will exploit you with deceptive words; for a long time their judgment has not been idle, and their destruction [a]does not slumber.

 

[Scott Downey]

Anyone who breaks the sabbath is not sinning. There is no sin for anyone in Christ who breaks the Sabbath. Even Christ broke the sabbath and He is without sin.
There is no disapproval from God for those who break the sabbath, they are still fully accepted into the beloved, Christians who do not keep the sabbath.
Anyone who tells you, you must keep the sabbath or your sinning against God is an antichrist.

 

[quietthinker]

God through Christ changed His own commandment when Christ instituted the NC
HE wiped out the Sabbath commandment as Paul wrote here

Colossians 2

11 In Him you were also circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body [h]of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, 12 buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead. 13 And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses, 14 having wiped out the [i]handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. 15 Having disarmed principalities and powers, He made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them in it.

16 So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a [j]festival or a new moon or sabbaths, 17 which are a shadow of things to come, but the [k]substance is of Christ.

14 having wiped out the [i]handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us.

hmmm, yeah, stealing, adultery, taking the Lord's name in vain, coveting....yep, they are all against me, as well as several more, they restrict my freedom.....so we'll just get rid of them requirements, restrictions... which is it? Ohhhh, yeah, and the one that is the greatest thorn in my side ie, the Sabbath, yeahhhh, the one designed for what? ....it's such a pain in the neck to have to remember to take a rest and put the menial activity of life to one side so I can focus. I've got all this work to do for the Lord so now I'm not burdened by this restriction?...restriction?...did it say something about being against me? Ohhhhh, of course, it's a real inconvenience.....why did God even put it in there in the first place?.....I'm so glad he had second thoughts on that one.....as well as the coveting one....that was the worst inconvenience.....and while I'm at it, I'll just dismiss Psalm 119 cuz the writer (David?) just can't stop extolling that Law which I hear all those 'freedom' fighters say was against us. Isn't it just great to do my own thing and when someone pulls me up on my 'liberty' to suit myself, particularly on forgetting the Sabbath, I can just pull out Colossians 2 and bingo, all my sins are no longer sins....and it matters not how I see is out of context....I will insist on my 'freedom' to ignore what doesn't suit me!

thank-you for your riveting attention!

 

[Scott Downey]

14 having wiped out the [i]handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us.

hmmm, yeah, stealing, adultery, taking the Lord's name in vain, coveting....yep, they are all against me, as well as several more, they restrict my freedom.....so we'll just get rid of them requirements, restrictions... which is it? Ohhhh, yeah, and the one that is the greatest thorn in my side ie, the Sabbath, yeahhhh, the one designed for what? ....it's such a pain in the neck to have to remember to take a rest and put the menial activity of life to one side so I can focus. I've got all this work to do for the Lord so now I'm not burdened by this restriction?...restriction?...did it say something about being against me? Ohhhhh, of course, it's a real inconvenience.....why did God even put it in there in the first place?.....I'm so glad he had second thoughts on that one.....as well as the coveting one....that was the worst inconvenience.....and while I'm at it, I'll just dismiss Psalm 119 cuz the writer (David?) just can't stop extolling that Law which I hear all those 'freedom' fighters say was against us. Isn't it just great to do my own thing and when someone pulls me up on my 'liberty' to suit myself, particularly on forgetting the Sabbath, I can just pull out Colossians 2 and bingo, all my sins are no longer sins....and it matters not how I see is out of context....I will insist on my 'freedom' to ignore what doesn't suit me!

thank-you for your riveting attention!

Colossians 2 specifically mentions as examples of this where it applies

16 So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a [j]festival or a new moon or sabbaths, 17 which are a shadow of things to come, but the [k]substance is of Christ.

Including murder and adultery and not loving God, is useless comparison, it does not apply to what is being spoken of here.

It does apply to these " having wiped out the [i]handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us."

 

[Scott Downey]

This also explains much and notice what they tell the churches regarding the Law of Moses
Acts 15

The Jerusalem Decree​

22 Then it pleased the apostles and elders, with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas, namely, Judas who was also named Barsabas,[g] and Silas, leading men among the brethren.

23 They wrote this letter by them:

The apostles, the elders, and the brethren,
To the brethren who are of the Gentiles in Antioch, Syria, and Cilicia:
Greetings.

24 Since we have heard that some who went out from us have troubled you with words, unsettling your souls, [h]saying, “You must be circumcised and keep the law”—to whom we gave no such commandment— 25 it seemed good to us, being assembled with one [i]accord, to send chosen men to you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul, 26 men who have risked their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. 27 We have therefore sent Judas and Silas, who will also report the same things by word of mouth.

28 For it seemed good to the Holy Spirit, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things: 29 that you abstain from things offered to idols, from blood, from things strangled, and from sexual[j] immorality. If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well.

Farewell.

 

[BarneyFife]

Some adherents to keeping Saturday sabbath frequently ask “where did the Lord take Saturday sabbatrh way?”
The answer can be found in Hebrews 10:9 and in Hebrews 7:12.

Neither of which mentions the Sabbath.

He brought forth a much higher standard... one that is even more Holy... Jesus Christ!

Jesus didn't come to destroy the law or replace the Sabbath. He is LORD of the Sabbath.

In the New Covenant we're supposed to be abiding IN Christ all the time... not just have one day a week that is holy.

One doesn't preclude the other.

The Law of Christ contains NO command or requirement to keep Saturday sabbath because God has something far better for His people under the New Covenant. Saturday sabbath (and the entire Law of Moses) has been made obsolete by the New Covenant and is of no benefit to those trying to continue in any part of the Law of Moses! (Those claiming Saturday sabbath is still required cannot prove this from the New Testament of the Bible because it’s simply not there and does not teach this) .

He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked. (1 John 2:6)

So He came to Nazareth, where He had been brought up. And as His custom was, He went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day, and stood up to read. (Luke 4:16)

Then Paul, as his custom was, went in to them, and for three Sabbaths reasoned with them from the Scriptures, (Acts 17:2)

Imitate me, just as I also imitate Christ. (1 Corinthians 11:1)

.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Well, you don't go to the synagogue on Saturday... like Jesus did, so you are not doing what Jesus did which is sinful right?

And you forgot to mention Jesus and His Apostles never once commended or encouraged anybody to observe Saturday Sabbath and Jesus and His Apostles never once corrected anybody for NOT observing Saturday Sabbath

And as mentioned so many times before, the Counsel at Jerusalem in Acts 15 did not include Saturday Sabbath in their leading by the Holy Ghost on what should be kept from the old covenant.

If what you are saying is true that Saturday Sabbath is required for salvation, then Jesus and His Apostles must have totally forgot to mention this in all the instructions and correction that was issued to New Covenant believers.

Now, if you are going to claim observing Saturday Sabbath is NOT required for salvation... then this entire conversation is a moot point.

 

[BarneyFife]

Well, you don't go to the synagogue on Saturday... like Jesus did, so you are not doing what Jesus did which is sinful right?

I don't think I should go to a house that was left desolate. And you're not funny.

And you forgot to mention Jesus and His Apostles never once commended or encouraged anybody to observe Saturday Sabbath and Jesus and His Apostles never once corrected anybody for NOT observing Saturday Sabbath

Why would I mention a bunch of evasive nonsense? Christ had a lot to say about how the Sabbath should be kept.

And as mentioned so many times before, the Counsel at Jerusalem in Acts 15 did not include Saturday Sabbath in their leading by the Holy Ghost on what should be kept from the old covenant.

They didn't mention any of the other 9 commandments either. Is it okay to break those now?

If what you are saying is true that Saturday Sabbath is required for salvation

I'm not saying that the 4th commandment is required to be kept any more than are the other 9 as a condition for salvation, as you keep trying to suggest.

Jesus and His Apostles must have totally forgot to mention this in all the instructions and correction that was issued to New Covenant believers.

Or, they might have just figured that no one who has been born again would be so anxious to trample one of God's commandments, as long as we're just speculating with arguments from silence.

.

 

[BlessedPeace]

God through Christ changed His own commandment when Christ instituted the NC
HE wiped out the Sabbath commandment as Paul wrote here

Colossians 2

11 In Him you were also circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body [h]of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, 12 buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead. 13 And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses, 14 having wiped out the [i]handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. 15 Having disarmed principalities and powers, He made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them in it.

16 So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a [j]festival or a new moon or sabbaths, 17 which are a shadow of things to come, but the [k]substance is of Christ.

You don't understand the verse if you think Paul is stating Jesus,who gave man the Sabbath , "wiped it out" when installing a new covenant, according to Paul.


Jesus said,in the NT,the Sabbath was made for man. The 10 commands of God in the OT says to remember the Sabbath. And keep it holy.

Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath. Not the God who gave it to us now cancelling it with his arrival as Savior.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

I don't think I should go to a house that was left desolate. And you're not funny.

Well, that's what the command said right?

You're the one saying we are required to do exactly as Jesus did... He kept the entire Law of Moses with perfection ... so good luck with all that!

Why would I mention a bunch of evasive nonsense?

Yeah, too bad you apparently think the teaching ministry of the Lord Jesus thru His Apostles.. is "nonsense"

They didn't mention any of the other 9 commandments either. Is it okay to break those now?

The other nine are already being taught in the New Testament writings so they are already in place.

Of course you are aware of this already as it's been posted numerous times.

I'm not saying that the 4th commandment is required to be kept any more than are the other 9 as a condition for salvation, as you keep trying to suggest.

Then your Saturday sabbath claims are a moot point... much today about something that is not salvation critical that the Lord never taught in the New Testament... BECAUSE something far better has replaced the rest old testament saints had access to.

You know this already as well but cannot acknowledge it as your religion would give you the left foot of fellowship wit you ever did.

Or, they might have just figured that no one who has been born again would be so anxious to trample one of God's commandments, as long as we're just speculating with arguments from silence.

It is the claim that Saturday sabbath is requited for New Covenant believers... that is being made from silence seeing it is not taught in the New Testament which sabbatarians cannot overcome..

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

The 10 commands of God in the OT says to remember the Sabbath. And keep it holy.

New Covenant believers being led by the Holy Spirit do enter in to God's rest by faith when thy abide IN CFhrist every day of the week, enduring IN Christ their entire lives.... so those led by the Holy Ghost ARE keeping the REST of God holy...

We do this every day... not just on Saturday since nothing in the New Testament tells us that we are to only rest one day a week and it has to be on Saturday... BECAUSE something far better has replaced the rest old testament saints had access to.

But hey, if you elect not to accept the Jesus upgrade you can if you'd like and just rest one day a week!
The rest of us will rest ALL days of the week by faith abiding IN Christ.

 

[Fred J]

Looking at Creation with Adam and Eve there, when God created the Sabbath we can see that they knew very well about the Sabbath before the Commandments were written on the stone tablets at Sinai.

One can speculate using Scripture among other things, but apparently non is mentioned prior, and all of this is in vain. Basically, the truth according to the Scripture is all bout, 'as it is written' or 'for it is written', whereby supposedly written.

In Genesis, it is GOD who rested on the 7th day from HIS work, and not man, nor given to man to observe.

Mark 2:27
And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:

It was time for the Law to be given and made through Moses to the Israelites. Where, the 11 tribe individually will receive lands to work on, even with herds, and bring their produces as offering and sacrifice. While, the Levites were ordained and received the works in the Temple alone serving the Israelites.

So, then is when, GOD implemented the Sabbath for man to rest from all of his work.

Thank you

 

[BarneyFife]

You're the one saying we are required to do exactly as Jesus did... He kept the entire Law of Moses with perfection ... so good luck with all that!

You know, you're absolutely right and I completely forgot to change my career field from machinist to carpenter.

I've never been real big on sandals, either.

I hope everything works out all right.

-

Do you actually expect anyone to take you seriously?

-

All I did was to literally quote Scripture and you twisted that into me saying that we have to do exactly what Jesus did.

He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked. (1 John 2:6)

Newsflash:
An apostle said it—not me.

If you want to suggest that "just as He walked" doesn't include keeping all of His Father's commandments, He might have something to say about that—like this:

If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love. (John 15:10)

And if things run true to form, you'll ignore all of this except for one or two things you can twist into something completely harebrained, callow, and insipid.

.

 

[Hobie]

God through Christ changed His own commandment when Christ instituted the NC
HE wiped out the Sabbath commandment as Paul wrote here

Colossians 2

11 In Him you were also circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body [h]of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, 12 buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead. 13 And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses, 14 having wiped out the [i]handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. 15 Having disarmed principalities and powers, He made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them in it.

16 So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a [j]festival or a new moon or sabbaths, 17 which are a shadow of things to come, but the [k]substance is of Christ.

Those were the ceremonial laws that point to Christ. If you look at what we have in the scriptures, the ceremonial law which is of types and ceremonies was written by Moses in a book, the book of the law, and had to be placed beside the ark. The Moral Law is Gods commandments which is encompassed by loving God and our fellow man, which Christ confirmed when he came.

Contrast of Moral and Ceremonial Laws


Moral Law ----------------------------------Ceremonial Law

Called Royal Law of Liberty --------------Called Law...contained in ordinances
James 2:8,12--------------------------------Eph 2:15; Heb 9:10

Spoken by God Himself --- ---------------Given to Moses to speak to the people
Deut 4:12; 5:22 -----------------------------Lev 1:1-3; Exod 24:3


Written by God's finger on stone ---------Written by Moses in "book of the law"
Exodus 31:18; 32:16 ------------------------Deut 31:9,24


Placed in the Ark --- ----------------------Placed beside the Ark
1 Kings 8:9, Deut 10:1-5; ------------------Deut 31:24-26
Heb 9:4;Exod 40:20


Existed before sin ------------------------Given after man sinned
1 John 3:4,8; Rom 4:15; 5:13 --------------Hebrews 5:1; 8:4

Purpose was to reveal sin. ----------------Purpose was to reveal the
Gives the knowledge ----------------------remedy for sin. Was given
of sin--------------------------------------because of sin
Romans 3:20; 7:7 --------------------------Gal 3:19, Lev 6:1,6,7; John1:29

Eternal, established by ---------------------Abolished at cross,
the gospel ----------------------------------Temporary
Ps 111:7,8; Matt 5:18; Rom 3:31-------------Col 2:14-17

Not grievous --------------------------------Contrary to us
1 John 5:3 -----------------------------------Col 2:14-17


Judges all men ------------------------------Judges no man
James 2:10-12 -------------------------------Col 2:14-17

Spiritual --------------------------------------Carnal
Romans 7:14 ---------------------------------Hebrews 9:10

Complete, "Perfect, -------------------------Subject to Change,
Holy, Just and Good"------------------------"made nothing perfect"
Deut 5:22, Psalm 19:7,------------------------Hebrews 7:12,18,19
Rom 7:12

Deuteronomy 31:24-26.
24 And it came to pass, when Moses had made an end of writing the words of this law in a book, until they were finished,
25 That Moses commanded the Levites, which bare the ark of the covenant of the Lord, saying,
26 Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

It's pretty hilarious that some apparently believe 1 John 2:6 means
we are supposed to live under the old testament law... just like Jesus did!

 

[BarneyFife]

It's pretty hilarious that some apparently believe 1 John 2:6 means
we are supposed to live under the old testament law... just like Jesus did!

I don't know why a Christian who cares about the eternal life of others would find what they perceive as erroneous beliefs in others to be hilarious.

Hardly anyone on this forum believes that Christians are required to live under the Law of Moses apart from the Ten Commandments and only those civil and non-ceremonial laws that include policies that support keeping the moral law.

(Christians are rarely slow in citing Mosaic laws forbidding sexual perversion. Interesting.)

This has been explained to you over a hundred times and in countless different ways and yet you still advance the lie that New Covenant Sabbatarians are teaching and practicing otherwise. Perhaps you could use a brushing up on the 9th commandment.

And it appears you're very conflicted about whether all of this is funny or sad.

It's sad to see that some know so little about God's Word that they don't
understand the difference between the old covenant and the New Covenant...

.

 

[Jay Ross]

Hello

It is sad that many Christians do not understand the importance of Christ's claim in Matthew 13:52. Jesus makes no reference to the Old Covenant or to a future New Covenant but rather he points to the availability of our salvation that has been there since the time of Adam.

What He does tell us is that the Covenant of salvation from the time of Adam will be refreshed when the scribes who have understanding about the Kingdom of God teach about this salvation.

Shalom

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

What He does tell us is that the Covenant of salvation from the time of Adam will be refreshed when the scribes who have understanding about the Kingdom of God teach about this salvation.

That's the New Covenant that some are willingly ignorant of not knowing the scriptures.

Jeremiah 31:31-34
Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I WILL MAKE A NEW COVENANT with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
NOT according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:
But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
And they shall teach no more every man his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

And of course in Romans 11 we see that the gentiles were able to be grafted in.

Some still are ignorant of the New Covenant for some strange and odd reason

 

[Jay Ross]

That's the New Covenant that some are willingly ignorant of not knowing the scriptures. View attachment 40580

Jeremiah 31:31-34
Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I WILL MAKE A NEW COVENANT with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
NOT according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:
But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
And they shall teach no more every man his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

And of course in Romans 11 we see that the gentiles were able to be grafted in.

Some still are ignorant of the New Covenant for some strange and odd reason View attachment 40581

Seems like you have shown your ignorance once again. The Covenant referenced in Matt 13:52 has nothing to do with Jer 31:31ff.

Yes, Romans does tell us that the gentiles will be grafted onto the stump of the Olive Tree because of the Israelites, but Paul gives this warning to the Gentiles in Romans 11: -

19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off that I might be grafted in.” 20 Well said. Because of unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by faith. Do not be haughty, but fear. 21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, He may not spare you either. 22 Therefore consider the goodness and severity of God: on those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness, if you continue in His goodness. Otherwise, you also will be cut off. 23 And they also, if they do not continue in unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again. 24 For if you were cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, who are natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree?

We need to be very careful because God is looking down the sights of his justice and he is seeing a Rabbit that would make a good stew meal.

Goodbye