Were We Alive In Heaven Before We Were Born?

[Ziggy]

Add another question into the mix. And I believe the answer is yes, but not in the sense that
there was a human form in heaven before birth or after death. (NOT YET, the later.)

Were we alive in heaven after the body died?

• Ecclesiastes 12:7: “And the dust returns to the earth as it was, and the spirit returns to God who gave it.”

This would indicate that your human spirit continues on after your body is rotting in the ground. So, depending on your Tripartite view of existence the human spirit is alive, but possibly awaiting an eventual rejoining.

• Matthew 10:28: “And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather fear him who can destroy both soul and body in hell.”

This would indicate that your human soul continues on after your body is rotting in the ground. So, depending on your Tripartite view of existence the human soul is alive, but may well end up non-existent depending on you yourself and beliefs and lifestyles.

If the Holy Bible is accurate.. and when one dies their human spirit goes back to God who gave it... then it likely it was in existence before you were ever a thought to your parents.
I suppose that the creation of your human spirit may have been closer to you conception... but that would still mean your spirit was in heaven before your conception and birth.
(I hope that is clear and not confusing)

Your body was not.

You need a human spirit to be able to communicate with God, but that is another subject for another day

So are there2 spirits at war. God's spirit and man's spirit which comes through the blood in the womb?

It says.. Refering to Seth who was Adam's 3rd son, that he was made after Adam and not after the likeness of God.

Gen 1:27
So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
Gen 5:3
And Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his own likeness, after his image; and called his name Seth:

Which makes me think of:
Jhn 8:44
Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

Gen 4:25
And Adam knew his wife again; and she bare a son, and called his name Seth: For God, said she, hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew.

Seth was "appointed"

Heb 9:27
And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

sheeth; a primitive root; to place (in a very wide application):—apply, appoint, array, bring, consider, lay (up), let alone, × look, make, mark, put (on), regard, set, shew, be stayed, × take.

What is the "mark" of the beast?

He has nothing in me...

Jhn 14:30
Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.

2Co 4:4
In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

Image of God vs. Image of man.

1Co 2:11
For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

Jhn 3:5
Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Jhn 3:6
That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
Jhn 3:8
The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
Gal 4:29
But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.

Ye must be born again...

thinking...
hugs

 

[Ziggy]

Cain physically slew Abel, but it was Adam that doomed us all to death by defying God. Spiritually speaking.

Hugs

 

[Rella ~ I am a woman]

So are there2 spirits at war. God's spirit and man's spirit which comes through the blood in the womb?

WAIT A MINUTE. Where in the world do you come up with God's Spirit as part of being born?

Especially in light of the scriptures you posted.

Are you referring to the fact that God the Father is a spirit... which is factual, or are you referring, as some do, to the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit could not be part of birth because
Paul... (WHO ELSE) ... clearly taught that we receive the Holy Spirit the moment we receive Jesus Christ as our Savior... so that cannot be what you are referring.

So you feel that God and man are warring? even before birth? or at the moment of?

If that be so... then I can think of no better argument to rush that baby to their baptism to get Satan removed... Yet... you don't believe in baby baptisms do you.

Or is it that you do not believe people have a spirit.... a human spirit?

You have me thoroughly confused...

It says.. Refering to Seth who was Adam's 3rd son, that he was made after Adam and not after the likeness of God.

Gen 1:27
So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
Gen 5:3
And Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his own likeness, after his image; and called his name Seth:

Which makes me think of:
Jhn 8:44
Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

Gen 4:25
And Adam knew his wife again; and she bare a son, and called his name Seth: For God, said she, hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew.

Seth was "appointed"

Heb 9:27
And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

sheeth; a primitive root; to place (in a very wide application):—apply, appoint, array, bring, consider, lay (up), let alone, × look, make, mark, put (on), regard, set, shew, be stayed, × take.

What is the "mark" of the beast?

He has nothing in me...

Jhn 14:30
Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.

2Co 4:4
In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

Image of God vs. Image of man.

1Co 2:11
For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

Jhn 3:5
Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Jhn 3:6
That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
Jhn 3:8
The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
Gal 4:29
But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.

Ye must be born again...

thinking...
hugs

 

[BlessedPeace]

No.

 

[Ziggy]

You have me thoroughly confused...

LOL

You have any idea how often I feel like Job?

Job 42:3
Who is he that hideth counsel without knowledge? therefore have I uttered that I understood not; things too wonderful for me, which I knew not.

WAIT A MINUTE. Where in the world do you come up with God's Spirit as part of being born?

Especially in light of the scriptures you posted.

Are you referring to the fact that God the Father is a spirit... which is factual, or are you referring, as some do, to the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit could not be part of birth because
Paul... (WHO ELSE) ... clearly taught that we receive the Holy Spirit the moment we receive Jesus Christ as our Savior... so that cannot be what you are referring.

So you feel that God and man are warring? even before birth? or at the moment of?

If that be so... then I can think of no better argument to rush that baby to their baptism to get Satan removed... Yet... you don't believe in baby baptisms do you.

Or is it that you do not believe people have a spirit.... a human spirit?

God the Father is Spirit. We all come from God. We all have one Father.
1Co 8:6
But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.
Eph 4:6
One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

Trying hard not to trip over the trinity thing here... that's another pandora's box. Not even sure how that works.

when does the war begin... I would say at the age of reason. Or usually teenage rebellion age. I believe children are innocent until proven guilty lol. For real. They have to deliberatly and knowingly do something wrong before they are guilty of a rebellious spirit.

I don't believe a baby understands baptism and the significance of it, so no.

God spirit and human nature. How would you define the two?

So this is what I'm thinking...
Prior to being concieved in the womb, our essence, our life force.. the ability to be born alive as an individual,
the very life which enters into the womb upon conception, comes from God.
We are not a person yet. We are simply a part of God's Spirit. Not actualized in form of flesh. We are as it were a breath of God. We are a part of his being. We have no form, no name, no character of our own. We are Him before we are ourselves. Spirit.

I wish I could draw a picture..lol

Upon conception that spark of life that gets things rolling comes from God. It is what makes life possible.
If a child dies during childbirth, that Spirit, that spark, returns to God.

Now what happens from the time of conception to birth is a merging between that spark that comes from God and human nature which is created from the elements of the earth. Flesh. It's as if the flesh has a mind of it's own. The Id and the Ego, and the super-ego.
Oh oh here comes Freud..

In the ego psychology model of the psyche, the id is the set of uncoordinated instinctual desires; the superego plays the critical and moralizing role; and the ego is the organized, realistic agent that mediates between the instinctual desires of the id and the critical superego

So the id is the nature of the flesh, or instinct, flight or fight, uncontrolled passion, desire...
The Superego is the Spirit of God. Have this mind in you which was in Christ Jesus....
The ego is our own reasoning and intellect. There is a way which seemeth right unto a man...

The conflict is between the superego and the ego.
The Id is controlled by one of these two ego's.
So to put it in biblical terms... God vs. the devil. One of these you serve, but they both can't be the master of the Id.

There comes a time when reasoning is brought into play. Is this good or bad, right or wrong, what happens if...
This is where the struggle begins. Not all people begin this struggle at the same age. Some call it maturity or puberty.
This is the age when Parenting is critical. The younger you begin teaching right from wrong, the easier the seeds get planted.
The younger the child, the softer the heart. As we grow in age our hearts become calloused and hard, stubborn, rebellious.
Our Ego tries to control both Id and Superego, Because we know best.
They did not like to retain God in their knowledge:

Rom 1:28
And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

The reprobate mind is the ego. The knowledge of God is the Superego. And the Id can only be obedient to one of them.
Otherwise your doubleminded and live in a state of confusion. I know I should do this, But this is what I want to do.
Hear Paul.. the things I would do..
Rom 7:18
For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.

In my flesh (Id) , to will (Superego) , to perform (Ego) .

The Superego in my opinion comes from God. The Ego comes from what we learn from our parents, from the world. The Id just follows whichever is the stronger of the two.

Mat 26:41
Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.

When we die, our Ego dies with the flesh, Id, but the Superego returns to God who gave it.

Does this help???
Hugs

 

[Ziggy]

Are you referring to the fact that God the Father is a spirit... which is factual, or are you referring, as some do, to the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit could not be part of birth because
Paul... (WHO ELSE) ... clearly taught that we receive the Holy Spirit the moment we receive Jesus Christ as our Savior... so that cannot be what you are referring.

So I didn't mean to skip over this part.

What is the role of the Holy Spirit? (Pandora's box)

I believe the Holy Spirit is God's Spirit. It is not seperate from God, but the very essence of God himself.
It is the Superego.

Just to recap:
In the ego psychology model of the psyche, the id is the set of uncoordinated instinctual desires; the superego plays the critical and moralizing role; and the ego is the organized, realistic agent that mediates between the instinctual desires of the id and the critical superego

This is the Holy in Holy Spirit.

Be Ye holy as I am holy.

Lev 20:7
Sanctify yourselves therefore, and be ye holy: for I am the LORD your God.
1Pe 1:15
But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;
1Pe 1:16
Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.

God is Spirit and He is Holy. Thus we have the Holy Spirit.

So the question is, are we born with the Holy Spirit or do we only recieve it when we accept Christ as our saviour?

I keep hearing.. sold your soul.. redemption,

What did Christ come to redeem?

Psa 49:15
But God will redeem my soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receive me. Selah.

Psa 72:14
He shall redeem their soul from deceit and violence: and precious shall their blood be in his sight.

Tit 2:14
Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

1. to release on receipt of ransom
2. to redeem, liberate by payment of ransom
   1. to liberate
   2. to cause to be released to one's self by payment of a ransom
   3. to redeem
   4. to deliver: from evils of every kind, internal and external

Are we born with the Holy Spirit...

What is repentance?

Act 3:19
Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;

Refreshing.. to re-fresh. to turn back, repent.


So I have a white sheet of paper but I have scribbled all over it with crayons so much so the paper is no longer white.
And yet if I have a magic eraser that can erase all those marks of crayons, the white sheet of paper still remains.

The blotting out of sins. The eraser.

Where do sins reside? Are they in the flesh, in the mind?

Do sins cover over something?
If we have a seed of God's spirit when we are born and over time our own ego and flesh build up sin, then ...
What is the purpose of going through purging?

Heb 9:14
How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

If the Holy Spirit isn't given until one accepts Jesus as Lord, how does David in the Psalms say:

Psa 51:10
Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me.
Psa 51:11
Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me.
Psa 51:12
Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation; and uphold me with thy free spirit.

renew and restore...


For where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is Liberty...
2Co 3:17
Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.

Redemption:
Isa 52:3
For thus saith the LORD, Ye have sold yourselves for nought; and ye shall be redeemed without money.

Pro 23:23
Buy the truth, and sell it not; also wisdom, and instruction, and understanding.
Mat 13:44
Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto treasure hid in a field; the which when a man hath found, he hideth, and for joy thereof goeth and selleth all that he hath, and buyeth that field.

1Jo 4:13
Hereby know we that we dwell in him, and he in us, because he hath given us of his Spirit.

Rom 8:1
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

Isa 42:5
Thus saith God the LORD, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out; he that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; he that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein:

Tit 3:5
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

Rom 12:2
And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing G342 of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

anakaínōsis

1. a renewal, renovation, complete change for the better

So if our beginning is the Superego and we wander off after the ego, then when one repents they are returning to the beginning.

I believe we are born with God's spirit, but the world leads us away with our own ego/spirit, when we repent we return to God's spirit, which he renews, renovates, redeems, and restores.
None of which is possible if you don't have a foundation in which to return to.

Ecc 12:12
And further, by these, my son, be admonished: of making many books there is no end; and much study is a weariness of the flesh.

Setting my pick and shovel down for the night. I just looked at the clock and its after 1am. lol

Hugs

 

[MA2444]

If the Holy Bible is accurate.. and when one dies their human spirit goes back to God who gave it... then it likely it was in existence before you were ever a thought to your parents.
I suppose that the creation of your human spirit may have been closer to you conception... but that would still mean your spirit was in heaven before your conception and birth.
(I hope that is clear and not confusing)

Your body was not.

You need a human spirit to be able to communicate with God, but that is another subject for another day

Then it in heaven before we were in the womb. Our spirit wasn't in limbo somewhere so it was with God who created it.

Agreed, I never meant to imply that our flesh body was in heaven before we were in the womb.

That sounds like something I'd disagree with but I'm also not sure and that does sound like it's own thread, lol.

In context, the speaking to an individual, “you, us, our, we, they, all”, etc. can apply to anyone included within the context.

The Lord God is not only the Creator and Maker but ALSO the “author” of “KNOWING” what each of His Creations SHALL believe, think, choose, do.

It is the manKIND of creation, that does not know his destiny until he steps into it.

Glory to God,
Taken

Right. But He still chose a proper pronoun instead of saying something like, before you were in the womb I knew my plans for you. Cuz if that's what it means He could have said that that initially and stopped a lot of confusio about it.

I knew you before you were in the womb!

If I said to you, I know you! You would think we have met and wonder when and where, right? If I said, I know you! Would you ask me, what have you heard about me? Or Have we met before?!

 

[MA2444]

This would indicate that your human spirit continues on after your body is rotting in the ground. So, depending on your Tripartite view of existence the human spirit is alive, but possibly awaiting an eventual rejoining.

Remember the scripture that says the spirit and soul can not be divided? (Hebrews 4?)
So our spirit and soul go to be with the Lord and the body rots in the grave...

"...possibly awaiting an eventual rejoining?"
It's called the Rapture! In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye we we will rejoin with our resurrected body and be transformed into our Resurrection Body just like Jesus has.

 

[Taken]

Then it in heaven before we were in the womb. Our spirit wasn't in limbo somewhere so it was with God who created it.

Agreed, I never meant to imply that our flesh body was in heaven before we were in the womb.

That sounds like something I'd disagree with but I'm also not sure and that does sound like it's own thread, lol.


Right. But He still chose a proper pronoun instead of saying something like, before you were in the womb I knew my plans for you. Cuz if that's what it means He could have said that that initially and stopped a lot of confusio about it.

I knew you before you were in the womb!

If I said to you, I know you! You would think we have met and wonder when and where, right? If I said, I know you! Would you ask me, what have you heard about me? Or Have we met before?!

God begins with something that IS His…
I find no elaboration on how or WHEN this thing was Created or made….
That “THING” is called “A SEED”.

Per scriptural knowledge….
God “scattered” seeds upon the ground….
And trees, plants, herb, etc. grew.

God also reveals to EVERY seed, God gives that SEED, it’s OWN BODY.

1 Cor 15:
[38] But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.

Did God KNOW, what Every SEED would become and do….?
I would say YES.

Does a SEED KNOW before it develops, becomes a being, receives it’s body, learns, experiences, chooses….. No.

A mystery of God….yet “somewhat” men can relate….by observing their own children, full well knowing what their children WILL CHOOSE TO DO, before “THE Child knows”.

We can tell, teach, children to DO this, NOT DO that….but still expect the chid to have curiosity about “NO, don’t do that”, and they have a try at it anyway.

 

[Rella ~ I am a woman]

So I didn't mean to skip over this part.

What is the role of the Holy Spirit? (Pandora's box)

I believe the Holy Spirit is God's Spirit. It is not seperate from God, but the very essence of God himself.
It is the Superego.

Just to recap:
In the ego psychology model of the psyche, the id is the set of uncoordinated instinctual desires; the superego plays the critical and moralizing role; and the ego is the organized, realistic agent that mediates between the instinctual desires of the id and the critical superego

This is the Holy in Holy Spirit.

Be Ye holy as I am holy.

Lev 20:7
Sanctify yourselves therefore, and be ye holy: for I am the LORD your God.
1Pe 1:15
But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;
1Pe 1:16
Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.

God is Spirit and He is Holy. Thus we have the Holy Spirit.

So the question is, are we born with the Holy Spirit or do we only recieve it when we accept Christ as our saviour?

I keep hearing.. sold your soul.. redemption,

What did Christ come to redeem?

Psa 49:15
But God will redeem my soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receive me. Selah.

Psa 72:14
He shall redeem their soul from deceit and violence: and precious shall their blood be in his sight.

Tit 2:14
Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

1. to release on receipt of ransom
2. to redeem, liberate by payment of ransom
   1. to liberate
   2. to cause to be released to one's self by payment of a ransom
   3. to redeem
   4. to deliver: from evils of every kind, internal and external

Are we born with the Holy Spirit...

What is repentance?

Act 3:19
Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;

Refreshing.. to re-fresh. to turn back, repent.


So I have a white sheet of paper but I have scribbled all over it with crayons so much so the paper is no longer white.
And yet if I have a magic eraser that can erase all those marks of crayons, the white sheet of paper still remains.

The blotting out of sins. The eraser.

Where do sins reside? Are they in the flesh, in the mind?

Do sins cover over something?
If we have a seed of God's spirit when we are born and over time our own ego and flesh build up sin, then ...
What is the purpose of going through purging?

Heb 9:14
How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

If the Holy Spirit isn't given until one accepts Jesus as Lord, how does David in the Psalms say:

Psa 51:10
Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me.
Psa 51:11
Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me.
Psa 51:12
Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation; and uphold me with thy free spirit.

renew and restore...


For where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is Liberty...
2Co 3:17
Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.

Redemption:
Isa 52:3
For thus saith the LORD, Ye have sold yourselves for nought; and ye shall be redeemed without money.

Pro 23:23
Buy the truth, and sell it not; also wisdom, and instruction, and understanding.
Mat 13:44
Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto treasure hid in a field; the which when a man hath found, he hideth, and for joy thereof goeth and selleth all that he hath, and buyeth that field.

1Jo 4:13
Hereby know we that we dwell in him, and he in us, because he hath given us of his Spirit.

Rom 8:1
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

Isa 42:5
Thus saith God the LORD, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out; he that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; he that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein:

Tit 3:5
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

Rom 12:2
And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing G342 of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

anakaínōsis

1. a renewal, renovation, complete change for the better

So if our beginning is the Superego and we wander off after the ego, then when one repents they are returning to the beginning.

I believe we are born with God's spirit, but the world leads us away with our own ego/spirit, when we repent we return to God's spirit, which he renews, renovates, redeems, and restores.
None of which is possible if you don't have a foundation in which to return to.

Ecc 12:12
And further, by these, my son, be admonished: of making many books there is no end; and much study is a weariness of the flesh.

Setting my pick and shovel down for the night. I just looked at the clock and its after 1am. lol

Hugs

Ziggy,

We cannot agree on this as we do see things far differently and WE CANNOT discuss this ... look at my signature.

Maybe someday.

Be blessed

 

[Rella ~ I am a woman]

Wick Stick​

Well-Known Member​

Sep 21, 20234042846344PhoenixFaithChristianCountryUnited States

Add another question into the mix. And I believe the answer is yes, but not in the sense that
there was a human form in heaven before birth or after death. (NOT YET, the later.)

Were we alive in heaven after the body died?

• Ecclesiastes 12:7: “And the dust returns to the earth as it was, and the spirit returns to God who gave it.”

This would indicate that your human spirit continues on after your body is rotting in the ground. So, depending on your Tripartite view of existence the human spirit is alive, but possibly awaiting an eventual rejoining.

• Matthew 10:28: “And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather fear him who can destroy both soul and body in hell.”

This would indicate that your human soul continues on after your body is rotting in the ground. So, depending on your Tripartite view of existence the human soul is alive, but may well end up non-existent depending on you yourself and beliefs and lifestyles.

If the Holy Bible is accurate.. and when one dies their human spirit goes back to God who gave it... then it likely it was in existence before you were ever a thought to your parents.
I suppose that the creation of your human spirit may have been closer to you conception... but that would still mean your spirit was in heaven before your conception and birth.
(I hope that is clear and not confusing)

Your body was not.

You need a human spirit to be able to communicate with God, but that is another subject for another day

Jarrod,

I am confused as usual... You quoted this of mine but no comment?

Blessings

 

[Rella ~ I am a woman]

Remember the scripture that says the spirit and soul can not be divided? (Hebrews 4?)
So our spirit and soul go to be with the Lord and the body rots in the grave...

I remember this... Heb 4:12

KJV For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

NASB 1995
For the word of God is living and active and sharper than any two-edged sword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
For the word of God is living and all-efficient, and much sharper than a double edged sword, and it pierces to the separation of soul and spirit and of joints, marrow and of bones, and judges the reasoning and conscience of the heart.

Young's Literal Translation
for the reckoning of God is living, and working, and sharp above every two-edged sword, and piercing unto the dividing asunder both of soul and spirit, of joints also and marrow, and a discerner of thoughts and intents of the heart;

"...possibly awaiting an eventual rejoining?"
It's called the Rapture! In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye we we will rejoin with our resurrected body and be transformed into our Resurrection Body just like Jesus has.

 

[Wick Stick]

Jarrod,

I am confused as usual... You quoted this of mine but no comment?

Blessings

Technical difficulties. I didn't know the post had gone through... deleting blank post.

 

[Ziggy]

Ziggy,

We cannot agree on this as we do see things far differently and WE CANNOT discuss this ... look at my signature.

Maybe someday.

Be blessed

Rom 12:18
If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.


HUGS

 

[Ziggy]

I'm still trying to determine where and what Heaven is.
So to determine if we were somewhere before we were somewhere else, I would need to know where the origen is.

For instance, If the Kingdom of heaven is within you, where should I being my excavation?
Is it in my heart, my mind, my conscience, my belly.
None of these existed before conception. According to the flesh.

The only component left is the spirit.
What is the spirit?
Where does it come from?

So here's a strange question...
About a month ago my Dad lost a lot of blood. He had to have a transfusion. If life, or the spirit is in the blood, then is my Dad's life still his own or is he living with someone else's spirit in him?
Speaking of Dad, His body is improving but I think his mind is slipping. I was going to bring him home from the hospital when he gets discharged, but he told me today he wants to go to rehab when a bed becomes available.
I don't know where that will be as there are no local (within 50 miles) rehabs that have any beds available.

Just taking one day at a time.

Hugs

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Were We Alive In Heaven Before We Were Born?

No, but God had foreknowledge that He was going to create you.

 

[The Learner]

NO

 

[The Learner]

Jeremiah 1:5
5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.../KJV

If Jesus knew us before we were in the womb, then we were in His presence before. We know that Jesus does not force the Gospel or Salvation upon any man. He has given us free will and wont violate it. So doesnt it make sense that since Jesus never foreces Himself upon anyone, and He never changes (!) that is it possible that we agreed to come here? Or maybe even chose our parents that we would be born to?

He is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow, and He knew us before we were in the womb. What did we talk about? Apparently, being born with Amnesia was part of the course.

What do you think?

God's preknowledge does not mean we existed then.
He is outside of time and sees all of time at once.

Jeremiah 1

Easy-to-Read Version

​

1 These are the messages of Jeremiah, the son of Hilkiah. Jeremiah belonged to the family of priests who lived in the town of Anathoth.[a] That town is in the land that belongs to the tribe of Benjamin. 2 The Lord began to speak to Jeremiah in the 13th year[b] that Josiah, son of Amon, was king of the nation of Judah. 3 He continued to speak to Jeremiah during the time that Jehoiakim, son of Josiah, was king of Judah and during the eleven years and five months that Zedekiah, also a son of Josiah, was king of Judah. In the fifth month of Zedekiah’s eleventh year as king, the people who lived in Jerusalem were taken away into exile.

God Calls Jeremiah​

4 The Lord’s message came to me:
5 “Before I made you in your mother’s womb,
I knew you.
Before you were born,
I chose you for a special work.
I chose you to be a prophet to the nations.”
6 Then I said, “But, Lord God, I don’t know how to speak. I am only a boy.”
7 But the Lord said to me,
“Don’t say, ‘I am only a boy.’
You must go everywhere I send you
and say everything I tell you to say.
8 Don’t be afraid of anyone.
I am with you, and I will protect you.”
This message is from the Lord.
9 Then the Lord reached out with his hand and touched my mouth. He said to me,
“Jeremiah, I am putting my words in your mouth.
10 Today I have put you in charge of nations and kingdoms.
You will pull up and tear down.
You will destroy and overthrow.
You will build up and plant.”

Two Visions​

11 The Lord’s message came to me: “Jeremiah, what do you see?”
I answered, “I see a stick made from almond wood.”
12 The Lord said to me, “You have seen very well, and I am watching[c] to make sure that my message to you comes true.”

 

[MA2444]

God's preknowledge does not mean we existed then.
He is outside of time and sees all of time at once.

Jeremiah 1​

​

Easy-to-Read Version​

​

​

1 These are the messages of Jeremiah, the son of Hilkiah. Jeremiah belonged to the family of priests who lived in the town of Anathoth.[a] That town is in the land that belongs to the tribe of Benjamin. 2 The Lord began to speak to Jeremiah in the 13th year[b] that Josiah, son of Amon, was king of the nation of Judah. 3 He continued to speak to Jeremiah during the time that Jehoiakim, son of Josiah, was king of Judah and during the eleven years and five months that Zedekiah, also a son of Josiah, was king of Judah. In the fifth month of Zedekiah’s eleventh year as king, the people who lived in Jerusalem were taken away into exile.

God Calls Jeremiah​

4 The Lord’s message came to me:
5 “Before I made you in your mother’s womb,
I knew you.
Before you were born,
I chose you for a special work.
I chose you to be a prophet to the nations.”
6 Then I said, “But, Lord God, I don’t know how to speak. I am only a boy.”
7 But the Lord said to me,
“Don’t say, ‘I am only a boy.’
You must go everywhere I send you
and say everything I tell you to say.
8 Don’t be afraid of anyone.
I am with you, and I will protect you.”
This message is from the Lord.
9 Then the Lord reached out with his hand and touched my mouth. He said to me,
“Jeremiah, I am putting my words in your mouth.
10 Today I have put you in charge of nations and kingdoms.
You will pull up and tear down.
You will destroy and overthrow.
You will build up and plant.”

Two Visions​

11 The Lord’s message came to me: “Jeremiah, what do you see?”
I answered, “I see a stick made from almond wood.”
12 The Lord said to me, “You have seen very well, and I am watching[c] to make sure that my message to you comes true.”

I understand that God is omnipresent, which is everywhere at once AND at every time!

But I can't see the truth in the statement: I didnt ask to be born here!
Now I'm no Abraham or Paul, but I know the Lord well enough to know that His Character would not let Him force us to be born here.

We all know very well that the Lord does not force Himself uopn anyone. We have free will to choose. So if we have free will now, why would He force us into being born here against our will?!
He would not, it's as simple as that. The Lord is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow, He never changes His character.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

I didnt ask to be born here!

That's a moot point!

You were in fact born here and now you have to deal with it.