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What constitutes penance!

Discussion in 'The Church Forum' started by theefaith, Mar 13, 2022.

  1. theefaith

    theefaith Well-Known Member

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    we still have apostles!

    the apostolic tradition must continue till Christ returns

    there are still nations to be taught
    Still disciples to be made by baptism Matt 28:19

    matt 28:19-20
    I am with you (the apostles) to the end

    apostolic succession
    Acts 1:15-26
     
  2. reformed1689

    reformed1689 Well-Known Member

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    No, we do not have apostles today. Matt 28:19 says nothing about apostles today. Acts 1:15-26 had some pretty specific criteria for the apostle that was selected, they had to have been with them from the beginning. Pretty sure that doesn't apply to anyone today.
     
  3. theefaith

    theefaith Well-Known Member

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    the apostles have the same mission power and authors Christ Jn 20:21

    Successors of Jesus Christ!

    Matt 28:19-20

    19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

    20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

    So there must be successors to the apostles, the USA was not a nation for 1800 years after the apostles, yet He says teach all nations!

    And behold I am with you (the apostles) to the end of the world!


    Jesus already prepares His apostles to continue His mission with His power (binding and loosing) and with His authority (keys) matt 16:18 matt 18:18

    Same mission, power, and authority Jn 20:21-23

    John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

    John 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.

    John 4:1 when therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John...
    Jn 4:2 Though Jesus himself baptized not, but his disciples

    Here we see Jesus delegating to His successors, Peter and the apostles!

    Jn 15:5 apart from me you can do nothing

    There can be no unity of the spirit without obedience to the faith! Rom 1:5 eph 4:3

    Matt 28 I am with you (the apostles)

    The papacy based on Matt 16:18 and Isa 22:21-22

    Matt 16:18-19
    18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

    19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

    Isa 22:21-22
    21 And I will clothe him with thy robe, and strengthen him with thy girdle, and I will commit thy government into his hand: and he shall be a father to the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and to the house of Judah.

    22 And the key of the house of David will I lay upon his shoulder; so he shall open, and none shall shut; and he shall shut, and none shall open.

    Behold I am with you (the apostles) until the end of the world,so the successors of the apostles must remain until the end of the world) matt 28:19

    (None of the so called reformers were apostles) (no man has authority to start a church)


    Successors of Moses!

    Matt 23 why does Jesus say to obey the successors of Moses?

    The successors of Moses sit in the chair of Moses having the authority of the keys and the power to bind and loose Matt 23 and Jesus commanded them to be obeyed! Then the kingdom was taken from them matt 21:43 and given to Peter, Matt 16:18 the apostles, Matt 18:18 and their successors with the authority of the keys and the power to bind and lose!

    Jesus said to obey the authority of the successors of Moses mt 23 authority of the keys and power to bind and loose and this power and authority was taken from them matt and given by Christ to Peter, the apostles and their successors, mt 16:18 18:18 this same authority and power must be obeyed!

    mt 28:18-20 all authority is given to Peter, the apostles, and their successors requiring obedience, rom 1:5 obedience to the faith!
    And Jesus say to Peter, the apostles, and their successors: behold I am with you even until the end of the world!!!
    So the apostles have to remain until the end! Revelation 5:10
    And hast made us unto our God kings and Priests: and we shall reign on the earth. Reign with kingdom authority (keys) power (bind loose) matt 16:18
    The successors of Peter and the apostles have a valid jurisdictional authority (keys) and power (bind and loose) by Jesus Christ!

    Lk 10:16
    He who hears you hears me...

    John 13:20
    Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me; and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.

    apostolic succession!

    explicit and implicit in scripture

    Judas was an apostle
    Acts 1:17 For he was numbered with us, and had obtained part of this ministry.

    acts 1:20 For it is written in the book of Psalms, Let his habitation be desolate, and let no man dwell therein: and his bishoprick let another take.

    Matthias succeeded him as apostle

    acts 1: 26 And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles.

    now if it applies to judas how much more to Peter and the other apostles

    Matt 28:19-20
    Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

    20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

    Jesus is with His church and His apostles until the end! So the apostles must remain until the end governing the church administering the kingdom

    Mt 16:18 Peter received the keys of the kingdom: (jurisdictional authority of the universal church) and the power to bind and loose:

    Lk 22:32
    Jesus prays for Peter:

    Jn 21:17
    Peter commanded to Feed my sheep:

    Isa 22 21-22 prime minister called father!
    Holding the keys of the kingdom under the king Lk 1:32-33 in the line of david!
    Matt 16:18

    Apostolic succession!

    Successors of Jesus Christ!

    Matt 28:19-20

    19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

    20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

    So there must be successors to the apostles, the USA was not a nation for 1800 years after the apostles, yet He says teach all nations!

    And behold I am with you (the apostles) to the end of the world!


    Jesus already prepares His apostles to continue His mission with His power (binding and loosing) and with His authority (keys) matt 16:18 matt 18:18

    Same mission, power, and authority Jn 20:21-23

    John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

    John 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.

    John 4:1 when therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John...
    Jn 4:2 Though Jesus himself baptized not, but his disciples

    Here we see Jesus delegating to His successors, Peter and the apostles!

    Jn 15:5 apart from me you can do nothing

    There can be no unity of the spirit without obedience to the faith! Rom 1:5 eph 4:3

    Matt 28 I am with you (the apostles)

    The papacy based on Matt 16:18 and Isa 22:21-22

    Matt 16:18-19
    18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

    19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

    Isa 22:21-22
    21 And I will clothe him with thy robe, and strengthen him with thy girdle, and I will commit thy government into his hand: and he shall be a father to the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and to the house of Judah.

    22 And the key of the house of David will I lay upon his shoulder; so he shall open, and none shall shut; and he shall shut, and none shall open.

    Behold I am with you (the apostles) until the end of the world,so the successors of the apostles must remain until the end of the world) matt 28:19

    (None of the so called reformers were apostles) (no man has authority to start a church)


    Successors of Moses!

    Matt 23 why does Jesus say to obey the successors of Moses?

    The successors of Moses sit in the chair of Moses having the authority of the keys and the power to bind and loose Matt 23 and Jesus commanded them to be obeyed! Then the kingdom was taken from them matt 21:43 and given to Peter, Matt 16:18 the apostles, Matt 18:18 and their successors with the authority of the keys and the power to bind and lose!

    Jesus said to obey the authority of the successors of Moses mt 23 authority of the keys and power to bind and loose and this power and authority was taken from them matt and given by Christ to Peter, the apostles and their successors, mt 16:18 18:18 this same authority and power must be obeyed!

    mt 28:18-20 all authority is given to Peter, the apostles, and their successors requiring obedience, rom 1:5 obedience to the faith!
    And Jesus say to Peter, the apostles, and their successors: behold I am with you even until the end of the world!!!
    So the apostles have to remain until the end! Revelation 5:10
    And hast made us unto our God kings and Priests: and we shall reign on the earth. Reign with kingdom authority (keys) power (bind loose) matt 16:18
    The successors of Peter and the apostles have a valid jurisdictional authority (keys) and power (bind and loose) by Jesus Christ!

    Lk 10:16
    He who hears you hears me...

    John 13:20
    Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me; and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.
     
  4. theefaith

    theefaith Well-Known Member

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    apostolic succession!

    explicit and implicit in scripture

    Judas was an apostle
    Acts 1:17 For he was numbered with us, and had obtained part of this ministry.

    acts 1:20 For it is written in the book of Psalms, Let his habitation be desolate, and let no man dwell therein: and his bishoprick let another take.

    Matthias succeeded him as apostle

    acts 1: 26 And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles.

    now if it applies to judas how much more to Peter and the other apostles

    Matt 28:19-20
    Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

    20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

    Jesus is with His church and His apostles until the end! So the apostles must remain until the end governing the church administering the kingdom

    Mt 16:18 Peter received the keys of the kingdom: (jurisdictional authority of the universal church) and the power to bind and loose:

    Lk 22:32
    Jesus prays for Peter:

    Jn 21:17
    Peter commanded to Feed my sheep:

    Isa 22 21-22 prime minister called father!
    Holding the keys of the kingdom under the king Lk 1:32-33 in the line of david!
    Matt 16:18
     
  5. theefaith

    theefaith Well-Known Member

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    Christ gives his kingdom to the apostles to administer

    Isa 22:21-22 Matt 16:18-19
    Until he returns


    Prophecy of the new covenant church fulfilled in the apostolic union with Christ!

    Matt 21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, (Israel) and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof. (The new covenant church) Jn 15:1-5

    Dan 2: 44 And in the days of these kings (Roman Caesars) shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever.

    Isaiah 2:2
    And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the Lord's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it.

    Micah 4:1
    But in the last days it shall come to pass, that the mountain of the house of the Lord shall be established in the top of the mountains, and it shall be exalted above the hills; and people shall flow unto it.

    Lk 1:32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:

    33 And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end.

    Lk 22:29 And I appoint unto you a kingdom, as my Father hath appointed unto me;

    Matthew 5:14
    Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.
     
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