And this is what you have for an answer?
Do you even know why Moses was not allowed?
Moses made mistakes. And guess what?
So did Paul!
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What did Paul Believe?
- Thread starter Eccl.12:13
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And this is what you have for an answer?
Do you even know why Moses was not allowed?
Moses made mistakes. And guess what?
So did Paul!
.
the stranger
New Member
JUST ONE QUESTION FOR YOU, ECCL.
Galatians 2:19 (New King James Version)
[sup]19[/sup] For I through the law died to the law that I might live to God.
Romans 7:4 (New King James Version)
[sup]4[/sup] Therefore, my brethren, you also have become dead to the law through the body of Christ, that you may be married to another—to Him who was raised from the dead, that we should bear fruit to God.
WHAT LAW DID PAUL DIE TO, AND WHAT LAW DID PAUL TELL US THAT WE DIED TO?
ps. AND WHAT DOES IT MEAN TO "DIE" TO?
Original Word: ἀποθνῄσκω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: apothnéskó
Phonetic Spelling: (ap-oth-nace'-ko)
Short Definition: I am dying, am about to die
Definition: I am dying, am about to die, wither, decay.
599 apothnḗskō (from 575 /apó, "away from," which intensifies 2348 /thnḗskō, "to die") – properly, die off (away from), focusing on the separation that goes with the "dying off (away from)."
599 /apothnḗskō ("die off, from") occurs 111 times in the NT. It stresses the significance of the separation that always comes with divine closure. 599 (apothnḗskō) stresses the ending of what is "former" – to bring what (naturally) follows.
Word Origin
from apo and thnéskó
Definition
to die
NASB Word Usage
dead (5), death (1), death* (1), die (34), died (53), dies (12), dying (4), mortal (1), perished (1), put (1).
be dead, death, die, lie dying, be slain.
From apo and thnesko; to die off (literally or figuratively) -- be dead, death, die, lie a-dying, be slain (X with).
Galatians 2:19 (New King James Version)
[sup]19[/sup] For I through the law died to the law that I might live to God.
Romans 7:4 (New King James Version)
[sup]4[/sup] Therefore, my brethren, you also have become dead to the law through the body of Christ, that you may be married to another—to Him who was raised from the dead, that we should bear fruit to God.
WHAT LAW DID PAUL DIE TO, AND WHAT LAW DID PAUL TELL US THAT WE DIED TO?
ps. AND WHAT DOES IT MEAN TO "DIE" TO?
Original Word: ἀποθνῄσκω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: apothnéskó
Phonetic Spelling: (ap-oth-nace'-ko)
Short Definition: I am dying, am about to die
Definition: I am dying, am about to die, wither, decay.
599 apothnḗskō (from 575 /apó, "away from," which intensifies 2348 /thnḗskō, "to die") – properly, die off (away from), focusing on the separation that goes with the "dying off (away from)."599 /apothnḗskō ("die off, from") occurs 111 times in the NT. It stresses the significance of the separation that always comes with divine closure. 599 (apothnḗskō) stresses the ending of what is "former" – to bring what (naturally) follows.
from apo and thnéskó
Definition
to die
NASB Word Usage
dead (5), death (1), death* (1), die (34), died (53), dies (12), dying (4), mortal (1), perished (1), put (1).
NAS Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible with Hebrew-Aramaic and Greek Dictionaries
Copyright © 1981, 1998 by The Lockman Foundation
All rights reserved Lockman.org
Copyright © 1981, 1998 by The Lockman Foundation
All rights reserved Lockman.org
From apo and thnesko; to die off (literally or figuratively) -- be dead, death, die, lie a-dying, be slain (X with).
That old system of law etched in stone led to death, yet it began with such glory that the people of Israel could not bear to look at Moses' face. For his face shone with the glory of God, even though the brightness was already fading away. Shouldn't we expect far greater glory when the Holy Spirit is giving life? If the old covenant, which brings condemnation, was glorious, how much more glorious is the new covenant, which makes us right with God! 2Cor.3:7-9
So if the old covenant, which has been set aside, was full of glory, then the new covenant, which remains forever, has far greater glory. 2Cor.3:11
We are not like Moses, who put a veil over his face so the people of Israel would not see the glory fading away. But the people's minds were hardened, and even to this day whenever the old covenant is being read, a veil covers their minds so they cannot understand the truth. And this veil can be removed only by believing in Christ. Yes, even today when they read Moses' writings, their hearts are covered with that veil, and they do not understand. 2Cor.3:13-15
[font="'trebuchet ms"]The law including the ten commandments were part of the old covenant and brought condemnation and led to death, yet the new covenant which is not an amendment to the old but rather a new and better covenant imparting life and justifiable righteousness with God. According to this scripture those who still follow the law are hard headed and can't understand the truth.[/font]
So if the old covenant, which has been set aside, was full of glory, then the new covenant, which remains forever, has far greater glory. 2Cor.3:11
We are not like Moses, who put a veil over his face so the people of Israel would not see the glory fading away. But the people's minds were hardened, and even to this day whenever the old covenant is being read, a veil covers their minds so they cannot understand the truth. And this veil can be removed only by believing in Christ. Yes, even today when they read Moses' writings, their hearts are covered with that veil, and they do not understand. 2Cor.3:13-15
[font="'trebuchet ms"]The law including the ten commandments were part of the old covenant and brought condemnation and led to death, yet the new covenant which is not an amendment to the old but rather a new and better covenant imparting life and justifiable righteousness with God. According to this scripture those who still follow the law are hard headed and can't understand the truth.[/font]
What broke the covenant that God made with Israel causing God to make a new covenant?
Did Paul say that God's LAWS were the reason there had to have a new covenant, OR did Paul tell us the fault was with the people?
The new covenant was made with the PEOPLE with God's PERFECT laws placed in their minds.
Again....let's read what Paul told these Romans....
Rom.7
[1] Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
So how long did Paul tell these ROMANS, that now know God's laws, how long they are to keep them? As long as they are alive. He goes on to tell them of one such law...
[2] For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
Paul tells these ROMANS(GENTILES) of a law that obligates a woman to stay married to her husband as long as he is alive. But when he dies she is free to remarry.
[3] So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.
Was this law nailed to Christ's cross?
How did this law survive?
Or what about this law Paul tells us to keep...
1 Cor.6
[18] Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that commiteth fornication sinneth against his own body
Please explain where Paul received the knowledge of this law?
.
.
Your continued attack on Paul's letters noted.
Galatians 5:18 (NKJV)
[sup]18 [/sup]But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.
Why? It has been explained to you repeatedly, but if you would believe that Jesus' death on the cross, alone, made you right with God you could then understand what Paul is talking about. Pray and ask God to help you.
I do believe that Christ shed blood has delivered me from the second death. But now that He has done that what do we continue in? Do we continue to sin?
Rom.
[1] What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
[12] Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
[15] What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
Why would Paul even tell these Romans not to sin, nor let it reign in their bodies if sin (the breaking of God's laws) were no longer an issue, something that was nailed to His cross?
Because Paul knew that breaking God's laws was still possible, which is why he gave us this warning;
Heb.10
[26] For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
So we just can't continue to sin (break God's laws)? Do you mean that Jesus is not going to come back and die for me again if I continue to break God's laws (sin)? Wait a minute!! How can one sin (break God's laws) if ALL of them have been nailed to His cross?
Paul even tells us what sins Jesus blood covered...
Rom.3
[25] Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
Now I see why Paul said...
"Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that commiteth fornication sinneth against his own body."
And...
"What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet."
And....
"For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself."
And...
"Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God."
Because he knew if we continued in such sins (breaking God's laws), eternal life would NOT be promised to us.
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Has anyone here said it is ok to commit fornication, adultery, murder, lying, etc. ??? Why are you implying that we are saying those are not sin? Nobody here has said that that I know of. Why are you? I'll tell you why. You are trying to make the works of the law the same and they are not. Christians are not under the works of the Law of Moses. You are preaching your agenda, not Christianity.
So I advise you to live according to your new life in the Holy Spirit. Then you won't be doing what your sinful nature craves.The old sinful nature loves to do evil, which is just opposite from what the Holy Spirit wants. And the Spirit gives us desires that are opposite from what the sinful nature desires. These two forces are constantly fighting each other, and your choices are never free from this conflict. But when you are directed by the Holy Spirit, you are no longer subject to the law. Gal. 5:16
What did Paul believe?
Paul believed and taught that the law was of no help in making anyone righteous and acceptable to God.
You say that is what Paul belived...but what did Paul himself say? Let's read it readers....AGAIN!
Acts 24
[14] But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:
Paul tells us that he believed ALL things written in the OT!
Again..you said,
But again, Paul said....
2 Tim.3
[14] But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
[15] And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
So....should the readers believe You are Paul?
Let's try James on for size......unless, of course, there are those that believe James words are less believeable that Pauls? For they were BOTH led by God's holy spirit, so they are both valid and do NOT contradict....right?
After all, God tells us, "And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God."
So let's read a bit of James writings, shall we...
James 2
[8] If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
[9] But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
Now James tells us, although you may love your neighbor, if you still have respect to persons, you have still committed a sin. And not only having respect of person, but also the following....
[11] For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
So all of God's laws have NOT been nailed to His cross.
[12] So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.
What? God's law is going to be used to judge us? Shut your mouth James!
[21] Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
And what was the works that justified Abraham? Him keeping God's law. Which law you ask? Let's read it....
Gen.22
[2] And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of.
Readers...do not forget, the moment God tells someone to do something or not to do something it becomes a LAW!
God commanded Abraham to sacrifice his son and Abraham OBEYED the commandment/law of God!
[24] Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
[26] For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
So, according to James, we need to be just as Abraham was. Just as Abraham followed God's laws so should we. And which laws does James say we are to follow?
[8] If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
[9] But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
AND......
[11] For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
So Paul and James BOTH taught that keeping God's laws were needed for salvation.
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