What did Paul Believe?

[Eccl.12:13]

There are many that THINK Paul came with a different doctrine and taught something different that Jesus Christ. So my question to the forum is this,

"What did Paul believe and from where did he receive his doctrine?"
"Did he teach something different from what he believed?"


.

 

[rockytopva]

There are many that THINK Paul came with a different doctrine and taught something different that Jesus Christ. So my question to the forum is this,

"What did Paul believe and from where did he receive his doctrine?"
"Did he teach something different from what he believed?"

Paul is the chosen vessel to present the gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ to both the Jews and the gentiles.

But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel: - Acts 9:15

 

[Butch5]

There are many that THINK Paul came with a different doctrine and taught something different that Jesus Christ. So my question to the forum is this,

"What did Paul believe and from where did he receive his doctrine?"
"Did he teach something different from what he believed?"


.

Paul taught the same thing as Jesus and the apostles.

 

[the stranger]

Correct! Eccl., Can you point us to a passage or site that lead you to this question? The doctrine of Paul was none other than the gospel of Jesus Christ. God bless

 

[Eccl.12:13]

Correct! Eccl., Can you point us to a passage or site that lead you to this question? The doctrine of Paul was none other than the gospel of Jesus Christ. God bless

Acts 24
[14] But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

Paul tells us that he believed ALL things written in the OT! And ALL means just that ALL! So that would mean Paul believed this....

Exod.20
[8] Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
[10] But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
[11] For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

And this....

Num.15
[16] One law and one manner shall be for you, and for the stranger that sojourneth with you.
[29] Ye shall have one law for him that sinneth through ignorance, both for him that is born among the children of Israel, and for the stranger that sojourneth among them.

And this....

Isa.56
[2] Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil.
[6] Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;

And this....

Lev.11
[1] And the LORD spake unto Moses and to Aaron, saying unto them,
[2] Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, These are the beasts which ye shall eat among all the beasts that are on the earth.
[3] Whatsoever parteth the hoof, and is clovenfooted, and cheweth the cud, among the beasts, that shall ye eat.
[4] Nevertheless these shall ye not eat of them that chew the cud, or of them that divide the hoof: as the camel, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.

And finally this.....

Ezek.44
[9] Thus saith the Lord GOD; No stranger, uncircumcised in heart, nor uncircumcised in flesh, shall enter into my sanctuary, of any stranger that is among the children of Israel.

Which is why he told Timothy the following.....

2 Tim.3
[14] But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
[15] And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

Everything Timothy and everyone needed for salvation could be found in the OT!!

And why shouldn't it? After all.....Jesus Christ, the God of the OT, is the one that gave the inspired word for salvation to the prophets!

And since Paul believed ALL things, then he surely TAUGHT all things to both Jews and Gentiles alike!

"For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.



.

 

[dan p]

Acts 24
[14] But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

Paul tells us that he believed ALL things written in the OT! And ALL means just that ALL! So that would mean Paul believed this....

Exod.20
[8] Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
[10] But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
[11] For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

And this....

Num.15
[16] One law and one manner shall be for you, and for the stranger that sojourneth with you.
[29] Ye shall have one law for him that sinneth through ignorance, both for him that is born among the children of Israel, and for the stranger that sojourneth among them.

And this....

Isa.56
[2] Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil.
[6] Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;

And this....

Lev.11
[1] And the LORD spake unto Moses and to Aaron, saying unto them,
[2] Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, These are the beasts which ye shall eat among all the beasts that are on the earth.
[3] Whatsoever parteth the hoof, and is clovenfooted, and cheweth the cud, among the beasts, that shall ye eat.
[4] Nevertheless these shall ye not eat of them that chew the cud, or of them that divide the hoof: as the camel, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.

And finally this.....

Ezek.44
[9] Thus saith the Lord GOD; No stranger, uncircumcised in heart, nor uncircumcised in flesh, shall enter into my sanctuary, of any stranger that is among the children of Israel.

Which is why he told Timothy the following.....

2 Tim.3
[14] But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
[15] And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

Everything Timothy and everyone needed for salvation could be found in the OT!!

And why shouldn't it? After all.....Jesus Christ, the God of the OT, is the one that gave the inspired word for salvation to the prophets!

And since Paul believed ALL things, then he surely TAUGHT all things to both Jews and Gentiles alike!

"For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.



.

Hi , and Paul did not teach what Jesus or the 12 taught

InActs 21:21 , Paul the following to the Jews among the Gentiles ;

#1 , teaching the Jews to forsake Moses

#2 , Saying to the Jews , that they ought NOT to circumcise their children

#3 , and teaching them NOT to walk after the Jewish customs

So , what you have written is wrong , dan p

 

[Eccl.12:13]

Hi , and Paul did not teach what Jesus or the 12 taught

InActs 21:21 , Paul the following to the Jews among the Gentiles ;

#1 , teaching the Jews to forsake Moses

#2 , Saying to the Jews , that they ought NOT to circumcise their children

#3 , and teaching them NOT to walk after the Jewish customs

So , what you have written is wrong , dan p

Are you SURE what you say above is true? Are you SURE the above scriptures is saying that PAUL taught these things;

Are you SURE it was PAUL that said all that you claim above?

Or are the scriptures saying that somebody ELSE accused Paul of saying these things?

Why was Paul put in jail?
Why were the Jews mad?
Why did they want to kill Paul?

Are you SURE of the doctrine you are teaching?

Acts 21
[22] What is it therefore? the multitude must needs come together: for they will hear that thou art come.
[23] Do therefore this that we say to thee: We have four men which have a vow on them;
[24] Them take, and purify thyself with them, and be at charges with them, that they may shave their heads: and all may know that those things, whereof they were informed concerning thee, are nothing; but that thou thyself also walkest orderly, and keepest the law.

They wanted to know if the things they were informed about, as far as what they HEARD that Paul said, were true or not.

And what did Paul do to PROVE to them that he was a keeper of God's laws?

[26] Then Paul took the men, and the next day purifying himself with them entered into the temple, to signify the accomplishment of the days of purifcation, until that an offering should be offered for every one of them.

And what does Paul go on to say in chapter 24?

[14] But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

As I said....Paul did NOT come with a different doctrine than Jesus or ANY of the other 12.

Readers....you cannot stop at just a few verses and come to a conclusion as the poster would have you believe.

Read the accounts in Acts 21 through the 24th chapter and you will see that it was Paul that was being accused of such things but he later said.....

But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

Readers...you can read for yourselves to know who is wrong here!


.

 

[the stranger]

Acts 24
[14] But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

Paul tells us that he believed ALL things written in the OT! And ALL means just that ALL! So that would mean Paul believed this....

Exod.20
[8] Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
[10] But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
[11] For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

And this....

Num.15
[16] One law and one manner shall be for you, and for the stranger that sojourneth with you.
[29] Ye shall have one law for him that sinneth through ignorance, both for him that is born among the children of Israel, and for the stranger that sojourneth among them.

And this....

Isa.56
[2] Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil.
[6] Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;

And this....

Lev.11
[1] And the LORD spake unto Moses and to Aaron, saying unto them,
[2] Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, These are the beasts which ye shall eat among all the beasts that are on the earth.
[3] Whatsoever parteth the hoof, and is clovenfooted, and cheweth the cud, among the beasts, that shall ye eat.
[4] Nevertheless these shall ye not eat of them that chew the cud, or of them that divide the hoof: as the camel, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.

And finally this.....

Ezek.44
[9] Thus saith the Lord GOD; No stranger, uncircumcised in heart, nor uncircumcised in flesh, shall enter into my sanctuary, of any stranger that is among the children of Israel.

Which is why he told Timothy the following.....

2 Tim.3
[14] But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
[15] And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

Everything Timothy and everyone needed for salvation could be found in the OT!!

And why shouldn't it? After all.....Jesus Christ, the God of the OT, is the one that gave the inspired word for salvation to the prophets!

And since Paul believed ALL things, then he surely TAUGHT all things to both Jews and Gentiles alike!

"For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.



.

Thank you for your response Eccl.

I think there is one big thing that you are missing here my friend.


Hebrews 9:16 (The Message)
[sup]16-17[/sup]Like a will that takes effect when someone dies, the new covenant was put into action at Jesus' death. His death marked the transition from the old plan to the new one, canceling the old obligations and accompanying sins, and summoning the heirs to receive the eternal inheritance that was promised them. He brought together God and his people in this new way.







2 Corinthians 3:16 (The Message)
[sup]16-18[/sup]Whenever, though, they turn to face God as Moses did, God removes the veil and there they are—face-to-face! They suddenly recognize that God is a living, personal presence, not a piece of chiseled stone. And when God is personally present, a living Spirit, that old, constricting legislation is recognized as obsolete. We're free of it! All of us! Nothing between us and God, our faces shining with the brightness of his face. And so we are transfigured much like the Messiah, our lives gradually becoming brighter and more beautiful as God enters our lives and we become like him.







Jeremiah 31:31 (The Message)
[sup]31-32[/sup]"That's right. The time is coming when I will make a brand-new covenant with Israel and Judah. It won't be a repeat of the covenant I made with their ancestors when I took their hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt. They broke that covenant even though I did my part as their Master." God's Decree.







Hebrews 10 (The Message)

Hebrews 10

The Sacrifice of Jesus
[sup]1-10[/sup]The old plan was only a hint of the good things in the new plan. Since that old "law plan" wasn't complete in itself, it couldn't complete those who followed it. No matter how many sacrifices were offered year after year, they never added up to a complete solution. If they had, the worshipers would have gone merrily on their way, no longer dragged down by their sins. But instead of removing awareness of sin, when those animal sacrifices were repeated over and over they actually heightened awareness and guilt. The plain fact is that bull and goat blood can't get rid of sin.

The Holy Spirit confirms this:

This new plan I'm making with Israel
isn't going to be written on paper,
isn't going to be chiseled in stone;
This time "I'm writing out the plan in them,
carving it on the lining of their hearts."
He concludes,
I'll forever wipe the slate clean of their sins.
Once sins are taken care of for good, there's no longer any need to offer sacrifices for them.
Don't Throw It All Away
[sup]19-21[/sup]So, friends, we can now—without hesitation—walk right up to God, into "the Holy Place." Jesus has cleared the way by the blood of his sacrifice, acting as our priest before God. The "curtain" into God's presence is his body.

=====================================================================


My friend, the old is finished, or done away with, through the blood of Jesus. It does not mean we no longer should worry about what is right and what is wrong, but it means this, just as I showed you in the other thread through the writing of Paul,

When we accept Jesus, we are beyond what they ever could be in the OT. In us Christ puts a new heart, a heart that wants to obey Him and His ways. Before this, we only did what we felt we had to do to stay out of trouble with God. Now, with our new heart, it is not about staying within the bounds, but not even wanting to get close to the edge. That is why Jesus says if we think about cheating, we have already been found guilty of it with in our hearts, and about murder, the same thing. So now it is not about pushing things to the limit, but trying to become more and more like Jesus Christ every day through the Holy Spirit of God.


Galatians 5:18 (The Message)
[sup]16-18[/sup]My counsel is this: Live freely, animated and motivated by God's Spirit. Then you won't feed the compulsions of selfishness. For there is a root of sinful self-interest in us that is at odds with a free spirit, just as the free spirit is incompatible with selfishness. These two ways of life are antithetical, so that you cannot live at times one way and at times another way according to how you feel on any given day. Why don't you choose to be led by the Spirit and so escape the erratic compulsions of a law-dominated existence?







Galatians 5:18 (King James Version)


[sup]18[/sup]But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.







====================================================================================================

===================================================================================================

Hi , and Paul did not teach what Jesus or the 12 taught

InActs 21:21 , Paul the following to the Jews among the Gentiles ;

#1 , teaching the Jews to forsake Moses

#2 , Saying to the Jews , that they ought NOT to circumcise their children

#3 , and teaching them NOT to walk after the Jewish customs

So , what you have written is wrong , dan p

1 Corinthians 9:19-23 (Good News Translation)
[sup]19[/sup] I am a free man, nobody's slave; but I make myself everybody's slave in order to win as many people as possible.[sup]20[/sup] While working with the Jews, I live like a Jew in order to win them; and even though I myself am not subject to the Law of Moses, I live as though I were when working with those who are, in order to win them.[sup]21[/sup] In the same way, when working with Gentiles, I live like a Gentile, outside the Jewish Law, in order to win Gentiles. This does not mean that I don't obey God's law; I am really under Christ's law.[sup]22[/sup] Among the weak in faith I become weak like one of them, in order to win them. So I become all things to all people, that I may save some of them by whatever means are possible.

[sup]23[/sup] All this I do for the gospel's sake, in order to share in its blessings.







Forgive me, this next segment is a drop lengthy but I believe quite important.





Galatians 3:15-25 (Common English Bible)
[sup]15[/sup] Brothers and sisters, I’ll use an example from human experience. No one ignores or makes additions to a validated will. [sup]16[/sup][sup]17[/sup] I’m saying this: the Law, which came four hundred and thirty years later, doesn’t invalidate the agreement that was previously validated by God so that it cancels the promise. [sup]18[/sup] If the inheritance were based upon the Law, it would no longer be from the promise. But God has given it graciously to Abraham through a promise. The promises were made to Abraham and to his descendant. It doesn’t say, “and to the descendants,” as if referring to many rather than just one. It says, “and to your descendant,” who is Christ.


The Law’s origin and purpose
[sup]19[/sup] So why was the Law given? It was added because of offenses, until the descendant would come to whom the promise had been made. It was put in place through angels by the hand of a mediator. [sup]20[/sup] Now the mediator does not take one side; but God is one. [sup]21[/sup] So, is the Law against the promises of God? Absolutely not! For if a Law had been given that was able to give life, then righteousness would in fact have come from the Law. [sup]22[/sup] But scripture locked up all things under sin, so that the promise based on faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. [sup]23[/sup] Before faith came, we were guarded under the Law, locked up until faith that was coming would be revealed, [sup]24[/sup] so that the Law became our custodian until Christ so that we might be made righteous by faith.
God’s children are heirs in Christ
[sup]25[/sup] But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a custodian.




Galatians 2:18-19 (New Century Version)
[sup]18[/sup] But I would really be wrong to begin teaching again those things that I gave up.[sup]19[/sup] It was the law that put me to death, and I died to the law so that I can now live for God.




========================================================




Bottom line, Paul never told any one to forsake Moses. For Gentiles, circumcision was only required in the OT if one moved to Israel and wanted to become a Jew as by obeying all of the Jewish laws. The same holds true for the Jewish customs.





Let us look at what Jesus taught:






Matthew 22:34-40 (Contemporary English Version)

The Most Important Commandment

(Mark 12.28-34; Luke 10.25-28)
[sup]34[/sup]After Jesus had made the Sadducees look foolish, the Pharisees heard about it and got together. [sup]35[/sup]One of them was an expert in the Jewish Law. So he tried to test Jesus by asking, [sup]36[/sup]"Teacher, what is the most important commandment in the Law?" [sup]37[/sup]Jesus answered:

Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, and mind. [sup]38[/sup]This is the first and most important commandment. [sup]39[/sup]The second most important commandment is like this one. And it is, "Love others as much as you love yourself." [sup]40[/sup]All the Law of Moses and the Books of the Prophets [sup][a][/sup] are based on these two commandments.






Mark 12:28-34 (The Message)

The Most Important Commandment
[sup]28[/sup]One of the religion scholars came up. Hearing the lively exchanges of question and answer and seeing how sharp Jesus was in his answers, he put in his question: "Which is most important of all the commandments?" [sup]29-31[/sup]Jesus said, "The first in importance is, 'Listen, Israel: The Lord your God is one; so love the Lord God with all your passion and prayer and intelligence and energy.' And here is the second: 'Love others as well as you love yourself.' There is no other commandment that ranks with these."

[sup]32-33[/sup]The religion scholar said, "A wonderful answer, Teacher! So lucid and accurate—that God is one and there is no other. And loving him with all passion and intelligence and energy, and loving others as well as you love yourself. Why, that's better than all offerings and sacrifices put together!"

[sup]34[/sup]When Jesus realized how insightful he was, he said, "You're almost there, right on the border of God's kingdom."

After that, no one else dared ask a question.






James 2:8 (Contemporary English Version)
[sup]8[/sup]You will do all right, if you obey the most important law [sup][a][/sup] in the Scriptures. It is the law that commands us to love others as much as we love ourselves.






Romans 13:10 (The Message)
[sup]8-10[/sup]Don't run up debts, except for the huge debt of love you owe each other. When you love others, you complete what the law has been after all along. The law code—don't sleep with another person's spouse, don't take someone's life, don't take what isn't yours, don't always be wanting what you don't have, and any other "don't" you can think of—finally adds up to this: Love other people as well as you do yourself. You can't go wrong when you love others. When you add up everything in the law code, the sum total is love.








I believe we now obey the law in a new way, through the Holy Spirit, and under the blood of Christ. His laws are now written in our hearts and through the holy spirit, we live with in the law, and a part from the holy spirit, we can or never could live with in the law. By living through the Holy Spirit, we are not under law because we comply with the law, that is, the heart of the law, and now living by and through the promise of God even before the law was ever given. In our hearts, we always want to make God happy.





Romans 7:6 (New King James Version)
[sup]6[/sup] But now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter.





2 Corinthians 3:9 (Common English Bible)
[sup]9[/sup] If the ministry that brought condemnation has glory, how much more glorious is the ministry that brings righteousness?











OK, I think I quoted enough scripture for now. Bottom line, Jesus was teaching of the new way to come, and what really was important about the commandments. Keep in mind, when Jesus was still on earth, the law was still in effect. When Jesus became the Lamb of the Pass over, the need for sacrifice ended. When Jesus arose from the grave, He brought with Him all who were with the beggar, in Hades, and with Abraham all up to heaven with Him. This giving us the hope and promise of our resurrection and promise of heaven being our home when we die. After this, some 50 days later after going back to heaven, He sent down the Holy Spirit, which now lives inside of us all who have faith and believe in the Christ. It was not until this we could fulfill the living with in the law by living through the Holy Spirit.




The Holy Spirit guides us as to what we ought and to not to do. Those who live by the spirit are not under the law, but only those who believe that they have to keep it. The laws were and are good, but were a sign of better things to come. The moral laws are still a guide in which we should live our lives today. However, God did not hold David accountable when he took food for him and his men from the priest, though it was against the law, because God knew his heart. Just like today, if we are living by the Holy Spirit, we will be living in the way that Christ wants us to live, because when we are living through Christ Jesus, we are living through someone who has already fulfilled the law. There fore the law and it's requirements have already been fulfilled by His blood.




=============




GOD BLESS AND THINKS FOR READING!

 

[Eccl.12:13]

In us Christ puts a new heart, a heart that wants to obey Him and His ways.

Paul tells us just the opposite. Paul tells us in the following scriptures that it is a CONSTANT struggle to do that which we know is right;

Romans 7:15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.

Each time I read that verse I must take my time to UNDERSTAND what Paul is trying to tell us. Let's break it down.

For that which I do (The things I do), I allow not (I don't want to do them): for what I would (the things I want to do), that I do not (I don't do them); but what I hate (the things I don't want to do), that I do (are the things I do).

The above scripture is NOT easy reading! Even for those learned it can be a challenge. Can you imagine babes in the word...NO WAY! Let’s continue;

[16] If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.

(If I do those things I know I should not do), (I agree with the law that it is good).

[17] Now it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

(But it’s not me that do those things), (Satan made me do it. J ) Couldn’t help that one!

[18] For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.

(I know my flesh is weak), (I have the will, but I cannot find the way to do good).

[19] For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.

(I want to do good but I don’t): (but the bad things I don’t want to do are the things I do.)

[20] Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

(Again, if I do those things I don’t want to do, it is not me, but the sin within me.)

[21] I find a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.

(I now have a law, that when I do good, it reminds me of sin.)

[22] For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:

(I enjoy the law of God, after the new man that is within me)

[23] But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.

(But I am confronted with the laws of sin, and they war with the Laws of God, and I am yet held captive by those laws of sin I should not do)


Paul tells us he struggles ALL of the time, trying to do that which is right.

But you believe that war within is now easy? Let's read how Paul ends this letter....

[25] I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin

Paul tells us with his mind he wants to do that which is right. He really wants to keep God's laws, but yet he still finds himself doing that which he should not; the laws of sin!

Let's read one more scripture of Paul....

1 Cor.9
[27] But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway

Paul realized that he had to constantly keep his body under control and do those things that he knew were right. For if he did not, he could find himself not worthy to enter into God's kingdom.

Now if our dear Paul had a hard time doing that which he knew was right, I doubt, with all of the influences we have today, we can be stronger than Paul and our hearts just flow over with egerness to do that which is right.

It was hard for Paul.

It is even HARDER for us!!

.

 

[Eccl.12:13]

Hi , and Paul did not teach what Jesus or the 12 taught

InActs 21:21 , Paul the following to the Jews among the Gentiles ;

#1 , teaching the Jews to forsake Moses
#2 , Saying to the Jews , that they ought NOT to circumcise their children
#3 , and teaching them NOT to walk after the Jewish customs

So , what you have written is wrong , dan p

Are you SURE what you say above is true? Are you SURE the above scriptures is saying that PAUL taught these things;

Are you SURE it was PAUL that said all that you claim above?

Or are the scriptures saying that somebody ELSE accused Paul of saying these things?

Why was Paul put in jail?
Why were the Jews mad?
Why did they want to kill Paul?

Are you SURE of the doctrine you are teaching?

Acts 21
[22] What is it therefore? the multitude must needs come together: for they will hear that thou art come.
[23] Do therefore this that we say to thee: We have four men which have a vow on them;
[24] Them take, and purify thyself with them, and be at charges with them, that they may shave their heads: and all may know that those things, whereof they were informed concerning thee, are nothing; but that thou thyself also walkest orderly, and keepest the law.

They wanted to know if the things they were informed about, as far as what they HEARD that Paul said, were true or not.

And what did Paul do to PROVE to them that he was a keeper of God's laws?

[26] Then Paul took the men, and the next day purifying himself with them entered into the temple, to signify the accomplishment of the days of purifcation, until that an offering should be offered for every one of them.

And what does Paul go on to say in chapter 24?

[14] But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

As I said....Paul did NOT come with a different doctrine than Jesus or ANY of the other 12.

Readers....you cannot stop at just a few verses and come to a conclusion as the poster would have you believe.

Read the accounts in Acts 21 through the 24th chapter and you will see that it was Paul that was being accused of such things but he later said.....

But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

Readers...you can read for yourselves to know who is wrong here!

.

Hello.... Danp? Are you there?

 

[dan p]

Hi , and Paul did not teach what Jesus or the 12 taught

InActs 21:21 , Paul the following to the Jews among the Gentiles ;

#1 , teaching the Jews to forsake Moses
#2 , Saying to the Jews , that they ought NOT to circumcise their children
#3 , and teaching them NOT to walk after the Jewish customs

So , what you have written is wrong , dan p






Hello.... Danp? Are you there?

Hi , law keeper , I am here and what Paul is saying in Rom 7 , is the conflict with the old nature .

So , please tell everyone that reads these posts , How are people saved under the Law ??

It has to be in the Context of the Law ??? dan p

 

[Eccl.12:13]

Hi , law keeper , I am here and what Paul is saying in Rom 7 , is the conflict with the old nature .
So , please tell everyone that reads these posts , How are people saved under the Law ??
It has to be in the Context of the Law ??? dan p

You call me a law keeper, but don't you do your best to also do that which you know is right? If you are a follower of Christ don't you try NOT to lie, steal, covet, and kill? Don't you try to give respect to your elders? Do you flee fornication?

I pray, as a follower of Christ, that you TOO are a law keeper!

Now....about your post and the following scriptures you used to say that Paul taught something different than Christ and the apostles...

Hi , and Paul did not teach what Jesus or the 12 taught

InActs 21:21 , Paul the following to the Jews among the Gentiles ;

#1 , teaching the Jews to forsake Moses
#2 , Saying to the Jews , that they ought NOT to circumcise their children
#3 , and teaching them NOT to walk after the Jewish customs

If you read Acts Chapters 21 through 24 you will find that there were Jews that HEARD Paul taught such things and they questioned him about it. Let's read the account...

Acts21
[15] And after those days we took up our carriages, and went up to Jerusalem.
[17] And when we were come to Jerusalem, the brethren received us gladly.

So here we have Paul who just arrived at Jerusalem. Now let's read who and how many were there to great him.

[17] And when we were come to Jerusalem, the brethren received us gladly.
[18] And the day following Paul went in with us unto James; and all the elders were present.

So first Paul met with the elders, no one else at this time. Now let's read what Paul discussed with them.

[19] And when he had saluted them, he declared particularly what things God had wrought among the Gentiles by his ministry.

Paul told them the things which God had given him to give to the Gentiles. Now were the elders angry with Pauls report?

[20] And when they heard it, they glorified the Lord,

Now why do you think the elders glorified God? Do you think Paul told them he had told the Gentiles to forsake the laws of Moses, do not circumcise their children and do not walk after the customs of the Jews? NO! They glorified God because Paul taught the Gentiles the same ways as the Jews.

Now let's finish that verse..

......and said unto him, Thou seest, brother, how many thousands of Jews there are which believe; and they are all zealous of the law:

So Paul did NOT address the thousands of Jews that had gathered in Jerusalem. But they did hear this about his ministry..

[21] And they are informed of thee, that thou teachest all the Jews which are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, saying that they ought not to circumcise their children, neither to walk after the customs.

Now this is what they were mad about. Let's read what the elders asked Paul...

[22] What is it therefore? the multitude must needs come together: for they will hear that thou art come.

The elders ask, "What is it therefore?" They also ask Paul to prove he is still a keeper and teacher of God's laws and Paul does prove it.

[23] Do therefore this that we say to thee: We have four men which have a vow on them;
[24] Them take, and purify thyself with them, and be at charges with them, that they may shave their heads:

And what will be accomplished when Paul does this?

"...and all may know that those things, whereof they were informed concerning thee, are nothing; but that thou thyself also walkest orderly, and keepest the law."

They will know that all that they heard about Paul; that thou teachest all the Jews which are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, saying that they ought not to circumcise their children, neither to walk after the customs, were NOT true and that Paul did in fact, "...keepest the law".

So what did Paul do? The samething you and I would do with thousands of angry Jews wanted to kill you...I mean come on...Paul knows what these guys are capable of, after all, they DID kill Jesus?

[26] Then Paul took the men, and the next day purifying himself with them entered into the temple, to signify the accomplishment of the days of purifcation, until that an offering should be offered for every one of them.

And what of the new Gentiles that are just coming into the faith? Well for now this is what Paul had to say...

[25] As touching the Gentiles which believe, we have written and concluded that they observe no such thing, save only that they keep themselves from things offered to idols, and from blood, and from strangled, and from fornication.

But we know from some of Paul's later letters, this too was changed.

.

 

[Duckybill]

Do you think Paul told them he had told the Gentiles to forsake the laws of Moses, do not circumcise their children and do not walk after the customs of the Jews? NO!

Yes, Paul did tell us that we are not under THE LAW of Moses.

Galatians 5:1-4 (NKJV)
[sup]1 [/sup]Stand fast therefore in the liberty by which Christ has made us free, and do not be entangled again with a yoke of bondage. [sup]2 [/sup]Indeed I, Paul, say to you that if you become circumcised, Christ will profit you nothing. [sup]3 [/sup]And I testify again to every man who becomes circumcised that he is a debtor to keep the whole law. [sup]4 [/sup]You have become estranged from Christ, you who attempt to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace.

All meaning eternity in Hell.

 

[Duckybill]

Ecc, I suggest that you state publicly whether you believe Paul's writings are the Word of God, as was Moses' writings. You seem to be riding the fence or simply hiding that you don't believe Paul's letters are God's holy Word and inerrant.

 

[Eccl.12:13]

Yes, Paul did tell us that we are not under THE LAW of Moses.

Galatians 5:1-4 (NKJV)
[sup]1 [/sup]Stand fast therefore in the liberty by which Christ has made us free, and do not be entangled again with a yoke of bondage. [sup]2 [/sup]Indeed I, Paul, say to you that if you become circumcised, Christ will profit you nothing. [sup]3 [/sup]And I testify again to every man who becomes circumcised that he is a debtor to keep the whole law. [sup]4 [/sup]You have become estranged from Christ, you who attempt to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace.

All meaning eternity in Hell.

And yet Paul said this....

Acts 24
[14] But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

Paul believed ALL things in the OT! So that means Paul also believed this....

"Thus saith the Lord GOD; No stranger, uncircumcised in heart, nor uncircumcised in flesh, shall enter into my sanctuary, of any stranger that is among the children of Israel."

This is from the OT that Paul said he believed ALL things.

So which is it?

.

 

[Duckybill]

And yet Paul said this....

Acts 24
[14] But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

Paul believed ALL things in the OT! So that means Paul also believed this....

"Thus saith the Lord GOD; No stranger, uncircumcised in heart, nor uncircumcised in flesh, shall enter into my sanctuary, of any stranger that is among the children of Israel."

This is from the OT that Paul said he believed ALL things.

So which is it?

If you get circumcised "Christ shall profit you NOTHING." Which means you will spend eternity in Hell. Jesus is the ONLY way to salvation. Try sticking to the NT, for therein is the ONLY to salvation.

 

[Eccl.12:13]

Ecc, I suggest that you state publicly whether you believe Paul's writings are the Word of God, as was Moses' writings. You seem to be riding the fence or simply hiding that you don't believe Paul's letters are God's holy Word and inerrant.

Was Moses wrong? Yep!

And if Paul did NOT write the Gentiles another letter letting them know that circumcision was required, he too was wrong.

So...... do we know for a fact that we have ALL of Pauls writings?

We DO know for a fact that Paul did change his mind on some of the requirements he gave the Gentiles.

Tell me....when a new believer comes into the word of God, do you hit them with EVERYTHING they are not to do upon their first visit?

Well....what do you think Paul did?

"I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able."

So again......do we know for a fact that we have ALL of Pauls writings?


.

 

[Duckybill]

Was Moses wrong? Yep!

And if Paul did NOT write the Gentiles another letter letting them know that circumcision was required, he too was wrong.

So...... do we know for a fact that we have ALL of Pauls writings?

Thanks for telling us that we can't believe the Bible. I will anyway.

We DO know for a fact that Paul did change his mind on some of the requirements he gave the Gentiles.

How so?

Tell me....when a new believer comes into the word of God, do you hit them with EVERYTHING they are not to do upon their first visit?

Well....what do you think Paul did?

"I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able."

So again......do we know for a fact that we have ALL of Pauls writings?

In other words you don't know what to believe. You don't trust Moses nor Paul. You're hoping your works will save you. Well they won't.

 

[Eccl.12:13]

Thanks for telling us that we can't believe the Bible.

Why did God NOT allow Moses to enter into the promise land?

Was it because he did something WRONG?

And if you did not know that Paul changed his mind on some things concerning what he taught the Gentiles, then you need to study God's word a bit more!

And... do you know if we have ALL of Pauls writings or not? Can you be 100% sure?

Because we know Paul fed newbies milk, "I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.", so when did he feed them the "meat" of the word?

.







.

 

[Duckybill]

Why did God NOT allow Moses to enter into the promise land?

Was it because he did something WRONG?

It certainly wasn't because the Torah was perverted.

And if you did not know that Paul changed his mind on some things concerning what he taught the Gentiles, then you need to study God's word a bit more!

Scripture please.

And... do you know if we have ALL of Pauls writings or not? Can you be 100% sure?

You are looking for ways to change what Paul said. Won't work.

Because we know Paul fed newbies milk, "I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.", so when did he feed them the "meat" of the word?

See above.

You're under THE CURSE ECC.

Galatians 3:10 (NKJV)
[sup]10 [/sup]For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse;