What are the parameters of religious liberty, if any?
What are the biblical foundations of religion liberty, if any?
What are the biblical foundations of religion liberty, if any?
What does Religious Liberty mean to you?
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Taken
Well-Known Member
What does Religious Liberty mean to you?
Freewill to CHOSE What/Whom will be “your” god.
Glory to God,
Taken
Freewill to CHOSE What/Whom will be “your” god.
Glory to God,
Taken
And how to worship that God you believe in? Does how you worship also come under religious liberty parameters?
John 3:16-18 & Romans 13:1-16 plus not having to fear this:-
Christian father imprisoned in Egypt for discussing theology in a Facebook group
I have a few “Big Eva” friends who cannot understand why I would need an alias. They never take stands on controversial topics, so they have no experience getting pushback from non-Chri…
winteryknight.com
Tried for a Tweet
What I’ve learned in the five years the Finnish state prosecuted me for my faith
www.thepublicdiscourse.com
Taken
Well-Known Member
Thanks Taken for your perspective. That was a very well written testimony from that Finnish member of parliament.
As for Islam, yes, that ideology is becoming a greater threat, particularly in Europe. I think however that if we studied history, the emergence of an Islamic government in the west is remote at best, although through fear of reprisals and threats, some in governments will show a sympathetic ear toward Islamic culture, even though there may be no true heartfelt support. The only chance of an Islamic government emerging in the West is through military conduct and resounding victory. That won't happen.
In America however there is a quiet movement that could be far more dangerous. Who can argue that the open border policy of the last 4 years wasn't deliberate? And what religion are the majority of those entering the US from the south? What religion is represented in the current administration? And in the supreme court? What religion was responsible for the last 1200 years in advancing religious freedom for itself, but denying it to others? What religion was represented before the United Nations and the Congress, received a standing ovation from all, and was exalted, even among Protestant ministers as the only potential uniting power for mankind in a future divisive society in crisis?
What biblical foundations are there in support of religious liberty?
Taken
Well-Known Member
U r Welcome.
God bless you.
Of course. Even Biden arranging undocumented air flights bringing in illegals in the middle of the night!
I believe it is over some 100 different countries….of people so down trodden…they magically have funding to cross contentments and oceans … pfff!
The founder established a Document (Constitution) with the express LIMITS under which an Elected Servant MUST agree to…
The potential “servant” attests by his WORD and SIGNATURE….ascribed according to the date….IN the Year of our Lord.
The US Constitution was established according to Gods standards and principles, and there after so to are enacted LAWS “supposed to be” according to the SAME standards and principles….
The founders warned to be cautious of seating “muslims” in governing positions…because their standards and principles are foreign to Gods standards and principles.
Odd…how Obama’s daddy was a muslim…Obama’s step-daddy was a muslim…Obama’s early formative years were learning muslims ways….and Obama’s mantra was “CHANGE”….and systematically during his tenure and for years since…he muddles around DC whispering in the ears of dems of HOW to keep undermining the Fixed objective standard of the US Constitution!!
SCOTUS was established as a high resolution center for conflicts between the States, her citizens and the Feds….which has become a giant joke of sitting individuals with the majority concerned over their personal preferences … race, gender, queers, godless….which are opinions that has nothing to do with the LAW.
Muslims, Catholics….closely adopt what clearly belongs to God….If you are not with Him, you are Against Him.
I don’t know of Protestant ministers attending a UN meeting or Congressional meeting to have stood and applauded themselves.
Congress routinely has clerics that represent different religions give an opening prayer….and such speaker facing the congress representatives….would ALSO be facing a (plack, can’t remember what is the official term of the plack )…of Moses that hangs above the doors where Congress reps enter the chamber.
It is parallel to Israel, allowing “strangers” into their community….AS LONG AS the “strangers” did NOT undermine…or encourage others to undermine Gods People Israel….and IF an undermining occurred….oust them.
Assimilation…by foreigners…agreeing with the Standards and Principles of the US….
Today, as scripture warns…no check, no balance…foreigners in DROVES….will become .a foreigners beliefs, their ways of governance will over take a nation.
….Obama’s change….Bidens payoff greed…Hillarys no care as long as she can sit on the throne she thinks she’s entitled to. An old hag, mafia influenced just like her daddy…huddles in the backroom of congress dictating demonizing catch phrases for dem nitwits…and the old man in the senate with glue stains on his pants dictating to the dems in the senate the same demonizing catch phrases for dems to drool on command.
The ONLY election that matters….IS an individual exercising his freewill to ELECT God!
Glory to God,
Taken
I’m not sure religious liberty exist. There is only liberation in spirit where the spirit of the Lord is there is freedom.
I mean the mix of religious freedom by exercise is legal…. But religious liberty … doesn’t exist.
There is only liberation in spirit where the spirit of the Lord is there is freedom.
What does that mean to you?
Religion
I mean the mix of religious freedom by exercise is legal…. But religious liberty … doesn’t exist.
There is only liberation in spirit where the spirit of the Lord is there is freedom.
What does that mean to you?
Religion
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
I don’t know if Jesus was commanding me to be religious when he suggested the worshipers of those whom are seeking after the Father, are to worship in spirit and truth. From what I understand there is liberation in the spirit and this not commandment but a belief which Jesus suggested his Father seeks those who worship in spirit and in truth. There is no bondage for doing so, but rewards, spiritual returns?
Are you not free to worship God according to the dictates of your own conscience...or not to worship anything or anyone, of you should so choose?
It is true the governments introduce laws with the intent to restrict your freedoms. However, are you not still free to choose to obey, or not? Look at Daniel. Nebuchadnezzar had agreed to a law that none should worship anyone except the statue on the plain of Dura. Shadrach, Mechach, and Abednego still had a choice, thus they were free. The consequences of exercising that freedom were dire, sure, but they still had a choice. Same with Daniel himself later under the rule of Darius. He agreed to a law that restricted prayer the king alone, but Daniel, despite knowing the consequences, exercised his freedom of religion to pray as he had always done, aloud, 3 times a day facing Jerusalem, with his window open.
In Revelation we read of a time soon to come whereby the government will pass laws restricting freedom of religion to a power approved of by that government. The government will use legislation that restricts buying and selling only to those who agree. Yet despite that pressure, there will be some who refuse to worship according to government dictates and legislation, will exercise their freedom to worship according to conscience, and be subject to a death sentence as further motivation to comply.
So while governments the world over in history and according to prophecy in the future, endeavour to control their populace through harsh laws and even harsher retribution, we are still free to obey God... therefore there is religious freedom. But it will cost. The question is, are we willing to pay the price as so many have done in the past?
The discussion then revolves around what role does government play, or should play, and do we have a responsibility to call the government out when it steps over the line? What is that line? And how far do we go in ensuring the boundaries are honoured?
Whoa. I’m just sharing concerning the Gospel. That was what Jesus stated. People who seek to worship God will do so in spirit and in truth. God so seeks for people to do so, and rewards them, by I assume spiritual means. I believe the Heavens declare Gods glory , and the firmament shows his handy work. How you take that is up to you, of course how do you take it?
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I was simply responding to your statement that there is no religious liberty. I believe there is, but sometimes it can cost. Which Jesus warned about.
“Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake. ”
Matthew 24:9 KJV
And yes, worshipping God in Spirit and in truth is a God given right, and always our choice to follow. However, even Christians can worship in accordance to the wrong spirit, and be deceived as to what is truth. Remember the words of Jesus, "in vain do they worship Me, teachings as doctrine the commandments of men". These same men, believing they were worshipping God, murdered millions during the dark ages, because dissenters chose to reject their man made doctrines and traditions. Jesus warned about that to.
“They shall put you out of the synagogues: yea, the time cometh, that whosoever killeth you will think that he doeth God service. ”
John 16:2 KJV
There was religious freedom in those circumstances, but it cost many their lives in exercising it.
Okay, all we can do is be transparent in what we believe.
Religion just forms bondage, so to me I do not understand how there could ever have been a "religious liberty" There was the freedom of having conversation directly with Yahavah, by means in which he would show forth himself I do believe. The hebrews believe that Yahavah would come by and speak with Adam and Eve in the wind, while we don't have evidence of it it's just something to think about. I can see where people are religious, be it buddism or something other but they could be seeking the one whoms glory is show in the heavens, and work declared in the firmaent if they are seeking to worship God in spirit and in truth, despite religious set backs....
Every persons heart will be weighted and examined.
Yes, people who proclaimed Jesus in the day, worship God in spirit and in truth, and showed forth works of love to God, and to others. Also people died for their faith just the same as Jesus. Jesus never said they would indeed to the apostles, die or lose their life didn't he? There is a lot of things to those notions whether or not they are important is just up to the person.
Some people like to point to scriptures like that who are religious, and act as though people are perscuting them for the name sake of Jesus, while in hindsight, they do it for other reasons... (Oh woe is me type of deal.) There is Paul who mentions even in his day wrote about the sincerity of some and also the harshness of others, but either way at least the name of Jesus was preached. From the name of Jesus being banned, to Christians being stoned to death, for believing because hatred.
Those are just some of my thoughts from your conversing.
I was thinking primarily of those coming across your southern border. Are they not predominantly catholic, and would likely vote in support of catholic rulers?
Back in the days of your founding fathers, Islam was barely thought of. The danger they saw was in that union of church and state which most of them had but recently escaped. That was a catholic state union. Catholics were, in this days, held with deep suspicion, and the influx of many Irish Catholics into New York brought with it no small amount of controversy, suspicion, and even violence. It took a long while before true religious liberty was appreciated by the American people. However, that hasn't dented catholic ambition to use religious liberty to their own advantage.
You seem to be avoiding the elephant. How many Catholics on the supreme court? What I'm trying to get at is the historically proven antipathy the Vatican has toward religious freedom, its profound impact on American society, protestantism's forgetfulness of history, and the advice determination by Rome to create an American catholic theocracy.
True. Lessons not learned by American evangelicals.
As far as religious liberty is concerned, the more Christians who serve in government the better. They would, if they were following biblical principles, provost a note of caution...a certain humility with the halls of power... sense of limiting state power knowing that the state will be held accountable to God.
In America, such as I describe above would certainly be useful when one considers the other extreme... communism, a state without any restraints, a system which is accountable to none, a government which sees itself as god. However, the temptation seeming to overwhelm America at present is to believe America has some sort of God given mandate to establish its own sense of righteousness, democracy, and social justice to the world... even through coercion, law, and a locked and loaded hip pocket.
In America, such as I describe above would certainly be useful when one considers the other extreme... communism, a state without any restraints, a system which is accountable to none, a government which sees itself as god. However, the temptation seeming to overwhelm America at present is to believe America has some sort of God given mandate to establish its own sense of righteousness, democracy, and social justice to the world... even through coercion, law, and a locked and loaded hip pocket.
How can the state acknowledge the limits placed on it through Christian and other religious ideas of a supreme Being to which we will all be held accountable, without being manipulated and reinvented to become a tool or weapon to enforce, even biblical righteousness?
No. For myself it must be, It must be in spirit and truth. Otherwise we are given Jesus the bird and saying forget what he says… it’s faith that’s make us right with Yahweh.
“And without faith it is impossible to please him, for whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him.”
Hebrews 11:6 ESV
I don’t see anything but religious burden, from my understanding concerning supporting “religious liberty” cause it doesn’t exist, unless one says it does.
That’s just me though and I tend to hate religion. And believed; Yahweh, sent his Son who fulfilled the law… so we aren’t under law when in spirit… not that we were any other law in the first place cause the Jewish people existed long before the Word was sent. And the Word fulfilled the Law in Christ who puts that old religion to death.
“For when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do what the law requires, they are a law to themselves, even though they do not have the law.”
Romans 2:14 ESV
“But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law.”
Galatians 5:22-23 ESV
“Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.”
2 Corinthians 3:17 ESV
“Jesus said to her, “Woman, believe me, the hour is coming when neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem will you worship the Father. You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews. But the hour is coming, and is now here, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for the Father is seeking such people to worship him. God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.””
John 4:21-24 ESV
But I digress, just more thoughts, of course they may be counter to your narrative; all the best! Just wanted to share; you had no thoughts on my last response?
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Taken
Well-Known Member
Southern influx predominately “Catholic” ?
Hard to pin-point…
The border is 2,000+ miles.
Check point stations…71
Hundreds of miles ‘unchecked’.
South & Central American citizens predominately hold to claiming to be Catholic…
Thousands from other continents/ Nations enter Central America & Mexico to then enter the US…
It is without historical doubt…the political flavor of US Democrats has been and is to embed and project to the:
* Religious sector of Catholics…
* African descent individuals…
THAT…democrat representatives is “THEIR” ONLY assurance of “Fair treatment in the US.”
AS Well…regarding…a mix of Religion & Nationals…
* Chinese, Arabs, Middle eastern, Russians…
religious or not…the same mantra…
THAT….democrat representatives is “THEIR” ONLY assurance of “Fair treatment in the US”.
The “process” has a long “history” effected via “spreading propaganda and demonization” of anything IN the US, NOT democrat is wicked and evil”.
It is NO secret…”democrats” for decades have used their power of the podium to PROMISE those IGNORANT of American Government Design (Americans AND Foreigners) with flowery language of freebie utopian lifestyles …
WHILE BACKDOOR FUNDING and CO-Conspiring with Organized THUG Groups to KEEP their (voting base) inline, oppressed, demonized, in FEAR. (KKK, mafia, Antifa, Raza, blah, blah, blah, whatever organized name they operate under).
Inanutshell…It amounts to CONTROL..to Promise ONE thing, Confiscate millions, pocket some, dole out some FREEBIE scraps…Fund the Thugs…(while preaching how awful their treatments is)…and living arm guarded luxurious life styles, far removed from the filthy, poor slums they have created and systematically perpetuate their demise.
Saying and Doing two different things!
FYI…
A democracy has RULERS
A republic has SERVANT Representatives
Glory to God,
Taken
Taken
Well-Known Member
Americanism…from the beginning was a broad escape from OPPRESSION…(under multiple lines….Religion, Race, Creed.)
Americanism…from the beginning was MODELED UNDER the Fixed Objective of the Standards and Principles of the Lord God Almighty.
Americanism…from the beginning was a JUST and Limited Constitution from under which ANY LAW so enacted must fall within the Limited perimeter OF said Limiting Constitution…OR…it was no law at all.
Muslims were not mentioned in the Federalist Papers…rather a reference to that group fell under “musselmen”.
Presently my copy of the Federalist Papers are on loan, and I do not have a way to quote from which Essay those two points are mentioned in the Fed Papers.
I can tell you…the Public School Systems in the US…very little, scant….teaches about the Design and Limits of American Republic Governments…and there was nor is any such thing as an American Democracy Government.
Glory to God,
Taken
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