What I Like About Universalism

[aspen]

Here are the facts, I am not a Universalist because my faith is too weak. I still believe that God is not willing to redeem those who choose to remain in their hatred and sin; however, I am longing to be be wrong on this point. I am convinced that people who are cutting-corners and lashing out at others are doing so for the same reason others choose to use the Bible as a security blanket - they are afraid. We are all terrified that God has abandoned us and some people behave badly their whole lives because of it. Is God going to punish fear? I doubt it. Does fear cause a hardness and bitterness in the heart? I believe it does, especially if it sets in at a young age. I pray that people will not have to be separated from God for eternity because they lived their lives in fear. There is very little difference between the fundamentalist, extremist, atheist, sinner, and antisocial person when it comes to the effect of fear on a person's life.

 

[jiggyfly]

Just stating an indisputable fact Jiggy. If you're right I can't go to Hell. If you're wrong you will be held accountable for everyone who goes to Hell because they believed you.

Don't feel like going in circles with you ducky, but you are wrong about what I believe which is really not that surprising given your track record here at CB with misinterpreting the posts of others and assuming way to much most of the time.
I actually believe that you could possibly have to endure hell for sometime to burn out your religious and rebellious nature.

As I have stated many times here at CB I believe in hell but I don't believe in unending torment. Big difference but I have serious doubts that you could understand given your limited religious thinking.

I also think that enough has been said and believe it is now a waste of time for the both of us, so i'm done.

 

[Rach1370]

Hey Jiggy, I really haven't followed this conversation all the way through...you may have already answered this, so if you have just tell me and I'll wade through the previous 4 pages!!

I'm just wondering how the universalism view meshes with the fact that Jesus Himself spoke of hell more than anyone else in the Bible? Why would He do that if hell was not very real and a very real danger for many, many people?

When you put that together with these verses, I'm truly wondering how you think everyone will end up in heaven. (this is not an attack, I really am wondering!)

[5] No, I tell you; but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.”
(Luke 13:5 ESV)

[23] And someone said to him, “Lord, will those who are saved be few?” And he said to them, [24] “Strive to enter through the narrow door. For many, I tell you, will seek to enter and will not be able. [25] When once the master of the house has risen and shut the door, and you begin to stand outside and to knock at the door, saying, ‘Lord, open to us,’ then he will answer you, ‘I do not know where you come from.’ [26] Then you will begin to say, ‘We ate and drank in your presence, and you taught in our streets.’ [27] But he will say, ‘I tell you, I do not know where you come from. Depart from me, all you workers of evil!’ [28] In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God but you yourselves cast out. (Luke 13:23-28 ESV)

 

[jiggyfly]

Hey Jiggy, I really haven't followed this conversation all the way through...you may have already answered this, so if you have just tell me and I'll wade through the previous 4 pages!!

I'm just wondering how the universalism view meshes with the fact that Jesus Himself spoke of hell more than anyone else in the Bible? Why would He do that if hell was not very real and a very real danger for many, many people?

When you put that together with these verses, I'm truly wondering how you think everyone will end up in heaven. (this is not an attack, I really am wondering!)

[5] No, I tell you; but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.”
(Luke 13:5 ESV)

[23] And someone said to him, “Lord, will those who are saved be few?” And he said to them, [24] “Strive to enter through the narrow door. For many, I tell you, will seek to enter and will not be able. [25] When once the master of the house has risen and shut the door, and you begin to stand outside and to knock at the door, saying, ‘Lord, open to us,’ then he will answer you, ‘I do not know where you come from.’ [26] Then you will begin to say, ‘We ate and drank in your presence, and you taught in our streets.’ [27] But he will say, ‘I tell you, I do not know where you come from. Depart from me, all you workers of evil!’ [28] In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God but you yourselves cast out. (Luke 13:23-28 ESV)

Well Rach I'm not sure where you formed your idea of universal reconciliation but it does not deny hell just it denies unending torment in hell. You must also understand that not every scripture applies to every age and dispensation.

The reason I think that all will be reconciled is because the scripture say so time and again.

For instance,
The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him and said, "Look! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world! John 1:29


And when I am lifted up from the earth, I will draw everyone to myself." john 12:32


For he must remain in heaven until the time for the final restoration of all things, as God promised long ago through his holy prophets. Acts3:21


For the Scriptures say, "'As surely as I live,' says the LORD, 'every knee will bend to me, and every tongue will confess and give praise to God. Romans 14:11


Therefore, God elevated him to the place of highest honor and gave him the name above all other names, that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.Philippians 2:9-11


God has now revealed to us his mysterious plan regarding Christ, a plan to fulfill his own good pleasure. And this is the plan: At the right time he will bring everything together under the authority of Christ—everything in heaven and on earth. Ephesians 1:9&10


For God in all his fullness was pleased to live in Christ, and through him God reconciled everything to himself. He made peace with everything in heaven and on earth by means of Christ's blood on the cross. Colossians 1:19&20


This is good and pleases God our Savior, who wants everyone to be saved and to understand the truth. For there is only one God and one Mediator who can reconcile God and humanity—the man Christ Jesus. He gave his life to purchase freedom for everyone. This is the message God gave to the world at just the right time. 1Timothy 2:4-6


I have more scriptures if your interested, there are about 600 scriptures that speak of a universal reconciliation with God. Have you ever counted how many speak of unending torment or annihilation?

The Greek word apollymi while is translated here as perish it can also mean lost.
A word study of the Hebrew word olam and the Greek word aion are very helpful in understanding God's plan.
If I didn't answer all your questions please point out the ones I missed.

Here are the facts, I am not a Universalist because my faith is too weak. I still believe that God is not willing to redeem those who choose to remain in their hatred and sin; however, I am longing to be be wrong on this point. I am convinced that people who are cutting-corners and lashing out at others are doing so for the same reason others choose to use the Bible as a security blanket - they are afraid. We are all terrified that God has abandoned us and some people behave badly their whole lives because of it. Is God going to punish fear? I doubt it. Does fear cause a hardness and bitterness in the heart? I believe it does, especially if it sets in at a young age. I pray that people will not have to be separated from God for eternity because they lived their lives in fear. There is very little difference between the fundamentalist, extremist, atheist, sinner, and antisocial person when it comes to the effect of fear on a person's life.

Aspen I really appreciate your honesty. I like this scripture.

Once, you Gentiles were rebels against God, but when the people of Israel rebelled against him, God was merciful to you instead. Now they are the rebels, and God's mercy has come to you so that they, too, will share [fn] in God's mercy. For God has imprisoned everyone in disobedience so he could have mercy on everyone. Oh, how great are God's riches and wisdom and knowledge! How impossible it is for us to understand his decisions and his ways! For who can know the LORD's thoughts? Who knows enough to give him advice? [fn]And who has given him so much that he needs to pay it back? [fn]For everything comes from him and exists by his power and is intended for his glory. All glory to him forever! Amen. Romans 11:30-36

 

[Rach1370]

Well Rach I'm not sure where you formed your idea of universal reconciliation but it does not deny hell just it denies unending torment in hell. You must also understand that not every scripture applies to every age and dispensation.

The reason I think that all will be reconciled is because the scripture say so time and again.

For instance,
The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him and said, "Look! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world! John 1:29


And when I am lifted up from the earth, I will draw everyone to myself." john 12:32


For he must remain in heaven until the time for the final restoration of all things, as God promised long ago through his holy prophets. Acts3:21


For the Scriptures say, "'As surely as I live,' says the LORD, 'every knee will bend to me, and every tongue will confess and give praise to God. Romans 14:11


Therefore, God elevated him to the place of highest honor and gave him the name above all other names, that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.Philippians 2:9-11


God has now revealed to us his mysterious plan regarding Christ, a plan to fulfill his own good pleasure. And this is the plan: At the right time he will bring everything together under the authority of Christ—everything in heaven and on earth. Ephesians 1:9&10


For God in all his fullness was pleased to live in Christ, and through him God reconciled everything to himself. He made peace with everything in heaven and on earth by means of Christ's blood on the cross. Colossians 1:19&20


This is good and pleases God our Savior, who wants everyone to be saved and to understand the truth. For there is only one God and one Mediator who can reconcile God and humanity—the man Christ Jesus. He gave his life to purchase freedom for everyone. This is the message God gave to the world at just the right time. 1Timothy 2:4-6


I have more scriptures if your interested, there are about 600 scriptures that speak of a universal reconciliation with God. Have you ever counted how many speak of unending torment or annihilation?

The Greek word apollymi while is translated here as perish it can also mean lost.
A word study of the Hebrew word olam and the Greek word aion are very helpful in understanding God's plan.
If I didn't answer all your questions please point out the ones I missed.

Hey Jiggy, thanks for your answer. I know there are a lot of differences in opinions when it comes to hell: no one goes, some go for only a short time, some suffer then go to heaven, some suffer and then die eternally....
As Aspen says, it would be nice to think that hell is not eternal punishment, but I just don't see that in scripture. I read your verses and I can see why you see them teaching one thing, but I really feel that scripture tells us another thing, which means we either have contradictions, or misinterpretations. I tend to think it's the latter, but I'm not gonna denounce you just because I differ in opinion with you. I'll try and put down some verses to show why I think differently, 'kay?

[26] And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, in order that those who would pass from here to you may not be able, and none may cross from there to us.’
(Luke 16:26 ESV) - Jesus tells us in this parable that the rich man in Hades cannot move to the other side, no matter his torment.

[28] In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God but you yourselves cast out.
(Luke 13:28 ESV)

[For God So Loved the World]
[16] “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. [18] Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God. (John 3:16-18 ESV) - Yes, Jesus came to save, but the bible clearly and repeatedly says that salvation only comes through Christ, and many, many people do not believe in Christ.

[36] Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him. (John 3:36 ESV) - 'remains'...that implies a permanence. ('wrath' Original Word: ὀργή, ῆς, ἡ, Definition: anger, wrath, passion; punishment, vengeance......'abide' Original Word: μένω, Short Definition: I remain, abide, continue, endure.)

[10] and the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever. (Revelation 20:10 ESV) - lake of fire = torment for ever and ever. ('torment' Original Word: βασανίζω, Definition: I torment, torture, buffet....'ever' Original Word: αἰών, ῶνος, ὁ, Definition: an age, a cycle (of time), especially of the present age as contrasted with the future age, and of one of a series of ages stretching to infinity.)

[12] And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Then another book was opened, which is the book of life. And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, according to what they had done. [13] And the sea gave up the dead who were in it, Death and Hades gave up the dead who were in them, and they were judged, each one of them, according to what they had done. [14] Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. [15] And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire. (Revelation 20:12-15 ESV) - Those not in the book of life (that claim Jesus as saviour) are in Hades, which is cast into the lake of fire....as we've just read lake of fire = unending torment.

[8] But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable, as for murderers, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur, which is the second death.” (Revelation 21:8 ESV) - all sinners will be in the lake of fire...the only exceptions are the sinners "who believe in Him". As I said, we cannot deny that the Bible teaches clearly again and again that the only way to Salvation is through belief in, love for, Christ.

[6] since indeed God considers it just to repay with affliction those who afflict you, [7] and to grant relief to you who are afflicted as well as to us, when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with his mighty angels [8] in flaming fire, inflicting vengeance on those who do not know God and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. [9] They will suffer the punishment of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might, (2 Thessalonians 1:6-9 ESV) ('eternal'Original Word: αἰώνιος, ία, ιον , Definition: eternal, unending......'vengeance' Original Word: ἐκδίκησις, εως, ἡ, Definition: (a) a defense, avenging, vindication, vengeance, (b ) full (complete) punishment)


As you say, there are many more passages. I truly believe that every single person, as sinful, rebellious people, deserve hell. It is the price for turning our backs on the God who created us. The only way out, is through Jesus. Yes, eventually the whole world will be made to see that Jesus is Lord, but acknowledgement does not mean love, and only those who love Christ will find their names in the book of life. I wish it were otherwise, but I feel that to declare that "it must be different" is just another way people try and claim lordship over God and what He has decreed. I know you feel otherwise, and as I said, I will not damn you for it...that's hardly my job!! I think it's for us to discuss what we feel the bible teaches and encourage each other to come to as Godly a conclusion as we can. I think the Bible teaches that hell is real and eternal. I think that urges us to fight for people's souls even harder....every day matters!

 

[jiggyfly]

Hey Jiggy, thanks for your answer. I know there are a lot of differences in opinions when it comes to hell: no one goes, some go for only a short time, some suffer then go to heaven, some suffer and then die eternally....
As Aspen says, it would be nice to think that hell is not eternal punishment, but I just don't see that in scripture. I read your verses and I can see why you see them teaching one thing, but I really feel that scripture tells us another thing, which means we either have contradictions, or misinterpretations. I tend to think it's the latter, but I'm not gonna denounce you just because I differ in opinion with you. I'll try and put down some verses to show why I think differently, 'kay?

[26] And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, in order that those who would pass from here to you may not be able, and none may cross from there to us.’
(Luke 16:26 ESV) - Jesus tells us in this parable that the rich man in Hades cannot move to the other side, no matter his torment.

[28] In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God but you yourselves cast out.
(Luke 13:28 ESV)

[For God So Loved the World]
[16] “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. [18] Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God. (John 3:16-18 ESV) - Yes, Jesus came to save, but the bible clearly and repeatedly says that salvation only comes through Christ, and many, many people do not believe in Christ.

[36] Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him. (John 3:36 ESV) - 'remains'...that implies a permanence. ('wrath' Original Word: ὀργή, ῆς, ἡ, Definition: anger, wrath, passion; punishment, vengeance......'abide' Original Word: μένω, Short Definition: I remain, abide, continue, endure.)

[10] and the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever. (Revelation 20:10 ESV) - lake of fire = torment for ever and ever. ('torment' Original Word: βασανίζω, Definition: I torment, torture, buffet....'ever' Original Word: αἰών, ῶνος, ὁ, Definition: an age, a cycle (of time), especially of the present age as contrasted with the future age, and of one of a series of ages stretching to infinity.)

[12] And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Then another book was opened, which is the book of life. And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, according to what they had done. [13] And the sea gave up the dead who were in it, Death and Hades gave up the dead who were in them, and they were judged, each one of them, according to what they had done. [14] Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. [15] And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire. (Revelation 20:12-15 ESV) - Those not in the book of life (that claim Jesus as saviour) are in Hades, which is cast into the lake of fire....as we've just read lake of fire = unending torment.

[8] But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable, as for murderers, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur, which is the second death.” (Revelation 21:8 ESV) - all sinners will be in the lake of fire...the only exceptions are the sinners "who believe in Him". As I said, we cannot deny that the Bible teaches clearly again and again that the only way to Salvation is through belief in, love for, Christ.

[6] since indeed God considers it just to repay with affliction those who afflict you, [7] and to grant relief to you who are afflicted as well as to us, when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with his mighty angels [8] in flaming fire, inflicting vengeance on those who do not know God and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. [9] They will suffer the punishment of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might, (2 Thessalonians 1:6-9 ESV) ('eternal'Original Word: αἰώνιος, ία, ιον , Definition: eternal, unending......'vengeance' Original Word: ἐκδίκησις, εως, ἡ, Definition: (a) a defense, avenging, vindication, vengeance, (b ) full (complete) punishment)


As you say, there are many more passages. I truly believe that every single person, as sinful, rebellious people, deserve hell. It is the price for turning our backs on the God who created us. The only way out, is through Jesus. Yes, eventually the whole world will be made to see that Jesus is Lord, but acknowledgement does not mean love, and only those who love Christ will find their names in the book of life. I wish it were otherwise, but I feel that to declare that "it must be different" is just another way people try and claim lordship over God and what He has decreed. I know you feel otherwise, and as I said, I will not damn you for it...that's hardly my job!! I think it's for us to discuss what we feel the bible teaches and encourage each other to come to as Godly a conclusion as we can. I think the Bible teaches that hell is real and eternal. I think that urges us to fight for people's souls even harder....every day matters!

Thanks for the reply Rach, you ever do word studies and study the scriptures going back to the Hebrew and Greek? Olam aion and aionios are good words to start with.

 

[Duckybill]

This is a troubling statement, based in fear.

It shouldn't be "troubling" to Christians. It is totally factual.

Pascal's wager has never been a satisfying reason for faith because it only addresses the mind, not the heart. Believing in God simply to avoid Hell misses the entire point of sanctification and could only be thought up by a logical, mathematician like Pascal. Jiggy is calling people to more than just hunkering down in correct doctrine and waiting for Christ so they can provide the correct verses so He will not smite them. He is calling people to come out of their fear and oppression and allow Christ to teach them to love.

I am not a Christian because it makes sense and I am hedging my bets.....I am a Christian because I desire to graduate from the School of Love and become what I was created to be, fully human.

It's the BOTTOM LINE that counts Aspen, We are either saved from Hell or not. There's no in between.

Don't feel like going in circles with you ducky, but you are wrong about what I believe which is really not that surprising given your track record here at CB with misinterpreting the posts of others and assuming way to much most of the time.[
I actually believe that you could possibly have to endure hell for sometime to burn out your religious and rebellious nature.

As I have stated many times here at CB I believe in hell but I don't believe in unending torment. Big difference but I have serious doubts that you could understand given your limited religious thinking.

I also think that enough has been said and believe it is now a waste of time for the both of us, so i'm done.

As I said, If you are right I can do whatever I choose and still be saved. But you're wrong. So I live a Godly life.

1 Peter 4:18 (ESV)
[sup]18 [/sup]And “If the righteous is scarcely saved, what will become of the ungodly and the sinner?”

 

[aspen]

Well Duckybill,

I guess we will have to agree to disagree. I believe Christ came to bring us life and life abundantly, I choose to be sanctified for Heaven, by overcoming my fear and living for love. Fearing Hell is like becoming agoraphobic because of a fear of Polio; not relevant.

 

[Duckybill]

Well Duckybill,

I guess we will have to agree to disagree. I believe Christ came to bring us life and life abundantly, I choose to be sanctified for Heaven, by overcoming my fear and living for love. Fearing Hell is like becoming agoraphobic because of a fear of Polio; not relevant.

Those who don't fear God don't know the God of the Bible.

1 Peter 2:17 (ESV)
[sup]17 [/sup]Fear God.

 

[tomwebster]

Those who don't fear God don't know the God of the Bible.

1 Peter 2:17 (ESV)
[sup]17 [/sup]Fear God.

I don't fear God, I am in awe of God, I revere Him.

 

[Duckybill]

I don't fear God, I am in awe of God, I revere Him.

So "fear God" is a request?

 

[aspen]

Those who don't fear God don't know the God of the Bible.

1 Peter 2:17 (ESV)
[sup]17 [/sup]Fear God.

It means to be in awe of God, Ducky.

You are always claiming that people do not understand the English version of the Bible; go look up the word fear in the context of 1Peter 2:17 in a good concordance.

 

[Duckybill]

It means to be in awe of God, Ducky.

You are always claiming that people do not understand the English version of the Bible; go look up the word fear in the context of 1Peter 2:17 in a good concordance.

Then why is it translated "FEAR" in nearly every English Bible?

 

[aspen]

Then why is it translated "FEAR" in nearly every English Bible?

You asked:


Fear the Lord God... ??

Although the phrase "fear the LORD God" is common in the King James version of the bible, why should we fear or dread the very arms that we are, with every breath, lovingly drawn into? Certainly there are some people who can only be motivated by dreadful fear, and for them, such words of fear may be useful, or even necessary, but for the rest of us, there is a far more beautiful and inspiring interpretation of the these words.​

​

Admittedly, millions have learned to have a fearful attitude, perhaps by using flawed translations or by listening to those who have blindly preached such fearful attitudes. This unfortunate concept of fear and dread seems have often been a result of the choice of words used by the scripture translators, not from the original words of the prophets.​

​

The word most often translated in the Old Testament as fear is the Hebrew word

(transliterated as yirah) which can possibly mean fear, but also means awe, reverence, respect and devotion. A closely related Hebrew word is

(transliterated as yare) which can mean fearful, but also means to stand in awe, reverence or honor.​

​

Similarly, the King James translators also chose to translate the Hebrew

(transliterated as mowra) as fear, although it also means reverence, object of reverence, or an awe inspiring spectacle or deed. Another word that the King James translators chose to call fear is the Hebrew

(transliterated as guwr) which can mean fear, but which also means to stir up, sojourn, dwell with, remain, dwell in or to stand in awe.​

​

Fortunately, some of the newer bible translations are slowly beginning to correct this situation and are beginning to use fitting terms such as honor and reverence to express our relationship with God. What a magnificent difference it is to change from an attitude of fear of a dreadful, vengeful God into the beautiful, loving attitude of awe, reverence, respect and devotion towards a kind, loving God.​

​

 

[Duckybill]

Anyone who doesn't fear the God of the Bible who drowned everyone on Earth but 8 to make an example, just doesn't get it yet.

2 Kings 17:25 (ESV)
[sup]25 [/sup]And at the beginning of their dwelling there, they did not fear the Lord. Therefore the Lord sent lions among them, which killed some of them.

 

[aspen]

Anyone who doesn't fear the God of the Bible who drowned everyone on Earth but 8 to make an example, just doesn't get it yet.

2 Kings 17:25 (ESV)
[sup]25 [/sup]And at the beginning of their dwelling there, they did not fear the Lord. Therefore the Lord sent lions among them, which killed some of them.

Did you even bother reading my post?

 

[Duckybill]

Did you even bother reading my post?

Sure, You attacked our English Bibles. That's quite common here. When you don't like what God said change it.

 

[aspen]

Sure, You attacked our English Bibles. That's quite common here. When you don't like what God said change it.

Ducky,

The Bible was not written in English. Do you know a foreign language? Words do not translate directly. Why are you interpreting my post into an attack, when I am simply providing a more accurate translation?
Is your salvation tied into the English translation of the Bible?

 

[Duckybill]

Ducky,

The Bible was not written in English. Do you know a foreign language? Words do not translate directly. Why are you interpreting my post into an attack, when I am simply providing a more accurate translation?
Is your salvation tied into the English translation of the Bible?

Because it is an attack. We do not have to know Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek to be saved. God knows the English Language.

"I am simply providing a more accurate translation?"

And how do you know that? Because it is more pleasing to you?

 

[aspen]

Because it is an attack. We do not have to know Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek to be saved. God knows the English Language.

"I am simply providing a more accurate translation?"

And how do you know that? Because it is more pleasing to you?

So your salvation is riding on your understanding of the English translation - wow. I am sorry you are carrying this extra burden, when Christ is sufficient.

In any case, we are not talking about salvation - we are talking about the word 'fear' and how it has a broader meaning in the language it was written in. Knowing the original languages of the Bible is not a requirement of salvation, but a general understanding (or willingness to learn) of the languages is important for teaching. For example; do you believe

Mathew[font="Verdana][b][url="http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+19:24&version=31"]19:24[/url]: "[/b][/font][font="Verdana]Again I tell you, it is easier for a [/font][b]camel[/b][font="Verdana] to go through the eye of a [/font][b]needle[/b][font="Verdana] than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God.” is supposed to be interpreted as a real camel trying to fit into a real eye on a real needle?" [/font][/size]
[size="2"][font="Verdana]
[/font][/size][font="Verdana][size=2]Certainly not. Jesus is referring to a main entrance to the city of Jerusalem, which camels had to enter on their knees.[/size][/font] [size="2"][font="Verdana]Understanding the cultural context and the broader meaning of words by learning from the original language enhances understanding.[/font]