What reveals?

[VictoryinJesus]

The question is ...what reveals?


Warning, this may be another ‘endtimes’ thread.

 

[Helen]

The question is ...what reveals?


Warning, this may be another ‘endtimes’ thread.

Should the question not be- Who reveals?
There is on;y one Revealer of secrets...and that is God, via His Holy Spirit... or am I missing something here? :)

 

[icxn]

The question is ...what reveals?

The knocking at the door (Matthew 7:7-8), i.e. the working (knocking involves the hands, hence working) of Christ's commandments (the door). John 14:21 states it more explicitly:

He that hath My commandments and keepeth them, he it is that loveth Me; and he that loveth Me shall be loved by My Father, and I will love him and will reveal Myself to him.”​

 

[bbyrd009]

what and who seem settled to me, i would seek where wadr

 

[VictoryinJesus]

I wanted to be fair in saying this question was headed to another concerning end-times. What reveals? Of course I would agree it is Christ which is light. Proverbs 4:18-19 But the path of the just is as the shining light, that shineth more and more unto the perfect day. [19] The way of the wicked is as darkness: they know not at what they stumble.

Shining more and more and more ...how does the light shine more unto that perfect day? Is it a literal light like the sun in intensity? What is that perfect day?

If light reveals ... then can the wicked be revealed without light? Can anything be manifest, revealed or seen without light. 2 Thessalonians 2:7-10
[7] For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let , until he be taken out of the way. [8] And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: [9] Even him , whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, [10] And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

Why couldn’t it be ‘until he be taken out of the way’ from preventing light to make manifest what is not seen or hidden?

2 Corinthians 4:4
[4] In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

What restrains or prevents? Does light prevent or darkness? Is a thing covered or uncovered to be revealed?

Matthew 24:27
[27] For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

1 John 2:7-8
[7] Brethren, I write no new commandment unto you, but an old commandment which ye had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which ye have heard from the beginning. [8] Again, a new commandment I write unto you, which thing is true in him and in you: because the darkness is past, and the true light now shineth.

1 John 3:2
[2] Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

Romans 8:19
[19] For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.

 

[Enoch111]

Shining more and more and more ...how does the light shine more unto that perfect day? Is it a literal light like the sun in intensity? What is that perfect day?

“But the path of the just is as the shining light, that shineth more and more unto the perfect day.” (Prov 4:18)
The path of the just (the justified ones) and the shining light are primarily Christ (the narrow way and the Light of the world) and secondarily the Word of God (thy Word is a lamp unto my feet and a light unto my path). This shows a double application. The perfect day is that future period when there will be everlasting righteousness on earth, after the creation of the New Heavens and the New Earth.

If light reveals ... then can the wicked be revealed without light?

Of course not. The answer is obvious.

Why couldn’t it be ‘until he be taken out of the way’ from preventing light to make manifest what is not seen or hidden?

Because the Mystery of Iniquity has been at work ever since the Fall. Satan planted iniquity in Eden and it continues to this day. And God has revealed this to all mankind within Scripture.

What restrains or prevents? Does light prevent or darkness? Is a thing covered or uncovered to be revealed?

It is God th Holy Spirit who is the Restrainer of Satan on earth and prevents him from taking total control until the appropriate time (and that too for a limited time -- 3.5 years). Of course light banishes darkness, not just prevents it. And the appearance of the Antichrist is still hidden.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

It is God th Holy Spirit who is the Restrainer of Satan on earth and prevents him from taking total control

Thank you for your response. Agree with a lot of what your shared. Also, there is no dispute that God restrains Satan but you say to prevent Satan from having full control. You mentioned in another thread, I think if I remember correctly ...that Satan and evil men are sent of God for Judgement. 1) then Satan is not in control, and never will be. God allows Satan to hold (restrain) the Revelation of Christ which is light? Why? Nothing is seen in the dark as it is but instead they stumble and do not even know what they stumble over. The light reproves. The light judges. The brightness of His coming we assume is an intensity of light in the natural)...but as you said above this light is knowledge of God and seeing what is hidden in the dark.

Revelation 7:16
[16] They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat. (The natural is not their light ...the Lamb of God will be their light)

The fire is already here. It is getter hotter. Paul was pulling from wrath and giving out ‘fireproof’ rainment which is Christ. Famine is already here; famine of hearing the words of God. The sword is already here. The pestilences are here. How much darker can it get? (I’m afraid to ask).

Isaiah 46:10-12
[10] Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure: [11] Calling a ravenous bird from the east, the man that executeth my counsel from a far country: yea, I have spoken it , I will also bring it to pass; I have purposed it , I will also do it. [12] Hearken unto me, ye stouthearted, that are far from righteousness:

“...my counsel shall stand.”
“...a ravenous bird from the east...”

 

[Enoch111]

then Satan is not in control, and never will be.

Kindly read and study Revelation 13.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Kindly read and study Revelation 13.

Ok I read it. What is your point? That God gave control there to Darkness(the beast and dragon)?

Ezekiel 29:4
[4] But I (God)will put hooks in thy jaws, and I will cause the fish of thy rivers to stick unto thy scales, and I will bring thee up out of the midst of thy rivers, and all the fish of thy rivers shall stick unto thy scales.

Job 41:2,15
[2] Canst thou put an hook into his nose? or bore his jaw through with a thorn? [15] His scales are his pride, shut up together as with a close seal.

Who is worthy to open the seals? Who overcomes Satan (beast and dragon?)

Ezekiel 38:4
[4] And I will turn thee back, and put hooks into thy jaws, and I will bring thee forth, and all thine army, horses and horsemen, all of them clothed with all sorts of armour, even a great company with bucklers and shields, all of them handling swords: —(but rather put on THE arm our of light)

Job 41:33-34
[33] Upon earth there is not his like, who is made without fear. [34] (the dragon)He beholdeth all high things : he is a king over all the children of pride.

But who has the power to break (the kingdoms of) pride? The beast and Dragon may be given control for a time but it is still for God’s purposes which means it is for good and not evil. Revelation 13:10 He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

 

[Enoch111]

Ok I read it. What is your point? That God gave control there to Darkness(the beast and dragon)?

Exactly. You did not believe that was possible, but God says that is exactly what will happen in future. And introducing other passages which pertain to other matters is not helpful to you.

 

[bbyrd009]

Calling a ravenous bird from the east, the man that executeth my counsel from a far country: yea, I have spoken it , I will also bring it to pass; I have purposed it , I will also do it.

fwiw a fairly diff sense is gotten if you make your own translation imo,
Isaiah 46:11 Lexicon: Calling a bird of prey from the east, The man of My purpose from a far country. Truly I have spoken; truly I will bring it to pass. I have planned it, surely I will do it.
wadr that one is...arg, almost useless, the symbology is all whacked, "east" should almost surely be "sunrise" in that context, and etc

 

[bbyrd009]

then Satan is not in control, and never will be.

word :)

God allows Satan to hold (restrain) the Revelation of Christ which is light? Why?

so that we can have the desires of our hearts, that we may learn to sow what we want to reap imo

 

[bbyrd009]

Ok I read it. What is your point? That God gave control there to Darkness(the beast and dragon)?

a valid dialectic perspective imo, that is not even trying to state any Facts, what ppl are mostly looking for i guess

 

[VictoryinJesus]

fwiw a fairly diff sense is gotten if you make your own translation imo,
Isaiah 46:11 Lexicon: Calling a bird of prey from the east, The man of My purpose from a far country. Truly I have spoken; truly I will bring it to pass. I have planned it, surely I will do it.
wadr that one is...arg, almost useless, the symbology is all whacked, "east" should almost surely be "sunrise" in that context, and etc

“East” I thought of sunrise also. East, brightness: Fan. To scatter. A winnowing shovel(as scattering the chaff). The north wind(as dispersing clouds). Now Isaiah 46:11 Calling a ravenous bird from the east, the man that executeth my counsel from a far country: yea, I have spoken it , I will also bring it to pass; I have purposed it , I will also do it.

ravenous: extremely hungry: hungry even to rage; as ravenous wolf or vulture. Eager for prey or ravenous appetite or desire.

Isaiah 41:16
[16] Thou shalt fan them, and the wind shall carry them away(as chaff), and the whirlwind shall scatter them: and thou shalt rejoice in the Lord , and shalt glory in the Holy One of Israel.

Isaiah 30:24-25
[24] The oxen likewise and the young asses that ear the ground shall eat clean provender, which hath been winnowed with the shovel and with the fan. [25] And there shall be upon every high mountain, and upon every high hill, rivers and streams of waters in the day of the great slaughter, when the towers fall.

Jeremiah 15:7
[7] And I (God) will fan them with a fan in the gates of the land; I will bereave them of children, I will destroy my people, since they return not from their ways.

Jeremiah 51:1-2
[1] Thus saith the Lord ; Behold, I (God)will raise up against Babylon, and against them that dwell in the midst of them that rise up against me, a destroying (north)wind; [2] And will send unto Babylon fanners, that shall fan her, and shall empty her land: for in the day of trouble they shall be against her round about.

Matthew 3:11-12
[11] I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire: [12] Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.

Luke 3:16-17
[16] John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire: [17] Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and will gather the wheat into his garner; but the chaff he will burn with fire unquenchable.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Exactly. You did not believe that was possible, but God says that is exactly what will happen in future. And introducing other passages which pertain to other matters is not helpful to you.

I believe all things are possible with God. Thank you for your input.

You may feel they are (not) helpful verses but they are for me; in seeing Who(God) is the one in control and nothing slips out of His hand. I’ve always been an anxious person. Knowing God is in control takes it away. That’s all.