When exactly do you become a Christian?
- Thread starter Ernie
- Start date
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
Well then, by jove, use them !I can relate with both different views.
Sorry I like these little images.
I like them too but it requires patience to find just the right one !
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
I’d like to address these points if I may....
The “spirit” that was breathed into Adam was the “breath of life” that filled his lungs, causing him to become “a living soul”. The spirit and the soul are two distinctly different things....nowhere are these two words conflated in the Bible...only in church theology.
Nowhere is the “soul” ever described as a disembodied spirit. The only disembodied spirits in the Bible are angels and demons....not humans.
If we have a dog and come home after an absence, even a dog can express joy at our homecoming.
It is apparent that you have not really examined the Genesis account carefully because you speak of Adam having a “lust of the flesh” when that was not the case at all. Adam was created without those lusts that are common in our world. What Adam felt for his wife was love...genuine love.
The devil purposely approached the woman when she was alone, because otherwise Adam, as the educated one, would have told the serpent to get lost. So approaching the ‘newby’, satan was able to deceive her with a temptation which in her innocence, she could not refute. She was “thoroughly deceived” by what the devil had told her....the fruit of the tree was not going to kill them, but it would make them “like God”. Once she fell for that lie, the devil waited for the second part of his plan to unfold....Adam was now presented with a division of his loyalties....he had waited a long time for God to give him a mate, and he was totally besotted by her.
Would he join her in disobedience and lose favour with God..... join her in a rebellion he knew would end in death?.....or would he obey his Creator and lose her? We all know what choice he made....throwing the entire human race that descended from them into a course of sin and death, from which they could not extract themselves.
Adam was not created “immortal” otherwise the TKGE could not have brought death upon them....an immortal cannot die. What they were presented with was a choice between two trees that God placed in the garden as a test of their obedience. One produced everlasting life (which is not immortality) and the other resulted in the death penalty.
The ‘subduing’ of the earth, that would have spread the boundaries of their paradise home to the four corners of the globe, would wait until the object lesson was over. Kicked out of the garden, they began a very different life....and so did we as their offspring.
James 2:26 is repeating what verse 17 had already stated....
“faith by itself, without works, is dead”.
Putting your own interpretation on James’ words there is misleading, because these Jewish disciples of Jesus well understood what the condition of the dead was in their religion. (Excl 9:5, 10) There was no immortal soul mentioned in their Scripture. A “soul” was a living, breathing creature...both human and animal. Read Genesis and see that the “souls” God created, included the animals......and the “spirit” that animated them was the same as that which animated Adam.
That divine spark was passed on to all living creatures because we are all designed to share this beautiful planet together, forever.
What we lost, is what Jesus came to buy back for us...that is what “redemption” means. Payment for something forfeited, that is redeemed with something of equal value. The price was set and only Jesus could pay it, because he became “the last Adam”. His sinless life paid for what the first Adam forfeited.
No sorry, Adam was the first human “son of God”.... what makes one a “son” of the Almighty, is the fact that he created them. Every angel is a created “son of God”, as is God’s “firstborn”...who existed before all of them, and was instrumental in their creation. (Col 1:15-16)
Where will I find that written? Adam was not born....but was created directly by God. The spirit he had in him was the same “spirit” that animates all living earthly creatures. We all breathe the same air....and die the same death....we stop breathing, and our body returns to the dust. (Eccl 3:19-20; Gen 3:19)
Nope, not even close. The body that God formed was designed to procreate, again like all living things on this planet...are designed to replicate their “kind” in perpetuity....only humans were created with a spiritual nature and with superior intelligence which included a desire to worship the one who created them....the one they recognize as their “Father”.
The “spirit” that was breathed into Adam was the “breath of life” that filled his lungs, causing him to become “a living soul”. The spirit and the soul are two distinctly different things....nowhere are these two words conflated in the Bible...only in church theology.
Nowhere is the “soul” ever described as a disembodied spirit. The only disembodied spirits in the Bible are angels and demons....not humans.
There is no doubt that as oxygen filled the cells in his lifeless body, that Adam came to life....”life” as defined in the Bible for living souls. Sentient creatures are those who feel what we feel...pain, happiness, hunger, discomfort, love, hate, anger, joy....feelings are hard to quantify.....but we all have them.
If we have a dog and come home after an absence, even a dog can express joy at our homecoming.
It is apparent that you have not really examined the Genesis account carefully because you speak of Adam having a “lust of the flesh” when that was not the case at all. Adam was created without those lusts that are common in our world. What Adam felt for his wife was love...genuine love.
The devil purposely approached the woman when she was alone, because otherwise Adam, as the educated one, would have told the serpent to get lost. So approaching the ‘newby’, satan was able to deceive her with a temptation which in her innocence, she could not refute. She was “thoroughly deceived” by what the devil had told her....the fruit of the tree was not going to kill them, but it would make them “like God”. Once she fell for that lie, the devil waited for the second part of his plan to unfold....Adam was now presented with a division of his loyalties....he had waited a long time for God to give him a mate, and he was totally besotted by her.
Would he join her in disobedience and lose favour with God..... join her in a rebellion he knew would end in death?.....or would he obey his Creator and lose her? We all know what choice he made....throwing the entire human race that descended from them into a course of sin and death, from which they could not extract themselves.
Adam was not created “immortal” otherwise the TKGE could not have brought death upon them....an immortal cannot die. What they were presented with was a choice between two trees that God placed in the garden as a test of their obedience. One produced everlasting life (which is not immortality) and the other resulted in the death penalty.
That is when Adam and his wife began their time on ‘death row’. God had given them an assignment to “fill the earth and subdue it”.....so he allowed the first part of that assignment to go ahead, in spite of the awful inheritance of sin and inevitable death that would result for their children.
The ‘subduing’ of the earth, that would have spread the boundaries of their paradise home to the four corners of the globe, would wait until the object lesson was over. Kicked out of the garden, they began a very different life....and so did we as their offspring.
Yes, a knowledge of anatomy is useful but not when it is misapplied.Dichotamists needed to take anatomy, like I did. And then study their bibles a bit harder.
JAM 2:26 For as the body without the (divine spark) spirit (from God) is dead,
James 2:26 is repeating what verse 17 had already stated....
“faith by itself, without works, is dead”.
Putting your own interpretation on James’ words there is misleading, because these Jewish disciples of Jesus well understood what the condition of the dead was in their religion. (Excl 9:5, 10) There was no immortal soul mentioned in their Scripture. A “soul” was a living, breathing creature...both human and animal. Read Genesis and see that the “souls” God created, included the animals......and the “spirit” that animated them was the same as that which animated Adam.
That divine spark was passed on to all living creatures because we are all designed to share this beautiful planet together, forever.
What we lost, is what Jesus came to buy back for us...that is what “redemption” means. Payment for something forfeited, that is redeemed with something of equal value. The price was set and only Jesus could pay it, because he became “the last Adam”. His sinless life paid for what the first Adam forfeited.
What does interpretation mean?
In my opinion it is: To get the understanding the Bible is trying to explain.
================================================================================================
For example, think about it if, you have 3 scriptures and I have 3 scriptures that do not agree with your 3, has either one of us found a correct interpretation? No.
If we want the Bibles view wouldn't we have to include every scripture we can find on the subject?
Would you like me to provide a example? ..... What Bible topic interests you?
In my opinion it is: To get the understanding the Bible is trying to explain.
================================================================================================
For example, think about it if, you have 3 scriptures and I have 3 scriptures that do not agree with your 3, has either one of us found a correct interpretation? No.
If we want the Bibles view wouldn't we have to include every scripture we can find on the subject?
Would you like me to provide a example? ..... What Bible topic interests you?
Hi Walter
You've hit upon one of my pet peeves about the bible.
The fact that almost anything can be proven.
I agree with you that one has to read ALL scripture on a subject and not pick one verse out,,,or even a couple.
Actually, I'm only interested, at the end of years of discussion, in just a couple of topics that I feel are very important.
Here they are:
1. We are to obey God. Some tell me that our good works (which is obeying God) are like filthy rags to God.
2. OSAS. I don't see this doctrine anywhere in scripture, and yet some post verses that sound like it's true.
So...what to do?
What do YOU believe the solution to be?
Go ahead and provide an example...
use OSAS.
Does God Want Us to Understand His Word?
Consider the following verses from the Bible itself:
“This commandment that I am commanding you today is not too difficult for you, nor is it far away.”—Deuteronomy 30:11.
“The very disclosure of your words gives light, making the inexperienced ones understand.”—Psalm 119:130.
“In that very hour [Jesus] became overjoyed in the holy spirit and said: ‘I publicly praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have carefully hidden these things from wise and intellectual ones, and have revealed them to babes.’”—Luke 10:21.
John 14:26
But the helper, the holy spirit, which the Father will send in my name, that one will teach you all things and bring back to your minds all the things I told you.
2nd Peter 1:20-21
For you know this first, that no prophecy of Scripture springs from any private interpretation. 21 For prophecy was at no time brought by man’s will, but men spoke from God as they were moved* by holy spirit.
Luke 11:9
So I say to you, keep on asking, and it will be given you; keep on seeking, and you will find; keep on knocking, and it will be opened to you.
James 1:5-6
So if any one of you is lacking in wisdom, let him keep asking God, for he gives generously to all and without reproaching,* and it will be given him.6 But let him keep asking in faith, not doubting at all, for the one who doubts is like a wave of the sea driven by the wind and blown about.
The scriptures are written in English and I speak English, so how hard could it be? --Jesus says things are revealed to little children and hidden from the wise and learned.
Matthew 11:25
At that time Jesus declared, “I praise You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because You have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children. 26 Yes, Father, for this was well-pleasing in Your sight. Berean Standard Bible
2 Timothy 3:16-17
All Scripture is inspired by God and beneficial for teaching, for rebuke, for correction, for training in righteousness; 17 so that the man or woman of God may be fully capable, equipped for every good work. New American Standard Bible
Consider the following verses from the Bible itself:
“This commandment that I am commanding you today is not too difficult for you, nor is it far away.”—Deuteronomy 30:11.
“The very disclosure of your words gives light, making the inexperienced ones understand.”—Psalm 119:130.
“In that very hour [Jesus] became overjoyed in the holy spirit and said: ‘I publicly praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have carefully hidden these things from wise and intellectual ones, and have revealed them to babes.’”—Luke 10:21.
John 14:26
But the helper, the holy spirit, which the Father will send in my name, that one will teach you all things and bring back to your minds all the things I told you.
2nd Peter 1:20-21
For you know this first, that no prophecy of Scripture springs from any private interpretation. 21 For prophecy was at no time brought by man’s will, but men spoke from God as they were moved* by holy spirit.
Luke 11:9
So I say to you, keep on asking, and it will be given you; keep on seeking, and you will find; keep on knocking, and it will be opened to you.
James 1:5-6
So if any one of you is lacking in wisdom, let him keep asking God, for he gives generously to all and without reproaching,* and it will be given him.6 But let him keep asking in faith, not doubting at all, for the one who doubts is like a wave of the sea driven by the wind and blown about.
The scriptures are written in English and I speak English, so how hard could it be? --Jesus says things are revealed to little children and hidden from the wise and learned.
Matthew 11:25
At that time Jesus declared, “I praise You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because You have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children. 26 Yes, Father, for this was well-pleasing in Your sight. Berean Standard Bible
2 Timothy 3:16-17
All Scripture is inspired by God and beneficial for teaching, for rebuke, for correction, for training in righteousness; 17 so that the man or woman of God may be fully capable, equipped for every good work. New American Standard Bible
Last edited:
I will get some scriptures together. Thank You so much for the kind words.
I will give you scriptures only, so I'm not adding any narrative or extra meaning, I have a tendency to feel that if it's in the Bible, It's in there for a good reason.
Hey Walter
You just got another LIKE!
Don't go too crazy...
there's plenty there.
Here are 2 opposing verses:
John 10:27-28
27 "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me;
28 and I give eternal life to them, and they will never * perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand.
Colossians 1:22-23a
22 yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach -
23 if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel
There you go.
Yes I agree, with just a few scriptures you can prove just about anything.
Here is something I found to be true, take any Bible topic and look for as many scriptures as you can find on that topic.
the majority will compliment each-other but a few of them will disagree.
Then I go to studybible.info, and click the single verse I want to do research on, then I click compare in other Bible versions, then a page comes up with 60 or so different Bibles, and here I can find a Bible that renders that particular verse in a different way, that agrees with the majority of scriptures I already have. *My goal is finding 100% agreement.
I will add more words in a little while I'm in the hospital and I have to go do something right now..
That's an interesting method.
If you just google: John 1:1 biblehub ---it brings you to a biblehub page with almost all of the translations.
My method is that all scripture must be harmonized....
differences must be reconciled.
The way some post verses basically renders the NT untrustworthy due to all the conflicts that are caused.
And I'm probably going to sign off...almost 11PM here.
Might check back later or else tomorrow morning.
Hope your hospital visit is short and nothing of substance...
unless, of course, you work there.
pandaflower
Well-Known Member
You are irrevocably Saved the moment you believe .
33 Things That Happen at the Moment of Salvation - Sonlife
Discover what God does in our lives at the moment we commit our lives to Him!
www.sonlife.com
I use three websites Biblehub.com, Bible Gateway.com and studybible.info
Hillsage
Well-Known Member
Uhh, because their sinful natured bodies have a life force, just like I had before my spirit was BORN AGAIN. Do I still sin? HELL YES!!! Not cussing, simply a fact. So how can I, AND YOU, still sin if we have a 'new spirit' from God dwelling IN our bodies?.
Being born a perfect lamb did not fulfill the inspection of the priests to cut its throat on the feast of Passover. I quoted One scripture giving your view one black eye. Your second rebuttaled opinion still pales without one scripture to support your opinion. I'll give you 3 scriptures, for my opinion.
HEB 2:10 For it was fitting that he/GOD, for whom and by whom all things exist, in bringing many sons to glory, should make the pioneer/JESUS of their salvation perfect through suffering.
ROM 8:3 .....God sending his own Son in the likeness/homoioma of sinful flesh, .....:
Now I'll give another scripture with the same greek word and context.
PHI 2:7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness/homoioma of men:
I believe this "form" that Jesus had, means a sinful flesh/body just like us. That doesn't mean "likeness" means he looked exactly like me in the mirror.
Now produce ONE scripture to support your opinion. Or don't answer at all, and just accept a new truth in place of an old lie.
That foundation was changed with the Church of ROME. The foundation of the NT APOSTOLIC church was JESUS, and the foundation of the church of Rome was PETER. ROMAN influence reigned for 1500 years. I gu
Are you a ROMAN CATHOLIC? If not, then what denomination do you best fit in?
And if your 'are' or you 'aren't' a RC, briefly tell me what the doctrine of 'the Immaculate conception' is.
pandaflower
Well-Known Member
Jesus taught that those who are born again do not continue to sin because God's life is in them, making it impossible for them to live in sin as they did before. This concept is emphasized in 1 John 3:9, which states that anyone born of God does not practice sin.
Hillsage
Well-Known Member
NOT TRUE. When God made the FIRST ADAM out of dirt in west EDEN, He also made a bunch of other humans. Often referred in "THEOLOGY" circles as the PRE ADAMIC RACE. But they haven't got 'their theology' exactly right either IMO. Their view does help explain where CAIN and ABLE got their wives from though.
GEN 2:1* Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host/tsaba' of them.
6635 tsaba': a mass of persons (or fig. things),espec. reg. organized for war (an army); by impl. a campaign, lit. or fig. (spec. hardship, worship).
The Holy Spirit birthed all the spirits "that which is born of/FROM the Spirit is spirits." which were put into all those animal and humans. They all had been CREATED with UN-annointed spirits in them. IOW not smeared with annointing oil by God.
What made the first son of God, a son, was the FACT that the HOLY SPIRIT first re-birthed (born again) the spirit in "the FIRST MAN ADAM" of the ADAMIC RACE, and nobody else. God then planted a Garden in EAST EDEN. He then came back and took that first man ADAM out of the WORLD of UN-regenerated mankind/ADAMS and placed him in that GARDEN in EAST EDEN.
COL 1:15 He/JESUS is the image of the invisible God, the first-born of all creation;
16 for in him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or authorities -- all things were created through him and for him.
You verse above says nothing about Jesus being an angel who existed before the other angels. The first Adam was not born of a woman, his body was created from 'scratch dirt' along with "HOST". of mankind/ And all of that creation in Genesis came from the spoken WORD of God. The Father was invisible, the Word was invisible and the Holy Spirit was invisible. Because "GOD IS SPIRIT". But when God wanted to manifest VISIBLY to His creation He put the same spirit he put in ADAM in a body which came from GOD. And the WORD became FLESH in Mary with her seed giving Jesus a body/flesh. Then the Holy Spirit put an anointed christo spirit in Him FROM EL ELYON "the MOST HIGH GOD". The God who was higher than the ELOHIM God of creatioon. That's how the spirit WORD came to get the title THE SON OF MAN.
Yes, the spirit ADAM was created as having, was the same spirit as the "LIVING"/Chay CREATURES/Nephesh" and those same Hebrew words get translated as "LIVING/Chay SOUL/Nephesh" when applied to Adam. And that spirit from GOD birthed FROM The Holy Spirit, had to be BORN AGAIN before Adam was taken to the Garden. End of story....from the BIBLE and not tweaked JW theologians.
And you need to quit acting like another brother here who can't separate the LITERAL vs the SYMBOLIC interpretation of words like PNEUMA. God didn't blow oxygen into a dead body and make it breathe. He blew a spirit into his nostrils. That spirit animated that dead body. His dead brain became functioning and that living brain/soul/mind told the diaphragm to contract and inhale NOT A SPIRIT/Pneuma but OXYGEN like pneumatic tools run on. When scripture says "the Spirit bloweth LIKE a wind "it never said it WAS WIND. It was invisible LIKE the wind. And like the spirit of God who wanted to manifest his invisible spirit to a physical world.
When Jesus died on the cross He surrendered his holy spirit to the Father. And when that spirit left Jesus, his animating life force was gone. His brain died and then he "BREATHED HIS LAST". Unlike your belief that He quit breathing and then died. NOT BIBLICAL,
When Jesus raised the little girl from death, what did He do? CPR? No! "her spirit returned" Luk 8:55. She became alive because of her SPIRIT returning, not because Jesus blew a big wind up her nose.
The genealogy of Jesus in Matt was the genealogy of his spirit going back to Adam. But he genealogy of the BODY of Jesus in Luke, went through MARY and not Joseph.
Because the spirit of christ was first born as a spirit which was put in the man named ADAM. And it was 'that spirit' which made ADAM the first son of God. The first time the christos/anointed spirit was first born in a WOMAN was the second time their was a 'son of God' but only the first time that spirit was BORN IN A WOMAN of flesh.
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
I’m glad you mentioned that this “pre Adamic race” was from “theology”....because it is certainly not from the Bible, and makes no sense in the big picture. It makes a mockery of creation and Jesus’ role as redeemer.
I looked up this word and when it speaks of a “host” it was referring to all creation.....
“host (of organised army)
- host (of angels)
- of sun, moon, and stars
- of whole creation” (Strongs)
You purposely left out the other meanings of this word to suit your theology.
God told Isaiah....
“Lift up your eyes on high
And see who has created these stars,
The One who leads forth their host by number,
He calls them all by name;
Because of the greatness of His might and the strength of His power,
Not one of them is missing.”
All creation, including animals and humans, were exactly as God had created them to be....organised and programmed for life on this earth....when the Creator said that “everything was very good” at the completion of the 6th day, there were no other humans in existence...
In the story of creation, one of the first things Adam is reported as doing is naming the animals.
When God gave Adam a wife, immediately Adam called her “Woman” (’Ish·shahʹ, in Hebrew). Later, he gave her the name Eve, meaning “Living One,” because “she had to become the mother of everyone living.” (Gen 2:19; 3:20)
All the “host” were living “souls” in the Hebrew meaning of the word, (living, breathing creatures) not the meaning given it in church theology.
A “soul” is not a disembodied “spirit”. “Souls” are entirely earth-bound and mortal.
Say what?.....
And I will find this idea in what particular passage of the Bible?
There was no race apart from the Adamic race.....these were the first humans, who gave all their children an awful inherited condition called sin....and it was a terminal condition. Jesus came to rescue those afflicted children who were born in this condition through no fault on their part.
Col 1:15-18 states about Jesus......
“He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through Him and for Him. He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together. He is also head of the body, the church; and He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, so that He Himself will come to have first place in everything.” (NASB)
Care to explain how Jesus is the “firstborn of ALL CREATION”? He is “the beginning” not the beginner.....And how he is also “the firstborn from the dead so that he will come to have first place in everything”....this is future tense so how can this possibly pertain to God?
He was not the first one to be resurrected.
When God wanted to manifest visibly to man, he sent his angels to convey his will to his earthly servants because nothing sinful can come before the Holiest person in existence.
He appointed a “mediator” to act as a go between, so that sinful humans could still communicate with him they he with them. God cannot be one of the parties that the mediator is trying to reconcile.
Again...say what??? Where the heck do you get this stuff?! We tweaked nothing.....you have added to the story and taken it down a whole other path...there is nothing biblical in your version of things.Yes, the spirit ADAM was created as having, was the same spirit as the "LIVING"/Chay CREATURES/Nephesh" and those same Hebrew words get translated as "LIVING/Chay SOUL/Nephesh" when applied to Adam. And that spirit from GOD birthed FROM The Holy Spirit, had to be BORN AGAIN before Adam was taken to the Garden. End of story....from the BIBLE and not tweaked JW theologians.
No sorry.......the human Jesus died the same kind of death that Adam did, because that is why he was called “the last Adam”....he paid back what Adam forfeited for all his children.....everlasting life in paradise on earth. God’s law demanded equivalency....”an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, a life for a life”. Without the savior sent by God to rescue Adam’s children, there was no way out of the dilemma....sin and death would continue forever. Jesus paid the debt, and allowed Adam’s children to reclaim what their first parents lost.
Yes, her breath was returned, just like a paramedic doing CPR.....once the heart resumes beating, breathing is restored. There is nothing about any wind up her nose, but there is nothing like that said about Adam either....it was a gentle introduction to life, just as the raising of Jairus’ daughter was a simple awakening from “sleep” as Jesus said.
This is the “spirit” in man....”the breath of life” that made Adam a “soul”.
This is “the spirit that returns to God”.....because God is the only one who can restore the breath of life to those who come back in the resurrection.
That is so warped, I am shaking my head.....you have reinvented Genesis....and rewritten the entire Bible narrative. Who needed to do that....I wonder?
You decide, wouldn't all the scriptures be important?
Use any Bible translation you like.
Believe
John 3:16
John 10:27-28
Colossians 1:22-23a
Acts 16:30, 31
1 John 2:2
Knowledge or Know
John 17:3
1 John 5:20
2 Timothy 3:15
1 Timothy 2:3, 4.
Psalm 79:6
Repent
Acts 3:19
Acts 26:20.
Acts 2:38
Matthew 3:2
Matthew 4:17
Get baptized
Matthew 28:19
Acts 2: 38, 40, 41
Acts 8:36-38
1 Peter 3:21
Mark 16:16
Acts 10:47-48
Obey Jesus and God's instructions in the Bible
Hebrews 5:9
Matthew 28:20
2 Thessalonians 1:8-9
John 3:36
John 14:15
Luke 8:21
Matthew 7:24
Romans 2:8
Acts 5:29
1 John 5:3
Matthew 19:17
James 1:22
Endure to the end
Mark 13:13
Hebrews 10:36
1 Corinthians 9:27
James 5:11
Romans 8:13
James 1:2-4
Last edited:
Hillsage
Well-Known Member
1JO 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.Jesus taught that those who are born again do not continue to sin because God's life is in them, making it impossible for them to live in sin as they did before. This concept is emphasized in 1 John 3:9, which states that anyone born of God does not practice sin.Bible Hub
renner.org
I made a major edit to this post Pandaflower: I would just like to apologize for what was written, but still correct you for saying that Jesus taught this verse. This verse was taught by John. But the point I believe you were trying to make was that the possibility for us to NOT SIN is supported with this verse. And I do agree with you if that's your opinion.
Last edited:
pandaflower
Well-Known Member
I've met Christians who will insist they're still sinners needing forgiveness.This verse was always a problem in my early years when people fought over it because that one extra word, which you used was never quoted. That word was "PRACTICE" sin. And it wasn't quoted because no translation ever said 'those who PRACTICE SIN.'
KJV 1JO 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and
RSV 1JO 3:9 No one born of God commits sin; for God's nature abides in him, and he cannot sin because he is born of God.
NAS 1JO 3:9 No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
YLT 1JO 3:9 every one who hath been begotten of God, sin he doth not, because his seed in him doth remain, and he is not able to sin, because of God he hath been begotten.
But that changed when the Nearly Inspired Translation came out in 1976. I was born again in 1972, and refused then and now, to believe that nobody ever got it right before the NIV.
NIV 1JO 3:9 No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in him; he cannot go on sinning, because he has been born of God.
I do my own study and interpreting because I believe 1Joh mandates that.
1JO 2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.
Otherwise you are going to be indoctrinated or brainwashed by the theologians who have taught so many lies that we have 40,000 (+-) denominations all believing that 'they' are right and 'everybody else is WRONG. Welcome to the NON CHRISTIAN church of the world today.
So, who HERE wants to tell, ME and all of us ,your theological REASON for why "PRACTICE SIN" and "cannot go on sinning," are your 'confessions' and 'scriptural belief' too.
IF anyone here can do that, I may just have to come back and tell you why YOU'RE ALL BELIEVING WRONG.....In My Humble Opinion, of course.
Sad.
The point of the scripture as I see it is to let us know,now that we are conscious of the Spirit and his communication,we know not to wilfully sin.
This is contrary to the anti-Christ rhetoric enemies of the cross use in claiming we can wilfully sin and be OK.
We make mistakes but we know that.
Hillsage
Well-Known Member
I can't believe you posted your last post while I was editing it to you.
I agree. But I also have had patients whose denomination teach that this verse means you have lost your 'born again' salvation of their spirit. So they either have to go to the altar again to get SAVED again or go to Hell. They don't want to do that, so they have a tendency to explain away their sins as not really being sin. Also sad.
I believe that 'willfully sinning' or not, is not the point of the verse. Is that what you're intimating? I believe it's saying a "CHRISTIAN" will not sin. I also believe this verse is poorly translated when it says "Whosoever/Whoever/No one" as the first word of the verse.
1JO 3:9* Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
Last edited:
Similar threads
