Earburner
Well-Known Member
Hebrews 11 is a very good read about the Faith that God GIVES to those who are willing to abandon themselves to the complete will of God, without reservation, or presumption!
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Simple answer: You and most professing Christians are living/following after a false form of faith, that your own fleshly minded is fabricating and gennerating.
If Jesus is Living within you, in the Person of the Holy Spirit (His Mind), He has brought with Him His OWN Faith, and has nothing to do with the type of faith that your human mind is conjuring up.
The Faith of Jesus (Revelation 14:12), is to simply trust in God, NO MATTER where He leads you, and/or what the circumstances are. It is one of the GIFTS OF His Holy Spirit.
1 Corinthians 12[7] But the manifestation of the Spirit IS GIVEN TO EVERY man [in Christ] to profit withal.
[8] For TO ONE IS GIVEN BY the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
[9] TO ANOTHER [is given] FAITH by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
[10] To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:....
Three thumbs up on this post!Your answer is nauseating to me. It is Pharisaical and legalistic. You are using Scriptures which are true, but you are not speaking the truth. Where was Jesus faith when He asked, "...Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me...." (Matt. 26:39) Or when His soul was depressed to death? "...My soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death...." (Matt. 26:39) Or on the cross when He questioned why God had forsaken Him? (Matt. 27:46)
Faith is not in the absence of these troubles we are forced to endure. It is in the midst of them when they overwhelm us even, as our experience is important. The faith you describe seems unreal and shallow. It is so victorious through trial because you seem to not even experience the trials. It is my opinion that if you have not been brought to the place as described by many in this thread, then your faith has not been tested.
I have often pictured this in my imagination concerning God and Christ and the trials He sends and my response. Again just my thoughts.
God the Father says: 'Lets give ole Stranger a trial to test his faith.
Christ the Son says: 'Sounds good, he needs it'
The Trial is sent, and a very grievous one at that.
Stranger responds: 'This is a hard trial but I am going to go through it victoriously, doubting nothing' And so I do.
The Father says to the Son: 'I don't think it's doing any good'
The Son says: 'I know, We are going to have to increase the pressure' Trial grows worse.
Stranger responds: 'I'm not sure why Lord, but I am going to trust you through this' And so I continue.
The Father says to the Son: 'Still not getting anywhere'
The Son says: 'I know...more pressure' Trial increases in severity
Stranger says: 'God what are You doing to me? Are You even paying attention to what is happening? Where are You when I need You?
The Father says to the Son: 'We are getting somewhere now'
The Son says: 'Yes, now we will see his faith'
I am aware of the verse (1Cor. 10:13) "...God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able:..." And I believe it. But I also know that what I perceive myself able to bear, and what God sees me able to bear, are very different.
Stranger
I am not the one who associates faith with the fictional story of "Pilgrim's Progress", nor do I fantasize of HOW I should think that God shall test me!Your answer is nauseating to me. It is Pharisaical and legalistic. You are using Scriptures which are true, but you are not speaking the truth. Where was Jesus faith when He asked, "...Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me...." (Matt. 26:39) Or when His soul was depressed to death? "...My soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death...." (Matt. 26:39) Or on the cross when He questioned why God had forsaken Him? (Matt. 27:46)
Faith is not in the absence of these troubles we are forced to endure. It is in the midst of them when they overwhelm us even, as our experience is important. The faith you describe seems unreal and shallow. It is so victorious through trial because you seem to not even experience the trials. It is my opinion that if you have not been brought to the place as described by many in this thread, then your faith has not been tested.
I have often pictured this in my imagination concerning God and Christ and the trials He sends and my response. Again just my thoughts.
God the Father says: 'Lets give ole Stranger a trial to test his faith.
Christ the Son says: 'Sounds good, he needs it'
The Trial is sent, and a very grievous one at that.
Stranger responds: 'This is a hard trial but I am going to go through it victoriously, doubting nothing' And so I do.
The Father says to the Son: 'I don't think it's doing any good'
The Son says: 'I know, We are going to have to increase the pressure' Trial grows worse.
Stranger responds: 'I'm not sure why Lord, but I am going to trust you through this' And so I continue.
The Father says to the Son: 'Still not getting anywhere'
The Son says: 'I know...more pressure' Trial increases in severity
Stranger says: 'God what are You doing to me? Are You even paying attention to what is happening? Where are You when I need You?
The Father says to the Son: 'We are getting somewhere now'
The Son says: 'Yes, now we will see his faith'
I am aware of the verse (1Cor. 10:13) "...God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able:..." And I believe it. But I also know that what I perceive myself able to bear, and what God sees me able to bear, are very different.
Stranger
Three thumbs down on your comment, because you also lack spiritual discernment. Which btw, is also a characteristic and GIFT of the Holy Spirit.Three thumbs up on this post!
I have to laugh at this. Sorry if it offends you to say this.Three thumbs down on your comment, because you also lack spiritual discernment. Which btw, is also a characteristic and GIFT of the Holy Spirit.
1 Corinthians 12:10
Your answer is nauseating to me. It is Pharisaical and legalistic. You are using Scriptures which are true, but you are not speaking the truth. Where was Jesus faith when He asked, "...Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me...." (Matt. 26:39) Or when His soul was depressed to death? "...My soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death...." (Matt. 26:39) Or on the cross when He questioned why God had forsaken Him? (Matt. 27:46)
Faith is not in the absence of these troubles we are forced to endure. It is in the midst of them when they overwhelm us even, as our experience is important. The faith you describe seems unreal and shallow. It is so victorious through trial because you seem to not even experience the trials. It is my opinion that if you have not been brought to the place as described by many in this thread, then your faith has not been tested.
I have often pictured this in my imagination concerning God and Christ and the trials He sends and my response. Again just my thoughts.
God the Father says: 'Lets give ole Stranger a trial to test his faith.
Christ the Son says: 'Sounds good, he needs it'
The Trial is sent, and a very grievous one at that.
Stranger responds: 'This is a hard trial but I am going to go through it victoriously, doubting nothing' And so I do.
The Father says to the Son: 'I don't think it's doing any good'
The Son says: 'I know, We are going to have to increase the pressure' Trial grows worse.
Stranger responds: 'I'm not sure why Lord, but I am going to trust you through this' And so I continue.
The Father says to the Son: 'Still not getting anywhere'
The Son says: 'I know...more pressure' Trial increases in severity
Stranger says: 'God what are You doing to me? Are You even paying attention to what is happening? Where are You when I need You?
The Father says to the Son: 'We are getting somewhere now'
The Son says: 'Yes, now we will see his faith'
I am aware of the verse (1Cor. 10:13) "...God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able:..." And I believe it. But I also know that what I perceive myself able to bear, and what God sees me able to bear, are very different.
Stranger
I have to laugh at this. Sorry if it offends you to say this.
Perhaps you haven't been crushed to pieces by God. Perhaps it's coming. He will do this if He desires to use you in ways you never even imagined. But know that the grain isn't crushed forever (Is 28:28)--only til it's made usable.
God bless you, Earburner! I pray that you will know that God loves you, even if He tests you beyond your own strength and discernment!
dang stranger, that was...impactful, is the word comes to mind. def a zinger imo broYour answer is nauseating to me. It is Pharisaical and legalistic. You are using Scriptures which are true, but you are not speaking the truth. Where was Jesus faith when He asked, "...Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me...." (Matt. 26:39) Or when His soul was depressed to death? "...My soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death...." (Matt. 26:39) Or on the cross when He questioned why God had forsaken Him? (Matt. 27:46)
Faith is not in the absence of these troubles we are forced to endure. It is in the midst of them when they overwhelm us even, as our experience is important. The faith you describe seems unreal and shallow. It is so victorious through trial because you seem to not even experience the trials. It is my opinion that if you have not been brought to the place as described by many in this thread, then your faith has not been tested.
I have often pictured this in my imagination concerning God and Christ and the trials He sends and my response. Again just my thoughts.
God the Father says: 'Lets give ole Stranger a trial to test his faith.
Christ the Son says: 'Sounds good, he needs it'
The Trial is sent, and a very grievous one at that.
Stranger responds: 'This is a hard trial but I am going to go through it victoriously, doubting nothing' And so I do.
The Father says to the Son: 'I don't think it's doing any good'
The Son says: 'I know, We are going to have to increase the pressure' Trial grows worse.
Stranger responds: 'I'm not sure why Lord, but I am going to trust you through this' And so I continue.
The Father says to the Son: 'Still not getting anywhere'
The Son says: 'I know...more pressure' Trial increases in severity
Stranger says: 'God what are You doing to me? Are You even paying attention to what is happening? Where are You when I need You?
The Father says to the Son: 'We are getting somewhere now'
The Son says: 'Yes, now we will see his faith'
I am aware of the verse (1Cor. 10:13) "...God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able:..." And I believe it. But I also know that what I perceive myself able to bear, and what God sees me able to bear, are very different.
Stranger
it was maybe a little harsh up top but wadr i would try to ignore that and absorb the point down lower if you can. I dont agree with stranger too much fwiw lolThree thumbs down on your comment, because you also lack spiritual discernment. Which btw, is also a characteristic and GIFT of the Holy Spirit.
1 Corinthians 12:10
And the whole point of Him working in us is to erradicate our feeble human faith, so as to install HIS FAITH, whereby we will be able to FULLY trust God the Father, as Jesus did. Job 13:15.I'm glad that you posted that because I too have been crushed to pieces by God. I recall reading about a pastor who said he was pushed to the brink of despair and broken down until "nothing was left."
These struggles are real. The pastor of a church that we attended was very good at opening up Scripture. The church was legalistic so we left. We bumped into someone who still attends and she told us the pastor's wife committed suicide.
So some trials drive us to beyond what we think we can bear. And some take a way out. So I question where was God? I've been pushed to the point of thinking of escaping. I was injured badly due to a company's mistake. I am in pain 24/7 and have to bear the results of it that are very hard to live with. Sometimes I think of taking the way out. I know I'll be in paradise and these horrid trials done with. I've "despaired of life" as Paul did.
"For we would not, brethren, have you ignorant of our trouble which came to us in Asia, that we were pressed out of measure, above strength, insomuch that we despaired even of life."
And the whole point of Him working in us is to erradicate our feeble human faith, so as to install HIS FAITH, whereby we will be able to FULLY trust God the Father, as Jesus did. Job 13:15.
As I did say:
The Faith of Jesus (Revelation 14:12), is to simply trust in God, NO MATTER where He leads you, and/or what the circumstances are. It is one of the GIFTS OF His Holy Spirit.
1 Corinthians 12
That is what our pain and suffering (chastisement) is all about. Are we in that state of mind as was Job?
Only by the the Lord's Gift faith, being that of Jesus' own faith, are we able to endure all suffering, even persecution unto death.
My dear sister, I pray that God will fill you with His hope, peace, and joy!I'm glad that you posted that because I too have been crushed to pieces by God. I recall reading about a pastor who said he was pushed to the brink of despair and broken down until "nothing was left."
These struggles are real. The pastor of a church that we attended was very good at opening up Scripture. The church was legalistic so we left. We bumped into someone who still attends and she told us the pastor's wife committed suicide.
So some trials drive us to beyond what we think we can bear. And some take a way out. So I question where was God? I've been pushed to the point of thinking of escaping. I was injured badly due to a company's mistake. I am in pain 24/7 and have to bear the results of it that are very hard to live with. Sometimes I think of taking the way out. I know I'll be in paradise and these horrid trials done with. I've "despaired of life" as Paul did.
"For we would not, brethren, have you ignorant of our trouble which came to us in Asia, that we were pressed out of measure, above strength, insomuch that we despaired even of life."
As I previously said:I honestly have to say that I don't know what He's doing - I try to get to the point of thinking that He must be working something out. Yet it's very hard to sustain that thought when your body or mind is screaming in pain and you cry out for relief and none comes. The only thing that comes is another day...full of trials.
God did encourage me with answered prayer: I had a looooooong time of beating on heaven's door, crying, fasting - and finally the answer came. So God did give me an answer there; it still hasn't fully sunk in. Yet I'm still waiting on other answers and it's grueling because I don't know if He's going to answer and the waiting and waiting and waiting and praying, praying, praying all gets wearying.
God knows I'm not one to handle pain well and He sees fit to give it to me - and that's hard. The sustaining of beliefs that God is working something is hard.
I don't believe that He eradicates our faith. I believe He strengthens it as we exercise our faith muscle by choosing to believe what He has said even when our eyes see the opposite and our hearts are breaking.As I previously said:
And the whole point of Him working in us, is to erradicate our feeble human faith, so as to install HIS FAITH, whereby we will be able to FULLY trust God the Father, as Jesus did.
KJV- Job 13[15] Though he slay me, yet will I trust in him: but I will maintain mine own ways before him.
Do you honestly believe your human faith is equal to the faith of Jesus, the Son of God from Heaven!I don't believe that He eradicates our faith. I believe He strengthens it as we exercise our faith muscle by choosing to believe what He has said even when our eyes see the opposite and our hearts are breaking.