Taken
Well-Known Member
Those “IN” Christ… is True, they can sin no more.
You should Learn “Why” … Before preaching Denial of Gods Word.
Glory to God,
Taken
When Jesus "took away" your sin, did He leave behind the source, the sin nature?
- Thread starter 1stCenturyLady
- Start date
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
Those “IN” Christ… is True, they can sin no more.
You should Learn “Why” … Before preaching Denial of Gods Word.
Glory to God,
Taken
Yes, believing a truth in the Bible is more of a catalyst to change than believing a false doctrine about sin and winding up with a big surprise when you die and where you are, in total darkness where the demon of that false doctrine wants you, instead of seeing the face of Jesus. Keep abiding in Jesus because it is He that will change you, not you yourself. We can't change ourselves; that is not repentance. Confess your weaknesses to Jesus with integrity of heart like the publican, not leaving out any of the nasty details that you find you can't change and like too much to even want to change. Only He can take away the desire out of your nature, by cleansing your whole nature. Once you have a new nature, He starts on the fruit.
I don't know where you are in this complete process. Know this truth also. There are two types of sins in God's eyes that we see in our schoolmaster, the Old Testament. Sins that break a commandment of God, like mine - adultery. Those are willful and sins unto death. They stoned adulterers under the Old Covenant. Breaking one command, breaks the whole law of God. So when our nature is born again, ALL commandments will be abhorrent to you to break, not just the one making you actually righteous with the righteousness Christ had who was sinless. Sins unto death are not a process, but taken care of all at once at the born again experience.
Not so for the second type of sins, trespasses unintentionally committed, Lev. 5:15 sins NOT unto death, 1 John 5:16-17. Those are weaknesses, immaturities in the fruit of the Spirit. These Jesus takes care of one at a time, but cleanses those unintentionally committed while you are walking in the Spirit, 1 John 1:7. Dealing with people on the forums is a great place to be for these, especially if you live alone like I do, and study the Bible only, not bothered with false doctrines in denominations. I found that I don't deal with people the same way I did, say, a year ago. Where I was weak, now I'm strong. But then a different fruit pops up to be matured. This second process is the process of glorification, not sanctification when becoming righteous all at once and set apart. 1 Corinthians 6:11. Romans 8:29-30, becoming like Jesus with the glory He gives us now, John 17:20-23. Of course, there is another false doctrine on glorification, that we will not be glorified at all because it has to do with our dead body becoming new. No! Our body didn't have to be born again now while it lives because sin is from within, not from outside. Our triune personhood is made up of spirit, soul and body, 1 Thes. 5:23. They are our mind, heart and body. Only our mind and heart are born again now and are eternal, because they are the puppet masters of the body which cannot sin on its own. It will be changed later with a body suitable for eternity.
We don't actually know whether Adam said that to Eve, if Eve came up with it herself, or where exactly that part came from.
These are the kinds of blanks people like to fill in as they create their false teachings. They can say this or that, whatever seems to support their error.
Much love!
Look at how she addresses others, and then compare this to the fruit of the Spirit.
Much love!
Davy
Well-Known Member
I'm not the one in denial.
We are to 'reckon' Apostle Paul says in Romans 6:11 to be dead unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ. That 'reckon' idea means we still CAN... sin if we walk by our flesh. Paul didn't just make one little ole' statement that those in Christ can no longer sin; he went further into detail how he meant it...
Rom 6:12-19
12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
You mean we can still fall... to the lusts in our "mortal body" if we're not careful? What body is that? Our FLESH body, not some philosophical mumbo-jumbo. Satan glorifies the flesh because it is imperfect and cannot inherit the kingdom of God (1 Cor.15:49-50). Our flesh body is temporary and is only for this present imperfect world. As long as we are in it our spirit/soul is subject to the law of sin in its members.
14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
And that is one hundred percent right, because IF... we walk by The Spirit, we won't be breaking any of God's laws and will not sin. But Who only born in the flesh could do that??
15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.
19 I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.
KJV
That above verse right there is Paul saying make a choice. Now yield your members as servants to righteousness unto holiness. That is Paul admonishing the brethren to not sin. He didn't say it's now impossible to not have sin, he said yield our "members" (flesh) to righteousness and holiness.
Taken
Well-Known Member
Not sure why you react as you reacted.
The command was given to Adam, Eve was not yet created.
And yet Eve showed knowledge, but added something God never said.
I did not say that added information came from Adam, but he certainly was responsible to correct his wife.
Someone who is finally born again of the Spirit. I went to church for 30 years before I was born again of the Spirit and lost the desire to commit sins against the commandments of God. That makes us righteous/sinless, but not holy/perfect. Next, comes the long process of maturing in all of the fruit of the Spirit one at a time towards perfection. It is these small imperfections that made Paul say he wasn't perfect yet, but his last letter implied he finally made it.
For someone who doesn't want ad hominems against you, you don't think your rules apply to yourself. What a hypocrite.
Behold
Well-Known Member
Paul uses the word "flesh" in various ways.
For example........a believer, can "fall from GRACE" ( See Gal 3 & 5) = "they are in the flesh".
And Paul details that this person is trying to do good works and keep law and commandments to try to maintain God's acceptance, and this is 100% because they are become deceived by the false understanding that to try to do that is "Salvation". or "Keeping myself saved".
Paul refers to this one as "bewitched"... and "in the Flesh"., and defines most of them as ministers for the devil.
Paul is explaining and defining and exposing = the carnal mind in the Christian. and labels it as : "in the FLESH".
The way you can spot these deceived people.....is that they believe they can lose their Salvation, and will try to prove it.
And the reason they do this is because they are "in the flesh"... "carnally minded"... and have lost real faith in Christ tho they will pretend they still have it.
But as soon as you ask them.......>"what keeps you saved".....they will start with "WORKS" and "LAW".. "and commandment keeping", and "confessing sin".... and then try to misuse 2-4 bible verses to try to falsely prove that God's GIFT OF SALVATION , can be lost.
So, reader, never listen to anyone on a forum, or in a pulpit, or a TV Minister or a commentary writer, who believes that they can lose their Salvation........as THAT ONE has no real faith in Christ and is ACTING...They are a PRETENDER....they are a FAKE......and they will try to "sound spiritual" when they teach their deceptive theology while often posting many verses on a "christian forum"... that they can't explain if you really put them to the test, and ive put thousands to the test and they all perfectly fail, every time.
You MUST Learn to HEAR THEM on a Forum, and on a TV and on a RADIO and in a Youtube video., and then avoid them as they are going to try to lead you astray, exactly as they have been led astray, as that is their : dark ministry.
Last edited:
I'm just pointing out that the text does not tell us where that additional wording originated, whether with Eve, or Adam (the first "fence law"?), or another source. Where Scripture is silent we should likewise remain silent, unless we are prefacing that something is purely our own speculation.
Much love!
You are deflecting away from what I've said. Apparently you are unwilling to consider this truth, that you're postings simply do not show the fruit of the Spirit in them. It's nothing to do with me, I'm just your current excuse. You proclaim yourself sinless yet you show the truth of yourself in your words. Everyone does. Everyone is revealed in their words. You can hear this, or you can ignore it, your chose. The Spirit says come.
Like a child you close your eyes, open them.
Behold
Well-Known Member
Reader,
If you have a bible, then read Romans 7, sometime.
Paul is teaching that when you try to earn Salvation or Keep it.........by trying to "be like Christ" or "do good" or "resist sin" by will power, then all that happens is your carnality becomes inflamed by THE LAW, which is why this desire for sin, along with seeing more of your own sinfulness gets WORSE and WORSE..... inside your HEAD...never to be resolved.........unless................
--------------------------........... = So, this is the part of Romans 7 where Paul is trying to keep the law and commandments, initially believing that he could......and he couldn't at all.
And that is when he found out that The power of sin is the LAW........which created him to be like this......>>"that which i want to do, i can't and that whichi hate, that i do"..
THEN, as we read the rest of Romans 7, we find that Paul discovered the solution and said.......teaches.......ROMANS 7:5......that by being "IN CHRIST"....>>He found deliverance...... complete, and lasting.
Later he also wrote....>"Christ ALWAYS gives me the VICTORY">.. over sin, the flesh, and the world and the devil.
And reader, this victory is not found by SELF EFFORT........its only found by RIGHT FAITH.
And all Paul had to do, was stop trying to DO His Salvation, and instead relax inside God's GRACE by understanding this.....
= 1.) "Christ has redeemed us from the CURSE OF THE LAW".........>2.) "Christ is the END OF THE LAW for RIGHTEOUSNESS"....
3.) "Christ is the ONE TIME ETERNAL SACRIFICE for SIN">..
See those 3 reader?
That is Jesus taking MOSES LAW and 10 Commandents off of you, with His Blood and Death, and in its place, you find GOD's GRACE that has replaced all of that for you.........and now you exist HERE.......(if you are truly born again, and not just water baptized and religiious)......
= A.) = The Born again....>"" are NOT UNDER THE LAW, but under GRACE""............So, once Paul's mind became "under Grace"... then the Law could not touch His mind with condemnation or guilt or judgement.......and the wonder of this REAL FAITH, is that it totally empowers you to live HOLY.....whereas when you were trying to do it by Law and Self Effort, you couldn't .
Last edited:
King David committed murder (by proxy) and adultery, which are serious sins punishable by death in the Old Testament.
But God forgave David, and called him “a man after my own heart.”
You would think if anyone could live in “sinless perfection”, and never have any desire to commit a sin unto death, it would be David. But we are told that even this great believer could willfully commit horrible sins, then sincerely repent in remorse and sorrow.
Jesus said not only is adultery sinful, but so is lusting in your heart. Not only is murder sinful, but so is anger.
To think you never have any desire to commit big willful sin, and only commit little sins “accidentally” due to being immature in Spirit, is error. This unbiblical attitude leads to holier than thou arrogance and feeling superior to “less spiritual” believers.
Do not be fooled by such false doctrines.
We must struggle constantly against random and deliberate sinful thoughts. By our own fleshly strength and keeping the law, we cannot triumph over inner evil. We must rely on God’s Spirit working in us by grace through faith.
We must mortify, we must reckon dead. God will not just remove our flesh / old man / sin nature.
Romans 8:13
For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
Romans 6:11
Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
But God forgave David, and called him “a man after my own heart.”
You would think if anyone could live in “sinless perfection”, and never have any desire to commit a sin unto death, it would be David. But we are told that even this great believer could willfully commit horrible sins, then sincerely repent in remorse and sorrow.
Jesus said not only is adultery sinful, but so is lusting in your heart. Not only is murder sinful, but so is anger.
To think you never have any desire to commit big willful sin, and only commit little sins “accidentally” due to being immature in Spirit, is error. This unbiblical attitude leads to holier than thou arrogance and feeling superior to “less spiritual” believers.
Do not be fooled by such false doctrines.
We must struggle constantly against random and deliberate sinful thoughts. By our own fleshly strength and keeping the law, we cannot triumph over inner evil. We must rely on God’s Spirit working in us by grace through faith.
We must mortify, we must reckon dead. God will not just remove our flesh / old man / sin nature.
Romans 8:13
For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
Romans 6:11
Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Personally I think the one who considers themself sinless is going beyond what the Bible speaks concerning us.
Paul wrote that even though he didn't know anything against himself, that didn't mean everything he did was right, only Jesus is qualified to judge us. (I Cor 4)
We don't know ourselves well enough.
What we cannot see, those around us often do. So when we make these claims, we risk being shown false. I'm of the mind that those who walk in the Spirit don't go around promoting them selves.
Much love!
If you are finished with your ad hominems, let me teach you again because you've not repeated what I teach in your scorn, I don't commit sins unto death; I can't. The desire for them were cleansed when my nature was cleansed. But I do commit sins not unto death, especially frustration with those who do not give Jesus credit that He has made them just as sinless/righteous as He's made me at a time in my life when I couldn't stop myself from sinning. In fact, they scorn the doctrine of sinless perfection, even though Jesus preached it. But I've never heard anyone preach that in my life, except maybe I have come the closest, but I sure have seen people taught to scorn it. Are you still ignorant of the difference between sinlessness and perfection? It is the same difference between righteousness and holiness and there are verses that support the differences. Even Catholics who went off the rails in idolatry know the difference between the two types of sins. Most Protestants believe "sin is sin" period. They also believe their past, present and future sins unto death are forgiven, though they aren't smart enough to know only our past sins unto death were taken away when born again. Present and future sins that are cleansed after that are only unintentional sins not unto death, not willful sins but they are ignorant of that crucial factor.
Sinlessness is not perfection. Sinlessness is righteousness not holiness and only deals with sins unto death. Holiness would be sinless perfection of both types of sins, but that would be late in life when you are not only free from sins unto death from the point of being born again, and Jesus has also finished maturing ALL the fruit of the Spirit, and only He knows when He is finished. I do not think I'm perfect by any means, but only Jesus knows is my righteous indignation is a sin, but I doubt it as Jesus was filled with it when He turned over the tables of the money changers.
Last edited:
According to the New Testament, when Jesus “took away” sin, He dealt with both the guilt of sin and the power of sin — but the sin nature (the flesh) is not removed from the believer in this life. Instead, it is crucified, rendered powerless, and no longer your master, though it still exists until resurrection.
What Jesus actually removed
• The guilt of sin — “There is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus” (Romans 8:1).
• The penalty of sin — “He bore our sins in His body on the tree” (1 Peter 2:24).
• The dominion of sin — “Sin shall not have dominion over you” (Romans 6:14).
These are objective, completed realities.
What Jesus did not remove (yet)
Scripture is clear that the sin nature (the flesh) still exists in believers:
• Paul says, “I see another law in my members warring against the law of my mind” (Romans 7:23).
• He warns believers not to “let sin reign in your mortal body” (Romans 6:12).
• He says the flesh and Spirit “are in conflict” (Galatians 5:17).
If the sin nature were gone, none of these warnings would make sense.
So what changed?
The New Testament teaches that the sin nature is:
• Crucified (Romans 6:6)
• Rendered powerless (same verse: “that the body of sin might be destroyed,” meaning deprived of power)
• No longer your master (Romans 6:14)
• Opposed by the Spirit (Galatians 5:16–18)
But it is not eradicated until resurrection (Romans 8:23).
The best way to summarize it
Jesus removed the condemnation of sin and broke the power of sin,
but the presence of sin remains until glorification.
This is why believers can still struggle — but not as slaves.
What Jesus actually removed
• The guilt of sin — “There is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus” (Romans 8:1).
• The penalty of sin — “He bore our sins in His body on the tree” (1 Peter 2:24).
• The dominion of sin — “Sin shall not have dominion over you” (Romans 6:14).
These are objective, completed realities.
What Jesus did not remove (yet)
Scripture is clear that the sin nature (the flesh) still exists in believers:
• Paul says, “I see another law in my members warring against the law of my mind” (Romans 7:23).
• He warns believers not to “let sin reign in your mortal body” (Romans 6:12).
• He says the flesh and Spirit “are in conflict” (Galatians 5:17).
If the sin nature were gone, none of these warnings would make sense.
So what changed?
The New Testament teaches that the sin nature is:
• Crucified (Romans 6:6)
• Rendered powerless (same verse: “that the body of sin might be destroyed,” meaning deprived of power)
• No longer your master (Romans 6:14)
• Opposed by the Spirit (Galatians 5:16–18)
But it is not eradicated until resurrection (Romans 8:23).
The best way to summarize it
Jesus removed the condemnation of sin and broke the power of sin,
but the presence of sin remains until glorification.
This is why believers can still struggle — but not as slaves.
Last edited:
King David lived in the Old Covenant of the Law and is called the ministry of death. Our covenant is much more powerful than the old covenant. It is the ministry of the Holy Spirit and the blood of Jesus who does not just cover sins as in David's time, but takes it away, and then on top of that gives us the indwelling of the Spirit of God to prevent us from committing the type of sins David committed. 1 John 3:9 NKJV, not the corrupted modern versions.
Similar threads
