When lust is conceived

[WalterandDebbie]

Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death. James 1:15

 

[Windmill Charge]

And your comment or thoughts on this are..................?

 

[WalterandDebbie]

And your comment or thoughts on this are..................?

A person can easly have a desire for something/anything, but it don't have to be a sinful nature to indulge, or to lust after.

 

[Helen]

Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death. James 1:15

Yep...that is what it says...
....but, I need more thoughts here...for me to comment upon. :)

 

[WalterandDebbie]

Yep...that is what it says...
....but, I need more thoughts here...for me to comment upon. :)

Hi Helen, The passage: Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

To me it is like, being married and wanting to have somebody else wife or husband, or like a person just not having enough of something.

 

[Helen]

Hi Helen, The passage: Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

To me it is like, being married and wanting to have somebody else wife or husband, or like a person just not having enough of something.

This scripture always takes me back to the Garden.
The Serpent knew the power of lust. He knew that Eve lusting was not going to be enough.
She saw the tree was good for knowledge...she was getting hooked by him..but still not sinning. But when she ate of what was being offered..(wisdom)..she had fallen...she had conceived the lie.
The lie that she was not already complete in her relationship with God.
The Deceiver told her that there was more... she bought the lie.

I lust chocolate very often... eating it is only sin if I had been given a law by God, not to eat it.
Praise God, temptation is not sin. :)

 

[WalterandDebbie]

This scripture always takes me back to the Garden.
The Serpent knew the power of lust. He knew that Eve lusting was not going to be enough.
She saw the tree was good for knowledge...she was getting hooked by him..but still not sinning. But when she ate of what was being offered..(wisdom)..she had fallen...she had conceived the lie.
The lie that she was not already complete in her relationship with God.
The Deceiver told her that there was more... she bought the lie.

I lust chocolate very often... eating it is only sin if I had been given a law by God, not to eat it.
Praise God, temptation is not sin. :)

You are correct in the above, But I would say that "I shall not want" anything that is of a sinful nature. And what about you? since it is a personal relationship with our creator from the garden.

Purpose and Concluding Remarks: 1 John 5:13-21

13These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. 14And this is the confidence that we have in him, that, if we ask any thing according to his will, he heareth us: 15And if we know that he hear us, whatsoever we ask, we know that we have the petitions that we desired of him.

16If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it. 17All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death.

18We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not. 19And we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness. 20And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

21Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen.

 

[Blessed15]

This scripture always takes me back to the Garden.
The Serpent knew the power of lust. He knew that Eve lusting was not going to be enough.
She saw the tree was good for knowledge...she was getting hooked by him..but still not sinning. But when she ate of what was being offered..(wisdom)..she had fallen...she had conceived the lie.
The lie that she was not already complete in her relationship with God.
The Deceiver told her that there was more... she bought the lie.

I lust chocolate very often... eating it is only sin if I had been given a law by God, not to eat it.
Praise God, temptation is not sin. :)

So I am linking your response to marriage. Any spouse who cheats on their spouse have accepted the lie ''that they do not have a complete relationship with their spouse''. They think that they will get the ''missing links'' outside marriage.

 

[WalterandDebbie]

This type of lust goes for women/girls also, and Jesus said:
But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart. I don't think it means that a person has done the act, but it does have the awareness of the act before it happen.

There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

1 Corinthians 10:13

The above is the reason why each party male and female must keep his/Jesus commandments. John 14:15

 

[Helen]

This type of lust goes for women/girls also, and Jesus said:
But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart. I don't think it means that a person has done the act, but it does have the awareness of the act before it happen.

There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

1 Corinthians 10:13

The above is the reason why each party male and female must keep his/Jesus commandments. John 14:15

Well then "lets talk " :)
I do not agree. Hows that for starters ha!!

Anyway..you said..quote...Jesus said:-
"But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart."
< I don't think it means that a person has done the act, but it does have the awareness of the act before it happen. >

So here you go and contradict what is written !!! How come?
You either believe what you quoted of Jesus words, or you don't.;)

You go on and say :- ( after quoting you other scripture) <The above is the reason why each party male and female must keep his/Jesus commandments.>

Now that sounds a wee bit confusing to me. :)

I will tell you now how I see those scriptures...and then you can either keep your confusion or see it in a different light :)
... I never try and push my beliefs on other people!!
I do NOT believe what Jesus says in what is called the Sermon on the Mount is what people say that he is saying!! He give the answer in this verse below..He Himself is the answer to the problem.

Matt 5:18 "For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled." ( now did you ever read the words where Jesus says :- "It is Finished" )

" For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven." ( okay how is that working for you? )
Ye have heard that it was said of them of old time, Thou shalt not kill...
But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry .....
Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart. etc etc"

Now what I believe Jesus is doing here is showing them, and us who follow..that man cannot keep the law!! Just like God took 4000 years to showed Israel of old, that they could not attain to holiness by keeping the law..
Jesus said in the very same chapter of "The Sermon On The Mount"...just a few verses before your quote. v 17 "Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil."
And now we see it again...from your quoted verse on adultery etc the word.."FULFILL"
He was standing there before them on the mount...He'd just said I come to fulfil ...but He knew they were steeped in the law and works...so here He shows them how ridiculous that mindset is...He RAISES the OT law right up , showing them how unattainable it is...according to the legalists who will always maintain that The Sermon On The Mount is our standard today...*every Christian man walking and looking at women, has already been guilty of adultery in their hearts ..so they have no chance of entering in!!
Because that is what Matt 5 is saying... Wow!! Or "Yikes" as @bbyrd009 says.

And your quote :- < The above is the reason why each party male and female must keep his/Jesus commandments.>

Brother, I believe that you are striving for, and asking other to also strive for and keep, a law that only Jesus could keep and deliver you from.

This is why the gospel =Good News is "good news."!! Thank You God!!
Wow, what a deliverance, what a Saviour...what a place where we can run and hide..."Abide in Me."
Our works are not in striving to attain...( striving to keep run the race forward..yes) ..but our work are in looking to the Lord and clinging to Him.
THAT is our work....that is what Faith is all about...not in ourselves 'to attain'...but in Him who has attained and sat down at God's 'right hand'.

If you don't agree with this ( which most people don't) then please tell me how your "attaining" in your own strength and your own works, is working out for you. Are you almost there yet?

Because I am getting to know your heart a wee bit...I am brave enough here to tell you how I see these things....
I will have no problem at all if you tell me you don't agree. ;)
But, no one yet every tells me how far they have got in their own "attaining" in keeping the law. :)
I have asked many before...but somehow they are reluctant to answer on how well they are 'making it work!!'

Every blessing....Helen

 

[bbyrd009]

I have asked many before...but somehow they are reluctant to answer on how well they are 'making it work!!'

lol, the goal should be to be able to testify on how well one is dealing with the failure of the law after all, right.
both works of the law and works of grace are judged, however, i see a lot of...well, essentially denial that any works can be done in Grace at all?

so then, i got one for ya; some clueless guy snags my ice cream on a hot day, and boy do i let him have it! Now, who might i have to be prepared to give a defense of my faith to in that scenario, do you imagine, after the works i have just manifested?

 

[Helen]

i see a lot of...well, essentially denial that any works can be done in Grace at all?

That is foolishness ...Then they do not really understand grace.
Grace is never without accountability...Paul makes that very plain.
Grace with no accountability make the message of grace a mockery.

 

[bbyrd009]

That is foolishness ...Then they do not really understand grace.
Grace is never without accountability...Paul makes that very plain.
Grace with no accountability make the message of grace a mockery.

well, i guess that is where "it is finished" gets applied by them, and i can't help but think these ppl are kind of...watching a movie, too?
which i am currently questioning for its validity, but that doesn't mean it has none, @ScottA exhibits quite a bit of grace, and i see analogs of "rest" in this too, even if i currently have to agree with you in principle, if for no other reason than that these ppl still have works, just like you and i do, and their works are still being judged, just like ours are; even the ones who insist that they need have no works to be "saved."

 

[bbyrd009]

so then, i got one for ya; some clueless guy snags my ice cream on a hot day, and boy do i let him have it! Now, who might i have to be prepared to give a defense of my faith to in that scenario, do you imagine, after the works i have just manifested?

but then if one is convinced that they should be prepared to give a defense of their faith to strangers, wouldn't that mean that by definition they were not loving them to begin with? i mean, can anyone suggest a scenario in which they were being loving to everyone, and that doctrine getting them into a situation in which otherwise disengaged ppl would be asking them to defend their doctrine? rather than saying "thank you" to them, iow, if anything

and don't get me wrong, the scenarios exist, i have one or two, but the elements are all seemingly different from the Standard Proselytizing Model, let's say. i don't recall anyone ever asking me why i was being loving back then, unless it was a friend or family member, back then, too. Anyone?

 

[amadeus]

but then if one is convinced that they should be prepared to give a defense of their faith to strangers,

What we need to be is what God wants us to be at all times. As we may already have discovered that is not such an easy task. Actually, without God's help it is one of those impossible things.

When we are really walking with God, I believe that our cup is then overflowing, which means we have whatever it is that is needed when it is needed. This does not necessarily having all of the answers to the questions someone may press on us. Our answer should be our life as we are living it before them. Jesus was living such a life better than anyone and what was the end result for his physical body? On top of that He did have answers as well, but even those correct answers did not convince everyone.

wouldn't that mean that by definition they were not loving them to begin with?

That little phrase of yours is saying what I am saying. Our lives should demonstrate the answer to the questions that anyone has who is really hungry and thirsty for the righteousness of God [see Matt 5:6]. Our lives will then be at least what they need in the moment of our encounter with them.

i mean, can anyone suggest a scenario in which they were being loving to everyone, and that doctrine getting them into a situation in which otherwise disengaged ppl would be asking them to defend their doctrine? rather than saying "thank you" to them, iow, if anything

If we really do love God as He wants us to, will we not be preparing ourselves to face every person or situation God will put before us? Some will walk a lukewarm walk and then wonder why they seemed to be no help at all when confronted with someone who is really was hungry and thirsty.

and don't get me wrong, the scenarios exist, i have one or two, but the elements are all seemingly different from the Standard Proselytizing Model, let's say. i don't recall anyone ever asking me why i was being loving back then, unless it was a friend or family member, back then, too. Anyone?

Proselytizing I guess could be a good thing, but whenever I purposely tried it [many years ago] I was definitely not successful because I did not know what I was doing and no one else who should have been able to advise me could... Unless a person is really called by God to do exactly that, I would not. A person should would rather do exactly what God does call him to do. Do we each know what that is?

 

[tooldtocare]

10 seconds before conception give or take a second

 

[bbyrd009]

What we need to be is what God wants us to be at all times. As we may already have discovered that is not such an easy task. Actually, without God's help it is one of those impossible things.

ha i've found that dogs help there immensely, when in doubt just follow them lol
being as how we ask little kids what to do as a joke, i mean

 

[Helen]

well, i guess that is where "it is finished" gets applied by them, and i can't help but think these ppl are kind of...watching a movie, too?
which i am currently questioning for its validity, but that doesn't mean it has none, @ScottA exhibits quite a bit of grace, and i see analogs of "rest" in this too, even if i currently have to agree with you in principle, if for no other reason than that these ppl still have works, just like you and i do, and their works are still being judged, just like ours are; even the ones who insist that they need have no works to be "saved."

Hi Mark.
I see there is still a gap between our belief. But slowly we are getting there. ( I think)
We agree that grace is not without accountability.
2 Cor 6:1 "As God's co-workers we urge you not to receive God's grace in vain."
Grace is not so that we have licence for the flesh to indulge itself.
The wonderful thing about God is..He leaves us free to choose. If we squander grace....we are then paupers when we stand before.

The difference between you and I is...you still maintain that our salvation still needs works!! This is not so.
See in your quote below.

if for no other reason than that these ppl still have works, just like you and i do, and their works are still being judged, just like ours are; even the ones who insist that they need have no works to be "saved."

Now I agree that to maintain an ongoing day to day relationship we do choose to spend time with the Lord ...but liked we have talk before...this is the works of a love relationship. All of our works are for loves sake...or they are just hollow and what Paul calls dead-work. ( ie wrong motivation) in trying to earn something from God, but not from the heart. Everything comes back to the heart.
All our works will be tried , we know that and agree...Love Himself will try our works.
And you and I agree..with the right motivation of works, the "race" the Rest...is being achieved daily.

So, at the moment we still have our gap...I maintain via Word, that the only "work" we do in our salvation is to fall at His feet and say THANK YOU LORD.
( the repentance part, is all part and parcel)...when we see the price of love that He paid to redeem us...it breaks us and then the great exchange comes..my darkness for His Light!!
It is only then after this, that any works are involved...the work of love to maintain a vibrant ongoing wonderful relationship.

....H

 

[amadeus]

ha i've found that dogs help there immensely, when in doubt just follow them lol
being as how we ask little kids what to do as a joke, i mean

There is truth in what you say. I have always loved dogs because they do the right thing without thinking about it. They are criticized because they don't always do what people think is the right thing. Perhaps if dogs could talk they would really tell us how it is like Balaam's donkey.

 

[bbyrd009]

10 seconds before conception give or take a second