Why Did Our Father Want Blood Sacrifices?

[Robinson Crusoe]

I love this topic!

The thing that really gets me in The World today, is the extreme hypocrisy, when it comes to blood. For example, I see Janeane Garofalo and Keith Olberman, mockingly call Tea Party Protesters, "Tea Baggers," on prime-time cable news, with the obvious connotation, if you don't already know, << removed. >>; an obvious and particularly gross violation of The Law. However, the host of the show, tolerates her calling them that and has picked it up himself and uses it ad-nauseam. Furthermore, no doubt they would both characterize what I just said, as hate speech, sexism, the ravings of a mad man and somehow they'd wiggle it around to racism. lol Because, and this is besides the topic, in her mind, TeaParty = KKK = Lynch all The Black People In The World, but that is besides the point.

We tolerate the slaughter of a million babies a year in the United States and over 40 million a year worldwide, but we grimace at the thought of a Holy Sacrifice! Are we not idiots?

We tolerate grotesque sexual practices, which involve blood, but we are offended by The Blood of Christ! Are we not wicked? Of course! The unholy church of political correctness, of which people like Janeane Garofalo engage in evil crusades for, tolerates the blood of just about anything, but Christ. Remember, the mainstream media's reaction to, "The Passion."
The World often finds The Blood of Christ offensive, but they like to pretend, it is only because they are such good people! roflol

 

[Butch5]

I don't know what everybody's problem is with blood, but the aversion to it seems hypocritical. I used to be an Atheist and, when I became a Christian, I could immediately see Christians setting themselves up to look like hypocrites. That posture by Christians seemed so ingrained in them, that Atheists I talked to immediately assumed, I would take it to and treated me accordingly. It was only after some effort, that they began to see my posture as different and then began treating me differently. This of course, does not mean they liked me any better! It just means they quit with the same old tired complaints.

Alright, with that said, here's the words used in Genesis 4:4-5 in four different versions:

New American Standard : regard; had no regard

King James: respect; had not respect

Young's Literal: Looketh and not looketh

New Living Translation: accepted; did not accept

In my thesaurus, pleased is synonymous with gratified and satisfied. Christ's Blood satisfies and gratifies; the blood of tortured babies does not. However, that doesn't mean Christ did not endure a torturous death and that it didn't satisfy or "please" God. It did; praise God! Of course, our modern sensibilities, which are extremely hypocritical, think that is icky! roflol

I used the word, "pleased." As in, God was pleased by Able's sacrifice and displeased by Cain's. As in, God was pleased with Israel's sacrifices, when they were doing what He wanted them to and displeased when they weren't. It is all about seeking God's approval. Hence, the righteous desire to please God and the wicked desire to displease Him. Our moronic sensibilities, have nothing to do with it.

God being please with Abel does not necessarily mean that He enjoyed the blood sacrifice. You spoke of Christ's death, you said it "pleased" God. In what sense do you believe it pleased Him? The reason I ask is I believe many atheists have the wrong understanding of Chrsit 's death and d your statement gives me that same impression.

I had a big post that I accidentally erased - my fault ---suffice it to say...

Hosea 6:6 says it all. No one has ever directed me to that and I even had it marked already.

Butch great post -thank you. You said it didn't please God, but was showing Israel...
I don't know if my atheist friend would buy that - but it certainly is different than what most say.
He will respect it.

So, it seems it does not actually please God from Hosea 6:6, etc.
The plot thickens.

Thanks all.
Miss Hepburn

Now what did someone say - Most atheists don't believe in God, because of the God that everyone describes.
Something I just read. I should write things down...

You are welcome Miss Hepburn. Here is the verse I was speaking of.

Isaiah 1:11-15 ( KJV )
To what purpose is the multitude of your sacrifices unto me? saith the LORD: I am full of the burnt offerings of rams, and the fat of fed beasts; and I delight not in the blood of bullocks, or of lambs, or of he goats.
When ye come to appear before me, who hath required this at your hand, to tread my courts?
Bring no more vain oblations; incense is an abomination unto me; the new moons and sabbaths, the calling of assemblies, I cannot away with; it is iniquity, even the solemn meeting.
Your new moons and your appointed feasts my soul hateth: they are a trouble unto me; I am weary to bear them.
And when ye spread forth your hands, I will hide mine eyes from you: yea, when ye make many prayers, I will not hear: your hands are full of blood.

 

[Robinson Crusoe]

God being please with Abel does not necessarily mean that He enjoyed the blood sacrifice. You spoke of Christ's death, you said it "pleased" God. In what sense do you believe it pleased Him? The reason I ask is I believe many atheists have the wrong understanding of Chrsit 's death and d your statement gives me that same impression.

What impression is that?

 

[Butch5]

What impression is that?

The impression that God was pleased with Christ's death. Is that how you see it? If so why?

 

[Robinson Crusoe]

The impression that God was pleased with Christ's death. Is that how you see it? If so why?

Of course God was pleased, he said it, "this is my Son in whom I am well pleased..." In The Garden of Gethsemane, Christs BEGS God to take "this cup away," (this is where The Trinity gets weird) but God wouldn't do it, because it wasn't what He wanted! Are you pleased when people under your authority do what you want them to do? I hope so, because if you aren't, then it must be pretty miserable, for people who have to live under your authority. You know, they go around saying, "I can't please him; nothing makes him happy" (boo hoo hoo)!

 

[Butch5]

Of course God was pleased, he said it, "this is my Son in whom I am well pleased..." In The Garden of Gethsemane, Christs BEGS God to take "this cup away," (this is where The Trinity gets weird) but God wouldn't do it, because it wasn't what He wanted! Are you pleased when people under your authority do what you want them to do? I hope so, because if you aren't, then it must be pretty miserable, for people who have to live under your authority. You know, they go around saying, "I can't please him; nothing makes him happy" (boo hoo hoo)!

The statement "this is my Son, in Him I am well pleased" was not saying that God was pleased with Christ's death. Regarding Gethsemane, and Jesus statement, God did not refuse to take away the cup, Christ said, thy will be done. If God Was unwilling to take away the cup then Jesus statement here would have no force.

Matthew 26:51-54 ( KJV )
And, behold, one of them which were with Jesus stretched out his hand, and drew his sword, and struck a servant of the high priest’s, and smote off his ear.
Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword.
Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels?
But how then shall the scriptures be fulfilled, that thus it must be?

Christ willfully went to that cross, he was not forced.

God had "no" pleasure in the death of His Son, the pleasure was in the fact that Christ did so willingly. You see I believe that many atheists are against Christianity because they do not want to believe in a God that would kill His own son. Neither do I, however, many Christians believe this is the very thing that happened and it is in error due to false teaching that entered into the church around the year 1100 and was furthered by the reformation.

 

[Robinson Crusoe]

The statement "this is my Son, in Him I am well pleased" was not saying that God was pleased with Christ's death. Regarding Gethsemane, and Jesus statement, God did not refuse to take away the cup, Christ said, thy will be done. If God Was unwilling to take away the cup then Jesus statement here would have no force.

Matthew 26:51-54 ( KJV )
And, behold, one of them which were with Jesus stretched out his hand, and drew his sword, and struck a servant of the high priest’s, and smote off his ear.
Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword.
Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels?
But how then shall the scriptures be fulfilled, that thus it must be?

Christ willfully went to that cross, he was not forced.

God had "no" pleasure in the death of His Son, the pleasure was in the fact that Christ did so willingly. You see I believe that many atheists are against Christianity because they do not want to believe in a God that would kill His own son. Neither do I, however, many Christians believe this is the very thing that happened and it is in error due to false teaching that entered into the church around the year 1100 and was furthered by the reformation.

You say, Christ had a choice. I never said He didn't. He had the choice to please His Father or displease His Father. Christ made the righteous choice (Hence the phrase, God is faithful!); Satan, on the other hand, did not. Neither did Dr Faustus, in Christopher Marlowe's, "The Tragical History of Doctor Faustus." (circa 1560) Faustus was an expert in theology, but he wouldn't turn to Christ. He has the greatest life; he's an expert in all natural knowledge and theology, he has wealth and health. But, of course, he only knows what God has revealed to man. So, he sells his soul to The Devil, for 24 years of supernatural power and knowledge. Faust has a great time; he does it all! On his death bed, (Faust has been given the exact time of his death), he is exhorted, by what appears to be a messenger from God, to repent, but he won't. The demons come to drag his soul to Hell. As they do, he passes a great river of Christ's Blood. He knows all that is required for his salvation, is one tiny drop. The Blood is within his reach. However, he scorns it and, even though he knows it is vain, he cries out to Lucifer, calling him lord, to save him.

Submission to authority, even when that authority demands a horrible sacrifice. The morons (and they are idiots) you worry about, would mostly burn in Hell, regardless of anyone's efforts to make God more to their liking. Their problem is not with death, blood or even submission; their problem is with submission to Righteousness! The creator of the band, Army of Lovers illustrates my point in his life. When he was 14, he was a Preacher of The Word of God, with a small church. Not long after, he was pouring pig's blood (it's always about blood; blood, blood, blood!) over graves and performing wicked rituals, with his evil friends. Like Dr. Faustus, an expert in theology, he won't burn for a lack of knowledge of God, he will burn for a lack of submission to righteousness and a total submission to wickedness! Like Faust, in Christopher Marlowe's, "The Tragical History of Doctor Faustus," he knows the consequences, but he is going to do it anyway.

The thing I love about this guy, is that he pulls no punches; what you see, is what you get: (he's the goofy one in the wizard outfit)

My link

He's selling it; you could sum up his video like this: don't worry about the flames; they are cool! Come join us; it will be fun! Torture can be fun too! Sure, they do it to you, but you get to do it to them too! And, think about all the fun fornication is! Whoopee!

 

[jiggyfly]

You say, Christ had a choice. I never said He didn't. He had the choice to please His Father or displease His Father. Christ made the righteous choice (Hence the phrase, God is faithful!); Satan, on the other hand, did not. Neither did Dr Faustus, in Christopher Marlowe's, "The Tragical History of Doctor Faustus." (circa 1560) Faustus was an expert in theology, but he wouldn't turn to Christ. He has the greatest life; he's an expert in all natural knowledge and theology, he has wealth and health. But, of course, he only knows what God has revealed to man. So, he sells his soul to The Devil, for 24 years of supernatural power and knowledge. Faust has a great time; he does it all! On his death bed, (Faust has been given the exact time of his death), he is exhorted, by what appears to be a messenger from God, to repent, but he won't. The demons come to drag his soul to Hell. As they do, he passes a great river of Christ's Blood. He knows all that is required for his salvation, is one tiny drop. The Blood is within his reach. However, he scorns it and, even though he knows it is vain, he cries out to Lucifer, calling him lord, to save him.

Submission to authority, even when that authority demands a horrible sacrifice. The morons (and they are idiots) you worry about, would mostly burn in Hell, regardless of anyone's efforts to make God more to their liking. Their problem is not with death, blood or even submission; their problem is with submission to Righteousness! The creator of the band, Army of Lovers illustrates my point in his life. When he was 14, he was a Preacher of The Word of God, with a small church. Not long after, he was pouring pig's blood (it's always about blood; blood, blood, blood!) over graves and performing wicked rituals, with his evil friends. Like Dr. Faustus, an expert in theology, he won't burn for a lack of knowledge of God, he will burn for a lack of submission to righteousness and a total submission to wickedness! Like Faust, in Christopher Marlowe's, "The Tragical History of Doctor Faustus," he knows the consequences, but he is going to do it anyway.

The thing I love about this guy, is that he pulls no punches; what you see, is what you get: (he's the goofy one in the wizard outfit)

My link

He's selling it; you could sum up his video like this: don't worry about the flames; they are cool! Come join us; it will be fun! Torture can be fun too! Sure, they do it to you, but you get to do it to them too! And, think about all the fun fornication is! Whoopee!

But it is just a fable based on a myth. How does it relate to the OP?

 

[jerryjohnson]

Because many people are turned off to God because of how they view Him in the Bible -as wrathful, mean, cruel, etc,---and
ask me many questions about all the contradictions found in the Bible ---help me with an answer about:

Why would a loving Father want blood from innocents? His little innocent creatures, lambs, His Son...?

Quoting the Bible doesn't count because they reject such "nonsense".
Their brains want to logically "get" ---W-H-Y?

Any help? If you say go to Hebrews 9 - it doesn't help them. It does not answer the question why?

Then, they don't want to believe in a God that would put His Son thru being a Blood Sacrifice.
Purposely, they reject the thought of such a Father as this.

What is in the mind of God that He likes lambs killed? Or does He? Is it a made up ritual of early Man's?
I need logic. Is there any?

Thanks,
Miss Hepburn

God is Holy, and can not, will not, tolerate sin or be in the presents of sin. The wages of sin is death, remember. And not the death of a carrot, God doesn’t want carrot blood to satisfy the penalty for sin. Carrot blood is too cheap. Sin is serious, God does not even want the blood of any old animal, He wants the blood of your best, most perfect animal. And that blood would cover sin for one time only, it did not cover man's sin forever.

 

[Butch5]

You say, Christ had a choice. I never said He didn't. He had the choice to please His Father or displease His Father. Christ made the righteous choice (Hence the phrase, God is faithful!); Satan, on the other hand, did not. Neither did Dr Faustus, in Christopher Marlowe's, "The Tragical History of Doctor Faustus." (circa 1560) Faustus was an expert in theology, but he wouldn't turn to Christ. He has the greatest life; he's an expert in all natural knowledge and theology, he has wealth and health. But, of course, he only knows what God has revealed to man. So, he sells his soul to The Devil, for 24 years of supernatural power and knowledge. Faust has a great time; he does it all! On his death bed, (Faust has been given the exact time of his death), he is exhorted, by what appears to be a messenger from God, to repent, but he won't. The demons come to drag his soul to Hell. As they do, he passes a great river of Christ's Blood. He knows all that is required for his salvation, is one tiny drop. The Blood is within his reach. However, he scorns it and, even though he knows it is vain, he cries out to Lucifer, calling him lord, to save him.

Submission to authority, even when that authority demands a horrible sacrifice. The morons (and they are idiots) you worry about, would mostly burn in Hell, regardless of anyone's efforts to make God more to their liking. Their problem is not with death, blood or even submission; their problem is with submission to Righteousness! The creator of the band, Army of Lovers illustrates my point in his life. When he was 14, he was a Preacher of The Word of God, with a small church. Not long after, he was pouring pig's blood (it's always about blood; blood, blood, blood!) over graves and performing wicked rituals, with his evil friends. Like Dr. Faustus, an expert in theology, he won't burn for a lack of knowledge of God, he will burn for a lack of submission to righteousness and a total submission to wickedness! Like Faust, in Christopher Marlowe's, "The Tragical History of Doctor Faustus," he knows the consequences, but he is going to do it anyway.

The thing I love about this guy, is that he pulls no punches; what you see, is what you get: (he's the goofy one in the wizard outfit)

My link

He's selling it; you could sum up his video like this: don't worry about the flames; they are cool! Come join us; it will be fun! Torture can be fun too! Sure, they do it to you, but you get to do it to them too! And, think about all the fun fornication is! Whoopee!

Why do you assume the choice was to please or displease the Father? Where does Scripture say Christ was required to do this? You see the error comes along with the Penal model of the atonement which was brought into the church by the reformers.

God is Holy, and can not, will not, tolerate sin or be in the presents of sin.

Matthew 9:10 ( KJV )
And it came to pass, as Jesus sat at meat in the house, behold, many publicans and sinners came and sat down with him and his disciples.

 

[jerryjohnson]

Why do you assume the choice was to please or displease the Father? Where does Scripture say Christ was required to do this? You see the error comes along with the Penal model of the atonement which was brought into the church by the reformers.



Matthew 9:10 ( KJV )
And it came to pass, as Jesus sat at meat in the house, behold, many publicans and sinners came and sat down with him and his disciples.

I am talking about God the Father, not God the Son. You need to stretch your mind a little: Study these verses in depth, check out each word for each word is full of meaning.


Php 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
Php 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
Php 2:7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
Php 2:8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
Php 2:9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
Php 2:10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
Php 2:11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

 

[mjrhealth]

blood sacrifices were pleasing to the lord

, where they ??

Psa 40:6 Sacrifice and offering thou didst not desire; mine ears hast thou opened: burnt offering and sin offering hast thou not required.

Hos 6:6 For I desired mercy, and not sacrifice; and the knowledge of God more than burnt offerings.

Psa 51:16 For thou desirest not sacrifice; else would I give it: thou delightest not in burnt offering.
Psa 51:17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise.

God never wanted sacrifices, but mans eveil hearts desired it, because man could not accept Gods grace and desired works to find himself acceptable, and so it is today, men dont desire to know the heart of God, they desire to do things in the hope he will be found pleasing to God, for God grace in his eyes is not sufficent for it doesnt please the flesh, for when one does a work his flesh cries out,see God what I have done for thee", but only in his own eyes has he done a righteous deed, for we are found pleasing to God through the works of our Lord, Jesus Chrsit.\

In His LOve

 

[gumby]

, where they ??

Psa 40:6 Sacrifice and offering thou didst not desire; mine ears hast thou opened: burnt offering and sin offering hast thou not required.

Hos 6:6 For I desired mercy, and not sacrifice; and the knowledge of God more than burnt offerings.

Psa 51:16 For thou desirest not sacrifice; else would I give it: thou delightest not in burnt offering.
Psa 51:17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise.

God never wanted sacrifices, but mans eveil hearts desired it, because man could not accept Gods grace and desired works to find himself acceptable, and so it is today, men dont desire to know the heart of God, they desire to do things in the hope he will be found pleasing to God, for God grace in his eyes is not sufficent for it doesnt please the flesh, for when one does a work his flesh cries out,see God what I have done for thee", but only in his own eyes has he done a righteous deed, for we are found pleasing to God through the works of our Lord, Jesus Chrsit.\

In His LOve

Ok answer me this if god never wanted sacrifice than why did jesus come and die on the cross? why did god give us mercy and salvation through the bloody and brutal death of his son? Christ death wast pretty it was violent and it was grusome but god arranged it that way from the begining of time because he loves us and wants us to be saved. Ephesians 5:2, John 6:51, Galatians 2:20 Isaiah 53:7, Acts 8:32, Hebrews 10:10 and Hebrews 10:12.

And might i remind you that in the first five books of the bible that sacrifice was a law to be stricly obeyed, Leviticus 7:11 and Leviticus 7:37.

 

[Irish]

Timing is everything, what did the Lord think of Abel's offering, as opposed to Cain's. You have to be able to see that what was required was known. As time went on we were being educated as the pointlessness of mans attempts.


Irish

 

[gervais]

Ok answer me this if god never wanted sacrifice than why did jesus come and die on the cross? why did god give us mercy and salvation through the bloody and brutal death of his son? Christ death wast pretty it was violent and it was grusome but god arranged it that way from the begining of time because he loves us and wants us to be saved. Ephesians 5:2, John 6:51, Galatians 2:20 Isaiah 53:7, Acts 8:32, Hebrews 10:10 and Hebrews 10:12.

And might i remind you that in the first five books of the bible that sacrifice was a law to be stricly obeyed, Leviticus 7:11 and Leviticus 7:37.

God wanted love and obedience, Adam sinned, disobeying God, which lead to blood sacrifice and Christ’s death.

 

[gumby]

God wanted love and obedience, Adam sinned, disobeying God, which lead to blood sacrifice and Christ’s death.

Whats your point and how does it relate to the posting of the scripture?

 

[mjrhealth]

Isa 1:11 To what purpose is the multitude of your sacrifices unto me? saith the LORD: I am full of the burnt offerings of rams, and the fat of fed beasts; and I delight not in the blood of bullocks, or of lambs, or of he goats.

God never wanted sacrifice, satan demands blood for sin, God gave us the easy way out, animal sacrifice, but He desired forgiveness and love above all. But this man he created always demands revenge, justice, payment for sin just as satan does, so God gave him animal sacrifice in place of human sacrifice. EVerytime something goes worng, man cries out," whos to blame , who can i find guilty, just like satan", God cries out , forgive forget, the debt has being paid in full. We are a pathetic species, why God puts up with us , Ill never know, well it goes to show how much he loves us, warts and all.
In His LOve

 

[Butch5]

I am talking about God the Father, not God the Son. You need to stretch your mind a little: Study these verses in depth, check out each word for each word is full of meaning.


Php 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
Php 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
Php 2:7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
Php 2:8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
Php 2:9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
Php 2:10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
Php 2:11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

OK, but where does Scripture tell us that God cannot be in the presence of sin or that He cannot tolerate it. I know that is taught a lot of the time. I myself have been told that, however, I have not seen anything in Scripture that would indicate this. As a matter of fact I was told a lot over the years that I have not been able to find in Scripture.

 

[Miss Hepburn]

I just wanted to say I am sorry if I have not gotten back to many here.

So, if I don't comment on something it is not a slight to anyone. It's just TOO much. Thank you.
I also don't want to show my cards too much with my personal leanings.

Please know that I am reading these posts as my atheist friend, Tim, would read them.
Since he doesn't believe in God He certainly never goes along with any "argument" using scripture.

I, however, am learning alot, as in Hosea 6:6 and Is 1:11, Ps 40:6 Sacrifice and offering thou didst not desire; mine ears hast thou opened: burnt offering and sin offering hast thou not required.

Ps 51:16 For thou desirest not sacrifice; else would I give it: thou delightest not in burnt offering.
Ps 51:17 , for examples!

Thank you all.

I'm still (myself) waiting for someone to show somewhere where does it say - God wanted or was "pleased", in whatever
translation, in blood sacrifices and that that was why Jesus came here. (Since it has been brought up.)
Miss Hepburn

 

[Robinson Crusoe]

Why do you assume the choice was to please or displease the Father? Where does Scripture say Christ was required to do this? You see the error comes along with the Penal model of the atonement which was brought into the church by the reformers.

This is getting repeptitive.


You want to read about "Penal" vs. "Governmental" and rehash The Reformation, then read this, if you don't care, then just read The Bible and celebrate The Eucharist, somewhere

http://www.theopedia.com/Penal_substitutionary_atonement