Why I Believe God Created Man (Adam) Sin-ful

[daq]

Don't capitalize it. It's not the Holy Spirit.
I don't take that breath to be the Holy Spirit as it is spirit, the animating power of God.
Without God bringing life to man (Adam) he remained a dead soul. He didn't impart the Holy Spirit, but the animating power of God that made him alive.
Thanks for stopping by.

"Thanks for stopping by" ... You are quite welcome!
One last parting word: Beware the "wife of your bosom" is not of the seed of the daughters of 'Iyzebel seeing how that the Master has already clearly warned us concerning such false prophet spirit entities, (Re: Revelation 2:20 KJV).

Deuteronomy 13:1 ASV (American Standard Version)
1. If there arise in the midst of thee a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and he give thee a sign or a wonder,

Deuteronomy 13:2-10 KJV
2. And the sign or the wonder come to pass, whereof he spake unto thee, saying, Let us go after other gods, which thou hast not known, and let us serve them;
3. Thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams: for the Lord your God proveth you, to know whether ye love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul.
4. Ye shall walk after the Lord your God, and fear him, and keep his commandments, and obey his voice, and ye shall serve him, and cleave [same word in Genesis 2:24 KJV] of unto him.
5. And that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams, shall be put to death; because he hath spoken to turn you away from the Lord your God, which brought you out of the land of Egypt, and redeemed you out of the house of bondage, to thrust thee out of the way which the Lord thy God commanded thee to walk in. So shalt thou put the evil away from the midst of thee.
6. If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers;
7. Namely, of the gods of the people which are round about you, nigh unto thee, or far off from thee, from the one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth;
8. Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him:
9. But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people.
10. And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die; because he hath sought to thrust thee away from the Lord thy God, which brought thee out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage.

The inner "wife of your bosom" (or close associate-friend "who is like unto your own soul") can surely be deceived as was Eve the mother of all living, (spirit) and this is why spirit is transient while the soul is the permanent resident in the body-vessel of the man. Therefore if the wife of your bosom entices you secretly to forsake the Ways of the Most High, (even in a dream, prophecy, or a vision) then you are being "proven" to see whether you love the Most high with all your heart and with all your soul. You are commanded therefore to be the first to put your hand upon her; to put her to death, even to stone her with stones that she die off, (or visa-versa to the females here in the forum because truly, as Paul states, there is neither male nor female concerning those baptized into Messiah who walk according to the Spirit).

Micah 7:5-6 KJV
5. Trust ye not in a friend, put ye not confidence in a guide: keep the doors of thy mouth from her that lieth in thy bosom.
6. For the son dishonoureth the father, the daughter riseth up against her mother, the daughter in law against her mother in law; a man's enemies are the men of his own house.

Matthew 10:34-36 KJV
34. Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
35. For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.
36. And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.

The man is the house! And even worse is that "the inner wife of the bosom" can not only be deceived herself, (and change her nature) but then will "creep in unawares" at your "love feastings" in the Word and will deceive the man-'adam with whispers of sweet stones of emptiness in his quiet times; casting tantalizing tales in the chambers of his imagery with wild ideas like the notion that the Most High "created man with sin from the very beginning" and other fanciful notions of a similar kind which are recently witnessed wherein a certain one is professing that his Ioudan Iskariotes-Sicarii scapegoat is "saved" (neither does the same understand that typology). Oh well as you wish; just passing through, and with that said have a nice thread!

 

[jeremiah1five]

It is a nice thread. Too bad there are some here that hate nice threads and the born again Christians that post them. Seems if I don't believe as they do they will cause me some trouble for me here.
Oh well. Christ has my battles. Some people are worthy of the Word of God and some don't.
Nice piece.
I can dig it.

 

[afaithfulone4u]

Why I believe God created Adam sin-ful:

There is only one God.
The Biblical definition of sin is literally, "to miss the mark."
What is the "mark?"
The glory [and perfection] of God.

Since God cannot reduplicate Himself in Himself, Adam's creation fell short of the glory of God. This is the reason why Adam disobeyed God in the command to not eat of the fruit of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil. The eating of the fruit did not change the nature of Adam, he did not undergo any metamorphosis change to his nature (meaning he did not change from "good" to "evil"), but since he was created sin-ful, or missing the mark of the glory of God, he sinned. The Second Adam, Christ, proved this. Sin does not originate from holy. Sin does not originate from righteousness. Again, the Second Adam proved this.

If indeed God created Adam "missing the mark" of the glory of God (God cannot reduplicate Himself in Himself), which is what I believe, then the question becomes "How can a righteous God create and unrighteous being (Adam)? It would be inconsistent with the nature of God to do this. But He did it. He was able to create an unrighteous being (Adam) because God made atonement in Himself before He created heaven, earth, man, and the realm of TIME in which to create a man, and from this man, take out a people to Himself.

Revelation 13:8
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

As all three members of the Trinity of God was directly involved in the creation of heaven and earth, so, too, is the Trinity of God directly involved in the creation of the new man in Christ. And because of this group God ordained to eternal life whose names are in the book of life of the Lamb slain before the foundation of the world, the long-suffering of God waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God before Him in TIME in order to birth His people that He may directly provide deliverance to them. God knows the end from the beginning because He has ordained the end.

There is only One God. Adam was not holy, nor in standing before a holy God, was Adam innocent, nor righteous. He was not God. There is only One God. Adam was created fallen short of the glory of God, because again, there is only One holy, righteous, and omnipotent God. It was the only way God could create Adam for God cannot reduplicate Himself in Himself. Nor does sin come from holy. The Second Adam, who did no sin, neither was guile found in His mouth, did no sin because He was holy, and righteous, and innocent. But the first Adam did sin because it was his nature to sin. Adam only did what his sin-ful nature dictated he do, that is, disobey God.

Isn't Paul correct when he said:

1 Timothy 1:9
9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers...

There was a law in the Garden of Eden which is found here:

Genesis 2:17
17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

Adam sinned because he was created sin-ful, or as the word means, falling short of the glory of God. If the existence of the Law of God to do or not do a thing, and the existence of the Law reveals that we are sin-ful, the existence of a "Thou shalt not" is a restriction God placed on Adam to not eat of the fruit of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil. The commands of the LORD are Law, and the Law of the LORD are commands. There is no distinction. The apostle Paul said:

Romans 7:7
7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

Paul said: "I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet." The same reasoning applies to Adam: Adam had not known disobedience except the Law said, thou shalt not eat of it.

Sin comes from sinfulness. Holy comes from holiness. The Last Adam. Jesus Christ, proved this.
There is only One God.
And that is why I believe God created Adam (man) sin-ful.

Adam was created in the image(attributes) of God and was supposed to live forever as long as he remained "ALIVE" meaning walking in the Spirit of God who was his protection and provider.
Only once Adam was defiled by woman, meaning chose to please his wife instead of obey God, did Adam spiritually die. The Spirit of God left them and instead of Adam coming to God to repent, they HID from God.
Adam and Eve had no children until after the fall, because they had no reproductive organs that is why they were naked but unashamed. Only after they became spiritually dead God covered their "NAKEDNESS/SIN" by giving them skin with reproductive organs now being in their fleshly nature.
Up until that time God created man, but now in their fleshly lusts as animals, Eve was sentenced under the curse to BIRTH children in her own body from now on WITH PAIN.
God is restoring all things to the way that it was in the BEGINNING and our children are not necessarily our flesh children unless they are reborn from above. For it is the spiritual children that we birth for the kingdom in Christ rather they are the 5 yr old in our home or the 50 yr old that lives down the street that we brought to Christ, these will be considered our children. Flesh and blood nature can not inherit the kingdom of God for they are yet carnal being led of the lustful desires to kill, steal and destroy.

You will notice that when they had SETH, that he was not born in the image of God (even though Adam at first had been), but in the image and likeness of fallen Adam. Able was no more because Cain killed him and Cain who was a spiritual son of the devil, being the son of perdition, was cast out of God's presence and they mentioned him no more.
In the new covenant God says no longer will the children suffer for the father's sin and vice versa, but now the soul that sinneth it shall die says God. So we must be sure to teach our small children of God's Word to instill morals and integrity and good character in them to save them while they are teachable and in our care, for when they pass the year of accountability they are not so easy to teach the truth and are not the children of God for they still walk in the way of the Wicked One and we and they suffer the consequences of their CAPTIVITY.
I know, for I did not know God when my children were at home under my guidance and now I suffer along with them because of MY lack of wisdom. I plead in prayer daily that God would give me another chance with them by opening their heart just a bit to listen to me. I do not ever pray for Him to just overlook their sins, for they have not repented and turned to Christ, I lift them up to God for THEIR OWN GOOD and OUT OF LOVE so that they will repent before it is too late!
They are good people as humans go, but far from God. Job lost his children because he thought just covering up their possible sins would save them. But what he needed to do was TEACH them how to not sin against God and raise them UP for their own good, not just allow them to stay as they are out of emotional fallen nature love by asking God to look the other way. Sin destroys us and sin must be eliminated so that we don't get ourselves to the state that we are in now in this day.

Notice that no one lived past 1 day after Adam sinned? We must remember that when God said in the DAY you that you eat you shall surely die, and they did die, to the Spirit of Life that day, but their flesh began to decay and none lived to see 1,000 yrs, which is 1Day to God.
Gen 5:1-3
5:1 This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him;
2 Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.
3 And Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his own likeness, after his image; and called his name Seth:
KJV

We are worthy to God when we spread His Word, the revelation of His Dear Son unto those around us to raise man righteous in the sight of God. If we withhold the TRUTH when in public arenas or with family and friends when we see evil being done, we only allow the devils strength to grow stronger. We must not be those who shrink back, to keep silent to keep ourselves from being persecuted for it, we must lay our life down for them and suffer with Christ to bring the TRUTH to their ears to maybe save a life.
Blessings

Ah! One more thing speaking of us be chosen in him and him being slain from the foundation of the world.
It is not talking about from the beginning when God created the world, it is talking about us NOW being chosen, many called, few chosen, to be being prepared, raised up in the womb of our mother heavenly Jerusalem from our birth(RE-BIRTH BORN AGAIN) being transformed into the image of Christ to learn to rule and reign with him in the NEW WORLD to come, being chosen before the foundation of the new heaven and new earth.
Yet all mankind who live on the earth must submit to Christ, the living Word of Truth if they want to really LIVE and not die.

 

[domenic]

Why I believe God created Adam sin-ful:

There is only one God.
The Biblical definition of sin is literally, "to miss the mark."
What is the "mark?"
The glory [and perfection] of God.

Since God cannot reduplicate Himself in Himself, Adam's creation fell short of the glory of God. This is the reason why Adam disobeyed God in the command to not eat of the fruit of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil. The eating of the fruit did not change the nature of Adam, he did not undergo any metamorphosis change to his nature (meaning he did not change from "good" to "evil"), but since he was created sin-ful, or missing the mark of the glory of God, he sinned. The Second Adam, Christ, proved this. Sin does not originate from holy. Sin does not originate from righteousness. Again, the Second Adam proved this.

If indeed God created Adam "missing the mark" of the glory of God (God cannot reduplicate Himself in Himself), which is what I believe, then the question becomes "How can a righteous God create and unrighteous being (Adam)? It would be inconsistent with the nature of God to do this. But He did it. He was able to create an unrighteous being (Adam) because God made atonement in Himself before He created heaven, earth, man, and the realm of TIME in which to create a man, and from this man, take out a people to Himself.

Revelation 13:8
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

As all three members of the Trinity of God was directly involved in the creation of heaven and earth, so, too, is the Trinity of God directly involved in the creation of the new man in Christ. And because of this group God ordained to eternal life whose names are in the book of life of the Lamb slain before the foundation of the world, the long-suffering of God waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God before Him in TIME in order to birth His people that He may directly provide deliverance to them. God knows the end from the beginning because He has ordained the end.

There is only One God. Adam was not holy, nor in standing before a holy God, was Adam innocent, nor righteous. He was not God. There is only One God. Adam was created fallen short of the glory of God, because again, there is only One holy, righteous, and omnipotent God. It was the only way God could create Adam for God cannot reduplicate Himself in Himself. Nor does sin come from holy. The Second Adam, who did no sin, neither was guile found in His mouth, did no sin because He was holy, and righteous, and innocent. But the first Adam did sin because it was his nature to sin. Adam only did what his sin-ful nature dictated he do, that is, disobey God.

Isn't Paul correct when he said:

1 Timothy 1:9
9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers...

There was a law in the Garden of Eden which is found here:

Genesis 2:17
17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

Adam sinned because he was created sin-ful, or as the word means, falling short of the glory of God. If the existence of the Law of God to do or not do a thing, and the existence of the Law reveals that we are sin-ful, the existence of a "Thou shalt not" is a restriction God placed on Adam to not eat of the fruit of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil. The commands of the LORD are Law, and the Law of the LORD are commands. There is no distinction. The apostle Paul said:

Romans 7:7
7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

Paul said: "I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet." The same reasoning applies to Adam: Adam had not known disobedience except the Law said, thou shalt not eat of it.

Sin comes from sinfulness. Holy comes from holiness. The Last Adam. Jesus Christ, proved this.
There is only One God.
And that is why I believe God created Adam (man) sin-ful.

Lets assume what you say of God is true; He created Adam sinful;
He knew Adam would sin, and the whole human family would suffer for it. That would make God some kind of sick monster. That would take all the blame off of Satan, and put it on God…who has been guiding your thinking?

 

[Angelina]

Well said domenic...God did not make Adam sinful. He made Adam in his image... :huh:

Shalom!

 

[daq]

Since the OP does not appear to be around anymore I do not want to "harang" but as a matter of common sense anyone with children should know what it is like to have "created" a living creature in his/her own image, (though the life and breath is of our Creator). No sane parent desires his or her child to do something they know would be detrimental to the child; yet they always eventually do because they are not robots but made with a creative intellect and a will. Likewise no father puts his child in charge of all his goods before the appointed time where and when the child must prove himself a worthy son, (like a Bar Mitzvah ceremony).

------------------------------

I had not noticed this last time in this thread dragonfly, thanx, and thanx also for the complimentary passages!

daq's points in reference to 1 Corinthians 15 are also helpful. Please place them beside Hebrews 2:14 - 17 and Romans 8:3.