Paul

[Bob Estey]

Hello Bob,
Answer to your question?
2 Timothy 3:16-17

16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:"

How do you pick and choose what is NOT inspired of God when the word itself says the opposite?
Just curious. Would be pretty confusing to many if they cherry picked. I could also make that bible say what I want it to but, that's not how it goes. God is NOT a God of confusion! If it is in the bible, God wanted it there, if it is not then, was not meant to be there.
I'm afraid you are delving into dangerous area here as Paul was given to preach to the Gentiles, I hope you are not among this newer group of "anti-Pauline's"
God bless and give you peace.

So Paul is telling us that his writings are holy?

 

[Nancy]

So Paul is telling us that his writings are holy?

I'm not following what you mean by that...?

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Is there some reason to blindly believe that Paul was always right?

God speaking: “ Paul is my ‘ Chosen Vessel’

Jesus told Paul to say,” Follow me as I follow Christ”

Paul said “ This is My Gospel, by which you are will be Judged”

 

[Davy]

People on the conservative side of the spectrum seem to believe everything Paul says in the Bible was inspired by God, and therefore is the Word of God. People on the left seem to pick and choose what is the Word of God. People in the middle might go back and forth between the two.

I might suggest this: God gave Paul a very important mission: Setting up churches and instructing them. Paul wasn’t perfect, though. He commanded much respect, so his letters were kept, and in time considered scripture.

Apostle Paul was a Hebrew scholar, and he spoke several languages. He was learned by one of the best Hebrew scholars of his day, Gamaliel. And Lord Jesus spoke with Paul on occasion, directed him.

So to treat Paul's Ministry like he made mistakes, and that we can pick and choose which part of his Epistles to heed, simply is error. It is in essence to think that Lord Jesus made mistakes in choosing Paul, and left Paul on his own.

 

[Bruce Atkinson]

Aside from the fact that you're preaching a false gospel, you're telling a bold-faced lie. Judaizers were people who were trying to convince converts that they had to be physically circumcised in order to be saved. Paul said nothing about the other things you claim Paul taught against, and his own words prove it:

"As many as desire to make a good showing in the flesh, these would compel you to be circumcised, only that they may not suffer persecution for the cross of Christ." - Gal. 6:12

That is what Paul mainly addressed throughout Galatians. At no point in Galatians or any other letter authored by Paul did he ever tell people they could eat unclean meat, considering all of Acts and the Pauline letters show he still believed in the authority of the Law enough to practice what was in it. Not only are you preaching another Christ, you're preaching another Paul.

Apparently, your understanding of what Judaizers are and my understanding are different. What I was taught about them by a very knowledgeable Bible teacher at church was that they were attempting to put the Christians under the law...not just part of it. My understanding is confirmed by the definition of Judiazers found in Google:

"The Judaizers were a faction of the Jewish Christians, both of Jewish and non-Jewish origins, who regarded the Levitical laws of the Old Testament as still binding on all Christians."

You are likely aware circumcision is part of the law:

Genesis 17:11-13 (God speaking to Abraham)
11 And ye shall circumcise the flesh of your foreskin; and it shall be a token of the covenant betwixt me and you.
12 And he that is eight days old shall be circumcised among you, every man child in your generations, he that is born in the house, or bought with money of any stranger, which is not of thy seed.
13 He that is born in thy house, and he that is bought with thy money, must needs be circumcised: and my covenant shall be in your flesh for an everlasting covenant. (KJV)

Leviticus 12:1-3 (Mosaic Law)
1 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,
2 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, If a woman have conceived seed, and born a man child: then she shall be unclean seven days; according to the days of the separation for her infirmity shall she be unclean.
3 And in the eighth day the flesh of his foreskin shall be circumcised. (KJV)

One must ask, why would the Judaizers only want to put the new Christians under only one of the 613 Mosaic laws? That makes no sense to me. That would be like telling a 16 year old with a brand new drivers license they only have to obey the speed limit and nothing else while driving. No, the Judaizers required that the Galatians (and likely the other churches that Paul started) to be fully under the law, not just part of it.

Paul specifically wrote that Christians are NOT under the law -

Romans 3:27-28 (KJV)
27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.
28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

Romans 8:2-4 (KJV)
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

Putting Christians under the law, whether it is the Mosaic law or laws of some denomination is adding to Gods' Word. That's why Paul writes as Jesus told him that we are saved by grace through faith, by keeping the law -

Galatians 2:21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain. (KJV)

 

[Stumpmaster]

So Paul is telling us that his writings are holy?

Paul was of course referring to the much studied and proclaimed OT Scripture which had long been in existence, which Timothy had been raised with.

But we should also be aware of the "three as endorsement" Peter gives of Paul's writings.

It is not that Paul claimed to be writing Scripture, but that what he wrote was acknowledged as Scripture, at first by Peter, and later by those God guided in collating the canon of the NT.

2Pe 3:14-16 Therefore, beloved, looking forward to these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, without spot and blameless; (15) and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—

• as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, (16)
• as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction,
• as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

 

[Bob Estey]

I'm not following what you mean by that...?

Quoting that verse is like a self-fulfilling prophecy, isn't it?

 

[Bob Estey]

God speaking: “ Paul is my ‘ Chosen Vessel’

Jesus told Paul to say,” Follow me as I follow Christ”

Paul said “ This is My Gospel, by which you are will be Judged”

Can you give me the Bible passages that say those things?

 

[Bob Estey]

Apostle Paul was a Hebrew scholar, and he spoke several languages. He was learned by one of the best Hebrew scholars of his day, Gamaliel. And Lord Jesus spoke with Paul on occasion, directed him.

So to treat Paul's Ministry like he made mistakes, and that we can pick and choose which part of his Epistles to heed, simply is error. It is in essence to think that Lord Jesus made mistakes in choosing Paul, and left Paul on his own.

Nobody is, or was, perfect, except Jesus.

 

[Bob Estey]

Paul was of course referring to the much studied and proclaimed OT Scripture which had long been in existence, which Timothy had been raised with.

But we should also be aware of the "three as endorsement" Peter gives of Paul's writings.

It is not that Paul claimed to be writing Scripture, but that what he wrote was acknowledged as Scripture, at first by Peter, and later by those God guided in collating the canon of the NT.

2Pe 3:14-16 Therefore, beloved, looking forward to these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, without spot and blameless; (15) and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—

• as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, (16)
• as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction,
• as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

Are we too assume there are no errors in the Old Testament?

 

[Stumpmaster]

Are we too assume there are no errors in the Old Testament?

There are some minor transcriptional errors that have no bearing on historicity, authenticity and inspiration.

The KJV has Ahaziah (aka Jehoahaz) the son of Jehoram as 42 when he began to reign immediately after his 40 year old father died. Other versions correct this error to Ahaziah being 22, not 42.

2Ch 21:16-20 Moreover the LORD stirred up against Jehoram the spirit of the Philistines, and of the Arabians, that were near the Ethiopians: (17) And they came up into Judah, and brake into it, and carried away all the substance that was found in the king's house, and his sons also, and his wives; so that there was never a son left him, save Jehoahaz, the youngest of his sons. (18) And after all this the LORD smote him in his bowels with an incurable disease. (19) And it came to pass, that in process of time, after the end of two years, his bowels fell out by reason of his sickness: so he died of sore diseases. And his people made no burning for him, like the burning of his fathers. (20) Thirty and two years old was he when he began to reign, and he reigned in Jerusalem eight years, and departed without being desired. Howbeit they buried him in the city of David, but not in the sepulchres of the kings.

2Ch 22:1-2 And the inhabitants of Jerusalem made Ahaziah his youngest son king in his stead: for the band of men that came with the Arabians to the camp had slain all the eldest. So Ahaziah the son of Jehoram king of Judah reigned. (2) Forty and two years old was Ahaziah when he began to reign, and he reigned one year in Jerusalem. His mother's name also was Athaliah the daughter of Omri.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Can you give me the Bible passages that say those things?

Yep

Acts9:15
1Cor1:11
Rom2:16

 

[Truman]

If you don't like Paul and don't want to read him, then don't!
Oh yeah...I keep forgetting that some people actually enjoy arguing!
I'll leave you "gentlemen" to your pleasure.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

If you don't like Paul and don't want to read him, then don't!
Oh yeah...I keep forgetting that some people actually enjoy arguing!
I'll leave you "gentlemen" to your pleasure.

There are few things as pleasurable as “ arguing” with poor students of the Word who like to pretend that Paul ( God's CHOSEN VESSEL ! ) and his Holy Spirit inspired writings are irrelevant .....I can’t be the “ only” one that enjoys “shooting fish in a barrel”.........They unknowingly provide a fine service as they make great “ springboards” to get the Truth Of Paul’s Gospel Of Pure Grace out there for many poorly taught Newbies that need to hear it.

 

[Truman]

There are few things as pleasurable as “ arguing” with poor students of the Word who like to pretend that Paul ( God's CHOSEN VESSEL ! ) and his Holy Spirit inspired writings are irrelevant .....I can’t be the “ only” one that enjoys “shooting fish in a barrel”.........They unknowingly provide a fine service as they make great “ springboards” to get the Truth Of Paul’s Gospel Of Pure Grace out there for many poorly taught Newbies that need to hear it.

A sportsman, I see! Lol If only they spent as much time reading the bible as they do watching T.V. Knock yourself out, BB...as long as I don't have to listen! Lol

 

[Bob Estey]

Yep

Acts9:15
1Cor1:11
Rom2:16

There is a difference between saying that "Paul is a chosen instrument of the Lord," and "Paul is perfect."

 

[Davy]

Nobody is, or was, perfect, except Jesus.

Of course Jesus only was perfect. Where did I ever say Apostle Paul was perfect? Don't try to put 'your' words into 'my' mouth.

 

[Nancy]

Quoting that verse is like a self-fulfilling prophecy, isn't it?

Which verse Bob? Sorry, my mind is all over the place at the moment...

 

[Bob Estey]

Of course Jesus only was perfect. Where did I ever say Apostle Paul was perfect? Don't try to put 'your' words into 'my' mouth.

But aren't you saying that we have to treat his words as if they are God's words?

 

[Bob Estey]

Which verse Bob? Sorry, my mind is all over the place at the moment...

The one where Paul says all scripture is beneficial.