How does God Create Evil

[quietthinker]

Do you believe in evolution and the big bang?

of course there was a Big Bang.....or do you believe your mother resorted to in vitro fertilisation?

 

[GEN2REV]

Isaiah 45:7 'I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the LORD, do all these things.'
1 John 1:5 'This is the message we have heard from him and declare to you: God is light; in him there is no darkness at all.'
have fun!

Creating darknes and having darkness within Him aren't the same thing. You're getting into judging what God is capable of based on a human's limited ability to perceive and limited experience in a world with physical laws and limitations that God is not subject to.

Try having some reverence for the Almighty and give Him the benefit of the doubt. Get over yourself in thinking that YOU can tell what's possible from His scripture and what is not.

His ways are higher than your limited mind can even conceive. His thoughts are higher than you can even pretend to understand.

Isaiah 55:8-9
Romans 11:33
Romans 11:36

 

[quietthinker]

Creating darknes and having darkness within Him aren't the same thing. You're getting into judging what God is capable of based on a human's limited ability to perceive and limited experience in a world with physical laws and limitations that God is not subject to.

Try having some reverence for the Almighty and give Him the benefit of the doubt. Get over yourself in thinking that YOU can tell what's possible from His scripture and what is not.

His ways are higher than your limited mind can even conceive. His thoughts are higher than you can even pretend to understand.

Isaiah 55:8-9
Romans 11:33
Romans 11:36

You resort to chastisement because my questions/statements do not fit your paradigm. That's unfortunate because it implies your paradigm is the authority.

 

[GEN2REV]

of course there was a Big Bang.....or do you believe your mother resorted to in vitro fertilisation?

Oh MY, grandmother! What big ears you have!

Goodness, what big eyes you have!

But grandmother, ... what big teeth you have!

 

[Oceanprayers]

What is evil in this context? It cannot be against God's will if God creates it.

It seems to me that evil in this context is another way to identify the horrible and inescapable Wrath of God. When almighty God, the LORD of Heaven's Armies, has committed his infinite power to your destruction, all manner of evil may befall upon you - up to and including total annihilation in the Lake of Fire.

You'll notice you're in a thread wherein the question is posited, how does God create evil?

The thread title isn't asking, does God create evil? But instead first affirms God created evil when asking how he did it.

 

[GEN2REV]

You resort to chastisement because my questions/statements do not fit your paradigm. That's unfortunate because it implies your paradigm is the authority.

My paradigm is God's paradigm.

God's paradigm IS the Authority.

Bow down.

Or you'll bow down later.

 

[quietthinker]

My paradigm is God's paradigm.

God's paradigm IS the Authority.

Bow down.

Or you'll bow down later.

I think thats what the Pope has in mind as well!

 

[GEN2REV]

I think thats what the Pope has in mind as well!

 

[Wrangler]

But how about creating an evil spirit for Saul, and a lying spirit for the king to be decieved by?

I find it peril to question the HOW of the almighty's plan.

 

[Curtis]

No one is making any doctrine out of one Scripture, but are trying to show this one Scripture does not mean that God purposely creates eveil beings, and so is the Author and Creator of all things evil.

Malevolent evil is a good insert, making the difference between something that is evil, as in not a good thing vs something that is evil-doing.

The death penalty of God is not a good thing, and God takes no pleasure in it, and yet by creating souls with free will, evil things can come to pass: both evil doers not choosing to serve God, and God destroying them both body and soul in hell.

Creating hell is an evil necessity of creating by love all souls equally and with free will to choose Him freely from the heart, and not by might nor by power, but by His Spirit, saith the Lord.

I didn’t mean you were making a doctrine out of it, but that many people do, and thus accuse God of malevolence.

 

[Curtis]

The old covenant is gone, defunct, ended.

God didn’t break the old covenant, Israel did, repeatedly, so God ended it, as He promised He would if they didn’t keep it.

 

[GEN2REV]

The old covenant is gone, defunct, ended.

God didn’t break the old covenant, Israel did, repeatedly, so God ended it, as He promised He would if they didn’t keep it.

You lost me.

What does that have to do with the post that you quoted?

-Or with this thread even for that matter?

 

[quietthinker]

do you think I'm a wolf?

 

[Wrangler]

You'll notice you're in a thread wherein the question is posited, how does God create evil?

The thread title isn't asking, does God create evil? But instead first affirms God created evil when asking how he did it.

Yes but do you get the impression in reading the posts that there is universal agreement that God does create evil?

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I’ll stick with Gods doctrine! “God created evil”.

I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

How does God create evil? Did He create the devil evil? Does He create evil people?

How does He create darkness? Does He create the children of darkness?

By giving people free will

 

[Robert Gwin]

The argument is not about who tempts to do evil, which is not God, but about who creates evil, which is God. And so, the question is how does God create evil, not if He does, because Scripture plainly says He does.

The believer's challenge is not to challenge what is written, but to rightly divide Scripture to truly understand what is written by God about Himself in Scripture.

The fact of Scripture is that no darkness nor evil ever existed, until God created the heaven and the earth and commanded the light to shine.

And so, God created darkness and evil. God created the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, not the devil, and God used it to test the heart of man, while the devil used it to tempt man to choose the evil.

All killing is evil to God, and so commands not to kill, and yet God commanded to kill and avenge the blood kin, as well as rebuked the king for not killing all the Amalekites, which Samuel proceeded to do by the will of God.

God takes no pleasure in the necessary evil of destroying both body and soul in hell.

And yet: And not rather, (as we be slanderously reported, and as some affirm that we say,) Let us do evil, that good may come? whose damnation is just.

But Paul is not speaking of the necessary evil of righteous judgment against evil-doing, but is in fact rebuking the lie of doing evil sin that good may come.

The wrath of man works not the righteousness of God, but the wrath of God does: it is an evil thing to need take vengeance on any creature, but is necessary.

Evil was created by God when He chose beforehand to create creatures with free will, resulting in such creatures as Lucifer, who chose the evil instead of the good, and Adam who chose both good and evil.

I am not saying I disagree with you fully Rob, but I would certainly express it with different terms. Keep in mind, all of this would be irrelevant if Adam had not sinned. Free will is a given of being created in God's image, there could be no other way, and that certainly is not evil, rather the one who chooses to use his free will outside God's laws was actually the one who creates evil. All evil is a byproduct of Adam's sin.

 

[Ziggy]

Gen 2:9 And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

knowledge of good and evil. What is evil?
Gen 6:5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

Man himself is created in the image and likeness of God. Which means we have the same ability to do that which is good and to shun evil.
Exo 32:14 And the LORD repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people.

But where did evil originate?
1Jo 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

Where did the devil come from?
Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

Gen 3:1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?

Why did God create the devil?
1Co 5:5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

2Co 12:7 And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.

Pride, Envy, Covetousness...

Why did Eve take from the tree of knowledge of good and evil?

Gen 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.

Isa 14:13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

Man was created in the image and likeness of God.
We have the same charcteristics to do good and to repent from doing evil.
It is our own choice and freewill to follow one path or the other.
And for this cause was the serpent created.
To test us, to destroy our flesh nature, and to save the spirit in the day of redemption.

For God so loved the world....
that he gave his only begotten son...
that whomsoever believeth on him...
shall be saved.

There was only one that was with God from the beginning.
And he was created the Light of the world.
To lead men from darkness unto the light.
By making himself a ransom once and for all.

And God repented himself from the evil he thought to do unto his people.

God is a God of Love, he is also a God of Justice and Judgment.
He is the Light and the dark. The morning and the evening.
The ying and the yang. The positive and negative. Life and death.

There is only One God.
And you decide which side you will stand.
In the end, only God wins, because there is only one God.

And God is in us. And we choose which path we will follow.
The one that leads to Life and Light, or the one that leads to death and darkness.
And yet all roads lead to God.

When you are angry or you feel that you have been mistreated, you pray to God to get even with your enemies.
That means you want God to be evil to your foes because you don't want to be responsible for your thoughts and intentions of the heart.
You make God the bad guy while clinging on to him for yourself as the good guy.

Eve should of confessed of her own sin instead of pointing the finger at the serpent.
She had a choice...
and so do we.

We always have.
HUGS

 

[robert derrick]

Isaiah 45:7 'I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the LORD, do all these things.'
1 John 1:5 'This is the message we have heard from him and declare to you: God is light; in him there is no darkness at all.'
have fun!

Actually I'd like as many of these from you as you have. It's how I became convinced the Bible is all true without contradiction, and so there must be One God guiding all prophets and apostles for thousands of years to not contradict one another. That isn't possible for man to do on his own.

And so, God is light does cannot mean He cannot also create darkness, except they contradict one another.

A contradiction is only when there is no possible explanation to resolve the two, and so the task to show by Scripture how He that is Light can create darkness. If there is any sensible possibility of Scripture to resolve them, then there is no contradiction of scripture.

Whether one chooses to accept that possibility is not the final matter, but only if there is a reasonable explanation and doubt abo0ut it, such as in a court of law, any reasonable doubt is necessary and acceptable to find the defendant not guilty, which in this case is Scripture being accused by you of being a contradictory lie in any part:

Inasmuch as both in my bonds, and in the defence and confirmation of the gospel, ye all are partakers of my grace.

Believers ought be able to stand in defense of the gospel of the Scriptures, because if the Scripture is false in any detail, then there is no gospel of Scripture to trust in for our soul's sake. (Which of course makes it all the more confusing for them that claim their soul is saved by a gospel they also say is tainted with error by Scriptureal error. I.e. it's not about salvation of the soul for them, but only about intellectual argument about a book called the Bible, which they reject as being truly God's word, because they reject becoming truly obedient to it.)


He formed the light of nature, and created the darkness of nature thereby.

He that is the Light of truth will not create the darkness of a lie:

He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.

Not believing the truth is to believe a lie, which is evil, and to be damned for it:

And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.


1. Scripture does not say God created light: He formed the light, even as He is Light and is the form and shape of Godis LightThe question is not about God saying He is Light and He is darkness, which is a lie, but rather can the true Light create darkness, and if so how.

The answer is simple, by shining the Light, the darkness is created that refuses the light, if not for the light shining, no darkness would be created at all.

God does not 'create' light, but is Light and commanded His Light to shine out of the darkness:

For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

God created the possibility for darkness and evil, when He created all things for the good and His beings with free will: by allowing them to do so by choice, he created evil. Otherwise, He needed create by force and power over all things to choose Him only, which He rejected to do, because He is love.

I am not saying I disagree with you fully Rob, but I would certainly express it with different terms. Keep in mind, all of this would be irrelevant if Adam had not sinned. Free will is a given of being created in God's image, there could be no other way, and that certainly is not evil, rather the one who chooses to use his free will outside God's laws was actually the one who creates evil. All evil is a byproduct of Adam's sin.

Keep in mind, all of this would be irrelevant if Adam had not sinned.

I believe you sum it up most succinctly here: If not for free will in God's creation, there would be no evil created, which God therefore created by creating with free will.

However, it began with Lucifer, not Adam. It was the devil that tempted Adam, without which Adam would not have sinned, because sin only comes by temptation. (James 1)

Lucifer was not tempted by any, but simply was found with iniquity.

We know God creates and sends lying spirits for the foolish to destroy themselves with. So perhaps with creation of the angels, God created evil to test them.

God created iniquity, to see who would do it.

Serving and obeying God is an active participation willingly from the heart; therefore, resistance against disobeying is necessary to prove the heart: We don't obey God without enduring temptation to disobey Him and sin.

God created the angels and also creates evil to test them?

The point being that the one who knows the truth is the one that can best make a lie.

Creating evil, iniquity, and lies to test His creatures is not the same as being an evil doer, worker of iniquity, and a liar.

It's also not the same as tempting any to sin, because temptation is to actually invite sin, to try and place lust in the heart.

God created the tree of knowledge of good and evil to test man, but did not invite man to eat of it, He did not tempt man to eat it, but rather commanded plainly not to.

ALso, perhaps the one thing seen in all of Scripture that God has made something impossible for Himself to do is to lie, the one thing we can say God cannot do:

In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began.

That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us.

God can create a lying spirit, but God cannot lie.

 

[robert derrick]

Gen 2:9 And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

knowledge of good and evil. What is evil?
Gen 6:5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

Man himself is created in the image and likeness of God. Which means we have the same ability to do that which is good and to shun evil.
Exo 32:14 And the LORD repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people.

But where did evil originate?
1Jo 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

Where did the devil come from?
Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

Gen 3:1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?

Why did God create the devil?
1Co 5:5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

2Co 12:7 And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.

Pride, Envy, Covetousness...

Why did Eve take from the tree of knowledge of good and evil?

Gen 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.

Isa 14:13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

Man was created in the image and likeness of God.
We have the same charcteristics to do good and to repent from doing evil.
It is our own choice and freewill to follow one path or the other.
And for this cause was the serpent created.
To test us, to destroy our flesh nature, and to save the spirit in the day of redemption.

For God so loved the world....
that he gave his only begotten son...
that whomsoever believeth on him...
shall be saved.

There was only one that was with God from the beginning.
And he was created the Light of the world.
To lead men from darkness unto the light.
By making himself a ransom once and for all.

And God repented himself from the evil he thought to do unto his people.

God is a God of Love, he is also a God of Justice and Judgment.
He is the Light and the dark. The morning and the evening.
The ying and the yang. The positive and negative. Life and death.

There is only One God.
And you decide which side you will stand.
In the end, only God wins, because there is only one God.

And God is in us. And we choose which path we will follow.
The one that leads to Life and Light, or the one that leads to death and darkness.
And yet all roads lead to God.

When you are angry or you feel that you have been mistreated, you pray to God to get even with your enemies.
That means you want God to be evil to your foes because you don't want to be responsible for your thoughts and intentions of the heart.
You make God the bad guy while clinging on to him for yourself as the good guy.

Eve should of confessed of her own sin instead of pointing the finger at the serpent.
She had a choice...
and so do we.

We always have.
HUGS

I believe it is clear, as you show here, that God created evil by first creating creatures with free will to choose to obey God or do evil.

He creates evil by creating with free will, but He does not do evil Himself.

Creating something and doing something is not the same thing.

And for this cause was the serpent created.

The serpent created himself, when he was willing to do iniquity, but was created by God perfectly as Lucifer. Any of the three promoted archangels could have done iniquity, but it was only Lucifer who did so.

God created the possibility of doing evil with the angels first, and then allowed the serpent to tempt mankind.

And he was created the Light of the world.

Nowhere does Scripture say He created the Light of the world.

The Word was not created by God, but was with God and was God. ;)

 

[Ziggy]

What if you consider darkness as a shadow?
It trails the light.
The dark side of the moon.
There is only one moon and yet we see the light side because the light shines upon it.
The dark side is the part we don't see.
And yet many walk on the dark side of the moon not wanting to come to the light to be seen.
There is no escape from God, whether one walks in the light or in the shadows.
hugs