Is believing/faith a work ?

[Ernest T. Bass]

People are justified by obedience to the Gospel It is called "the obedience of faith" and it means repentance toward God and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ (Acts 20:21). But the Bible is crystal clear -- Abraham believed God and it was imputed to him for righteousness.

SINNERS ARE JUSTIFIED BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH PLUS NOTHING.

Faith INCLUDES obedience to God's will not disobedience for all the disobedient will be lost. In fact, disobedience to God's will is faithLESSNESS.

Abraham's faith included obedience and he was justified by that obedient faith. Disobedience justifies no one. And obedience is not a work of merit as some wrongly claim it is.

 

[Enoch111]

Faith INCLUDES obedience to God's will not disobedience for all the disobedient will be lost.

Obviously. But you seem to be missing the point. It is obedience to the will of God to BELIEVE on the Lord Jesus Christ. And those who BELIEVE are justified by grace through faith. Justification is followed by sanctification, which is in fact doing God's will.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Danthemailman does this to me everytime I teach faith must accompany obedience to be an acceptable faith to God.

If we go along with this misrepresentation of what we both know as saving faith,
then these faith alone folks are guilty of meritorious works based salvation.

They define works of any kind as merit.
James taught works of obedience.
They teach James' works are meritorious if they are are required for salvation.

Some will claim people are saved by saying some kind of "sinner's prayer". If that were the case, then saying a sinners prayer is a work of merit. They conveniently define for themselves what they want to be works of merit (submitting to water baptism) and what they don't want to be works of merit (sinner's prayer)

Therefore the obedient works they do after salvation must also be mislabeled as meritorious to be consistent with their wrong definition of obedience.

Any good works they do are not works of obedience but meritorious works.
They better stop all good obedient works, Ephesians 2:10

Absolutely right, those good works MUST be done by a Christian else that Christian will be cut off as an unfruitful branch (Titus 3:14: John 15) and thrown into the fire. Those good works would equally be works of merit also where by God owes them salvation for those good works.

 

[Titus]

People are justified by obedience to the Gospel It is called "the obedience of faith" and it means repentance toward God and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ (Acts 20:21). But the Bible is crystal clear -- Abraham believed God and it was imputed to him for righteousness.

SINNERS ARE JUSTIFIED BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH PLUS NOTHING.

If siiners are really justified by grace through faith plus nothing, then you just added repentance to faith alone. You cannot have Grace alone, faith alone, repentance added to faith alone AND IT ALL BE ALONE(EXCLUDED).

Repentance is not belief. And faith is not repentance.

Biblical repentance is doing something. It is repentance of sins,
Acts 8:22
Repent therefore of this your wickedness and pray God if perhaps the thought of your heart may be forgiven you.
Simon already had faith in Jesus, Acts 8:13 Then Simon himself also believed...

Faith comes first in Acts 2. Then Peter commands repentance and baptism for the forgiveness of sins.
Acts 2:37
Now when they heard this they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

That is their reaction to leaning they have murdered their Messiah. That response proves they believed Peter's preaching.

Now that they have faith in Christ, Peter tells them to repent and be baptized for forgiveness of their sins,
Acts 2:38.

 

[Behold]

a Sovereign God who is in control over all things, so again our experience, our knowledge, our relationships, our faith, are all the result of His work and not our own. All glory belongs to Him and He does not share His glory with another. Amen.

God does not force you to believe in Christ.
As if he forced you to believe, He would force everyone, as if He didn't, then He would be causing some to go to hell.
And why would God do that, when all are SINNERS, all are LOST, all are equal this way?

If God causes you to go to Hell, then """"God is Love""""" is a lie., and He's no better than SATAN who is working all the time to cause you to go to hell.
So, to teach that they are both doing this to some, is a LIE of the DEVIL, that he wants you to believe.
Dont believe that lie, and do not teach that LIE.
Do not teach that God and the DEVIL are doing the same WORK.
Do not belong to a CULT that teaches this Anti-Christ Anti-Cross, God Offending LIE.

 

[Scott Downey]

If siiners are really justified by grace through faith plus nothing, then you just added repentance to faith alone. You cannot have Grace alone, faith alone, repentance added to faith alone AND IT ALL BE ALONE(EXCLUDED).

Repentance is not belief. And faith is not repentance.

Biblical repentance is doing something. It is repentance of sins,
Acts 8:22
Repent therefore of this your wickedness and pray God if perhaps the thought of your heart may be forgiven you.
Simon already had faith in Jesus, Acts 8:13 Then Simon himself also believed...

Faith comes first in Acts 2. Then Peter commands repentance and baptism for the forgiveness of sins.
Acts 2:37
Now when they heard this they were vut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

That is their reaction to leaning they have murdered their Messiah. That response proves they believed Peter's preaching.

Now that they have faith in Christ, Peter tells them to repent and be baptized for forgiveness of their sins,
Acts 2:38.

Faith is never alone though as God is the author of your faith
People are born again of God, the regeneration and washing of the Holy Spirit, according to His mercy, not by righteous works, then they confess Christ as Lord and believe God raised Him from the dead.
Born Again comes first before faithfulness, see if you can find that in John 3.
See where else you can find where God has given to each one a measure of faith, meaning that came from Him as a gift, your faith.

Where is this good works required to be saved in Romans 10?
8 But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart” (that is, the word of faith which we preach): 9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, “Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame.” 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him. 13 For “whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved.”

Who now is playing the false teacher role?
How can the word be in your heart unless God has made you regenerated...

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Obviously. But you seem to be missing the point. It is obedience to the will of God to BELIEVE on Lord Jesus Christ. And those who BELIEVE are justified by grace through faith. Justification is followed by sanctification, which is in fact doing God's will.

Believing is obedience (John 3:36; Acts of the Apostles 14:1-2) believing is a work (John 6:27-29) yet it is not a work of merit whereby one earns the free free gift of everlasting life. But believing is meeting a necessary requirement God has placed upon receiving His free gift. Therefore one cannot be saved BEFORE one obeys.
One who is in disobedience is lost and remains lost as long as they remain in disobedience....as long as one continues in unrighteousness (disobedience) one continues to not be of God (1 John 3:10). Since obedience must come BEFORE justification (Romans 6:17-18) and obedience is NOT a work of merit, then obedience cannot, does not earn anything. God accepts those who "worketh righteousness" (Acts 10:35) not those who continue in doing unrighteousness.

 

[Scott Downey]

God does not force you to believe in Christ.
As if he forced you to believe, He would force everyone, as if He didn't, then He would be causing some to go to hell.
And why would God do that, when all are SINNERS, all are LOST, all are equal this way?

If God causes you to go to Hell, then """"God is Love""""" is a lie., and He's no better than SATAN who is working all the time to cause you to go to hell.
So, to teach that they are both doing this to some, is a LIE of the DEVIL, that he wants you to believe.
Dont believe that lie, and do not teach that LIE.
Do not teach that God and the DEVIL are doing the same WORK.
Do not belong to a CULT that teaches this Anti-Christ Anti-Cross, God Offending LIE.

God does not force, He does everything by His Spirit.
Being born again is not forced, God changes your heart to be open to Him, he gives to you a new spirit, one that can be taught about Christ and know God. The unbelieving, their minds are blinded by Satan and do not come to the Light as their works are evil, Jesus says the same kind of thing in John 1 and John 3

2 Corinthians 4
New King James Version
The Light of Christ’s Gospel
1 Therefore, since we have this ministry, as we have received mercy, we do not lose heart. 2 But we have renounced the hidden things of shame, not walking in craftiness nor handling the word of God deceitfully, but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man’s conscience in the sight of God.

3 But even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing, 4 whose minds the god of this age has blinded, who do not believe, lest the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine on them. 5 For we do not preach ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord, and ourselves your bondservants for Jesus’ sake. 6 For it is the God who commanded light to shine out of darkness, who has shone in our hearts to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

 

[Titus]

Faith is never alone though as God is the author of your faith
People are born again of God, the regeneration and washing of the Holy Spirit, according to His mercy, not by righteous works, then they confess Christ as Lord and believe God raised Him from the dead.
Born Again comes first before faithfulness, see if you can find that in John 3.
See where else you can find where God has given to each one a measure of faith, meaning that came from Him as a gift, your faith.

Where is this good works required to be saved in Romans 10?
8 But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart” (that is, the word of faith which we preach): 9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, “Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame.” 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him. 13 For “whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved.”

Who now is playing the false teacher role?
How can the word be in your heart unless God has made you regenerated...

Scott Downey, post: 1230707, member: 14632"]People are born again of God, the regeneration and washing of the Holy Spirit, according to His mercy, not by righteous works, then they confess Christ as Lord and believe God raised Him from the dead

Titus response: People are saved before faith? Regeneration means born again.
If folks are saved before faith then we do not need the power of the gospel to save us.
Romans 1:16
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ ,For IT is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the jew first and also for the greek.

Belief in the gospel is how we are regenerated not before belief.
Romans 1:16-17
For IN IT the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith; as it is written the just shall live by faith.

We do not know the righteousness of God until we know the gospel of Jesus Christ.

Regenerated before believing the gospel?
Not according to the Holy Bible.
We are born again, regenerated by the gospel of Christ!

1Corinthians 4:15
....for IN Christ Jesus I have BEGOTTEN you THROUGH THE GOSPEL.

You were saying about who was playing a false teacher ? Not me

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Is believing/faith a work ?

CHuckle!!! Since a human, without Holy Spirit input is incapable of having Biblical FAITH (Heb 11:1), then FAITH isn't a "Work" - it's a gift.

"Belief" can be a "work" (or at least lead to "works"), but since it's meaningless, has no substance, and is evidence of NOTHING, except how you feel at the time.

 

[Behold]

The unbelieving, their minds are blinded by Satan

If carnal minds were not blinded by Satan, then every mind would come to the Light of Christ and be born again, already.

The Devil's work is to accuse us, accuse God, and deceive minds.

People who went to hell today, didnt go there because they are bad, .. most went there because they never came to the knowledge of the Truth , who is Christ. John 14:6

However, there are those who know the truth, but they think...>"well, i have time, i can get saved later". "I want to live a little more fun first, and then i can get saved and then hate my life as all it will be is going to church and trying not to sin".

Can there be anything worse than to suddenly be in hell, because today was for them.... "And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:""
So, they end up in Hell, thinking they had more time to get saved., and knew how, and yet.....WAITED TOO LONG.
Terrible.

 

[Scott Downey]

If carnal minds were not blinded by Satan, then every mind would come to the Light of Christ and be born again, already.

The Devil's work is to accuse us, accuse God, and deceive minds.

People who went to hell today, didnt go there because they are bad, .. most went there because they never came to the knowledge of the Truth , who is Christ. John 14:6

However, there are those who know the truth, but they think...>"well, i have time, i can get saved later". "I want to live a little more fun first, and then i can get saved and then hate my life as all it will be is going to church and trying not to sin".

Can there be anything worse than to suddenly be in hell, because today was for them.... "And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:""
So, they end up in Hell, thinking they had more time to get saved., and knew how, and yet.....WAITED TOO LONG.
Terrible.

Of course, that is sad. But they are blinded by Satan, which is why they are perishing.
V6 are God's children, the saved and explains why they are no longer blinded by Satan, v3 and v4 are the devils children, the unsaved. Satan blocks the light of the gospel from entering minds. Satan does that to all people, but when God sovereignly intervenes and shines His light in their hearts, then they believe and are saved. Fact is people are not receptive to the light of Christ by their evil nature, they shrink back and do not come to the light as their deeds are evil. So it is on God's will working within to change their hearts, else they remain blinded.

3 But even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing, 4 whose minds the god of this age has blinded, who do not believe, lest the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine on them

6 For it is the God who commanded light to shine out of darkness, who has shone in our hearts to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

Then John 3

18 “He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

the unsaved in v19 and 20
19 And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
20 For everyone practicing evil hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed.

the saved, and you see the reason they come to the light is their deeds are done in the power of God working within them, in total corollary agreement with 2 Corinthians 4:6
21 But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his deeds may be clearly seen, that they have been (wrought) done in God.”

first part of v21 is what they did, the second part is why they did what they did.

 

[Behold]

Of course, that is sad. But they are blinded by Satan,

Satan also blinds the minds of the born again.
See, he cant touch your Spirit, but he can deal with your mind.

Paul says of these.....>"who has BEWITCHED YOU, that you no longer obey the TRUTH"
He's talking to Galatian Christians.

How do you spot these, today?
JUDE talks about them....He says they are committing the...."error of Cain".

Find out if they believe they can "lose their salvation", or if they believe that "God chooses some for hell, and not others'. (predestined elect Hyper Calvinism).

When you find this carnal believer, this CULT, this "church".....that believes all that.....you have found heretics, bewitched by the Devil, teaching this....Galatians 1:8

 

[Scott Downey]

Scott Downey, post: 1230707, member: 14632"]People are born again of God, the regeneration and washing of the Holy Spirit, according to His mercy, not by righteous works, then they confess Christ as Lord and believe God raised Him from the dead

Titus response: People are saved before faith? Regeneration means born again.
If folks are saved before faith then we do not need the power of the gospel to save us.
Romans 1:16
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ ,For IT is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the jew first and also for the greek.

Belief in the gospel is how we are regenerated not before belief.
Romans 1:16-17
For IN IT the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith; as it is written the just shall live by faith.

We do not know the righteousness of God until we know the gospel of Jesus Christ.

Regenerated before believing the gospel?
Not according to the Holy Bible.
We are born again, regenerated by the gospel of Christ!

1Corinthians 4:15
....for IN Christ Jesus I have BEGOTTEN you THROUGH THE GOSPEL.

You were saying about who was playing a false teacher ? Not me

You still have no answer for Romans 10 according to you philosophy

John 3 tells us they are born again first.
3 Jesus answered and said to him, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

That word see, means to perceive, desire, want anything to do with, so if they are not born again first, the enmity they have against Christ remains. Look it up and see for yourself! See here does not mean enter.

G3708 - horaō - Strong's Greek Lexicon (kjv)
"ὁράω" "see", as you can see what it really means. People not born again will have no interest in Christ as God for their salvation.
They will not heed Him, care for, experience who Christ is, become acquainted with Christ.

1. to see with the eyes
   
   
2. to see with the mind, to perceive, know
   
   
3. to see, i.e. become acquainted with by experience, to experience
   
   
4. to see, to look to
   
   1. to take heed, beware
      
      
   2. to care for, pay heed to
      
5. I was seen, showed myself, appeared
   

 

[Scott Downey]

Satan also blinds the minds of the born again.
See, he cant touch your Spirit, but he can deal with your mind.

Paul says of these.....>"who has BEWITCHED YOU, that you no longer obey the TRUTH"
He's talking to Galatian Christians.

How do you spot these, today?
JUDE talks about them....He says they are committing the...."error of Cain".

Find out if they believe they can "lose their salvation", or if they believe that "God chooses some for hell, and not others'. (predestined elect Hyper Calvinism).

When you find this carnal believer, this CULT, this "church".....that believes all that.....you have found heretics, bewitched by the Devil, teaching this....Galatians 1:8

The blinding by Satan in 2 Corinthians 4 is only in reference of those who are perishing, versus those who are saved, that is the whole of it, nothing about blinding the minds of believers is in there.

 

[Behold]

3 Jesus answered and said to him, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

In this verse you posted...>"see" means: "to enter in"......literally

Its this....>"Translated from Darkness....>TO LIGHT"

"LIGHT< is both God's domain, and Christ the Light of the World.
So, when we "SEE" the Kingdom, its because we have JOINED IT.....Spiritually........we have become "children of THE Light".

To become...."ONE with God"...."In Christ"... as a "new Creation".......is the same idea.

Its simply to become BORN AGAIN....as that is to enter into GOD's Spirit, which is the Kingdom we enter.

KOG, Heaven, "the righteousness of God"...>"Christ in you the Hope of Glory"...>"Glory" is Heaven.
"LIGHT" is Truth, and Righteousness., and Eternal Life.

its all the same Spiritual PLACE .....that we enter into by being born again by the Spirit of God, INTO the Spirit of God.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Yes and in James 2:14 we read of one who merely says/claims they have faith, but they have no works (to evidence their claim). That is not genuine faith, but a bare profession of faith. So when James asks, "Can that faith save him?" he is saying nothing against genuine faith, but only against an empty profession of faith/dead faith.

*So James does not teach that we are saved "by" works. His concern is to show the reality of the faith professed by the individual (James 2:18) and demonstrate that the faith claimed (James 2:14) by the individual is genuine. Simple!

Works-salvationists just can’t seem to figure out that James is discussing the evidence evidence of faith (says-claims to have faith but has no works/I will show you my faith by my works - James 2:14-18) and not the initial act of being accounted as righteous with God. (Romans 4:2-3)

Pride is a hard thing to break

Thats why Jesus says we must become poor in spirit to enter. All pride must be shed..

A worker has to feel they did something, that's why it is so hard for them to repent

 

[Eternally Grateful]

No one was justified by disobeying God.

--Each man is doing either 1 of 2 things, each man is either obeying God or disobeying God
--Since disobedience does not, cannot justify
--Then it must be obedience that justifies....."obedience UNTO righteousness" (Romans 6:16). Paul never said 'DISobedience unto righteousness'. Paul never said 'obedience BECAUSE one is already righteous' but Paul did say obedience unto, in order to be righteous.

No one CAN be justified by obeying commands. Because by those same commands we are in need of being justified. because we have failed to be obedient using Gods standard

The ONLY obedience one can do is to receive the gift of life through faith. which is obeying the gospel

He who believes is not condemned, he who believes not is condemned already

 

[Scott Downey]

There is also that big problem with ENMITY of the unsaved against Christ. Satan blinds the minds of the unbelievers, and also they then have ENMITY with God and Christ,
For those born again by the Spirit, this enmity is removed, that is why they believe in Christ.
"7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be."

The carnal mind not being subject to God's laws will never believe in Christ.
All unbelievers are carnally minded, have Satan as their father and are running with the devil, read Ephesians 2
ALL believers are 'in the Spirit' spiritually minded, as all are born again. If they do not have the indwelling Spirit, then they do not belong to Christ.
People at enmity, the unsaved, non born again, non regenerated are actively hostile to Christ. Can you see where that leads?

enmity
[ˈenmədē]
NOUN

1. the state or feeling of being actively opposed or hostile to someone or something.

Romans 8
3 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh, 4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His. 10 And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 11 But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.

 

[Behold]

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