Death Penalty

[Duckybill]

I think this objection has already been answered. This one hasn't: WHY WOULD JESUS TELL HIS DISCIPLES TO BUY A SWORD?

To fulfill Scripture.

Luke 22:36-38 (ESV)
36 He said to them, “But now let the one who has a moneybag take it, and likewise a knapsack. And let the one who has no sword sell his cloak and buy one. 37 For I tell you that this Scripture must be fulfilled in me: ‘And he was numbered with the transgressors.’ For what is written about me has its fulfillment.” 38 And they said, “Look, Lord, here are two swords.” And he said to them, “It is enough.”

 

[Groundzero]

To fulfill Scripture.

Luke 22:36-38 (ESV)
36 He said to them, “But now let the one who has a moneybag take it, and likewise a knapsack. And let the one who has no sword sell his cloak and buy one. 37 For I tell you that this Scripture must be fulfilled in me: ‘And he was numbered with the transgressors.’ For what is written about me has its fulfillment.” 38 And they said, “Look, Lord, here are two swords.” And he said to them, “It is enough.”

Actually, that is not the answer. I think what Jesus was telling them, was that now that he was about to die on the cross, a new dispensation was about to begin, and the spiritual battle between good and evil was about to escalate, whence the swords. If you don't agree with this, either keep it short, or start another topic.

Even then, the death penalty is never actually abolished. We have Scriptures that state the death penalty. We do not have Scriptures that abolish it. I see it this way: The death sentence is for clear-cut cases of murder. The murder must be without provocation (in realistic terms. Just because you don't like them is not an excuse. I mean, say someone is robbing you and you kill them, accidental murder, etc): cold-blooded. And it is ultimately up to the family of the victim/victims. If they want to forgive the murderer, fine. If not, fine.

 

[Duckybill]

Actually, that is not the answer. I think what Jesus was telling them, was that now that he was about to die on the cross, a new dispensation was about to begin, and the spiritual battle between good and evil was about to escalate, whence the swords. If you don't agree with this, either keep it short, or start another topic.

Then why did Jesus say 'that this Scripture must be fulfilled'?

Even then, the death penalty is never actually abolished. We have Scriptures that state the death penalty. We do not have Scriptures that abolish it. I see it this way: The death sentence is for clear-cut cases of murder. The murder must be without provocation: cold-blooded. And it is ultimately up to the family of the victim/victims. If they want to forgive the murderer, fine. If not, fine.

What 'death penalty'?

 

[Groundzero]

Then why did Jesus say 'that this Scripture must be fulfilled'?

What 'death penalty'?

Luk 22:37 For I say unto you, that this which is written must be fulfilled in me, And he was reckoned with transgressors: for that which concerneth me hath fulfillment.

The part in bold was what Jesus was talking about. Where in the Scripture does it make a prophecy about Jesus and his statement about buying swords?!


Is this a stupid question? Firing squad, the axe, the sword, stones, electrocution. Whatever is 'humane' enough for a person!

 

[Duckybill]

Luk 22:37 For I say unto you, that this which is written must be fulfilled in me, And he was reckoned with transgressors: for that which concerneth me hath fulfillment.

The part in bold was what Jesus was talking about. Where in the Scripture does it make a prophecy about Jesus and his statement about buying swords?!

'And he was reckoned with transgressors', because Jesus taught them to 'love their enemies' and 'do good to those who hate you'. Using swords would be EXTREME disobedience, and thereby they would be 'transgressors'.

Is this a stupid question? Firing squad, the axe, the sword, stones, electrocution. Whatever is 'humane' enough for a person!

No, I didn't say nor imply it was stupid. I was wondering if you were referring to the OT death penalty since you stated 'the death penalty is never actually abolished'.

 

[aspen]

Really? What if the people have spent their lives studying the Bible? I think there is great benefit in learning as much as we can about the Bible rather than simply relying on our own ability to comprehend the message, even if we have a close relationship with the Holy Spirit. Of course, it makes sense that you would reject Augustine and C.S. Lewis' writings because they are orthodox Christians (believe in the Trinity).

I think you know full well that I have demolished any concept that the Trinity is Biblical. If you want to continue such a point, start another forum, please. I don't reject their writings, but I do line them up by Scripture, not by what man has called 'orthodox' Christianity. The one who makes Christian is Jesus. Only through the Bible will we find a true account of him. If someone's writings don't line up with Scripture, I don't care if they are the most decorated men in history, I don't give a damn over what they say. When replying to my posts, I would appreciate it if you would have the courage to tackle what I say in full. Instead of just taking one sentence, what about you take the whole paragraph?!

God calls evil what it is - lesser good. Evil was not part of creation. Evil is not a separate force - it is like cold, which is an absence of heat. Cars do not have two equal parts in the engine - one broken and one not broken. Evil is reliant on good to exist - Good exists alone.

I am not even going to get into this.

Well, Augustine and Lewis based what they wrote about on scripture - to claim otherwise is ignorant. There theology is so foundational within Christianity that you probably share many of their beliefs and do not even know it.

Oh really? So they weren't human and prone to error!!!!!!!! God help us! God forbid that we EVER take a man's word as gospel without lining it up with Scripture! I KNOW what I believe, and I know where I stand. I stand fully on Scripture alone. I have not based any doctrine on something man has created, even though some seem to think that is ok!

Yep! That is the Good News! As far as my soul being safe....I am in a saving relationship with Jesus, which is rebuilding my heart into the heart it was originally created to be. If I continue to submit my will to Christ's sanctification, He will finish the good work of my redemption. I guess I really do not think of it as being 'safe' - it is sort of like being in a good marriage - are you really safe from divorce?


Doing whatever I want means following my ego, which leads to Hell. Submitting my will to Christ's means redemption. We are called to practice our sanctification by loving God and our neighbor - it's the whole point of Christianity.


George W. Bush is the only leader I know foolish enough to declare victory before finishing a war. Jesus has restored a relationship with us and now we need to submit to His sanctification. The only war is with our false selves.

My dear friend, I would love to see what would happen if YOU were president of the USA. Perhaps you would view things differently! In case you are wondering, if we have been sanctified by Jesus' blood, how can we be wicked?! Those darts are not from us, it from the wicked, or as the version you use puts it, the wicked ONE! I think that is referring to Satan!


1. We are still prone to selfishness
2. Satan worship is following demonic examples - worship of the ego. If you do not believe me, ask any Satanist.
3. Yep. The 80s were filled with claims of Satan worship - 99% turned out to be false. Google 'satanic scare 80s'
4. Your ego is what is going to damn you....not any demon. Even Satan knows that - his ego damned him.
Imaginary? Ha! The false self is hardly imaginary! Your false self or ego is fully capable of driving you right off a cliff. If you really need to believe that a demon is required to tempt your false self, do what works for you. The fact is, hormones and a pretty face needs no encouragement for most.

Look here. This forum is about the death penalty. If you want to have a discussion over whether Satan is alive and active in today's world, start the forum. I am not going to say anymore, as I cannot see the point. You can go on believing that there is only yourself to worry about, that is probably true. At the moment, I don't think Satan is that worried about you. He's probably killing himself laughing over the fact that you think HE is no longer active!


Yep. Paul is talking about evil. The world is following the doctrine of demons instead of submitting to Christ - collectively denying what they were created to do and choosing to worship the ego. So how do we battle against this doctrine? Submit to Christ and receive His justification; receive and practice His sanctification by practicing love. Love is the only way to prevail against the lack of love.

Oh, yes. I can just see the beautiful logic! Some foreign army marches onto Australia's shores intent on destroying and killing, and I just show them love by letting them do whatever they wish to me and my country! God! How can we get so warped in our thinking?! If an enemy ever sets foot in my country, I WILL show love. I'LL SHOW IT TO MY COUNTRYMEN BY PUTTING MY LIFE ON THE LINE FOR THEM AND THEIR FREEDOM!


Oh boy...I've seen this verse butchered in my day, but this is a new low.....

Jesus is reassuring His disciples that His Church will never be extinguished from the Earth. That is it. Jesus spends quite a bit of time reassuring His disciples because they had a lot to fear being His followers in those days.

You seem to have missed the part about the Gates of Hell. I guess you think that GATES WALK! I don't think Jesus would have said 'gates' of hell if he was talking about a passive Christianity! GATES DON'T COME TO YOU, YOU GO TO THEM!

Jesus was talking to Jews who believed they were members of God's Chosen People, by birth. He was letting them know that the traditions of their families was not going to restore them to a relationship with God - they needed to love. Hyperbole was a common form of speak during Jesus's day - He makes use of it here.
Really? Well I can't see the hyperbole?! It might not be the case in every instance, but all the same, there will be division, and it will be in the most foundational blocks of society! Back to the death penalty. If you want to continue this discussion, start it in another forum.



I think this objection has already been answered. This one hasn't: WHY WOULD JESUS TELL HIS DISCIPLES TO BUY A SWORD?



I agree with you. I get sick of hearing people cry about 'mercy' for the killer, and seemingly forget about mercy for the murdered. Issues are being made about the 70x7. Ummm, please, let's have logic here. Does that mean that someone can go about murdering and we just keep forgiving? I SEVERELY DOUBT THAT! I don't think Jesus was saying that we should only forgive 490 times, but I think Jesus was saying that if our brother offends us and asks for forgiveness, give it to him. I don't think he was referring to murder and stealing! Responsibility for actions is a must. Without it we fall apart, as is being so readily demonstrated for us in today's world.

So why are you getting so mad? You act like I am derailing your post when I am simply addressing your heresy - Modalism and Dualism. You brought up the Dualism - I simply pointed it out. As far as love is concerned - human judgment has nothing to do with it! In fact, we are called not to judge! And then claiming the Trinity is not found in the Bible? Taking the 'Gates of Hell' literally? Inserting new doctrine into the Christian narrative like dispensationalism?!?!? I will be praying for you and your understanding of scripture and the basics of Christianity, friend.......

 

[Groundzero]

So why are you getting so mad? You act like I am derailing your post when I am simply addressing your heresy - Modalism and Dualism. You brought up the Dualism - I simply pointed it out. As far as love is concerned - human judgment has nothing to do with it! In fact, we are called not to judge! And then claiming the Trinity is not found in the Bible? Taking the 'Gates of Hell' literally? Inserting new doctrine into the Christian narrative like dispensationalism?!?!? I will be praying for you and your understanding of scripture and the basics of Christianity, friend.......

I am not acting mad. I have a fully level head on my body. Yes, I believe that there are only two kingdoms to which one can belong. As for Modalism, I don't believe it. You have got me totally out of context. I am Oneness. I believe that there is one God, the Father. His name is Jesus. This all-present spirit fused itself into a human body in order to redeem us. The Holy Ghost is the Spirit of Jesus that in-fills the Believer. There is one God, undivided who is all-powerful, all-knowing, and eternal. I am explaining this quickly so you know exactly what I believe. If you want to debate about this, let's do it elsewhere. I am not claiming. I am merely stating a fact. There is no where that we find the word, and there are two places which mention all three 'persons' together, depending on what version you use. One is in Matthew 28. If we are going to claim that that is sufficient evidence, may I remind the reader that Jesus says to baptise in THE NAME? The name of the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are all the same, it stands to reason that they are all the same person! Then there is the reference in 1 John I think it is. This does not support anything. All it says is that the three, Father, Word, and Holy Spirit are ONE! Once again, I am merely explaining what I believe. If you want to discuss it more, let's do it in another forum.
As to the Gates of Hell, WHY were gates used? I don't think God is so careless as just to put gates there. Gates do not move. I don't take it that there are literal Gates, but I do believe that Christians should be taking the fight to the enemy. I think soldiers would agree with me that when you defend, you are on the back foot, whereas when you attack, the enemy is on the back foot. But then, you don't believe that we are in war with anyone but ourselves.
I don't claim to know everything, but I know the basics of Christianity and I can defend them fully. I don't rely on man-made creeds to support them, all I need is the Bible.

'And he was reckoned with transgressors', because Jesus taught them to 'love their enemies' and 'do good to those who hate you'. Using swords would be EXTREME disobedience, and thereby they would be 'transgressors'.

No, I didn't say nor imply it was stupid. I was wondering if you were referring to the OT death penalty since you stated 'the death penalty is never actually abolished'.

I can say right now, that deep inside, my heart cries out for every person, even those who do such horrible things, such as Ted Bundy and Adolf Hitler. Nevertheless, I don't have any issues over the fact that one was executed and the other committed suicide. It was the penalty that they had to pay for their crimes.
Yes, I am referring to the death penalty. It was never abolished. The only 'objections' are verses like the ones you posted, they do not actually address the subject.

 

[discipleHelovestoo]

[/size]
Yes, we have posted those Scriptures. You want to explain them away.

humor me - repost these New Covenant scriptures that you base your belief on

 

[Duckybill]

I can say right now, that deep inside, my heart cries out for every person, even those who do such horrible things, such as Ted Bundy and Adolf Hitler. Nevertheless, I don't have any issues over the fact that one was executed and the other committed suicide. It was the penalty that they had to pay for their crimes.
Yes, I am referring to the death penalty. It was never abolished. The only 'objections' are verses like the ones you posted, they do not actually address the subject.

So you believe it's right to execute adulterers, homosexuals, those who work on the Sabbath, those of other religions, etc., as Moses commanded?

 

[Groundzero]

humor me - repost these New Covenant scriptures that you base your belief on

I think you know full well what Scriptures they are based on. Scripture is Scripture.

 

[aspen]

I am not acting mad. I have a fully level head on my body. Yes, I believe that there are only two kingdoms to which one can belong. As for Modalism, I don't believe it. You have got me totally out of context. I am Oneness. I believe that there is one God, the Father. His name is Jesus. This all-present spirit fused itself into a human body in order to redeem us. The Holy Ghost is the Spirit of Jesus that in-fills the Believer. There is one God, undivided who is all-powerful, all-knowing, and eternal. I am explaining this quickly so you know exactly what I believe. If you want to debate about this, let's do it elsewhere. I am not claiming. I am merely stating a fact. There is no where that we find the word, and there are two places which mention all three 'persons' together, depending on what version you use. One is in Matthew 28. If we are going to claim that that is sufficient evidence, may I remind the reader that Jesus says to baptise in THE NAME? The name of the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are all the same, it stands to reason that they are all the same person! Then there is the reference in 1 John I think it is. This does not support anything. All it says is that the three, Father, Word, and Holy Spirit are ONE! Once again, I am merely explaining what I believe. If you want to discuss it more, let's do it in another forum.
As to the Gates of Hell, WHY were gates used? I don't think God is so careless as just to put gates there. Gates do not move. I don't take it that there are literal Gates, but I do believe that Christians should be taking the fight to the enemy. I think soldiers would agree with me that when you defend, you are on the back foot, whereas when you attack, the enemy is on the back foot. But then, you don't believe that we are in war with anyone but ourselves.
I don't claim to know everything, but I know the basics of Christianity and I can defend them fully. I don't rely on man-made creeds to support them, all I need is the Bible.

"While Oneness theologian Dr. David Bernard indicates that Modalistic Monarchianism and Oneness are essentially the same (so long as one does not understand Modalism to be the same as Patripassianism),"

 

[Groundzero]

So you believe it's right to execute adulterers, homosexuals, those who work on the Sabbath, those of other religions, etc., as Moses commanded?

Adultery, homosexuality, etc are not crimes against someone else. The reason they had the death sentence as well was to keep the land clean. Murder is a crime against someone else, and it isn't just taking something they own, it's taking their life. Life is priceless.

 

[veteran]

For anyone who has doubts that the death penalty still exists per the New Testament, then let Apostle Paul give you understanding...

1 Tim 1:8-11
8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;
11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.
(KJV)

Did Apostle Paul forget about Christ's command to love our enemies when he said that? Paul had The Lord's Will in proper perspective to His law, which is why he brought that subject up per New Covenant doctrine.


Paul also taught us this per New Covenant doctrine...

Rom 13:1-8
1 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.
2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.
3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:
4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.
5 Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake.
6 For for this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God's ministers, attending continually upon this very thing.
7 Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour.
8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
(KJV)


God has ordained the powers over us, His wrath and terror upon those who do evil, and good for those who do good. It's simple.

Rom.13:4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

Just who is Paul talking about there as that "minister of God"? Rulers He places in power over us. What do rulers use to rule with and keep the peace? They use law. God has given them the power to carry it out too, even using the sword to execute wrath upon those who do evil.

There is an end for those who love one another. And there is an end for those that do evil. Those are two separate works not to be confused with each other. This reveals just 'how' our Lord Jesus did not come to destroy the law, but to fulfill, which Paul clearly shows He did not just do away with God's laws that govern His creation.

 

[Duckybill]

Adultery, homosexuality, etc are not crimes against someone else. The reason they had the death sentence as well was to keep the land clean. Murder is a crime against someone else, and it isn't just taking something they own, it's taking their life. Life is priceless.

To keep the land clean? Why not now? You can't pick and choose which commandments. That's not consistent.



So tell us Vet, which Covenant are you under? The New or the Law of Moses? Doesn't sound like you know. If you want to be under THE LAW then you MUST keep all of it.

 

[discipleHelovestoo]

For anyone who has doubts that the death penalty still exists per the New Testament, then let Apostle Paul give you understanding...

1 Tim 1:8-11
8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;
11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.
(KJV)

Did Apostle Paul forget about Christ's command to love our enemies when he said that? Paul had The Lord's Will in proper perspective to His law, which is why he brought that subject up per New Covenant doctrine.


Paul also taught us this per New Covenant doctrine...

Rom 13:1-8
1 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.
2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.
3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:
4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.
5 Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake.
6 For for this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God's ministers, attending continually upon this very thing.
7 Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour.
8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
(KJV)


God has ordained the powers over us, His wrath and terror upon those who do evil, and good for those who do good. It's simple.

Rom.13:4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

Just who is Paul talking about there as that "minister of God"? Rulers He places in power over us. What do rulers use to rule with and keep the peace? They use law. God has given them the power to carry it out too, even using the sword to execute wrath upon those who do evil.

There is an end for those who love one another. And there is an end for those that do evil. Those are two separate works not to be confused with each other. This reveals just 'how' our Lord Jesus did not come to destroy the law, but to fulfill, which Paul clearly shows He did not just do away with God's laws that govern His creation.

1 Timothy 1:5-7 KJVR

(5) Now the end of the commandment is charity out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned:

(6) From which some having swerved have turned aside unto vain jangling;

(7) Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm. (emphasis added)


you've missed Paul's point - this wasn't about the death penalty - it was about Charity - LOVE.


1 Timothy 1:12-14 KJVR

(12) And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who hath enabled me, for that he counted me faithful, putting me into the ministry;

(13) Who was before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did it ignorantly in unbelief.

(14) And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.


Acts 22:20 KJVR

(20) And when the blood of thy martyr Stephen was shed, I also was standing by, and consenting unto his death, and kept the raiment of them that slew him.


this is Paul admitting that he was an accomplice to Stephen's death - an accomplice to murder - Paul's point in all of this is to not be disobedient to LOVE - this is not justification for the death penalty.


Romans 13:9-10 KJVR

(9) For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.

(10) Love worketh no ill to his neighbor: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law. (emphasis added)


read a little farther - to the conclusion - before you take scriptures and claim they justify the death penalty.

 

[rockytopva]

I have no use for those who commit violence against their fellow man... As far as I am concerned

For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:

For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake. - Romans 13: 3,4,5




The rulers of this world have been commissioned from God to carry out evil for evil...

 

[discipleHelovestoo]

Matthew 5:38-48 KJVR

(38) Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:

(39) But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.

(40) And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloak also.

(41) And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain.

(42) Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.

(43) Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbor, and hate thine enemy.

(44) But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

(45) That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

(46) For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?

(47) And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?

(48) Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect. (emphasis added)


how can you reconcile these commands from the Master with the concept that "The rulers of this world have been commissioned from God to carry out evil for evil..."?

 

[Duckybill]

I have no use for those who commit violence against their fellow man... As far as I am concerned

For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:

For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake. - Romans 13: 3,4,5

The rulers of this world have been commissioned from God to carry out evil for evil...

All governments are appointed by God, including Hitler, Stalin, Idi Amin, Saddam, etc.

Romans 13:1-2 (ESV)
1 Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. 2 Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment.

 

[discipleHelovestoo]

John 8:7 KJVR

(7) So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.



what has not been addressed by those who believe that the death penalty is for today is this:

who is qualified to judge and condemn?

according to the Master, it would be 'he that is without sin among you' - is there anyone here who would qualify?

 

[Duckybill]

what has not been addressed by those who believe that the death penalty is for today is this:

who is qualified to judge and condemn?

according to the Master, it would be 'he that is without sin among you' - is there anyone here who would qualify?

Excellent point. Nobody here is qualified. Anyone who condemns an innocent person to die will have bloody hands on Judgment Day.