You recently accused me of falsifying scripture, when all I had done was quote verbatim from the Geneva Bible. Bearing false witness. Shall we add that to the growing list of things which make your religion evil?
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Reasons why the Jehovah’s Witness religion is false (Despite my love for them as human beings)
- Thread starter Bible Highlighter
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You recently accused me of falsifying scripture, when all I had done was quote verbatim from the Geneva Bible. Bearing false witness. Shall we add that to the growing list of things which make your religion evil?
@Bible Highlighter I wouldn’t have done what you did in starting this thread. It will come back on your head.
Is this the way you want others to treat you?
It’s not too late to get off this path. I’d like to ask you to think about deleting the thread. It’s your thread and you can do whatever you want as long as the moderators allow it, but I hope you’ll reconsider.
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To the JWs and other non-trinitarians on the forum: Please don’t do to the trinitarians what a trinitarian decided, perhaps without giving it too much forethought, to do to the JWs.
Is this the way you want others to treat you?
It’s not too late to get off this path. I’d like to ask you to think about deleting the thread. It’s your thread and you can do whatever you want as long as the moderators allow it, but I hope you’ll reconsider.
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To the JWs and other non-trinitarians on the forum: Please don’t do to the trinitarians what a trinitarian decided, perhaps without giving it too much forethought, to do to the JWs.
@Bible Highlighter I just finished reading John 8:1-11.
I won’t post any further in your thread, but I will leave it with a request.
I would like for you to read, again, John 8:1-11.
Do whatever you think best after that.
I won’t post any further in your thread, but I will leave it with a request.
I would like for you to read, again, John 8:1-11.
Do whatever you think best after that.
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
So now we have permission to call all those who disagree with us 'of the devil' ? .....and quote texts which we think apply to them but exclude us?
No need. JW's murdered their own people by the false belief of refusing blood transfusions.
As for Trinitarian churches: That is a big tent you are painting there. Trinitarians would be both Protestant, and Catholic churches. It would also include non-denominational churches, as well (of which you really cannot pigeon hole so easily).
I am not Catholic, and I disagree with their unbiblical sinful practices that I believe are also evil.
As for Protestants: Well, I'm not really Protestant in my view of salvation, either. I do not agree with Martin Luther's evil statements (if they are true), like him saying: “No sin can separate us from Him, even if we were to kill or commit adultery thousands of times each day."
Even a blind squirrel can find a nut. So while the majority of churches may hold to a particular true teaching, that does not mean that they are correct on other things. Protestants and Catholics differ greatly among themselves but they both are in error in different ways. Granted, Protestantism is more correct than Catholicism, but Protestantism still has it's problems. Again, that does not mean the Bible does not plainly teach the Trinity. It does. Well... that is if you believe the Bible. If you don't, then there is no point in having this discussion. For faith comes by hearing and hearing the word of God (Romans 10:17).
What is worse than all that? The Jews killing their own Messiah who is the creator of the Universe and their Savior. Of course, many Jews at Pentecost repented of that. Why don't you join them?
You said:
I am not in support of them. So you are barking up the wrong tree.
You said:
Sorry. They are not my churches. I don't agree with Protestantism and Catholicism.
I just believe the Bible (Old and New Testament).
Jesus and the apostles never would have condoned the actions of Protestants and Catholics (let alone their odd beliefs and traditions).
But again, that does not mean the Trinity is not taught in the Bible.
As I said, a blind squirrel can find a nut.
You said:
Again, they are not my churches.
I don't fully agree with Protestant churches and or Catholic churches.
The only good thing that came out of the Protestant church was the Bible.
Other than that, I am not buying their man made traditions that makes void the Word of God.
Sure, Protestants may get a few key doctrines correct, but that does not mean they don't have a false view of faith, sin and salvation.
You said:
Jesus taught Non-Violence in the New Testament. So His true followers throughout history were Non-Violent.
Who are they? Only God knows them. I am not sure it is recorded in man's popular history books. My church is not Protestant or Catholic, but I seek to be of the body of Christ that is closest to the early church we read about in Scripture. That to me is the true church of Christ today and throughout history. But your big name brand churches? Yeah, okay. You can falsely associate me with them if you like. But it would not be true.
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Notice the OP title. It also says “Despite my love for them as human beings.” So I am not just having a hate on here. I am calling their false beliefs as evil. There is nothing wrong with calling false beliefs as evil if the Bible condemns those false beliefs. Are you a liberal? Do other Christians call you liberal? Do you take the Bible not so literally? I do remember you cracking jokes when we talk about the Bible in other threads. So I don't think you take the Bible as seriously as I do. This could be why we disagree here.
So you believe in Universalism in that everyone is going to be saved and there is no real true evil?
Are there no false beliefs in your world view with those false beliefs being evil?
Psalms talks about hating every false way.
Psalms 119:104
“Through thy precepts I get understanding: therefore I hate every false way.”
Hating every false way is obviously talking about evil ways.
But if that does not work for you, there is also Proverbs.
Proverbs 8:13
“The fear of the LORD is to hate evil: pride, and arrogancy, and the evil way, and the froward mouth, do I hate.”
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
One can make the Bible ones religion just as one can make football one's religion. The Jews made what Christians call half the Bible, their religion. They were so right in their own estimation ......and still think they are right that they killed the Prince of Life.
As Christians we think we are righter than the Jews because we have the whole Bible. We insist on categorising each other and argue about irrelevancies yet claiming God's word as their author.
We claim Jesus as our Lord yet make him so unattractive for unbelievers when they see our posts on these forums. We pat ourselves on the back constantly letting others know how right we are and how wrong they are.....your OP demonstrates this and your self righteousness confirms it although you are blind to this yourself.
You want to know which category I fit into and which one others think I fit into.....questions which I think are totally irrelevant yet it seems are on your priority list....for what purpose?.....to pigeon hole me like you do in the OP? and then run me down?
Tell me about Jesus so I am drawn to him. If you cannot and are still interested, make enquiries and learn from him. Put the self appointed teacher role aside and become the student.
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So you believe that I am just as equally teaching a false way or church that is evil because I believe in the Bible’s teaching on the Trinity, thereby making me a hypocrite in calling a clearly false cult religion as being evil? If so… I already told you before that I don’t agree with all of Protestantism and I especially do not back their history entirely, etcetera (Although I do recognize God used Protestants to preserve His Word, i.e. the Bible - But like I said before, God used the Jews to bring in their Messiah even when they rejected Him on a national level; That does not mean God is done with the Israelites). Neither do I agree with Catholicism, or Orthodox churches, either. Do you not think JW’s is a cult and evil?
You do realize that the Bible comes from Protestant movement and so if you also believe in calling something a false way or as evil, you can just as equally be a hypocrite because you use the Bible based on your faulty line of reasoning here (in that you must be attached with the violent atrocities that all Protestants had done in the name of God). In other words, you throw the baby out with the bath water. The Jews rejected their own Messiah but that does not mean we should join them. Just because some men make correct decisions at one point in time does not mean that all who were once Jewish were false. That’s your same line of reasoning with those who believe in the Bible’s teaching on the Trinity. I believe in Non-Violence because the New Testament teaches that. So why would I agree with the evil violences of the churches over the years? I don’t even agree with their view on the faith, sin, and salvation (Because it runs contrary to the Bible).
Please elaborate in more detail on exactly why Matthew 7:5 applies to me.
Otherwise you are just throwing around unfounded accusations mindlessly without really knowing what I actually believe.
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There are so many wrong things in this statement, I don’t even know where to begin.
If you don’t make the Bible your religion or practice of faith, then you are following another God that is not of the Bible. True Christians follow the Scriptures alone because that is what the Bible itself teaches for us to do. For 2 Timothy 3:16 basically says all Scripture is profitable for doctrine, instruction in righteousness so that the man of God may be perfect unto every good work. Faith comes by hearing, and hearing the Word of God (Romans 10:17). This would be Scripture or your Bible and nothing else. That is why the JW cult religion is wrong because they add something extra to the Bible that contradicts the Bible.
As for the Jews: They did not crucify their Messiah based on Scripture. If you were to ever read the Bible more closely, they ignored the weightier matters of the Law and the had traditions that made void the Word of God (Which was Scripture even at that time). For if the Jews followed faithfully the Torah Scriptures, they would have accepted Jesus as their Messiah. This is why what you said is silly and shows your lack of understanding the Bible.
You also compare football (a man made sport) to the Bible. I cannot imagine a more highly offensive statement about God’s Word. You have cracked jokes in other threads on other Bible topics when serious Bible discussions were being made. This again shows how little value you place upon the Bible. This is why you need to be born again of water (i.e. by the Word of God, the Scriptures) and be born again of the Spirit and accept the real Jesus of the Bible. Otherwise you will never see and you will just continue to mock the Bible and it’s related topics.
You said:
It takes spiritual discernment and understanding to stand for the Bible alone position as a part of being a faithful Christian to God’s Word. If you are not against calling the JW’s as false and evil, then why don’t you join them? Just know if you leave, they are commanded to hate you (Which goes against the command of our Lord to love even our enemies). This is why what you believe is highly illogical. But this thread is not about analyzing why we should call the JW church as being evil. This thread is merely to point out the facts of why they are evil. If you don’t agree. That’s your opinion, and I don’t share it because I stand by the Bible, a book that you seem to think is no different than football.
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But it’s not peace, but it is war you have made with me based on a faulty assumption. Again, according to you false line of thinking (because I believe in the Trinity) if you believe the Bible alone which is a Protestant position, then you must also agree with their violent atrocities in history and that means you cannot call out another religion or false way as evil. This is not what the Bible teaches. We can label false beliefs and religions and call them evil. Just as the Jews have messed up in history many times, that does not mean that Jesus was not of the Jews was correct. But you throw the baby out with the bath water. Protestants did not write the Bible. They merely translated it. I believe God used imperfect men to preserve His Word. It also does not mean that even the translators would have agreed to the violence that Protestants would later do in the name of God, either. Again, God can use people despite their imperfections. So the Trinity has nothing to do with the violence done by Protestants.
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I’m neither Catholic nor Protestant, nor trinitarian. I didn’t wage war on you. I asked you to reconsider the approach you’re taking and I’ve asked others not to do what you have done. What you or they do with my request is out of my hands.
What I have done is exposed a false cult religion that seeks to attack the Bible. If you don’t have a problem with the JW’s in being a false and evil way then why don’t you join them? You do realize if you leave… they will hate you (Which goes against our Lord’s instruction to love even our enemies).
You did wage war on me with your words by falsely accusing me with Matthew 7:5. You still thinking I am acting hypocritical even after I explained things. But you really don’t know what I believe. There is no church history that I can find for my belief. Do you know what I believe? Most likely you don’t and so… you are associating me with other groups that has nothing to do with what the Bible itself teaches. Just because men translated the Scriptures does not mean God agrees with their actions or the actions of men claiming to be a part of the translators. The Trinity teaching is derived from the Bible itself and it has nothing to do with those churches who have done violence in God’s name who were Trinitarian. That’s what your not getting. The teaching of the Trinity is not the corner market sole teaching of one particular religion like say the JW’s who created their own false doctrines out of thin air that runs contrary to the Bible. For example: They reject blood transfusions. That’s a doctrine they created and it is solely their doctrine they invented. But to lump all Trinity churches into one big ball of wax and say they are all false because some Protestants and Catholics have done evil is to simply be misinformed about history and the Bible itself. Catholics and Protestants did not insert the teaching of the Trinity in the Bible. The Protestants merely translated the Bible and that teaching can be derived from the Bible plainly. It does not matter what the history of Protestants are like. As I said, I don’t accept their view of the faith, sin, and salvation. That does not mean God could not have used them to translate the Scriptures accurately. Just as God used the Jews who were disobedient to bring in the Messiah for the salvation of all of mankind.
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VictoryinJesus
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What is scary is considering does religion breed narcissistic behaviors? Does God desire narcissists?
1) superiority and a nature of entitlement. Different from self confidence, trust, belief, hope, patience, long-suffering or faith…The world of the narcissist is all about good/bad, superior/inferior, right/wrong.
There is definite hierarchy with the narcissist …but they are always at the top, and you are always at the bottom.
2) deception: ability to dish it out, but inability to bear it. Anytime the facade, or deception, or perception of “self” is threatened: then comes wrath, rage, defensiveness, or dismissal…unable to handle what is covered up underneath, unable to come face to face with vulnerability or a weakness or the very thing claimed to be despised. Ability to turn it around, that again, you are on the bottom and they are superior through dismissal.
3) doing anything to get what they want. Their expectations better be met, no matter what. Holding grudges. Resentment. Bitterness. Revenge. Publicly humiliating or shaming others. Taking pleasure in others failures, taking pleasure in their shortcomings. taking pleasure in another persons “sin nature” which only validates their lack of one, which validates even more their own righteousness in freedom from any sin. for instance street corner bullhorns: craving the high of feeling above or exalted, craving the spot-light where a starved ego can openly feed through condemnation of the crowds…all the while supporting their lack of condemnation by their “genuine” love…for you!
4) Lack of Any and All accountability. How can you change what you refuse to acknowledge? Being so fully convinced, they have convinced themselves this is: the Gods honest truth. And nothing will change what can not be there.
5) prone to envy
Envious of others.
Downplaying others “pathological envy” with the ability to turn it around to convince others and themselves: it is the others fault, it is the other who envies them. (defection, denial, deception)… a cloak of malice?
I’ve lost my train of thought…point is I can see the works of the flesh in there. Which we all struggle with. We can lie and deny all we want to say we don’t, but that too reminds me of narcissistic behavior. I can see how religion could support narcissistic behaviors, especially with a sword placed in the hand. Does God support narcissistic behavior? Does God desire us to grow more narcissistic or less? Can narcissism claim to have “put off the works of the flesh”
So why don’t you join the JW religion? Do you believe all religions lead to the same place? Do you believe everyone teaches the same Jesus? Do you think a false Jesus (or another Jesus) can save a person?
As for Narcissists: Well, Narcissistic personality disorder is a mental condition in which people have an inflated sense of their own importance, a deep need for excessive attention and admiration, troubled relationships, and a lack of empathy for others.
First, I did not uplift myself. I am uplifting the Bible in light of false JW evil teachings.
Second, in the OP I said I love them. That is not an example of a Narcissist because no Narcissist would say that and mean it. To hate a false religious system and yet love the people and wanting to see them saved has nothing to do with Narcissism. So you are barking up the wrong tree and falsely seeking to accuse me and my stand for the truth. Again, if you don’t think the JW’s are evil. Join them. Just know they will hate if you leave (Which runs contrary to Jesus telling us to love our enemies).
VictoryinJesus
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I’m not talking about religions …or different domination because it is everywhere. As for how much you love the JW’s that is between you and God. All I’m talking about is life application of facing our truth. Mine is this: at work there was this lady…super sweet. We were friends because we were both put in a sales position. While she was my friend, secretly it honestly made me feel better on days she struggled to sale. Internally I could say “look at what all you have sold today.” And somehow her struggle made my success appear better. Like the expression: misery loves company…I have to wonder why misery loves company. One day in a meeting …the specialist were making fun of a lady…overhearing their conversation I realized it was her. I was always invited to the meeting, she wasn’t. I felt bad for her. But then I had some bad thoughts of my own when she struggled. This lady was supportive, encouraging me every day. Cheering when I was successful. I’ll never know what was really in her heart, but I know what was in mine. How fast it turns though…they did away with my position and she is now a Specialist. I am jobless. Point is, I have ugly thoughts. While I can say I love her, there was still something not so nice there competing with love. I wanted to do better. I wanted to feel better about myself. At her expense. That is not so pretty or desirable but it is the truth.
If you are in a false religion you cannot be saved. A person can be nice and be on their way to hell. I can see that anything I say here will fall on deaf ears for many here. This is because of the liberal approach many Christians today have taken with the Bible. You see it as hate speech, when in reality it is exposing a false way in love because I care for people’s souls. I am not going to sugar coat the truth and say JW’s have the correct way. They don’t. Hence, why their religion is not of God and of the evil one. If you cannot see it, all I can do is to tell you to read more closely about false doctrines mentioned in the New Testament and see the apostle’s opinions of false teachings. Let God’s Word open your eyes, and don’t let your own thinking be the faith.
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