Everyone Who Argues Against the Deity of Jesus

[Matthias]

My thought of the day for this thread: The Ante Nicene early Church Fathers themselves did not hold to this Boards Statement of Faith.

Bonus thought: Even many among those who adhered to the Nicene Creed in A.D. 325 did not hold to this Boards Statement of Faith. The revised Nicene Creed (in A.D. 381) forced them out of the Church.

 

[Waiting on him]

seen God at any time?

My thought of the day for this thread: The Ante Nicene early Church Fathers themselves did not hold to this Boards Statement of Faith.

Bonus thought: Even many among those who adhered to the Nicene Creed in A.D. 325 did not hold to this Boards Statement of Faith. The revised Nicene Creed (in A.D. 381) forced them out of the Church.

Constantine being the politician he was knew he had to appeal to pagans.

 

[David H.]

The SOF says Jesus was the son, but it also says he was God, so perhaps it should be re-written to make it perfectly clear where exactly it stands?
Anyway I'm sure you agree that the scriptures are more important than any SOF, and one scripture says-
"Who is it that overcomes the world? Only he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God" (1 John 5:5)
But because you and some others don't believe that, you're definitely candidates for the naughty step..

Jesus Proclaimed Himself to be both the Son of God and the Son of Man, these two go hand in hand as the Son of Man He was fully Human, as the Son of God He was proclaiming Himself fully God. This has been and forever will be the test of the spirit in the person claiming to be a Christian. By Being the Son of God, Jesus is saying He is distinct from the Father, But at the same time He says I and my Father are one. (John 10:30) The immediate reaction of the Jews was to take up stones and stone him "because thou, being a man, makest thyself God." (John 10:33) So the Jews knew His claim to be the Son of God and His proclamation of oneness with the Father, meant he was claiming to be God, and that very belief is the essence of Christian faith. So to truly Believe that Jesus is the Son of God is to declare that he is God, because he and the Father are one. To proclaim and believe he is the Son of Man is to believe he was fully Human.... Denying one or the other of these facts fails the test of the spirit in us, and we all need to re-examine what spirit it is that controls us, Because the Holy Spirit bears witness in our lives of these facts. Not a lesser God, or demi-god like Tammuz..... we do not worship Tammuz, we worship the Only Begotten Son of God.

Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God. (John 5:18)

 

[Matthias]

seen God at any time?

Constantine being the politician he was knew he had to appeal to pagans.

I recently finished reading a book on the Council of Nicaea. Constantine was a shrewd politician, and an evil man throughout this life, but the decision at Nicaea was made by the assembled clergy. They didn’t decide in favor of his original understanding, which was a misunderstanding of the terminology on his part. He quickly got on board with it once his misunderstanding was corrected. He endorsed and enforced their decision.

Constantine was tough on the Arians, but his sister was an Arian and she eventually prevailed upon him to “lighten up” on them. Constantine banished Arius, then warmly welcomed him back. When Athanasius refused to reconcile with Arius, Constantine sent Athanasius into exile. Nearly half of Athanasius’ time as a clergyman was spent in exile.

St. Constantine was always a superstitious man and he murdered his family, after “converting” to Christianity. He was so enamored with the bishops that he said even if he were to catch them committing sexual crimes he would conceal it.

 

[Waiting on him]

Jesus Proclaimed Himself to be both the Son of God and the Son of Man, these two go hand in hand as the Son of Man He was fully Human, as the Son of God He was proclaiming Himself fully God. This has been and forever will be the test of the spirit in the person claiming to be a Christian. By Being the Son of God, Jesus is saying He is distinct from the Father, But at the same time He says I and my Father are one. (John 10:30) The immediate reaction of the Jews was to take up stones and stone him "because thou, being a man, makest thyself God." (John 10:33) So the Jews knew His claim to be the Son of God and His proclamation of oneness with the Father, meant he was claiming to be God, and that very belief is the essence of Christian faith. So to truly Believe that Jesus is the Son of God is to declare that he is God, because he and the Father are one. To proclaim and believe he is the Son of Man is to believe he was fully Human.... Denying one or the other of these facts fails the test of the spirit in us, and we all need to re-examine what spirit it is that controls us, Because the Holy Spirit bears witness in our lives of these facts. Not a lesser God, or demi-god like Tammuz..... we do not worship Tammuz, we worship the Only Begotten Son of God.

Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God. (John 5:18)

Romans 8:14 KJV
[14] For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
Guess this means we’re all God according to your theology?

 

[dhh712]

I am open to having conversations with these people and I don't like censorship but these issues brought up in the OP are the subject of most threads on this forum. Still I don't think they should be censored. I'm kind of conflicted about this because the forum says it's a closed issue

It is my own personal policy to ignore any post in which the topic is the denial of the deity of Jesus. If there is no engagement, not much will come of such statements.

There appears to be an incongruity with the Statement of Faith and then there being, as the one poster pointed out, an Unorthodox Forum. Perhaps the members who subscribe to Unorthodoxy should be required to have as the "Faith" designation "Unorthodox" instead of "Christian" or at the very, very least "Unorthodox Christian". The incongruity of such members having a "Christian" designation to me is revealed by the referenced official statement declaring that Christianity is understood to be... [given statement which does include the deity of Jesus]. Then, such members who do not subscribe to said definition of Christianity are allowed to have as their faith designation "Christian". This to me appears to be similar to saying 1 + 1 = 3 not 2. It just doesn't add up.

 

[rockytopva]

Argue... In a spirituality forum? Paul classified variance as a work of the flesh...
Bible Gateway passage: Galatians 5:19-21 - King James Version
Definition of VARIANCE
And...
... Of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. - Galatians 5:20

 

[farouk]

Rather you think Jesus is God or not, neither side of the debate can grasped it.

Equal with God in Philippians 2 means that the Lord Jesus is God. Scripture leaves us in no doubt.

 

[farouk]

It is my own personal policy to ignore any post in which the topic is the denial of the deity of Jesus. If there is no engagement, not much will come of such statements.

There appears to be an incongruity with the Statement of Faith and then there being, as the one poster pointed out, an Unorthodox Forum. Perhaps the members who subscribe to Unorthodoxy should be required to have as the "Faith" designation "Unorthodox" instead of "Christian" or at the very, very least "Unorthodox Christian". The incongruity of such members having a "Christian" designation to me is revealed by the referenced official statement declaring that Christianity is understood to be... [given statement which does include the deity of Jesus]. Then, such members who do not subscribe to said definition of Christianity are allowed to have as their faith designation "Christian". This to me appears to be similar to saying 1 + 1 = 3 not 2. It just doesn't add up.

@dhh712 No beneficial outcome can emerge from a denial of the Lord Jesus' Deity...

 

[RLT63]

Argue... In a spirituality forum? Paul classified variance as a work of the flesh...
Bible Gateway passage: Galatians 5:19-21 - King James Version
Definition of VARIANCE
And...
... Of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. - Galatians 5:20

Good. Then no one should argue against the deity of Christ

 

[rockytopva]

Good. Then no one should argue against the deity of Christ

In which... I would assume such a one in the flesh and out of the Spirit. And the Bible thing to do when meeting these people is to stop... Give them a strange look... And keep on going!

Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. - Romans 16:17

 

[Matthias]

Like Jesus and Paul, I’m a Jewish monotheist.

In Jewish monotheism, the only deity of Christ is his God and Father.

Here I am. Who will stop …give me a strange look … and keep on going?

How about you @RLT63?

 

[RLT63]

Like Jesus and Paul, I’m a Jewish monotheist.

In Jewish monotheism, the only deity of Christ is his God and Father.

Here I am. Who will stop …give me a strange look … and keep on going?

How about you @RLT63?

I won't. I was attempting a bit of humor in my earlier post.

 

[Matthias]

Unity is a wonderful thing. What compromises are “you” willing to make in order to have it?

Trinitarians, binitarians and (many) unitarians are united on the deity of Christ’s person.

The proverbial saying is, “Politics makes strange bedfellows.”

How much more the politics of theology?

 

[RLT63]

Unity is a wonderful thing. What compromises are “you” willing to make in order to have it?

Trinitarians, binitarians and (many) unitarians are united on the deity of Christ’s person.

Unity is a wonderful thing. What compromises are “you” willing to make in order to have it?

Trinitarians, binitarians and (many) unitarians are united on the deity of Christ’s person.

The proverbial saying is, “Politics makes strange bedfellows.”

How much more the politics of theology?

The proverbial saying is, “Politics makes strange bedfellows.”

How much more the politics of theology?

I have been arguing with certain Trinitarians all day. They think their Church is the one true Church

 

[Matthias]

I have been arguing with certain Trinitarians all day. They think their Church is the one true Church

I know. I’ve been monitoring that conversation.

We all find things we can unite on with others and things which, in good conscience, we can’t and shouldn’t.

I liked the suggestion of one member concerning titling some Christians “orthodox” and titling other Christians “unorthodox”.

Ironically, few trinitarians insist upon historical orthodox trinitarianism. If the folks in charge were to make the decision to adopt the suggestion, not many trinitarians would be able to legitimately lay claim to the “orthodox” title; none of the binitarians and unitarians could.

Solution: Throw away historical orthodoxy as the measuring stick. Redefine “orthodoxy” in whatever way that the folks in charge deem palatable. Only then could trinitarians, binitarians and many unitarians bear a title which Church history since the 4th century denies them.

 

[Matthias]

As it stands, I’m a heterodox Christian. Given the option, I would happily bear that title in my profile, in place of the generic title “Christian”.

 

[David H.]

Romans 8:14 KJV
[14] For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
Guess this means we’re all God according to your theology?

Big difference between an adopted son (Small s) And the Only Begotten Son of God, (Big S).

 

[RLT63]

I know. I’ve been monitoring that conversation.

We all find things we can unite on with others and things which, in good conscience, we can’t and shouldn’t.

I liked the suggestion of one member concerning titling some Christians “orthodox” and titling other Christians “unorthodox”.

Ironically, few trinitarians insist upon historical orthodox trinitarianism. If the folks in charge were to make the decision to adopt the suggestion, not many trinitarians would be able to legitimately lay claim to the “orthodox” title; none of the binitarians and unitarians could.

Solution: Throw away historical orthodoxy as the measuring stick. Redefine “orthodoxy” in whatever way that the folks in charge deem palatable. Only then could trinitarians, binitarians and many unitarians bear a title which Church history since the 4th century denies them.

On another forum I'm on, their standard for being a Christian requires a belief in the Nicene creed. I wonder how many people on there who identify as Christians have read it or even know what it is.

 

[Dropship]

Of course I believe Jesus is the Son of God..

Good for you mate, he's the Son and can't therefore also be God..