The Problems of Perpetual Belief Alone Salvation-ism.

[Gospel Believer]

That “ Straight Gate” is Jesus......I already entered it.... about 50 years ago....

Let’s go eat some turkey.....and for all of you Legalists out there—- don’t forget that “ Gluttony” is a Sin..... lol......

Happy Thanksgiving!

 

[Bible Highlighter]

That “ Straight Gate” is Jesus......I already entered it.... about 50 years ago....

Read the context. These are people who already believe Jesus is their Lord.

Luke 13:25-27
25 “When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I know you not whence ye are: 26 Then shall ye begin to say, We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets. 27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.”

They were not able to enter because they worked iniquity (sin).

 

[mailmandan]

So it’s not just believing alone that will save you. Even the demons believe and tremble.

Think what you want to think....I won’t lose any sleep over it...

It’s a shame you have to misquote Scripture to try to make your invalid point....Want the Demons really “Believed “ was that there was “ ONE GOD” at a time when most civilizations ( like the Romans) believed that there were thousands of them —— the point that was trying to be made in these verses ( James 2:19) was that just because you believed the truth of One God verses thousands of them, That was better than nothing , but overall did not amount to a hill of beans.....if you could not read that verse and figure “ THAT” out, why would anybody think that you knew “ anything” about the Word Of God? A 12 year old could see it.....

Here’s something else a 12 year old could figure out—- When the question was asked of Paul by the Phillipian Jailer, “ What Must I do to be Saved?” , what did Paul say? Here was the Golden Opportunity to list all the things that confused people like you think are necessary to be Saved—- your entire, mighty Scripture Wall—- But Paul Only said the following : “ BELIEVE on the Lord, Jesus Christ and thou shall be Saved” .....PERIOD. If there were more to it than that, and Paul left it out and thereby was responsible for the Damnation of millions who simply Trust in what he said under the influence of the Holy Spirit, he should be cursed.....and he ain’t.

Amen! In James 2:19, we see that the demons believe "mental assent" that "there is one God," but they do not believe in/have faith in/trust in/reliance in Jesus Christ for salvation. In other words, they do not believe in/on the Lord Jesus Christ (Acts 16:31) and are not saved. Their trust and reliance is in Satan (and not in Jesus) as demonstrated by their rebellion in heaven and continuous evil works.

 

[mailmandan]

That “ Straight Gate” is Jesus......I already entered it.... about 50 years ago....

Amen! In Luke 13:24, we read "strive to enter through the narrow gate" (multiple other translations say "door") and in John 10:9, Jesus said - "I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture." Jesus is not teaching salvation by works here as legalists teach. Strive to enter through the narrow gate/door signifies a struggle against conflict. Christ was not suggesting that anyone could merit eternal life by striving or working hard enough to obtain it based on the merits of their works/performance, which contradicts numerous passages of scripture. (John 3:15,16,18; 6:28-29; Acts 10:43; 13:39; 16:31; Romans 4:5-6; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9; Philippians 3:9 etc..).

No matter how rigorously people labor, they could never earn their way to heaven by their works/performance. Entering through the narrow gate is nonetheless difficult because of it's cost in terms of human pride which prevents legalists/works salvationists/unbelievers from trusting exclusively in Jesus Christ as the ALL-SUFFICIENT means of their salvation and entering through the narrow gate/door. For such people their hands are full of their works and they will not let go in order to receive Christ through faith.

In context, Jesus is going through the cities and villages, teaching, and journeying toward Jerusalem and someone asked Him a question, "are only a few going to be saved?" Then Jesus answered by saying strive to enter through the narrow gate/door, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able. Once the door is shut, there will be those who stand outside and knock at the door, saying, ‘Lord, Lord, open for us,’ and He will answer and say to you, ‘I do not know you, where you are from...depart from Me, all you workers of iniquity.’ (vss. 25-27) This similar language is found in Matthew 7:22-23 in which we read of many (pseudo Christians/make believers) who said 'Lord, Lord' and (self righteously) trusted in their works for salvation, yet Jesus never knew them and told them to depart from Him and referred to these many people as those who work iniquity/practice lawlessness which is 'descriptive' of unbelievers.

 

[mailmandan]

Let’s go eat some turkey.....and for all of you Legalists out there—- don’t forget that “ Gluttony” is a Sin..... lol......

Happy Thanksgiving!

Happy Thanksgiving! I will be eating turkey AND Jack Stack BBQ at my brother in law's house for Thanksgiving. We are all originally from Kansas City and we love our BBQ!

 

[Gospel Believer]

Amen! In Luke 13:24, we read "strive to enter through the narrow gate" (multiple other translations say "door") and in John 10:9, Jesus said - "I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture." Jesus is not teaching salvation by works here as legalists teach. Strive to enter through the narrow gate/door signifies a struggle against conflict. Christ was not suggesting that anyone could merit eternal life by striving or working hard enough to obtain it based on the merits of their works/performance, which contradicts numerous passages of scripture. (John 3:15,16,18; 6:28-29; Acts 10:43; 13:39; 16:31; Romans 4:5-6; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9; Philippians 3:9 etc..).

No matter how rigorously people labor, they could never earn their way to heaven by their works/performance. Entering through the narrow gate is nonetheless difficult because of it's cost in terms of human pride which prevents legalists/works salvationists/unbelievers from trusting exclusively in Jesus Christ as the ALL-SUFFICIENT means of their salvation and entering through the narrow gate/door. For such people their hands are full of their works and they will not let go in order to receive Christ through faith.

In context, Jesus is going through the cities and villages, teaching, and journeying toward Jerusalem and someone asked Him a question, "are only a few going to be saved?" Then Jesus answered by saying strive to enter through the narrow gate/door, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able. Once the door is shut, there will be those who stand outside and knock at the door, saying, ‘Lord, Lord, open for us,’ and He will answer and say to you, ‘I do not know you, where you are from...depart from Me, all you workers of iniquity.’ (vss. 25-27) This similar language is found in Matthew 7:22-23 in which we read of many (pseudo Christians/make believers) who said 'Lord, Lord' and (self righteously) trusted in their works for salvation, yet Jesus never knew them and told them to depart from Him and referred to these many people as those who work iniquity/practice lawlessness which is 'descriptive' of unbelievers.

Excellent post! Typical.

 

[amigo de christo]

Many Christians today believe in Perpetual Belief Alone Salvation-ism.
They think that all you need is a belief alone in Jesus as the Savior and your good to go to enter Heaven.

While we are first saved by God's grace through faith (belief) without works in our Initial Salvation, faith does not remain as a belief alone.

Problem #1. - It ignores tons of warnings given to us on sin, and being fruitful in the Bible.
Problem #2. - It teaches that obedience to enter God's Kingdom is bad.
Problem #3. - There is no consistent standard of morality.
Problem #4. - It's a purely man made doctrine that attempts to call those who do good as bad, and those who do bad as being good.
Problem #5. - Believing a set of facts alone while persisting to disobey God does not really change you.
Problem #6. - Jesus came to save us from our sins, and not to just pay the penalty for our sin.
Problem #7. - It's the wide gate path (“Protestantism / Belief Alone-ism” is the second largest branch of Christianity in the world, with 800 million to 1 billion adherents).
Problem #8. - It is a lack of faith in what God's Word says involving God's instructions for our life.
Problem #9. - It's a religion of self or with one being their own god vs. making God (Jesus) the Lord of their life.
Problem #10. - The Bible actually warns against those who believe this way.
Problem #11. - It glorifies sin and darkness.
Problem #12. - It ignores the true purpose of grace. For Titus 2:11-12 says God's grace teaches us to deny ungodliness and that we should live righteously and godly in this present world. Also, see Ephesians 5:25-27.

Side Note:

Yes, Paul taught that we must believe in Jesus and His grace, and in the gospel in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4, but this was not Perpetual Belief Alone-ism with the exclusion of living holy afterwards. Paul taught Temporal Belief Alone-ism only in our Initial Salvation when we are first saved by God’s grace. Being saved by God’s grace in our Initial Salvation is not a process of salvation based on anything major we did whereby we can glory in own efforts. After a person is first saved by God’s grace by a belief alone in the Savior, they must enter the Sanctification of the Holy Spirit to live holy afterwards as a part of God’s plan of salvation.

Side Note 2:

The word “perpetual” in the context I am using it is defined as “unending.”

The TRUTH IS , BELIEVE YE IN JESUS CHRIST and YE shall be saved .
The PROBLEM IS , many dont BELIEVE CHRIST . That is the problem and thus they follow another jesus .
AKA , if one does not believe what he taught and said , THEIR BELIEF is a vain as mine once was .
A hearer only DECIEVES WHO , THEMSELVES . Too many make the claim THEY BELIEVE
but if they truly DID BELIEVE , then why do they not BELIEVE HIS TEACHINGS . WHY Do they pick and choose what to believe
and not rather BELIEVE and DO IT ALL . THAT IS THE PROBLEM .
TELLLING SOMEONE YE MUST BELEIVE IN JESUS TO BE SAVED IS TRUE . BUT what jesus do they believe in
WELL THEIR ACTIONS PROVE Which one . MANY follow another jesus and they are not saved .
Any lamb of CHRIST is HIS and one who IS HIS has the SPIRIT as in the HOLY SPIRIT .
YE shall know them by their fruits . PEROID . I make zero apologies for what i just wrote . no matter
that it does offend the many . WE BETTER KNOW ITS JESUS WE BELIEVE IN . AND IT HAD BETTER BE THE BIBLICAL ONE .

 

[Gospel Believer]

Happy Thanksgiving! I will be eating turkey AND Jack Stack BBQ at my brother in law's house for Thanksgiving. We are all originally from Kansas City and we love our BBQ!

Unusually warm Thanksgiving Day here in Southern Ohio....65 degrees......( Portsmouth ) .....May have to play some golf! Might have to pack a drumstick in the golf bag......might use it to putt.....anything would help......I stink as a golfer but nobody has more fun!

 

[amigo de christo]

Excellent post! Typical.

But what if our door or gateway is a jesus that satan painted on it .
In other words what if the door or gateway we enter into was a jesus sold to us by satan and men .
WE JUST ENTERED THE BROAD path under the guise we entered into the strait path .
FOLKS BETTER LEARN THOSE BIBLES . Hold not thy breath waiting for me to say otherwise . IT WONT happen .
TOO MANY think they have entered into CHRIST when in truth satan painted the name of jesus
upon HIS OWN DOOR . DONT THINK satan dont know how to decieve .
IF ANY comes and preaches ANOTHER JESUS ........................................
exactly .

 

[amigo de christo]

visualize this . you have two doors . Both have the name of JESUS .
but one was simply His name painted by satan on that door .
HOW ARE YOU GONNA KNOW .
Two different jesus have long been preached .
One totally agrees with HIS teachings and the truth of scripture
the other twists .
WHICH DOOR YE GONNA CHOOSE . the one that serves the god of self or the one that serves GOD .
The one that loveth rigtheousness , truth and every word of the LORD
or the one that twists his sayings unto their own destruction .
THE TRUE DOOR was painted by the BLOOD OF CHRIST
the other door by satan and his men who simply presented another jesus .
KNOW THY BIBLE and the GOD and CHRIST OF that bible is ALL I CAN TELL TO ALL .

 

[Titus]

Anybody that thinks that they have somehow “ risen above sin” since they got Saved is a blind Fool....Why does Jesus” Forever Live to be our Advocate “ if we don’t need one .....why does God say that He “ Chastises the Children That He Loves” If His Children no longer “ Stumble” ( as even James admits!) and don’t ever deserve to be Corrected with the Rod ? Does God punish those that don’t deserve it so as to get “ kicks” out of it or something? Jesus taught that even the thought of Sin is just as bad as the deed itself ( “ he that lusts in his heart after a woman is Guilty Of Adultery!) Even the more than unlikely Unsaved writer “ Dear Abbey” had the insight to know that”we ALL have secret thoughts hat would shame Hell! “

Commandment - Keeping is Great! I strive to keep all of the 613 ( not just Ten) Commandments That I can! They are for our own good! Try to Keep them and God will most certainly Bless you for it—— He just won’t SAVE you for it! If we could Save ourselves by Keeping Commandments , Jesus suffered and died for no reason....

Anybody that desires to get Justified by going the LegalRoute is certainly free to do so, but just remember this ——“ By The Deeds Of The Law, NO FLESH will be Justified! “ .....also realize that if you want to be under the Law you will also be under “ The Curse Of The Law! “ ......that Curse is that if you break Just ONE LAW , you are “ Guilty Of breaking them ALL! “

So, if you are Foolish enough to take on the Law to try to get Saved—- have at it and good luck! For those of you out there that have the sense to agree with Paul that the Law is “ Weak and Useless” unless you know how to use it ( and you “ use it” to let it show you that you are a Sinner That MUST have a Savior) , take advantage of the “ Good News”........The Good News ( The Gospel ) is that all those Sins that you have committed and are STILL committing have been dealt with! Jesus died for them! If you simply Believe that Jesus died for your sins and rose from the grave , God will give you a Deal that only Somebody with His unfathomable Grace and Love could ever dream up! For your Faith and your Trust in the Shed Blood Of His Son, Jesus,and THAT ALONE, He will take All Of your Sins and out them on the Cross and in turn, take the Perfection Of His Son and IMPUTE That Perfection to your Heavenly Account......
Make no mistake.....If you are Trying ( and of course, Failing ) to keep all of God’s Commandments in order to achieve Eternal Life, the Standard is PERFECTION ! .....24/7.....and you can’t do it! You can never “ make your self “ Worthy”...... however, you can be * MADE* Worthy , if you simply stop “ Trying” to be Saved and start “ TRUSTING” to be Saved......BELIEVE the Gospel Found In 1Cor15:1-4......Believe and REST in the fact that Jesus “ Died for your Sins and rose from the Grave”.......Believe that Promise of God .....that is what Faith is—— taking a Promise Of God and Trusting in it.....THAT is the Faith That Saves.....All Of That “ do do this and don’t do that” stuff that the confused and perhaps Lost Legalists in here preach in order to get Saved? That stuff FOLLOWS Salvation as God goes to work “ Transforming us into the Image Of His Son “ and “ HE will Finish the Good Work That He started”......Don’t Put the Horse Before the cart! May God Bless you in the understanding of these things.....

Hello, again.
You are in the camp that Jesus' commandments are not required to be obeyed.
So, you believe in salvation through disobedience.
It amazes me that folks who believe they will be saved by Jesus openly admit willful disobedient sin against Jesus,

Heres Jesus' own words of how He will save us not a theology that man has come up with.
Gospel Believer, do you really believe the gospel?
You directly go against Jesus, yet claim That same Jesus is going to save you.
You have strange doctrinal beliefs.

I am a very lazy man— retirement has ruined me—— lol.....

Then I tell you, that is open willful sin and you rebuke me here,

Anybody that thinks that they have somehow “ risen above sin” since they got Saved is a blind Fool....Why

Matthew 25:26;30
-but the Lord answered and said to him, You wicked and lazy servant, you knew that I reap where I have not sown and gather where I have not scattered seed.
-and cast the unprofitable servant into the outer darkness There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Jesus does not agree with your theology that you can willfully go against His commandments, disobey God and be saved.

At least you have admitted we must repent of sin to be saved. Your admission disproves your whole theological doctrine as false. You don't even believe it yourself.
Repentance of sins is certainly more that faith only for salvation.
Jesus taught unbelief to be a sin that must be repented of to be saved,
John 8:24,
-Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.

Technically speaking, you are correct--- if Unbelief is a sin , it is a sin that must be eliminated....but

So, you lost your argument when you admitted the truth that one , must repent of the sin of unbelief to be saved by Jesus.
Therefore your salvation gospel is:
Faith + repentance of one sin(unbelief) = salvation.

On your own you disproved faith only salvation as being the true gospel of Jesus Christ.
You are confused and need help understanding the gospel friend.
Folks who contradict themselves cannot know the truth.

 

[amigo de christo]

Hello, again.
You are in the camp that Jesus' commandments are not required to be obeyed.
So, you believe in salvation through disobedience.
It amazes me that folks who believe they will be saved by Jesus openly admit willful disobedient sin against Jesus,

Heres Jesus' own words of how He will save us not a theology that man has come up with.
Gospel Believer, do you really believe the gospel?
You directly go against Jesus, yet claim That same Jesus is going to save you.
You have strange doctrinal beliefs.

Then I tell you, that is open willful sin and you rebuke me here,


Matthew 25:26;30
-but the Lord answered and said to him, You wicked and lazy servant, you knew that I reap where I have not sown and gather where I have not scattered seed.
-and cast the unprofitable servant into the outer darkness There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Jesus does not agree with your theology that you can willfully go against His commandments, disobey God and be saved.

At least you have admitted we must repent of sin to be saved. Your admission disproves your whole theological doctrine as false. You don't even believe it yourself.
Repentance of sins is certainly more that faith only for salvation.
Jesus taught unbelief to be a sin that must be repented of to be saved,
John 8:24,
-Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.


So, you lost your argument when you admitted the truth that one , must repent of the sin of unbelief to be saved by Jesus.
Therefore your salvation gospel is:
Faith + repentance of one sin(unbelief) = salvation.

On your own you disproved faith only salvation as being the true gospel of Jesus Christ.
You are confused and need help understanding the gospel friend.
Folks who contradict themselves cannot know the truth.

any camp that teaches one to not be a doer is a lie .
THE JESUS I KNOW said this and all the true apostels knew it . THE JESUS of the BIBLE said
this . IF any comes to me and is not a doer they done built their house on sand A FAT LIE
and james and paul knew this as well as did the others .
James said a hearer only has DECIEVED THEMSELVES
paul said if any provides not for his own , specially for those of his own household
HE HAS DENIED THE FAITH . THE VERY FAITH , THE VERY FAITH and is worse than an infidel .
TOO many folks are following another jesus .
TWO DOORS . both claim to know Christ but one is the strait way and the other the BROAD WAY .
One has the BLOOD OF CHRIST ON IT and the other the delusions of men .
Dont think for a second that satan cannot say GOD is love or point to christ . BUT If you wonder why i did not captilize
that last christ , ITS CAUSE ITS NOT JESUS CHRIST but rather another jesus . Satan knows HOW TO LIE
and HE KNOWS how to decieve . and sadly most even in the christain realm have chosen to follow the wrong jesus .
ONLY the bibical CHRIST can lead us to GOD , the other jesus leads us to the dragon with the mindset its GOD and all is well .
THIS IS gonna piss a lot of folks off . But i have no choice now . WE are running out of time .
WE BETTER KNOW OUR BIBLE is all i can say . LEARN THAT JESUS , learn that TRUTH cause many
decievers have arise which say I know the christ and yet they lead us to another jesus and right to the dragon and not the FATHER .

 

[Gospel Believer]

Hello, again.
You are in the camp that Jesus' commandments are not required to be obeyed.
So, you believe in salvation through disobedience.
It amazes me that folks who believe they will be saved by Jesus openly admit willful disobedient sin against Jesus,

Heres Jesus' own words of how He will save us not a theology that man has come up with.
Gospel Believer, do you really believe the gospel?
You directly go against Jesus, yet claim That same Jesus is going to save you.
You have strange doctrinal beliefs.

Then I tell you, that is open willful sin and you rebuke me here,


Matthew 25:26;30
-but the Lord answered and said to him, You wicked and lazy servant, you knew that I reap where I have not sown and gather where I have not scattered seed.
-and cast the unprofitable servant into the outer darkness There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Jesus does not agree with your theology that you can willfully go against His commandments, disobey God and be saved.

At least you have admitted we must repent of sin to be saved. Your admission disproves your whole theological doctrine as false. You don't even believe it yourself.
Repentance of sins is certainly more that faith only for salvation.
Jesus taught unbelief to be a sin that must be repented of to be saved,
John 8:24,
-Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.


So, you lost your argument when you admitted the truth that one , must repent of the sin of unbelief to be saved by Jesus.
Therefore your salvation gospel is:
Faith + repentance of one sin(unbelief) = salvation.

On your own you disproved faith only salvation as being the true gospel of Jesus Christ.
You are confused and need help understanding the gospel friend.
Folks who contradict themselves cannot know the truth.

Busy eating Turkey.....I’ll get back to you later.....meanwhile, I think you might need to stay away from the expired food that’s in the Fridge—- it’s affected your thinking....

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Amen! In Luke 13:24, we read "strive to enter through the narrow gate" (multiple other translations say "door") and in John 10:9, Jesus said - "I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture."

A door and a gate are not really that different. They both are talking about gaining access or entrance in. Yes, we are to enter into Christ and this is by His grace, but it also includes following Jesus, too. If you were to look at the parallel passage for Luke 13:24 in Matthew 7:13, and you were to continue to keep reading, Jesus says, “Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.” (Matthew 7:19). Jesus also said in Matthew 7, “And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand: And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.” (Matthew 7:26-27). Ephesians 2:10 says, “For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them”

As for Jesus being a door as mentioned in John 10:9 or Him being the door of the sheep (John 10:7):

Well, Jesus said in John 10:4 that His sheep follow Him. Meaning, they obey Jesus.
Jesus is the WAY, the truth, and the life (John 14:6).
But Jesus also says, “He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings” (John 14:24).
Paul says, “If anyone does not love the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be accursed.” (1 Corinthians 16:22) (NKJV).

Jesus is not teaching salvation by works here as legalists teach. Strive to enter through the narrow gate/door signifies a struggle against conflict. Christ was not suggesting that anyone could merit eternal life by striving or working hard enough to obtain it based on the merits of their works/performance, which contradicts numerous passages of scripture.

Strive to enter the straight gate in Luke 13:24 means what it says.

“Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.” (Luke 13:24).

It says many will seek to enter in and will not be able.

Those who were not able to enter said, “Lord, Lord, open unto us;” signifying they were believers in Jesus.
Jesus says depart from me ye workers of iniquity.
Meaning, they justified sin on some level. They were on the wide gate path in doing wrong and evil.

Think. Most Christians today believe they can sin and still be saved on some level. It’s only those FEW Christians today who are striving to enter the narrow way by following Jesus.

(John 3:15,16,18;

Believing in Jesus is more than just believing in the person of Jesus Christ for salvation but it is also believing everything He told us to do, too. So if we are not obeying Jesus, we are not really believing or trusting in Him.

6:28-29;

The work of God is His drawing that person to Jesus so as to believe (John 6:44).

Acts 10:43;

Again, to believe in Jesus is to believe in everything He told us to do. If we are not obeying Jesus, we do not really believe Him or trust in Him. Disobedience to Jesus is what would make a person a worker of iniquity.

13:39;

Right. Paul is not referring to condemning all Law or works. Acts 13:39 says we cannot be justified by the Law of Moses (Which Is the Old Law and not the Laws of Christ).

16:31;

This is in context to Initial Salvation. Nowhere is Paul and Silas saying that the jailor can disobey Jesus and still be saved. Again, that would be unbelief.

Romans 4:5-6; Titus 3:5;

This is in reference to our Initial Salvation in being saved by God’s grace (Which is a process of salvation without works).

2 Timothy 1:9;

This is in reference to man directed works and not the works of God (Which is a call according to His purpose and grace - See: Titus 2:11-12, 1 Corinthians 15:10).

Philippians 3:9 etc..).

This would be righteousness of the 613 Laws of Moses which no longer apply as a whole or package deal. Yes, certain laws in the Old law have been repeated in the Laws of Christ, but we are not under the Old Law as a whole.

No matter how rigorously people labor, they could never earn their way to heaven by their works/performance. Entering through the narrow gate is nonetheless difficult because of it's cost in terms of human pride which prevents legalists/works salvationists/unbelievers from trusting exclusively in Jesus Christ as the ALL-SUFFICIENT means of their salvation and entering through the narrow gate/door. For such people their hands are full of their works and they will not let go in order to receive Christ through faith.

The unprofitable servant was cast into outer darkness (Matthew 25).
John the baptist said the axe is laid to the root of the tree and to bring forth fruits worthy repentance (Matthew 3).
The Lord did not find a particular church’s works perfect before God in Revelation 3. The Lord said they had a name that was alive and yet they were dead. Faith without works is dead.

In context, Jesus is going through the cities and villages, teaching, and journeying toward Jerusalem and someone asked Him a question, "are only a few going to be saved?" Then Jesus answered by saying strive to enter through the narrow gate/door, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able. Once the door is shut, there will be those who stand outside and knock at the door, saying, ‘Lord, Lord, open for us,’ and He will answer and say to you, ‘I do not know you, where you are from...depart from Me, all you workers of iniquity.’ (vss. 25-27) This similar language is found in Matthew 7:22-23 in which we read of many (pseudo Christians/make believers) who said 'Lord, Lord' and (self righteously) trusted in their works for salvation, yet Jesus never knew them and told them to depart from Him and referred to these many people as those who work iniquity/practice lawlessness which is 'descriptive' of unbelievers.

But don’t you believe you can commit sin (iniquity), and still be saved? Are you unaware that be unprofitable (fruitless) is a sin and can lead to outer darkness?

 

[Gospel Believer]

Folks who contradict themselves cannot know the truth.

Even though you are Foaming at the mouth, dying to somehow “ trip me up” , you jumped gun there just a little bit, my confused friend.....
Clarification of my Beliefs does not equal a Contradiction Of my Beliefs —- it’s back to the Drawing Board for you, Mr. “ Sower of Discord” .......
For the sake of clarification,” Unbelief” is a sin, but I usually leave it out of typical discussions in regard to sin because it is in a different type of Camp——It is the only sin not covered by the Blood....it is a unique Sin in a class of its own....failing to mention it does not entail a collapse of True Pauline Doctrine.....nice try.....

 

[Gospel Believer]

You are in the camp that Jesus' commandments are not required to be obeyed.
So, you believe in salvation through disobedience.
It amazes me that folks who believe they will be saved by Jesus openly admit willful disobedient sin against Jesus,

Lol.....exaggerate much? Yeah, that’s what I’m all about- “ Disobedience” .... ....not to sound repetitive, but, * Sigh*.......

I do God's Will—- the exact Opposite Of “ Disobedience”—- and what would “ God’s Will “ be? It would be to “ Believe in the One that He sent”....

The Obedience That Saves a person, this side of the Cross, is the “ Obedience to the Gospel” .....to “ Obey” the Gospel (1Cor15:1-4) means to BELIEVE IT! To Prove that one truly Believes it means that you REST in it as Commanded in Hebrews 3 and 4.....if you do not REST in Paul’s Gospel Of Pure Grace ,God declares you as being “ Disobedient” and Guilty Of UNBELIEF! Serious stuff—- stuff you are probably totally Ignorant about.....if you are ADDING to the Gospel with stuff like “ Commandment Keeping” or making sure that you “repent of all of your sins before you die , lest you be damned”, or totally refraining from sinning on-Purpose or “ Willfully” Sinning ( 99.9% of your sins, btw) , you are Adding Law to Grace and if you do that you are cancelling all of that Grace that could have saved you.....

All those previous things that I mentioned might be good things to do , in and of themselves , but they do not save.....if you add to the Gospel and say that you MUST do these things, saying essentially that the Blood Of Jesus is “ Essential” for Salvation but just not “ Adequate” by itself for Salvation , you have crossed the line—- you are one of the millions that has “ Fallen From Grace” and is clueless about it...You are “ Severed from Christ”...... read Galatians 5 and tell me that I am wrong....Some equate Falling from Grace as tantamount to Damnation—- you'd better pray that they are wrong......hope you had a nice Thanksgiving.....I hope this bad news did not give you indigestion....

 

[RLT63]

Nowhere does the Bible say to trust in the finished work of redemption. That is a Protestant saying. Protestants number in the high millions and thus they are not of the narrow path or way. They are the second largest branch of Christianity in the world. Jesus said narrow is the way that leads unto life and FEW be there that find it (Matthew 7:14).

So which denomination are you recommending?

 

[Titus]

Folks who contradict themselves cannot know the truth.

Even though you are Foaming at the mouth, dying to somehow “ trip me up” , you jumped gun there just a little bit, my confused friend.....
Clarification of my Beliefs does not equal a Contradiction Of my Beliefs —- it’s back to the Drawing Board for you, Mr. “ Sower of Discord” .......
For the sake of clarification,” Unbelief” is a sin, but I usually leave it out of typical discussions in regard to sin because it is in a different type of Camp——It is the only sin not covered by the Blood....it is a unique Sin in a class of its own....failing to mention it does not entail a collapse of True Pauline Doctrine.....nice try.....

To speak gospel truth and not doctrines of men one must speak as the bible speaks, 1Peter 4:11.
You argument has no scripture just you making claims that your belief is gospel.
Without scripture you have proven nothing.

 

[Titus]

A door and a gate are not really that different. They both are talking about gaining access or entrance in. Yes, we are to enter into Christ and this is by His grace, but it also includes following Jesus, too. If you were to look at the parallel passage for Luke 13:24 in Matthew 7:13, and you were to continue to keep reading, Jesus says, “Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.” (Matthew 7:19). Jesus also said in Matthew 7, “And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand: And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.” (Matthew 7:26-27). Ephesians 2:10 says, “For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them”

As for Jesus being a door as mentioned in John 10:9 or Him being the door of the sheep (John 10:7):

Well, Jesus said in John 10:4 that His sheep follow Him. Meaning, they obey Jesus.
Jesus is the WAY, the truth, and the life (John 14:6).
But Jesus also says, “He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings” (John 14:24).
Paul says, “If anyone does not love the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be accursed.” (1 Corinthians 16:22) (NKJV).



Strive to enter the straight gate in Luke 13:24 means what it says.

“Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.” (Luke 13:24).

It says many will seek to enter in and will not be able.

Those who were not able to enter said, “Lord, Lord, open unto us;” signifying they were believes in Jesus.
Jesus says depart from me ye workers of iniquity.
Meaning, they justified sin on some level. They were on the wide gate path in doing wrong and evil.

Think. Most Christians today believe they can sin and still be saved on some level. It’s only those FEW Christians today who are striving to enter the narrow way by following Jesus.


Believing in Jesus is more than just believing in the person of Jesus Christ for salvation but it is also believing everything He told us to do, too. So if we are not obeying Jesus, we are not really believing or trusting in Him.


The work of God is His drawing that person to Jesus so as to believe (John 6:44).



Again, to believe in Jesus is to believe in everything He told us to do. If we are not obeying Jesus, we do not really believe Him or trust in Him. Disobedience to Jesus is what would make a person a worker of iniquity.



Right. Paul is not referring to condemning all Law or works. Acts 13:39 says we cannot be justified by the Law of Moses (Which Is the Old Law and not the Laws of Christ).



This is in context to Initial Salvation. Nowhere is Paul and Silas saying that the jailor can disobey Jesus and still be saved. Again, that would be unbelief.



This is in reference to our Initial Salvation in being saved by God’s grace (Which is a process of salvation without works).



This is in reference to man directed works and not the works of God (Which is a call according to His purpose and grace - See: Titus 2:11-12, 1 Corinthians 15:10).



This would be righteousness of the 613 Laws of Moses which no longer apply as a whole or package deal. Yes, certain laws in the Old law have been repeated in the Laws of Christ, but we are not under the Old Law as a whole.



The unprofitable servant was cast into outer darkness (Matthew 25).
John the baptist said the axe is laid to the root of the tree and to bring forth fruits worthy repentance (Matthew 3).
The Lord did not find a particular church’s works perfect before God in Revelation 3. The Lord said they had a name that was alive and yet they were dead. Faith without works is dead.



But don’t you believe you can commit sin (iniquity), and still be saved? Are you unaware that be unprofitable (fruitless) is a sin and can lead to outer darkness?

Hello, I had a Muslim tell me I could not be in the right religion. I asked him why? He said because there are more muslims in the world than christians. I informed him if he is true he just proved himself wrong.

 

[Titus]

I do God's Will—- the exact Opposite Of “ Disobedience”—- and what would “ God’s Will “ be? It would be to “ Believe in the One that He sent”....

You just claim that. Let's look at the evidence.
Also, you have claimed belief only plus nothing else is Gods will. Prove that belief by putting it to the test against scripture.

Evidence of you doing Gods will,

, I am a very lazy man— retirement has ruined me—— lol.....

3 types of laziness, physical, mental, spiritual
Physical,
2Thessalonians 3:10,
-!if any of you will not work, neither shall he eat.

Spiritual,
Romans 12:11,
-not lagging in diligence, fervent in spirit, serving the Lord.

Mental,
Hebrews 6:12,
-but that you do not become sluggish, but imitate those who through faith and patience inherit the promises.

According to Gospel believer doing Gods will is believing in Jesus only.
According to scripture Gods will includes not being lazy, sloth.
Conclusion:
Gospel believer believes one can ignore the Bible that speaks against laziness and be saved.
Only faith is required by God.

Therefore Gospel believer's salvation gospel is,
Belief only and no obedience to Gods other commandments saves.
Thus Gospel believer's gospel is salvation through disobedience to God.

Lol.....exaggerate much? Yeah, that’s what I’m all about- “ Disobedience” .... ....not to sound repetitive, but, * Sigh*.......

I do God's Will—- the exact Opposite Of “ Disobedience”—- and what would “ God’s Will “ be? It would be to “ Believe in the One that He sent

It is Gods will to be baptized, Mark 16:15-16.
It is Gods will to repent of the sin of unbelief, Acts 17:30
It is Gods will that we repent of all our sins, Acts 2:38.
It is Gods will that we confess with our mouth faith in Jesus, Romans 10:9-10.

Gospel believer teaches none of this must be obeyed to be saved,
Therefore Gospel believer's gospel is not obedience to Gods will,
But disobedience to Gods will.
Thus he teaches a gospel of salvation through disobedience to Gods commandments.