Sanctification is not a Process

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op: sanctification NOT a process?:

part of my own sanctification toward God!:

"For we dare not make ourselves of the number, or compare ourselves with some that commend themselves: but they measuring themselves by themselves, and comparing themselves among themselves, are not wise." (2Co 10:12)

Praise His Holy Name!!
 
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Wrangler

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So what's wrong with wanting to see the featured big picture? What's wrong with seeking God for a greater revelation? All that is needed is faith and the love that drives us to seek God's face. We are to go to the throne of grace...to receive grace as we need it.

Now, you may not like the fact that very few will enter into that level of life and walk

Mother Teresa said we cannot all do great things but we can all do small things with love. I take her words over you incessant appeal to walk a made up ‘higher walk.’

Paul wrote to continue in the way God placed you before you were saved. I take his words over you incessant appeal to walk a made up ‘higher walk.’

Let the bible speak for itself. And let God reveal His ways through the narrative...wherever that might lead to. Even if it goes against the best laid plans we have imagined for ourselves.
Indeed. Jesus commanded people after healing them to ‘sin no more.’ One does not prohibit what one is incapable of doing. It means the saved can fail to act sanctified.
 

Episkopos

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Mother Teresa said we cannot all do great things but we can all do small things with love. I take her words over you incessant appeal to walk a made up ‘higher walk.’


A Mother Theresa acolyte? Will you be moving to Calcutta any time soon? ;)


Paul wrote to continue in the way God placed you before you were saved. I take his words over you incessant appeal to walk a made up ‘higher walk.’

That doesn't mean to act as unsaved people. Also, you don't seem particularly well verses in NT values. Why was Paul trying to "win Christ". Was he merely trying to do a "Mother Theresa"? Or was he in fact seeking to get back to the higher walk...that he had previously experienced?
Indeed. Jesus commanded people after healing them to ‘sin no more.’ One does not prohibit what one is incapable of doing. It means the saved can fail to act sanctified.
Act sanctified? That's the flesh trying to clean itself up to behave in a way that LOOKS like it is more than it is.

I remember hearing a song way back when that said..."a 3 dressed up like a 9." I always took that to mean the flesh trying to put on a show.
There is an ACTUAL sanctified walk in Christ. In Him is no sin.
 
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Episkopos

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op: sanctification NOT a process?:

part of my own sanctification toward God!:

"For we dare not make ourselves of the number, or compare ourselves with some that commend themselves: but they measuring themselves by themselves, and comparing themselves among themselves, are not wise." (2Co 10:12)

Praise His Holy Name!!
Are you saying you are NOT of the number that compare themselves with others but rather look to God for His approval and elevation?
 
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Wrangler

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Why was Paul trying to "win Christ".

He wasn’t.

A Mother Theresa acolyte? Will you be moving to Calcutta any time soon? ;)

No . And No.

Was he merely trying to do a "Mother Theresa"? Or was he in fact seeking to get back to the higher walk...that he had previously experienced?

Again, there is no such thing as a higher walk than to live as Christ.

Act sanctified? That's the flesh trying to clean itself up to behave in a way that LOOKS like it is more than it is.
You are keen to put all kinds of words in people’s mouth.

By act, I mean action, not pretending via the flesh. A casual observer of Christians know those saved are not all sanctified. And one knows this by their actions.
 

Wrangler

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A Mother Theresa acolyte?

Why was Paul trying to "win Christ".

What?! No pithy rejoinder regarding Christ’s words?

Indeed. Jesus commanded people after healing them to ‘sin no more.’ One does not prohibit what one is incapable of doing. It means the saved can fail to act sanctified.

There is an inescapable logic of Christ’s words that you seem to hope to escape by ignoring them. Not good form sir. Not good form at all.
 

Michiah-Imla

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Why was Paul trying to "win Christ".

He wasn’t.

:IDK:

“Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ” (Philippians 3:8)
 

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Many have been taught that sanctification is a process. But this is a smokescreen. No one gets holier with time. Maybe just holier than thou.

The Catholics also have a smokescreen. They call it "purgatory". But it's the same scheme....only with a different approach

What is the scheme? It is a reference to a denial that we can walk with God in holiness in THIS life...by grace through faith. That is our salvation. To walk with God as Jesus walked. No one does that gradually...it's not by works. It is a gift given to all who surrender themselves fully to God.

There are two paths we can follow...according to the ways of God. These are the ancient paths to walk in.

The way of righteousness. This way is the way of humility, honesty, brokenness and the fear of the Lord. This is the low road

The way of holiness in Christ: This is the narrow way that very few will find. This is the way of resurrection life...to walk as Jesus walked. This is the high road

Now, most believers walk in neither the low road nor the high road...(neither hot nor cold) instead they try to raise themselves up through a religious process...exemplified by Babylon.

The way up is actually down. Only God translates people into the higher walk. No one attains it over time.

We are to receive with MEEKNESS the implanted word. But that's not what happens, in most cases. In most cases a person who begins well gets seduced into placing themselves in a much higher place than they ought to. Let no one esteem himself higher than he should.

All religious efforts end the same way.
You are one confused person. Your own words testify of your own ignorance - that you have no idea what you're writing or what Sanctification is about.

FIRST you state "this is a smokescreen. No one gets holier with time. Maybe just holier than thou."

SECOND you state your approval of "the way of righteousness" and "the way of holiness in Christ."

BOTH 'ways' originate in Rwanda as a form of gospel message seeking disciples of the African church. It was a method of a regularly broadcast radio program that used the term 'way' to help listeners understand holiness & righteousness, WHICH IS WHAT SANCTIFICATION IS BY DEFINITION (ie: 'ways' of righteousness and holiness)

The word Holy means to separate unto God. It's a different concept than redemption/salvation because it's THE ACT being carried out as a result of being saved.

BOTH 'ways' play a game with words BECAUSE 'the way of righteousness' AND 'the way of holiness in Christ' IS THE SAME AS THE DEFINITION OF SANCTIFICATION.

Nobody is putting up a smokescreen here or elsewhere.

I fear you are guilty of hubris and a bit of self-righteous HOLIER THAN THOU attitude yourself. You've claimed everybody else is wrong about Santification and you are the only one that's correct without knowing the meaning of the word. No conceit there, right?

If anyone reading this is really interested in a study on Sanctification, please read Romans chapters 6, 7 & 8.

All three chapters are a rather deep explanation of the process of Sanctification in the life of the believer. The purpose of which, by the way, isn't to save but to instruct the disciple of Christ in living the normal Christian life. Read the Romans chapters.

Those three chapters in Romans, together with Genesis 3 are considered to be the Grand Canyon of the Bible because of the depth of spiritual teaching conveyed to the reader. Read them.

Too many arrogant fools today think they know all about the Bible when they haven't an understanding of some of its basic tenants.

Please read the Bible more and listen to radio broadcasts or YouTube less. Bear in mind the purpose of these media is to solicit MONEY from the listeners/users. The purpose of the Bible is to instruct.

Please read the Bible. It's pretty good at explaining itself. The problem is that one has to read it to 'get it'.

that's me, hollering from the choir loft...
 

stunnedbygrace

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You are one confused person. Your own words testify of your own ignorance - that you have no idea what you're writing or what Sanctification is about.

FIRST you state "this is a smokescreen. No one gets holier with time. Maybe just holier than thou."

SECOND you state your approval of "the way of righteousness" and "the way of holiness in Christ."

BOTH 'ways' originate in Rwanda as a form of gospel message seeking disciples of the African church. It was a method of a regularly broadcast radio program that used the term 'way' to help listeners understand holiness & righteousness, WHICH IS WHAT SANCTIFICATION IS BY DEFINITION (ie: 'ways' of righteousness and holiness)

The word Holy means to separate unto God. It's a different concept than redemption/salvation because it's THE ACT being carried out as a result of being saved.

BOTH 'ways' play a game with words BECAUSE 'the way of righteousness' AND 'the way of holiness in Christ' IS THE SAME AS THE DEFINITION OF SANCTIFICATION.

Nobody is putting up a smokescreen here or elsewhere.

I fear you are guilty of hubris and a bit of self-righteous HOLIER THAN THOU attitude yourself. You've claimed everybody else is wrong about Santification and you are the only one that's correct without knowing the meaning of the word. No conceit there, right?

If anyone reading this is really interested in a study on Sanctification, please read Romans chapters 6, 7 & 8.

All three chapters are a rather deep explanation of the process of Sanctification in the life of the believer. The purpose of which, by the way, isn't to save but to instruct the disciple of Christ in living the normal Christian life. Read the Romans chapters.

Those three chapters in Romans, together with Genesis 3 are considered to be the Grand Canyon of the Bible because of the depth of spiritual teaching conveyed to the reader. Read them.

Too many arrogant fools today think they know all about the Bible when they haven't an understanding of some of its basic tenants.

Please read the Bible more and listen to radio broadcasts or YouTube less. Bear in mind the purpose of these media is to solicit MONEY from the listeners/users. The purpose of the Bible is to instruct.

Please read the Bible. It's pretty good at explaining itself. The problem is that one has to read it to 'get it'.

that's me, hollering from the choir loft...
The loft, eh? Well, you sound so much like Jesus it’s uncanny. and Oh my gosh what a great teaching, I should print and frame it so I don’t forget all of the deep wisdom in it. And my how you have built us up in trust so splendidly.
 

APAK

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This is quite the stretch...and very dramatic...but completely from your own mind.

Before a movie comes out there is a trailer. A sample of what the movie looks like, feels like...etc. It does what a sample does. Now, if it gave away too many plot lines, what would be the point in seeing the main event? There are giveaways...called spoilers... that let people in on the plot lines. But usually not enough to stop people from wanting to see the movie for themselves. People will get offended that I give away spoilers...but only insofar as to create an interest in going to God for the whole measure of grace He has for those who seek Him for it..

Being born again by the Spirit is like a trailer of sorts that is supposed to attract us to get the full picture as we go to where the story line of eternal consciousness can be experienced...or...kingdom life. Many are thus called...but few put themselves into the place by faith whereby they may be chosen to proceed into the big picture. The fact that I have been given access into that big picture could only be seen as bad if one thinks that one's own understanding could not possibly be surpassed. As if, the movie trailer IS the movie itself (as the devil wants us to believe). So again, it is the ego of the one limiting God that limits all others to what it has itself attained. Jesus spoke that way to the Pharisees...who did not enter the kingdom...and also wanted to stop others from entering. The devil uses the ego to do his work. And religious egos are his specialty.

So what's wrong with wanting to see the featured big picture? What's wrong with seeking God for a greater revelation? All that is needed is faith and the love that drives us to seek God's face. We are to go to the throne of grace...to receive grace as we need it.

Now, you may not like the fact that very few will enter into that level of life and walk...and pin that on me as if I'm the one trying to limit others...but I am just citing what God has said to us. I am trying to get others to seek the deeper walk...that's my motivation. And I hold a lot back from what I know. I only share what I think is useful and helpful to get people to see that they need to take more steps.....and not rest on an initial experience (or be happy with a movie trailer rather than going to get the full picture). You might think that a spiritual Christianity looks Eastern ...but that is your own view on what's in the bible...not my own. I am simply not imposing my Western views onto the narrative, as you seem to be doing.

Let the bible speak for itself. And let God reveal His ways through the narrative...wherever that might lead to. Even if it goes against the best laid plans we have imagined for ourselves.

Your expression 'the whole measure of grace He has for those who seek Him for it..'...is gibberish, evil and destructive

See how you have twisted or undermined the intent of these scripture verses below. Read then carefully and then can you see your gross err concerning grace and who you think is in control of it. It's not you for sure.

Ephesians 4:7
'But grace was given to each one of us according to the measure of Christ’s gift.' (ESV)

Romans 12:3
'For by the grace given me I say to every one of you: Do not think of yourself more highly than you ought, but think of yourself with sober judgment, according to the measure of faith God has given you.'

1 Cor 12:11
All these are the work of one and the same Spirit, who apportions them to each one as He determines

Hebrews 2:4
and was affirmed by God through signs, wonders, various miracles, and gifts of the Holy Spirit distributed according to His will.

No, your doctrine and message is a menacing one, a cultist voice writing here not a believer in Christ at all. You deny and usurp the grace of God, and from his Son.

and Christ is the ONLY one given the FULL Measure of grace

John 3:34
For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.

You promote a cultist works for salvation philosophy. There is no extra or full measure for those who seek it. You just made this up! There is no scripture that supports it and I firmly believe you do not even know was the concept of holy grace means at all.

And the rest of your elitist exclusive club words of 'entering into' a loftier walk are also gibberish.

The obvious message and take away you bring is that you can be Christ himself if you seek the face of God....more gibberish....
 

stunnedbygrace

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Your expression 'the whole measure of grace He has for those who seek Him for it..'...is gibberish, evil and destructive
But He gives a greater grace. Therefore it says, “God is opposed to the proud, but gives grace to the humble.” Submit therefore to God.

May grace and peace be multiplied to you.

Therefore I will boast all the more gladly of my weaknesses, so that the power (grace) of Christ may rest upon me.

You lust and do not have, so you commit murder. And you are envious and cannot obtain, so you fight and quarrel. You do not have because you do not ask
 
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Michiah-Imla

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But He gives a greater grace. Therefore it says, “God is opposed to the proud, but gives grace to the humble.”

You lust and do not have, so you commit murder. And you are envious and cannot obtain, so you fight and quarrel. You do not have because you do not ask

“…he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.” (James 4:6)

:vgood:
 
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Episkopos

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“…he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.” (James 4:6)

:vgood:
Also we read we go from faith to faith (ours to His)...from glory to glory...and grace to grace...or..grace ANTI grace...


John 1:6 And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace

The fulness is the fulness of grace to experience the fulness of God. But some here are VERY against any mention of the fulness of God. I leave it to others to understand why that is.

Do we have access to the fulness of God? Yes, by a fulness of grace...or grace on top of grace.

Eph. 3:19 “And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God.”
 

stunnedbygrace

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You deny and usurp the grace of God
How can a man say go to God to receive more grace to overcome and you say that is denying the grace of God? It’s so ridiculous it can’t be taken seriously.

You lust and do not have, so you commit murder. And you are envious and cannot obtain, so you fight and quarrel. You do not have because you do not ask
 

stunnedbygrace

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you see your gross err concerning grace and who you think is in control of it. It's not you for sure.
He obviously thinks God is in control of it if he counsels men to go to God and ask for more grace to overcome.
 
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MatthewG

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You are one confused person. Your own words testify of your own ignorance - that you have no idea what you're writing or what Sanctification is about.

FIRST you state "this is a smokescreen. No one gets holier with time. Maybe just holier than thou."

SECOND you state your approval of "the way of righteousness" and "the way of holiness in Christ."

BOTH 'ways' originate in Rwanda as a form of gospel message seeking disciples of the African church. It was a method of a regularly broadcast radio program that used the term 'way' to help listeners understand holiness & righteousness, WHICH IS WHAT SANCTIFICATION IS BY DEFINITION (ie: 'ways' of righteousness and holiness)

The word Holy means to separate unto God. It's a different concept than redemption/salvation because it's THE ACT being carried out as a result of being saved.

BOTH 'ways' play a game with words BECAUSE 'the way of righteousness' AND 'the way of holiness in Christ' IS THE SAME AS THE DEFINITION OF SANCTIFICATION.

Nobody is putting up a smokescreen here or elsewhere.

I fear you are guilty of hubris and a bit of self-righteous HOLIER THAN THOU attitude yourself. You've claimed everybody else is wrong about Santification and you are the only one that's correct without knowing the meaning of the word. No conceit there, right?

If anyone reading this is really interested in a study on Sanctification, please read Romans chapters 6, 7 & 8.

All three chapters are a rather deep explanation of the process of Sanctification in the life of the believer. The purpose of which, by the way, isn't to save but to instruct the disciple of Christ in living the normal Christian life. Read the Romans chapters.

Those three chapters in Romans, together with Genesis 3 are considered to be the Grand Canyon of the Bible because of the depth of spiritual teaching conveyed to the reader. Read them.

Too many arrogant fools today think they know all about the Bible when they haven't an understanding of some of its basic tenants.

Please read the Bible more and listen to radio broadcasts or YouTube less. Bear in mind the purpose of these media is to solicit MONEY from the listeners/users. The purpose of the Bible is to instruct.

Please read the Bible. It's pretty good at explaining itself. The problem is that one has to read it to 'get it'.

that's me, hollering from the choir loft...
Right here with you on the encouragement for people to read the book of Roman’s, to learn about the wisdom that is found in Christ in aspect of how sanctification works in the life in the believer over time the more they yield their selves to abiding in the Lord Jesus’s Christ, even though the flesh seeks its own desires in opposition of the spirit and the heavenly desires.
 
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stunnedbygrace

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@APAK
human anger does not produce the righteousness that God desires

in the last days difficult times will come, people will be unloving, irreconcilable, malicious gossips, without self-control, brutal, haters of good, reckless, conceited, holding to a form of godliness although they have denied its power; avoid such people as these, these men also oppose the truth, men of depraved mind, worthless in regard to the faith. But they will not make further progress; for their foolishness will be obvious to all, just as was that also of Jannes and Jambres, who opposed Moses.

You lust and do not have, so you commit murder. And you are envious and cannot obtain, so you fight and quarrel. You do not have because you do not ask.
 
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Episkopos

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I'm wondering if any here see grace as a process...or the gifts of the Spirit?

Of course, maturity is a process. Purity, on the other hand is NOT a process...it is a gift of God. God is able to cleanse us from sin and empower us to walk in all His commandments. And He does this by "rapturing" us into the kingdom realm of the Spirit.

Do I really need to ask if rapturing (or translating someone from one place to another) is a process?

I think it is the thinking process that is so faulty...certainly in trying to understand the deeper things of God.
 

stunnedbygrace

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That post shook me up. I’m used to seeing men be angry in your threads but that was so exceedingly angry, hateful and vitriolic that it shocked me. And I EXPECT hatred and anger.
Im taking a break. It was just too, too ugly.
 

Episkopos

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That post shook me up. I’m used to seeing men be angry in your threads but that was so exceedingly angry, hateful and vitriolic that it shocked me. And I EXPECT hatred and anger.
Im taking a break.
As I said...just mention God's desire that we seek Him for a full measure of grace...and many GO BALLISTIC! Is that rational? Not even close. We battle against principalities and powers.