How are we to reckon ourselves as being dead to sin?

[Episkopos]

Correct a real overseer builds up believers, encourages them in their walk and does not tear them down. They correct with gentleness and patience not with insults, belittling, mocking, ad hominems etc........ There are lots of scripture that affirms this is true. And we will know them by their fruits. When the fruit of the spirit is missing so is God from their teachings.

What you seek with your itching ears is easily and readily available in the US among the myriads of ministries that cater to middle-class religious posturers such as yourself. A dime a dozen really. And if I was to conform to the religious masses...how would that help you?

I am very different. And you see that as bad. Why?... because I don't conform to the flesh and the religious aspirations of the outer man?

Just ignore me as I ignore you. Follow your religious mind....trust in yourself.

 

[ChristisGod]

What you seek with your itching ears is easily available in the US among the myriads of ministries that cater to middle-class religious posturers such as yourself. A dime a dozen really. And if I was to conform to the religious masses...how would that help you?

I am very different. And you see that as bad. Why?... because I don't conform to the flesh and the religious aspirations of the outer man?

Just ignore me as I ignore you. Follow your religious mind....trust in yourself.

Qualifications for an overseer,elder, @Episkopos

How do you measure up to Gods qualifications/standards ?

Let the readers decide.

man who is married
children who are believers and not disobedient
temperate
respectful
hospitable
humble
kind
gentle
peaceful
good reputation
blameless
loves good
self control
disciplined
not over bearing
not quick tempered/angry
encourages others
not proud
humble
not lording things over others


1 Tim 3:1-7
It is a trustworthy statement: if any man aspires to the office of overseer, it is a fine work he desires to do. 2 An overseer, then, must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, temperate, prudent, respectable, hospitable, able to teach, 3 not addicted to wine or pugnacious, but gentle, peaceable, free from the love of money. 4 He must be one who manages his own household well, keeping his children under control with all dignity 5 (but if a man does not know how to manage his own household, how will he take care of the church of God?), 6 and not a new convert, so that he will not become conceited and fall into the condemnation incurred by the devil. 7 And he must have a good reputation with those outside the church, so that he will not fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.


Titus 1:5-9
5 The reason I left you in Crete was that you might straighten out what was left unfinished and appoint elders in every town, as I directed you. 6 An elder must be blameless, the husband of but one wife, a man whose children believe and are not open to the charge of being wild and disobedient. 7 Since an overseer is entrusted with God's work, he must be blameless — not overbearing, not quick-tempered, not given to drunkenness, not violent, not pursuing dishonest gain. 8 Rather he must be hospitable, one who loves what is good, who is self-controlled, upright, holy and disciplined. 9 He must hold firmly to the trustworthy message as it has been taught, so that he can encourage others by sound doctrine and refute those who oppose it.


1 Peter 5:1-5
Therefore, I exhort the elders among you, as your fellow elder and witness of the sufferings of Christ, and a partaker also of the glory that is to be revealed, 2 shepherd the flock of God among you, exercising oversight not under compulsion, but voluntarily, according to the will of God; and not for sordid gain, but with eagerness; 3 nor yet as lording it over those allotted to your charge, but proving to be examples to the flock. 4 And when the Chief Shepherd appears, you will receive the unfading crown of glory. 5 You younger men, likewise, be subject to your elders; and all of you, clothe yourselves with humility toward one another, for God is opposed to the proud, but gives grace to the humble


hope this helps !!!

 

[Behold]

I put up with the vitriol I receive here for speaking a truth that is so far above them,

Your arrogant pride doth speaketh..... yet again.

 

[Lizbeth]

The problem with the religious version is that the testimonies of the NT are real. God is real. Jesus has been resurrected from the dead. He is alive. No man-made system is needed...it just gets in the way of a real connection to God.

Those who know the Lord by a true and living faith have a real connection to God. He speaks to us, we know His voice, and He feeds and leads His flock (those who are following Him). But it's comments like this that confuse me and have made me wonder if you are talking about those who are not born again as opposed to a mere mental assent and nominal form of Christianity like Catholicism is. When I (and others here) speak of believers, we're talking about those who have come to faith in Christ and experienced genuine conversion and experience a living relationship and connection with the Lord day by day.

But Jesus is coming back as a thief to take it back. There will be weeping and anger.

Now here is precisely why believing in imputed righteousness is NOT a recipe for smug self assurance on anyone's part and is not necessary for a doctrine of holiness to deny.... ....because the bible gives us plenty of warnings like this....parable of the talents ("even what he has will be taken away"), parable of the ten virgins with five cast out, and Jesus returning as a thief in the night, lukewarm being spewed out, churches having their lamps removed, etc. I believe where its says, "Though the number of the Israelites be as the sand of the sea, only a remnant will be saved".........serves as a warning to the church as well. The bride needs to be preparing for Christ's return by adorning herself with garments of holiness, (or I think at least be truly and wholeheartedly on that path and counting the cost to follow Jesus, should anyone happen to die before actually completing the process).

We are building on a sure foundation though.......and even are told not to cast our confidence away.....we need to have faith that God is able to make good on His promises like Abraham had. Seems as though there is always a healthy tension between fear of the Lord and trusting Him, and we need both at different times/seasons and circumstances along the way.

 

[ChristisGod]

Just ignore me as I ignore you.

Readers notice the made up words again just like his false teachings which are not true.

he claims to " ignore" me yet quotes me every day. ignore must mean something different to him than everyone else's definition.

and I will not ignore you as long as you are posting here with your heresies, I will oppose them as scripture instructs us to do with false teachers as we are to expose them.

hope this helps !!!

 

[Episkopos]

More nonsense again. Its not even little league.

I agree. This is like peewee or something. I am not qualified in day-care so admittedly I may not be as accomodating as people wish ...to the antics here.

There is no higher walk and lower walk which is another one of your fallacies. There is nothing in the bible which makes that false distinction. Its your man made ideas you are peddling that no one is buying.

Whether you believe it or not has no value whatsoever. The reason why you don't believe there is a higher walk is because you have ever been limited to a walk in the power of the flesh. Rather than humble yourself and listen and learn...you mock and project your own unbelief as something other than it is.

You cannot/will not even tell us what the GOSPEL is and what it means.

I have only said this many times...even today. The gospel is the good news of freedom from the bondage of sin, the flesh, and the devil, and the world. How? By grace through faith. Neither of these are understood...unless they are deviated by the carnal mind to mean a future salvation through a belief system concocted by Luther.

So who is in the major/minor league ?

One is in the minor league through honesty, humility, the fear of the Lord, and an openness to the truth.

The other one is in the major league as one is translated into the heavenly walk in Zion...to walk as Jesus walked. In Him is no sin.

The reason why people such as yourself can't remember all the times I have explained this is because the little birds come and steal away the potential seed that could cause you to actually become a follower of Christ.

Who is projecting ?

oh the irony epi.................

hope this helps !!!

We can always hope, I guess.

 

[ChristisGod]

Jesus has been resurrected from the dead. He is alive. No man-made system is needed...it just gets in the way of a real connection to God.

What does Resurrected mean ?

Is Jesus still a man in heaven and has a real human body with flesh and bones ? yes or no

Lets hear what Jesus resurrected means ?

JW's say they believe Jesus was Resurrected too but when you probe them you find out they actually deny the bodily Resurrection/Ascension and 2nd Coming of Jesus and redefine the meaning of the word resurrected.

me thinks you believe the same as the JW's since you run away from the Resurrection and the gospel when asked to define them.

hope this helps !!!

 

[ChristisGod]

I have only said this many times...even today. The gospel is the good news of freedom from the bondage of sin, the flesh, and the devil, and the world. How? By grace through faith.

Exactly you said it not the Bible. Nowhere does the Bible define the gospel as what you said above. Quote the Bible saying it epi ?

The reality is you cannot and made it up with your religious words/lingo. You sound "religious" like all cults, false teachers, pharisees etc..... But once you are asked to defend your beliefs with the Bible you are silenced. You cannot as all we get are our empty claims that cannot be substantiated with Scripture.

The gospel is clearly defined point by point in the Bible.

 

[Johann]

Yet if you do not go to the cross for forgiveness of all sin.

You will die dead in your sin.

You must be born again.. As moses lifted the serpent. so you too much look up to the cross.

Your gospel has no power to saved..

That's not true. There are the saved of the nations that will thank God forever for His mercy. Unlike you...God is merciful. He looks after the poor... Read the story of Lazarus and the rich man. Now tell me what beliefs, or doctrinal theology, saved Lazarus.

Since you are in denial of the necessity of the new birth--

Joh 3:7 μὴ mē|G3361|Adv|Not θαυμάσῃς thaumasēs|G2296|V-ASA-2S|do wonder ὅτι hoti|G3754|Conj|that εἶπόν eipon|G2036|V-AIA-1S|I said σοι soi|G4771|PPro-D2S|to you, ‘Δεῖ Dei|G1163|V-PIA-3S|It is necessary for ὑμᾶς hymas|G4771|PPro-A2P|you [all] γεννηθῆναι gennēthēnai|G1080|V-ANP|to be born ἄνωθεν. anōthen|G509|Adv|from above.
Personal pronoun
Person: second [you+]--and here you EXCLUDE yourself!


Unto thee - ye must
Note the change from the singular to the plural pronoun. In his address to Nicodemus (thee) the Lord had spoken also to those whom Nicodemus represented, and whom he had included when he said “we know” (Joh_3:2). His error was the error of his class.

But I have found something-you are into critical interpretation of the text--!
[Often as the fact of regeneration appears in the N. T., the terms for it are rare, and not near as frequent as the terms μετάνοια and others, which signify the corresponding act of man in turning to God under the regenerating operation of the Holy Spirit. The verb ἄνωθεν γεννεθῆναι, to be begotten, or born from above, i.e., from God, which is used twice in this ch. (Joh_3:6-7), occurs nowhere else in the N. T.

John also uses once to be born of water and Spirit (γεννηθῆναι ἐξ ὔδατος καὶ πνεύματος), Joh_3:5, and twice to be born of the Spirit (τὸ γεγεννημένον ἐκ τοῦ πνεύματος, Joh_3:6, ὁ γεγ. ἐκ τ. πν., Joh_3:8, without the water),

but the more usual phrase with him is to be begotten, or born of God (γεννηθῆναι ἐκ θεοῦ), Joh_1:13; 1Jn_2:19; 1Jn_3:9; 1Jn_4:7; 1Jn_5:1; 1Jn_5:4; 1Jn_5:18. The verb ἀναγεννάομαι, to be begotten, or born again, occurs but once or twice, 1Pe_1:23 (ἀναγεγεννημένοι οὐκ ἐκ σπορᾶς φθαρτῆς ἀλλὰ ἀφθάρτου, διὰ λόγου ζῶντοχ θεοῦ); 1Pe_1:3 (ἀναγεννήσας ἡμᾶς εἰς ἐλπίδα); comp. Jam_1:18 (ἀπεκύησεν ἡμᾶς λόγῳ ἀληθείας).

The noun ἀναγέννησις, regeneration, is not found at all in the N. T. (although often in the Greek fathers), but the analogous noun παλιγγεννεσία occurs twice, once in connection with baptism, Tit_3:5 (ἔσωσεν ἡμᾶς διὰ λουτροῦ παλιγγενεσίας καὶ ἀνακαινώσεως πνεύματος ἁγίου), and once in a more comprehensive sense, with reference to the final resurrection and consummation of air things, Mat_19:28 (ἐν τῇ παλιγγενεσία, ὄταν κ. τ. λ.).

Paul speaks of a new creature (καινὴ κτίσις) in Christ, 2Co_5:17, and of the new man (καινὸς ἄνθρωπος), Eph_4:24.

The Rabbinical theology had a very superficial conception of the new birth and confined it pretty much to the change in the external status of a proselyte to Judaism. Hence the comparative ignorance and perplexity of Nicodemus who, being a circumcised Jew, did not feel the need of such a radical change.—P. S.]
Lange

So you read the scriptures in a critical manner, as above--and "assume" you are in no need of the necessity of the rebirth since the
Personal pronoun
Person: second [you+]--is not for YOU-but to "them?"

Or maybe you don't know what I am referring to?

Not being facetious
J.

 

[Episkopos]

Exactly you said it not the Bible. Nowhere does the Bible define the gospel as what you said above. Quote the Bible saying it epi ?

The reality is you cannot and made it up with your religious words/lingo. You sound "religious" like all cults, false teachers, pharisees etc..... But once you are asked to defend your beliefs with the Bible you are silenced. You cannot.

The gospel is clearly defined point by point in the Bible.

The opposite is true. The gospel is ONLY what I have described. Luther was NOT an author of the bible This is where your confusion comes from.

You deny the power of the gospel...the very kind of people that Paul says we are to avoid.

 

[ChristisGod]

The opposite is true. The gospel is ONLY what I have described. Luther was NOT an author of the bible This is where your confusion comes from.

You deny the power of the gospel...the very kind of people that Paul says we are to avoid.

The it should be easy to quote the Bible saying the gospel is what you said. So quote it.

FYI- I'm not a lutheran or calvinist. Another false accusation.

You must be a papist right since luther opposed to pope and are against luther.

 

[Episkopos]

The it should be easy to quote the Bible saying the gospel is what you said. So quote it.

The gospel of the kingdom is prophesied by Isaiah

"The Spirit of the Lord God is upon me; because the Lord hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound;"

The gospel of Christ is clearly not meant for you. Only in humility...not religious pride...can one hear the god news. The good news is NOT meant for the outer man.

Liberty from the outer man. Opening the prison door that holds people within the confines of carnal strength.

FYI- I'm not a lutheran or calvinist. Another false accusation.

I never said you were. You are worse...both a cessationist and dispensationalist...the very worst possible twisting of scriptures that can happen.

You must be a papist right since luther opposed to pope and are against luther.

I'm not into any man-made religion. As such I stand against both popery and lutheran presumptions.

I do believe in spiritual authority. But men only respect other men...not what God is doing. I respect what God is building...the way He is building. I receive a prophet in the name of a prophet and a righteous man in the name of a righteous man.

Sounds weird, huh? You never heard of such things...

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Maybe not you personally...

I have never met anyone who is scared of your testimony.

I think you have a superiority complex. You think everyone is afraid or intimidated by you.

they are not

Exactly! On this we agree.

so you believe those saved will live forever with God in heaven? And the penalty of sin which condemns them is removed? when did you change your view?

Yes.


NO. Not the penalty of sin...the power of sin. The gospel is not in word but in power. You are missing the power. You deny the power. Admit it. You don't believe that through grace a regular man can walk as Jesus walked...without sin. Admit your unbelief.

This is where you are wrong

i can be saved from the power of sin all day long, If I am not saved from the PENALTY of sin. I am still dead in my sin.. If I am not redeemed, I will suffer eternal damnation or condemnation.

You can walk like Jesus all you want. It will not save you from the penalty of sin.

That's not true. There are the saved of the nations that will thank God forever for His mercy.

Yes they will. Because God has saved them, not by their works. But by his mercy,, through having their sins washed away and being born again (washing and renewal) which is done by God.

Unlike you...God is merciful. He looks after the poor... Read the story of Lazarus and the rich man. Now tell me what beliefs, or doctrinal theology, saved Lazarus.

So you do not think I look at the poor.. There you go with your nonsense again, You have no idea who I am and what I do with the poor..

Amen. My gospel is the gospel of both Christ AND Paul. Yours comes from Luther.

Mine comes from the word of God. it started back when adam first sinned.

You do not hold to Jesus gospel. or pauls..

First...I don't have people and neither do you.

yeah you do. they come to your aid all the time, and they continually seek you for guidance.

Your right, i do not have any people. nor do I want any. I point people to christ.

You are imagining yourself to be a kind of cult leader of sorts. But I know that no one listens to you..Ok maybe the family pet.

So again with your silly accusations. I think this is just a game to you

And the people who hear the truth I teach change immeasurably.

So all these people like stunned by Grace and others who have claimed they have NEVER walked int he spirit have changed?

come on man, Stop denying the truth about your gospel

They go from being hypocrites...like yourself at the present time...to being honest, humble, and God-fearing people. I don't have the power to translate people into the kingdom realm. God does that. But that doesn't mean that being saved from a damnation of an eternal outer darkness into the saved nations is not a huge step forward.

Honest and humble.. Like you?

Now that was a good laugh.. Look at the way they talk to people.. just like you do..

Your truth can only confine people to the same religious bondage that you are in. Wait till judgment day and the fire of testing. Many will weep and gnash their teeth at you for leading them astray. And then you will have to spend an eternity with them in the wilderness of darkness. Not very pleasant. I counsel you to repent of your shallow religious aspirations and look to God who can give you power over sin, the devil and the world.

I will be raised by Jesus on the last day. I have him promise

I am not trying to earn it..

You better repent and become born again. Or you will be the one screaming of all your works.. Just remember what Jesus said to them..

depart

 

[Eternally Grateful]

"Believe INTO Christ.." Is that the same thing as "grow up INTO the Head in all things, which is Christ...."?

But I have to ask, is this what a holy man sounds like? I don't think holiness involves disdaining and belittling the flock of Christ the way that is being done here, but would have a care and concern and a love for it.

if you do not believe as he does. and puff him up to what he thinks he is..then thats what you get.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

What you seek with your itching ears is easily and readily available in the US among the myriads of ministries that cater to middle-class religious posturers such as yourself. A dime a dozen really. And if I was to conform to the religious masses...how would that help you?

I am very different. And you see that as bad. Why?... because I don't conform to the flesh and the religious aspirations of the outer man?

Just ignore me as I ignore you. Follow your religious mind....trust in yourself.

How about you just look to christ. don;t worry about religion. or denominations. or following men,

Just look for Christ, who was sent to the lost so they could be found

Thats all you need to do.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

the wage (penalty of sin) is death.

the gift of God is life

being saved from the POWER of sin, does not save you from the WAGE of sin

 

[Episkopos]

the wage (penalty of sin) is death.

the gift of God is life

being saved from the POWER of sin, does not save you from the WAGE of sin

That's backwards. If a person does not sin..do they still need to repent?

You are not getting both sides of the equation...you have one truth cancelling out the other.

That's a scheme invented by Luther...whom you follow.

The gift of life in Christ doesn't cancel out the penalty of sin.

Do you think the law of flight cancels the law of gravity? or does one law OVERCOME the other by being a greater law?

 

[ChristisGod]

The gospel of the kingdom is prophesied by Isaiah

"The Spirit of the Lord God is upon me; because the Lord hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound;"

The gospel of Christ is clearly not meant for you. Only in humility...not religious pride...can one hear the god news. The good news is NOT meant for the outer man.

Liberty from the outer man. Opening the prison door that holds people within the confines of carnal strength.



I never said you were. You are worse...both a cessationist and dispensationalist...the very worst possible twisting of scriptures that can happen.

I'm not into any man-made religion. As such I stand against both popery and lutheran presumptions.

I do believe in spiritual authority. But men only respect other men...not what God is doing. I respect what God is building...the way He is building. I receive a prophet in the name of a prophet and a righteous man in the name of a righteous man.

Sounds weird, huh? You never heard of such things...

You are quoting Isaiah 61 in the OT when the gospel was a hidden mystery in the OT.

Try quoting the N.T.

And are you aware that the N.T. interprets the OT when it is quoted in the N.T. ?

You failed once again.

 

[ChristisGod]

The opposite is true. The gospel is ONLY what I have described. Luther was NOT an author of the bible This is where your confusion comes from.

You deny the power of the gospel...the very kind of people that Paul says we are to avoid.

More projecting since I quote Romans 1:16 often regarding the power of the gospel that saves a person.

 

[ChristisGod]

Those who know the Lord by a true and living faith have a real connection to God. He speaks to us, we know His voice, and He feeds and leads His flock (those who are following Him). But it's comments like this that confuse me and have made me wonder if you are talking about those who are not born again as opposed to a mere mental assent and nominal form of Christianity like Catholicism is. When I (and others here) speak of believers, we're talking about those who have come to faith in Christ and experienced genuine conversion and experience a living relationship and connection with the Lord day by day.


Now here is precisely why believing in imputed righteousness is NOT a recipe for smug self assurance on anyone's part and is not necessary for a doctrine of holiness to deny.... ....because the bible gives us plenty of warnings like this....parable of the talents ("even what he has will be taken away"), parable of the ten virgins with five cast out, and Jesus returning as a thief in the night, lukewarm being spewed out, churches having their lamps removed, etc. I believe where its says, "Though the number of the Israelites be as the sand of the sea, only a remnant will be saved".........serves as a warning to the church as well. The bride needs to be preparing for Christ's return by adorning herself with garments of holiness, (or I think at least be truly and wholeheartedly on that path and counting the cost to follow Jesus, should anyone happen to die before actually completing the process).

We are building on a sure foundation though.......and even are told not to cast our confidence away.....we need to have faith that God is able to make good on His promises like Abraham had. Seems as though there is always a healthy tension between fear of the Lord and trusting Him, and we need both at different times/seasons and circumstances along the way.

Amen