Coincidences? Or Time to WATCH be READY for the Day and Hour Is Near

[Ronald Nolette]

You forgot this verse:

"And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world."

If God redeemed all humanity, why did He purposely not seal them all in the Lamb's book of life?

Moses claims a name can be blotted out:

No, I accept that verse. Those unsaved in the church age are written in the book of Life.

"Yet now, if thou wilt forgive their sin--; and if not, blot me, I pray thee, out of thy book which thou hast written. And the Lord said unto Moses, Whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book."

All were placed in the Lamb's book of life. Only the Lamb could open the book so names could be removed. By the time the mark is given, names have been removed.

You have not proven there are 2 books of life where the Atonement Covenant allowed for the redemption of Adam's dead corruptible flesh. When a Seal was opened, John was told to come and see an event, but only the first four. John participated in the 5th and 6th Seal as he is redeemed and named in the Lamb's book of life.

Well yes Jesus is the Lamb slain from the foundation of the World. but you forget the church was not established until Pentecost. Even Jesus when He walked declared His Chruch had not yet begun to be built!

And you are forcing the Lambs Book of Life to equal the Book of Life which it is not.

You forget that the ancient OT saints did not have a heavenly hope. They were awaiting Messiah and to live in an earthly kingdom.
You also forget that these are written to people who had particular understandings, of which many are not written in Scripture.

The Book of Life is the Book of the Living. To be blotted out of the book of life is to die!

Believers will never have their names blotted out of the Lambs book of Life- though they may have their names blotted out of the the Book of the living.

 

[Timtofly]

No, I accept that verse. Those unsaved in the church age are written in the book of Life.

"Yet now, if thou wilt forgive their sin--; and if not, blot me, I pray thee, out of thy book which thou hast written. And the Lord said unto Moses, Whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book."

All were placed in the Lamb's book of life. Only the Lamb could open the book so names could be removed. By the time the mark is given, names have been removed.

You have not proven there are 2 books of life where the Atonement Covenant allowed for the redemption of Adam's dead corruptible flesh. When a Seal was opened, John was told to come and see an event, but only the first four. John participated in the 5th and 6th Seal as he is redeemed and named in the Lamb's book of life.

Well yes Jesus is the Lamb slain from the foundation of the World. but you forget the church was not established until Pentecost. Even Jesus when He walked declared His Chruch had not yet begun to be built!

And you are forcing the Lambs Book of Life to equal the Book of Life which it is not.

You forget that the ancient OT saints did not have a heavenly hope. They were awaiting Messiah and to live in an earthly kingdom.
You also forget that these are written to people who had particular understandings, of which many are not written in Scripture.

The Book of Life is the Book of the Living. To be blotted out of the book of life is to die!

Believers will never have their names blotted out of the Lambs book of Life- though they may have their names blotted out of the the Book of the living.

And you still fail to support two books of life from Scripture. You are going from a dispensational bias.

All are descendants of Adam. No one can claim any other paternal origin. So it is not about an OT and an NT. It is about being redeemed out of Adam's dead corruptible flesh.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

And you still fail to support two books of life from Scripture. You are going from a dispensational bias.

All are descendants of Adam. No one can claim any other paternal origin. So it is not about an OT and an NT. It is about being redeemed out of Adam's dead corruptible flesh.

It is you who fail to support two books of life. when did you decide to lie and flip who supports what?

You say the book of life and the Lambs book of life (as well as teh book in Rev. 6 which mentions not one person) as all one book. I say they are three separate books. when a book is mentioned, it doesn't always mean the same as the other books. You should know that as it is grammar school grammar.

And it is being redeemd from our own dead corrupted flesh. We do not go to hell because of Adam, but because we would reject Jesus as our own self.

 

[Timtofly]

And it is being redeemd from our own dead corrupted flesh. We do not go to hell because of Adam, but because we would reject Jesus as our own self.

I never said we go to sheol because of Adam. Paul said one man brought sin into the world.

If you do nothing, the default result is the LOF.

But you are avoiding that there is only one Lamb, one redemption, and one book of life. Still waiting for Scriptural proof of now 3 different books of redemption for sinners.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

I never said we go to sheol because of Adam. Paul said one man brought sin into the world.

If you do nothing, the default result is the LOF.

But you are avoiding that there is only one Lamb, one redemption, and one book of life. Still waiting for Scriptural proof of now 3 different books of redemption for sinners.

And I have been waiting for you to biblically show that the book of life and the Lambs Book are one and the same.

As for what you say I am avoiding- those are all false accusations. There is but one book of the living (or life) that has the name of all who ever lived.

 

[ewq1938]

And I have been waiting for you to biblically show that the book of life and the Lambs Book are one and the same.

Obviously they are the same book as scripture uses both terms for the same book:


Names are written in the book of life:

Rev_3:5 He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

Rev_20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
Rev_20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Names are written in the Lamb's book of life:

Rev_21:27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.



Names that are not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world:

Rev_17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

Names that are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world:

Rev_13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

These same names not written in the Lamb's book is repeated here using just "the book of life". Clearly this is the same book of life, whether called that or the Lamb's book of life:

Rev_20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
Rev_20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Rev_22:19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

 

[Timtofly]

And I have been waiting for you to biblically show that the book of life and the Lambs Book are one and the same.

As for what you say I am avoiding- those are all false accusations. There is but one book of the living (or life) that has the name of all who ever lived.

There is only one book sealed. That book belongs to the Lamb. The Lamb paid the price to purchase and seal all those redeemed. You sure don't get the whole Lamb and redemption theme of the book of Revelation, do you? You probably don't even interpret the "souls under the alter" correctly either. The alter the Lamb was the sacrificial Atonement on. The type set in the Law, that Jesus was the fulfillment of. Jesus was found worthy to open the Lamb's book of life because He was obedient to the Cross. No one else could be that Atonement Covenant.

There is no literal alter nor Lamb in heaven. This is all symbolism. But Jesus opened His book of life and is about to sit in judgment on earth and start removing names. You missed all that looking for an Antichrist instead.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Obviously they are the same book as scripture uses both terms for the same book:


Names are written in the book of life:

Rev_3:5 He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

Rev_20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
Rev_20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Names are written in the Lamb's book of life:

Rev_21:27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.



Names that are not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world:

Rev_17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

Names that are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world:

Rev_13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

These same names not written in the Lamb's book is repeated here using just "the book of life". Clearly this is the same book of life, whether called that or the Lamb's book of life:

Rev_20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
Rev_20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Rev_22:19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

Well you say they are teh same, but history, Jewish knowledge and language says the Book of Life is better called the Book of the Living and the lambs Book is the names of church saints.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

There is only one book sealed. That book belongs to the Lamb. The Lamb paid the price to purchase and seal all those redeemed. You sure don't get the whole Lamb and redemption theme of the book of Revelation, do you? You probably don't even interpret the "souls under the alter" correctly either. The alter the Lamb was the sacrificial Atonement on. The type set in the Law, that Jesus was the fulfillment of. Jesus was found worthy to open the Lamb's book of life because He was obedient to the Cross. No one else could be that Atonement Covenant.

There is no literal alter nor Lamb in heaven. This is all symbolism. But Jesus opened His book of life and is about to sit in judgment on earth and start removing names. You missed all that looking for an Antichrist instead.

Now you are just openly denying and contradicting Scripture.

Jesus became worthy to open the book with seven seals. Nowhere but in your mind does it say He owns that scroll.

I very much get Revelation. Have taught it for over 3 decades.

And if you do not think there is no altar in heaven- you are mistaken. The entire temple and all the instruments were crafted after the pattern shown MOses of the ones in Heaven.

 

[ewq1938]

Well you say they are teh same, but history, Jewish knowledge and language says the Book of Life is better called the Book of the Living and the lambs Book is the names of church saints.

There is nothing at all that suggests they are different books. All the SCRIPTURAL evidence is that it's two ways to speak of the same book.

 

[Timtofly]

Now you are just openly denying and contradicting Scripture.

Jesus became worthy to open the book with seven seals. Nowhere but in your mind does it say He owns that scroll.

I very much get Revelation. Have taught it for over 3 decades.

And if you do not think there is no altar in heaven- you are mistaken. The entire temple and all the instruments were crafted after the pattern shown MOses of the ones in Heaven.

I never said there was no temple nor alter in heaven. I said the symbolism is not a literal scene in heaven. "Souls under the alter" is the symbolism all the redeemed are covered by the Blood of the Lamb, called the Atonement Covenant. Being named in the Lamb's book of life is the same thing as "souls under the alter". After the 7 seals, there are still those on earth that are named in the Lamb's book of life, but they have to be translated out of Adam's dead corruptible flesh.

You call it a scroll. Scripture calls it a book.

It is not about Jesus owning the Book. It is called the Lamb's book of life, because Jesus is the Lamb that was the Atonement. The Atonement is what placed all the names in the Lamb's book of life.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

There is nothing at all that suggests they are different books. All the SCRIPTURAL evidence is that it's two ways to speak of the same book.

So the OT saints knew all about the Lambs book of life to you then. they knew about HIs book before they even knew He existed! WOW!

And I await your biblical evidence they are one and the same book.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

I never said there was no temple nor alter in heaven. I said the symbolism is not a literal scene in heaven. "Souls under the alter" is the symbolism all the redeemed are covered by the Blood of the Lamb, called the Atonement Covenant. Being named in the Lamb's book of life is the same thing as "souls under the alter". After the 7 seals, there are still those on earth that are named in the Lamb's book of life, but they have to be translated out of Adam's dead corruptible flesh.

So now you are walking back your statement it is all symbolism. Symbolism means it is notr reality but allegory or metaphor. And how do you know those souls are not under an altar? Have you been to heaven to scope out the altar there? I believe that is a metaphor but I won't be as dogmatic as you.

I don't think you know what translate even means.

We are not translated out of Adams dead corruptible flesh according to the Word of God. Our corruptible flesh is changed to incorruptible- we are not removed from it but it is changed. That is the point of being resurrected from the dead! To have our corruptible bodies become incorruptible

 

[ewq1938]

So the OT saints knew all about the Lambs book of life to you then. they knew about HIs book before they even knew He existed! WOW!

And I await your biblical evidence they are one and the same book.

You've seen it already. It is I that awaits you to attempt to unprove it.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

You've seen it already. It is I that awaits you to attempt to unprove it.

Not on this thread. I have heard your claims BUT NOT TEH BIBLICAL PASSAGES TO SUPPORT YOUR CLAIMS. Just your commentary that your opinion is fact.

 

[Timtofly]

So now you are walking back your statement it is all symbolism. Symbolism means it is notr reality but allegory or metaphor. And how do you know those souls are not under an altar? Have you been to heaven to scope out the altar there? I believe that is a metaphor but I won't be as dogmatic as you.

I don't think you know what translate even means.

We are not translated out of Adams dead corruptible flesh according to the Word of God. Our corruptible flesh is changed to incorruptible- we are not removed from it but it is changed. That is the point of being resurrected from the dead! To have our corruptible bodies become incorruptible

2 Corinthians 5

 

[Ronald Nolette]

2 Corinthians 5

And just using this verse in isolation is why you err. You must combine it with teh other verses that speak of what happens when we reach heaven.

1 Cor. 15

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

We are changed. Our mortal bodies are given immortality and our corruptible flesh will be made incorruptible.

 

[Timtofly]

And just using this verse in isolation is why you err. You must combine it with teh other verses that speak of what happens when we reach heaven.

1 Cor. 15

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

We are changed. Our mortal bodies are given immortality and our corruptible flesh will be made incorruptible.

That is a chapter not a verse.

You are interpreting 1 Corinthians 15 without taking 2 Corinthians 5 into consideration.

I incorporated both chapters into my point.

 

[David in NJ]

And just using this verse in isolation is why you err. You must combine it with teh other verses that speak of what happens when we reach heaven.

1 Cor. 15

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

We are changed. Our mortal bodies are given immortality and our corruptible flesh will be made incorruptible.

1 Cor 15:51-54 is not speaking of "what happens when we reach heaven".

Please read the entire chapter - thank you

 

[Ronald Nolette]

That is a chapter not a verse.

You are interpreting 1 Corinthians 15 without taking 2 Corinthians 5 into consideration.

I incorporated both chapters into my point.

Which is erroneous exegesis. In 2 Cor. 5 Paul is speaking of physical death when the soul and spirit of a believer leaves and goes to heaven while the body goes into the ground.

1 Thessalonians 4:16
For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

Revelation 20:13-15

King James Version

​

13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Every soul will be restored to their body. Teh body will have undergone a "metamorphis" (change) and all will be made immortal and incorruptible- some to go to life and the rest to he lake of fire to suffer for eternity in the body god gave. this is the whole point of the Jesus being the firstfruits of the resurrection. the body Jesus died in was the one risen and the one glorified and we will follow after Him in this.