What makes a doctrine false?

[St. SteVen]

Right, If a person doesnt believe in Christ, its because they were not of His Sheep that He died for. Jesus said this Jn 10:26

26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.

1 Jn 2:2 is Christs Sheep around the world

We seem to be at an impasse. - LOL

 

[St. SteVen]

False religion.

Go to the context and find out.

Thanks for quoting my post this time. Much appreciated.

 

[charity]

Question: Do we speak the truth in love when we declare someone else's doctrine false?

Hello @St. SteVen,

If it is genuinely false, yes. For you would be doing them a kindness.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Enoch111]

Have wondered how a star could point to a single city. Could have been an angelic light. ???

If this was a special star created by God to bring the wise men to Bethlehem, why not take it for what it is? Can God create special stars? Absolutely. The prophecy of this star was already made by Balaam about 1500 years before the star appeared. And the K.I.S.S. principle should apply.

 

[St. SteVen]

If it is genuinely false, yes. For you would be doing them a kindness.

I suppose it depends on how that was delivered.
Don't forget to shake the dust off your sandals before you walk away. - LOL

 

[St. SteVen]

St. SteVen said:

Have wondered how a star could point to a single city. Could have been an angelic light. ???

If this was a special star created by God to bring the wise men to Bethlehem, why not take it for what it is? Can God create special stars? Absolutely. The prophecy of this star was already made by Balaam about 1500 years before the star appeared. And the K.I.S.S. principle should apply.

Yes, K.I.S.S.
Try this simple test.
Stand under the starry sky and tell me which star points to your city.

 

[Zao is life]

How do you determine that God doesn't agree with it?
If you really thought that God didn't agree with someone else's doctrinal opinion, would you call it a false doctrine?
That's exactly what this topic is about. That mindset.

Jesus and the Apostles demanded doctrinal purity?
How did you arrive at that conclusion? All doctrine is man-made.
An attempt to codify what we think the Bible is saying.

I think Jesus was using exaggeration to make a point. Do you think he dishonored his own mother and father?
Nothing to do with doctrine, or beliefs. Follow Jesus and leave the rest behind.
When Jesus called the fishermen disciples to follow him, they left their nets and followed.

That's fine, but I was observing a very un-brotherly level of tribalism on that board.
Again, what this topic is about.

On the contrary, my good fellow. (assuming)
I run toward disagreement when many run away from it.
I work hard to understand where the other is coming from.

I am critical of negative and inappropriate responses to disagreement.
Posters are quick to label others as liars and claim they disagree with God. (sound familiar?)
And the obvious charge of false doctrine, over a difference of opinion.

OK well I understand your point, also, but if God doesn't agree with a doctrine then it means that doctrine is not true, and if it's not true, then it's false. It's not a grey area . It's either true, or false. Like if I as a non-American believe that the Grand Canyon is in Canada, but the Grand Canyon disagrees. Then what I believe is false, and if I teach it as doctrine, then it's a false doctrine.

We should make it our business trying to ascertain what God believes, and what Jesus and His apostles meant. The reason why there is so much 'tribalism' in the eschatology board is because there are different beliefs about what is true and false when it comes to certain doctrines, so in my opinion we should just get over it. Or play baseball with a tennis ball.

 

[Zao is life]

They weren't given Faith. If God doesnt give a person faith to believe, then that means, Christ didnt die for them, and so they consequently are condemned, and must suffer the consequences for their sins.

Faith to be believe in Christ must be granted in behalf of Christ Phil 1:29

29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;

Now if He was given for our sins, we will be given Faith with Him Rom 8:32

32 He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?

So God judged them unfairly is how I read what you are saying, because they weren't "given" the faith they were judged for not having. That's harsh.

I believe God knows what it is that causes any human being to close his heart (mind) to the gospel. I'm satisfied with that, but not with your explanation. I don't believe the reason some human hearts remain closed has anything to do with psychological reactions to harsh experiences or anything like that, either. However only God knows the human heart, so He did not and does not judge unfairly, just because we struggle to understand.

Jesus actually told us why many humans will not come to the light.

 

[St. SteVen]

if God doesn't agree with a doctrine then it means that doctrine is not true, and if it's not true, then it's false.

Does God really care at all about man-made doctrines?
I think we tend to put doctrines on a pedestal where they don't belong.

We should make it our business trying to ascertain what God believes

Same problem. God is not about a belief system. IMHO

The reason why there is so much 'tribalism' in the eschatology board is because there are different beliefs about what is true and false when it comes to certain doctrines, so in my opinion we should just get over it.

My concern was not with the differences in opinion, I expect there to be a differences in opinion.
But rather, my concern was with what those differences in opinion were doing to the fellowship of the whole.

Or play baseball with a tennis ball.

Good one. - LOL

 

[Zao is life]

Same problem. God is not about a belief system. IMHO

I disagree. The word Rabbi = Teacher = what Jesus is, and teaching is intricately linked with doctrine. In fact most of Jesus' ministry was about doctrine, which included Jesus fighting against false doctrine. He offended a lot of people that way, those who regarded the doctrine of Christ as false.

Part of what Jesus taught was a prophecy regarding two things: His return, and the coming destruction of the city and temple, and He referred to the prophecies of Daniel when He taught this doctrine. The Revelation too is a Revelation of Jesus Christ. The apostles prophesied also.

The Bible is full of doctrine, The religious beliefs of the Jews and of all peoples contains a great amount of doctrine. The Bible is full of doctrine about God, and also contains a great amount of prophecy regarding end times (eschatology). It's you who calls it all "man-made doctrine". The only man-made thing is our inability to understand everything aright, because we do not ask God enough to give us understanding.

Christian doctrine itself is not man-made. It's God-given. For you it's a case of "Problem: Doctrine causes division (because of human fallibility). Solution: Don't bother about doctrine.

I disagree with your solution.

 

[St. SteVen]

If this was a special star created by God to bring the wise men to Bethlehem, why not take it for what it is? Can God create special stars? Absolutely.

Why assume it was a "special" star?
Is that an attempt to separate stargazing from what God intended for humankind?
As if the ability to read the stars is somehow wrong? For what purpose did God create the stars? (lights in the sky)

Genesis 1:14 NIV
And God said, “Let there be lights in the vault of the sky to separate the day from the night,
and let them serve as signs to mark sacred times, and days and years,

 

[Enoch111]

Why assume it was a "special" star?

Why would it not be a special star since it was a guiding star? If you can't believe that you do have a problem.

 

[Enoch111]

Stand under the starry sky and tell me which star points to your city.

Why would any ordinary star point to any city?

 

[Zao is life]

Why assume it was a "special" star?
Is that an attempt to separate stargazing from what God intended for humankind?
As if the ability to read the stars is somehow wrong? For what purpose did God create the stars? (lights in the sky)

Genesis 1:14 NIV
And God said, “Let there be lights in the vault of the sky to separate the day from the night,
and let them serve as signs to mark sacred times, and days and years,

Lol you don't realize it but you're arguing doctrine.

 

[Zao is life]

But rather, my concern was with what those differences in opinion were doing to the fellowship of the whole.

Good one. - LOL

It's doing exactly what God wants, IMO. It's teaching us that our unity is in the Spirit, not in our opinions about the meaning of all doctrines, and it's separating the sheep from the goats in a way that isn't visible to man but is visible to God - and not because of some being "right" about their doctrine and others being "wrong", but there's a reason why God allows certain things to flourish (for now), IMO.

 

[St. SteVen]

Christian doctrine itself is not man-made. It's God-given.

Christian doctrine should be biblically based. But it is indeed man-made.
If doctrine is God-given, why are there differing views? Is God undecided?

doctrine
dŏk′trĭn

noun​

1. A principle or body of principles presented for acceptance or belief, as by a religious, political, scientific, or philosophic group; dogma.

For you it's a case of "Problem: Doctrine causes division (because of human fallibility). Solution: Don't bother about doctrine.

No. Division is caused by not accepting that there are differing views.

Division is when I tell you that:
- your view is WRONG and my view is RIGHT.
- my view is SOUND doctrine, and your view is FALSE doctrine.
- my doctrine is GOD-GIVEN and yours is from HELL.

 

[St. SteVen]

Lol you don't realize it but you're arguing doctrine.

You don't realize it, but I'm not anti-doctrine.
I just keep it in perspective by understanding that it is man-made, and therefore fallible.
My doctrines have changed over the years. I call it spiritual growth.

 

[St. SteVen]

... It's teaching us that our unity is in the Spirit, not in our opinions about the meaning of all doctrines, and it's separating the sheep from the goats in a way that isn't visible to man but is visible to God...

Arguing doctrine is separating the sheep from the goats? Explain.

 

[St. SteVen]

Why would it not be a special star since it was a guiding star? If you can't believe that you do have a problem.

Weren't all the stars created for that purpose?
It sounded like you were trying to separate God's purpose for the stars from the Bethlehem star by calling it special.
Why would you get snarky over that?

Genesis 1:14 NIV
And God said, “Let there be lights in the vault of the sky to separate the day from the night,
and let them serve as signs to mark sacred times, and days and years,

 

[St. SteVen]

... It's teaching us that our unity is in the Spirit...

I see posters making terrible comments about each other. Unity in the Spirit?