The 70 Weeks Prophecy - The Ezra 6:14 Challenge

[marks]

So if the text does not say 70 1/2, why would you bring up this fabricated point, that only you see, because you fabricated the point?

To him, it's a way to impugn other people's interpretations. His claim is that if you were consistent in the way you interpret the passage to arrive at 70 weeks in the normal way, that you'd actually have to have 70.5 weeks, and that's not right, so you have to use his way to interpret it.

I agree with you, I see that fabricated, without any real relevence to the discussion.

Much love!

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

Everyone here has addressed his so called "facts"

They just do not agree with his interpretation so he says no one is able to.

NO ONE has addressed it. You keep mocking and stating falsehoods. Your views just can't stand to the light of Scripture. You are afraid of even trying.

 

[marks]

Everyone here has addressed his so called "facts"

They just do not agree with his interpretation so he says no one is able to.

In other words, like so many others, to end with insults when it doesn't go the way he wants. It's childish in my view.

Much love!

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

In other words, like so many others, to end with insults when it doesn't go the way he wants. It's childish in my view.

Much love!

Calling the kettle black again. Seriously, you people are just childish.

Just stop posting in this thread if you won't stay on subject. This is NOT about your unscriptural views if you won't address the topic.

 

[marks]

Calling the kettle black again.

I don't insult others.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Except for the one correct one.

Have you actually shared the view you hold to? I've not seen it.

Much love!

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

I don't insult others.

Much love!

You'd better be reading your posts again.

"Rather presumptuous . . . perhaps, or perhaps just defensive, I don't know. Why do people say the things they do?

You speak of things you don't know. Maybe you are confused. Maybe you are making things up."

You can't even address the thread topic.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

In other words, like so many others, to end with insults when it doesn't go the way he wants. It's childish in my view.

Much love!

Yep.

Look how he responded.

its why I do not address him anymore.. He hurts his own reputation by the way he acts

 

[marks]

You'd better be reading your posts again.

"Rather presumptuous . . . perhaps, or perhaps just defensive, I don't know. Why do people say the things they do?

You speak of things you don't know. Maybe you are confused. Maybe you are making things up."

You can't even address the thread topic.

Should we include what I was responding to? I noticed you didn't quote, only posted these snippets. Perhaps - if you have the courage - post your comments that preceded those posts. What I was addressing.

No, nevermind, there is no value to that. Just as there is no value to this thread, IMO.

And have you even posted your view? I haven't seen it. Only your harping on others all being wrong, and cowards, and all the rest you've said.

Enough.

Much love!

 

[ScottA]

Here's another clue for the Ezra 6:14 Challenge.

The Challenge has identified the following facts.

1. Ezra says there were 4 commands given allowing for the completion of the temple. When was the first one done; where is this literal decree?
[Ezr 6:14 LSB] 14b So they built and completed [the Temple] according to the decree of the God of Israel and the decree of Cyrus, Darius, and Artaxerxes king of Persia.

2. The words to restore and build - Hebrew "sub" and "bana". Where were those actual words used in Jeremiah and what exactly did they signify?
[Dan 9:2 ESV] 2 in the first year of his reign, I, Daniel, perceived in the books the number of years that, according to the word of the LORD to Jeremiah the prophet, must pass before the end of the desolations of Jerusalem, namely, seventy years.

3. In Daniel 9:25 the phrase "the going out of a word...". The "word" is the Hebrew "dabar". It means speech, utterance, words. Daniel never uses this word to refer to an official decree by an earthly king. Never.

4. The entire contents of Daniel's prophecies would be hidden from proper interpretation until the time of the end.
[Dan 12:4 LSB] 4 "But as for you, Daniel, conceal these words and seal up the book until the time of the end; ..."

5. Bible translations of the 70 Weeks passage vary all over the place with the timing of the Weeks in the prophecy. It's so confusing since every translation puts their particular bias into the text. They have to. Hebrew does not have capital letters or punctuation so any translation will be an interpretation. The proper interpretation is all tied to the original Hebrew text. No one will understand the prophecy correctly by reading an English translation.

6. Many combine the 7 Weeks with the 62 Weeks to get a combined 69 Weeks. But they don't realize that in order to treat the text consistently, then according to the Hebrew text, they MUST also combine the following 1 Week with the 1/2 Week. All this adds up to 70 1/2 Weeks. It obviously must be 70 Weeks so they must explain this issue with their assumption.

7. There are those who use the 457 BC decree of Artaxerxes as the start of the period of 70 Weeks. Daniel 9:25 is quite specific to state that the start has to do with restoring and rebuilding Jerusalem. The 457 BC decree had nothing whatsoever to do with that; it allowed for the beautification of the Temple.
[Ezr 7:27 LSB] 27 Blessed be Yahweh, the God of our fathers, who has put [such a thing] as this in the king's heart, to beautify the house of Yahweh which is in Jerusalem,

8. There must be a specific purpose behind carving out the first period of 7 Weeks of years? What exactly is the reason for those 49 years?

All these facts must be addressed and properly explained by any interpretation of the 70 Weeks. This is all part of the Ezra 6:14 Challenge.

You are analyzing the tail of the dog (what did you hope to find?).

I gave you the head.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

This has been a great thread. It's given so much useful material for my next presentation about the Ezra 6:14 Challenge.

It's been a great example of people with closed minds who are set in their interpretations and how when they are challenged to defend their views against Scripture, how they react.

• You've got the trolls who have nothing to offer - they just put childish emojis on anything they don't like
• Then you have those who just deflect and change the subject back to their pet view.
• Then you've got the twisters - the ones who use pieces of pet Scripture totally out of context to bolster their views.
• Then you've got the ones who make things up, totally against historical evidence and defend it by saying "it means that to me, so I'm right".
• Then you've got the ostriches who think if they don't look at anything else, their own opinion is safe if they can stay in ignorance.
• Then you've got the projectors who accuse people of behaving and thinking exactly like they are behaving and thinking

And all of these types of people have one thing in common. They are unwilling to weigh their interpretations in the balance against the facts which can be easily shown. Facts which most people either are not aware of or choose to stay ignorant of.

 

[marks]

Yep.

Look how he responded.

its why I do not address him anymore.. He hurts his own reputation by the way he acts

I'm done.

Much love!

 

[Eternally Grateful]

You are analyzing the tail of the dog (what did you hope to find?).

I gave you the head.

He is stuck.

Dan 9 speaks of the command to restore JERUSALEM (the city)

Nothing in his ezra challenge shows anything about any command to restore the city. The only command is to restore and rebuild the temple. Which does not fit the Dan 9 command.

But he won;t acknowledge this fact. or acknowledge it destroys his theory. He will just attack and say no one can refute him.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

This thread is a perfect example of "agnotology" or the study of deliberately induced ignorance. How very interesting that so many are exhibiting the classic signs of this troubling phenomenon. I wonder if anyone has done a study about these ostriches in Christian populations.

Interesting video explaining the concept. Active ignorance. But most people won't want to check this out - it's too scary to rock their shaky interpretations.

 

[Jay Ross]

This thread is a perfect example of "agnotology" or the study of deliberately induced ignorance.

Thanks for providing the evidence of what you do to win your point of view and dominate us plebs with your ignorance.

LOL :cool::cool:

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

He is stuck.

Dan 9 speaks of the command to restore JERUSALEM (the city)

Nothing in his ezra challenge shows anything about any command to restore the city. The only command is to restore and rebuild the temple. Which does not fit the Dan 9 command.

But he won;t acknowledge this fact. or acknowledge it destroys his theory. He will just attack and say no one can refute him.

Your post proves that you have not even truly understood what Ezra is saying in Ezra 6:14. If you had you wouldn't be making such baseless and unsupported statements.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Here's another clue for the Ezra 6:14 Challenge.

Ezra 6:14 lists 4 commands that were given in order for the temple to be completed - and by way of returning to the land and restoring it. The Hebrew words "sub" and "bana". "Return" and "restore". These are the words found in Daniel 9:25. The words which signaled the start of the entire period of the 70 Weeks.

Arguments have raged back and forth as to when did this period start. What king's decree started the whole thing? Look on any forum thread about this topic and every tom, dick and harry has their pet interpretation. Very few base theirs on an accurate understanding of the text. Some tie it to their particular denomination. Or some "personal vision from God". Or some supposed expert scholar. But no one realizes that Ezra 6:14 invalidates all of their interpretations. They don't acknowledge or realize that God's command to "sub" and "bana" came before any of the 3 kings' decrees.

This makes complete sense, unfortunately. Out of all the many English translations, they all interpret Daniel 9:25 differently. It's a complete mess. This shows that no translator has ever truly correctly understood the 70 Weeks prophecy.

The vast majority of proposed interpretations are based on the King James Version.
King James Bible
Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

Some are very close in wording.
New American Standard Bible
So you are to know and understand that from the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem, until Messiah the Prince, there will be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks; it will be built again, with streets and moat, even in times of distress.

New International Version
"Know and understand this: From the time the word goes out to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One, the ruler, comes, there will be seven 'sevens,' and sixty-two 'sevens.' It will be rebuilt with streets and a trench, but in times of trouble.

But their biases are very evident. Anyone who knows the Hebrew language knows that there are no capital letters in Hebrew. Or punctuation. Any translation that puts in capitals and adds punctuation is making an INTERPRETATION of the original Hebrew text. It's very safe to say that anyone who bases their own view on the KJV, NASB, NIV or similar with added capitals will NEVER come to the correct view of the prophecy.

Obviously, the English language needs punctuation. But what about those translations who don't add capitals for "messiah" and "prince"?
NET Bible
So know and understand: From the issuing of the command to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until an anointed one, a prince arrives, there will be a period of seven weeks and sixty-two weeks. It will again be built, with plaza and moat, but in distressful times.

JPS Tanakh 1917
Know therefore and discern, that from the going forth of the word to restore and to build Jerusalem unto one anointed, a prince, shall be seven weeks; and for threescore and two weeks, it shall be built again, with broad place and moat, but in troublous times.

Coverdale Bible of 1535
Vnderstode this then, and marcke it well: that from the tyme it shalbe concluded, to go and repayre Ierusalem agayne, vnto Christ (or the anoynted) prynce: there shalbe seuen wekes. Then shall the stretes & walles be buylded agayne [sixty-two] wekes, but with harde troublous tyme.

Even though the Coverdale still capitalizes "Christ", they include the alternate "anoynted". But notice where the periods of weeks occur. Totally different. And what are you going to do with this translation?
English Standard Version
Know therefore and understand that from the going out of the word to restore and build Jerusalem to the coming of an anointed one, a prince, there shall be seven weeks. Then for sixty-two weeks it shall be built again with squares and moat, but in a troubled time.

The proper interpretation is all tied to the original Hebrew text. No one will understand the prophecy correctly by reading an English translation. That is part of the Ezra 6:14 Challenge.

Anyone can create some sort of test to try to discredit anything in Scripture by using SCripture. I remain solid in the knowledge that the decree was the one issued by Cryus.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

Anyone can create some sort of test to try to discredit anything in Scripture by using SCripture. I remain solid in the knowledge that the decree was the one issued by Cryus.

And in your "solid knowledge", how does it explain the 8 points of the Ezra 6:14 Challenge?

 

[Ronald Nolette]

And in your "solid knowledge", how does it explain the 8 points of the Ezra 6:14 Challenge?

Do me a favor. Succinttly list the 8 points on one post and I will do my best to answer them.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

Do me a favor. Succinttly list the 8 points on one post and I will do my best to answer them.

Well, if you were going to have respect for the discussion you would read the through the thread so you can give useful answers. The posts at the beginning explain the topic in detail. This post gives an overview. - The 70 Weeks Prophecy - The Ezra 6:14 Challenge