One last question!

[Dan Clarkston]

Can you lose your salvation or not?

I keep having people tell me I must do this or that which sounds a lot like they are saying you can't be saved unless you do a bunch of good things.

That makes me think they believe you can lose your salvation.

If you cannot lose your salvation then why is all this other being said?

 

[ScottA]

Can you lose your salvation or not?

I keep having people tell me I must do this or that which sounds a lot like they are saying you can't be saved unless you do a bunch of good things.

That makes me think they believe you can lose your salvation.

If you cannot lose your salvation then why is all this other being said?

Many do indeed believe one can lose their salvation. Which is not true, for no one who has passed from death to life (in God) can return to death, for they are born of God whom is eternal.

But...yes...you will hear a lot from that crowd that believes their salvation is in their own hands.

 

[Lambano]

There's scriptures that support both sides of the argument. That's why it's such a lively topic for debate.

So, we don't really know. We're told to trust God to save and keep us, to trust what Jesus has done for us, and to keep on trusting. We're also told to follow Christ and to strive (inasmuch as it depends on us) to eliminate the effects of sin in our lives. If you want a binary, black-or-white answer, you won't get it. I can guess at some of the reasons WHY God set it up this way.

Can you tolerate ambiguity?

 

[Dan Clarkston]

I guess I need to start listening to preachers that teach you can lose your salvation and see what bible passages they are using to make that claim.

And then compare those passages to the ones used by preachers that claim you can not lose your salvation to see what the bible says about this.

Many do indeed believe one can lose their salvation. Which is not true

So you believe if one lives in sin they will still go to Heaven since they cannot ever lose their salvation?

 

[Dan Clarkston]

If you want a binary, black-or-white answer, you won't get it. I can guess at some of the reasons WHY God set it up this way.

If that is true it doesn't sound like God is got any common sense at all if He is refusing to make the issue clear.

This sounds like something the government does because they are always hiding something since they are dishonest

This explanation sounds fishy, either that or I'm in error for thinking God is perfect.

 

[amadeus]

I guess I need to start listening to preachers that teach you can lose your salvation and see what bible passages they are using to make that claim.

And then compare those passages to the ones used by preachers that claim you can not lose your salvation to see what the bible says about this.

Do you believe that pitting one man's view against another man's view, even though both of them are gospel preachers, will result in you knowing God's view? Try again!

Joh 14:26

But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

Ro 8:13	For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
Ro 8:14	For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

 

[Dan Clarkston]

Do you believe that pitting one man's view against another man's view, even though both of them are gospel preachers, will result in you knowing God's view? Try again!

I didn't say I was going to compare men's views.

I said I should compare bible passages each side is using to come to their conclusions.

I heard one preacher that teaches eternal security refute Ro 8:13 saying sometimes when Christians live in sin the Lord takes them home to be with Him in Heaven.

Ever here that explanation?

 

[amadeus]

I didn't say I was going to compare men's views.

I said I should compare bible passages each side is using to come to their conclusions.

I heard one preacher that teaches eternal security refute Ro 8:13 saying sometimes when Christians live in sin the Lord takes them home to be with Him in Heaven.

Ever here that explanation?

Probably I have heard most of the explanations. If God was in the explanation, then we should be listening closely. If not, then not. Without the leading of the Holy Spirit, who is able to find or understand God's Truth? Jesus is the Truth but who is able to know Him completely? Who is seeing Him other than through a glass darkly?

 

[JBO]

Do you believe that pitting one man's view against another man's view, even though both of them are gospel preachers, will result in you knowing God's view? Try again!

Joh 14:26

But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

Ro 8:13	For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
Ro 8:14	For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

John 14:26 was Jesus speaking directly to His disciples, not you. It is a statement that they would be divinely inspired. You are not them.

 

[Dan Clarkston]

Who is seeing Him other than through a glass darkly?

So you think it's all a mystery and we can never know what God is thinking?

 

[Dan Clarkston]

John 14:26 was Jesus speaking directly to His disciples, not you. It is a statement that they would be divinely inspired. You are not them.

So the Holy Spirit was only sent to those guys... and to the rest of us it's all a mystery and we can never know what God's will is?

If that's true we may as well all go get drunk because this makes Christianity in to a bunch of foolishness!

I sure hope this is not the case.

 

[amadeus]

John 14:26 was Jesus speaking directly to His disciples, not you. It is a statement that they would be divinely inspired. You are not them.

Perhaps you believe that, but I do not. Through the Holy Spirit God speaks to men and sometimes He uses what we read in the scriptures to do so. I believe that the men who wrote the scriptures were inspired by God in that writing. I believe that men who read the scriptures with correct understanding according to God are similarly inspired by Him.

 

[amadeus]

So you think it's all a mystery and we can never know what God is thinking?

No it is not all a mystery to everyone. Consider this:

Pr 29:18

Where there is no vision, the people perish

Consider the result of the first touch of Jesus and the second:

Mr 8:23	And he took the blind man by the hand, and led him out of the town; and when he had spit on his eyes, and put his hands upon him, he asked him if he saw ought.
Mr 8:24	And he looked up, and said, I see men as trees, walking.
Mr 8:25	After that he put his hands again upon his eyes, and made him look up: and he was restored, and saw every man clearly.

Consider what Apostle Paul wrote here:

1co 13:11	When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
1co 13:12	For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.

When is THEN? Could it be when a person receives a second touch from Jesus?

 

[JBO]

Perhaps you believe that, but I do not. Through the Holy Spirit God speaks to men and sometimes He uses what we read in the scriptures to do so. I believe that the men who wrote the scriptures were inspired by God in that writing. I believe that men who read the scriptures with correct understanding according to God are similarly inspired by Him.

I think you don't have a good understanding of what it means that the apostles and prophets were divinely inspired. In their inspired writings there were no mistakes. We on the other hand are not given that ability.

 

[Dan Clarkston]

I believe that men who read the scriptures with correct understanding according to God are similarly inspired by Him.

Now all we gotta figure out is who is it that decides what "correct understanding" is and we'll be all set!

 

[JBO]

So the Holy Spirit was only sent to those guys... and to the rest of us it's all a mystery and we can never know what God's will is?

If that's true we may as well all go get drunk because this makes Christianity in to a bunch of foolishness!

I sure hope this is not the case.

I didn't say that. But what was done to and with the apostles and prophets through the Holy Spirit was much more than what is given every Christian through the indwelling Holy Spirit. The apostles and prophets were given supernatural signs, wonders, miracles and errorless teaching. You would benefit from some more studying on the person and work of the Holy Spirit.

 

[amadeus]

I think you don't have a good understanding of what it means that the apostles and prophets were divinely inspired. In their inspired writings there were no mistakes. We on the other hand are not given that ability.

I did not mean there were mistakes in the written text. I meant that without God leading or inspiring a person who reads the Bible or a portion thereof, that the person has incomplete or even wrong understanding of what he reads.

 

[amadeus]

Now all we gotta figure out is who is it that decides what "correct understanding" is and we'll be all set!

God decides. Who else? Certainly not me. Who is really led by the Spirit as he reads the Bible and who is rather reading and interpreting with his carnal mind? God knows!

 

[JBO]

When is THEN? Could it be when a person receives a second touch from Jesus?

I think THEN is when he gets to heaven. For now though, as he says in the next verse, it is faith, hope and love that abide.

 

[Ritajanice]

I didn't say that. But what was done to and with the apostles and prophets through the Holy Spirit was much more than what is given every Christian through the indwelling Holy Spirit. The apostles and prophets were given supernatural signs, wonders, miracles and errorless teaching. You would benefit from some more studying on the person and work of the Holy Spirit.

Not true......the Holy Spirit has shown me much....a Born Again is a child of God....we are led by the Spirit....I think it is you who needs to do the studying.

You obviously don’t know that Gods word is Alive and Active.....he speaks to his children, via the Spirit.......our Faith is Alive it’s not dead....

Spirit gives birth to spirit.....

I hope God gives you revelation...that his Spirit is Alive in His children....he testifies that to our spirit every day..that we are his children......via his Spirit.