The Key to Discipleship

[Ritajanice]

This is a small commentary I found, couldn’t have said it better myself.

My words....being a disciple for God is all about him and his Spirit, In other words heart knowledge, not intellectual head knowledge, which imo, I see on this thread.
Head knowledge will never get you into the Kingdom Of God, we need heart knowledge from God ,which of course is then relayed to our mind....and before you can receive any of that, we must be Born Again, “ Spirit gives birth to spirit “...just like flesh gives birth to flesh...

Only Spirit gives birth to spirit....is the supernatural,Living , spiritual rebirth, Gods word, which is Alive and Active....
Commentary....

The high calling of God is not just an ordinary call but a special call from Heaven. It requires going beyond what may be considered acceptable and into a life of total surrender to the will of God. You must be willing to suffer, to endure all things and to pay any price for Christ's name's sake.

This commentary I agree with 100%.....

 

[Behold]

The cross is about so much more than forgiveness of sins,

He said that "The cross is NOT ABOUT Forgiveness of Sins".


So, That's a Cross Denying Lie, that Offends Jesus, God, and The Holy Spirit.

But it pleases the Devil that a "christian" would teach that on a "christian" forum.


Try not to believe their Lie , @David H.

 

[amigo de christo]

And if any man have not the spirit, he is none of His........wrote the apostle by that same Spirit.

Jesus said in John 3 "Ye MUST be born again." "Except ye be born again you cannot see the Kingdom of God." "Except ye be born again of water and of the spirit you cannot enter the kingdom of God."

Reading further in that same chapter John 3…..some are fond of quoting v. 17 to make a case that the whole world will be saved after death, while they ignore the very next verse 18……Jesus doesn’t need to condemn anyone because if they believe not on Him they are condemned already.

Jhn 3:17-19

For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.


Jhn 3:36

He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.



Being born of the spirit by faith and belief in Christ is the rule, and I don’t see how that can be disputed when Jesus Himself said it so clearly.



But IF the Lord sometimes makes exceptions to this rule, then I’m open to considering that IF it can be shown in scripture, which so far nobody seems willing or able to show by the word of God in a coherent way. We are supposed to search the SCRIPTURES to see if anything be so, aren’t we? I’m not afraid of the word of God - if it’s true I want it, and if it isn’t true I don’t want it, simple as that – I have no vested interest.

(And IF the Lord makes exceptions to this rule, then seems to me the exception surely shouldn’t be taught as a rule, because that would be misleading and dangerous doctrine.)

I would also like to learn whether or not there is a difference between the spirit being saved and the soul being saved, because I wonder if possibly that might speak to some of this…? I have no problem with looking into that as well. Like where it says to “hand that one over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh that his spirit might be saved”….? Does that mean as opposed to his soul being saved? (since soul and spirit are two different words in the Greek.)

Anyway, these are questions I'm bringing to the Lord.

Jesus made it very clear . thus we shall stick to the simple message .

 

[Behold]

"So, @APAK, when you tell Wynona that you agree that "The cross is not about forgiveness of sin", and you just agreed, then you just became the same as the one who said it."


It is about the forgiveness of sin Behold. I never said the contrary.

Well, you said that "we" are both right..

He posted that "The Cross is not about Forgiveness"...

So, that OFFENDS Jesus who died on it for your SIN so that your sin can be forgiven,,

I guess you are not use to hearing Blasphemy.
I am.

So, i appreciate that you would realize what you've done and come and talk to me about it.
Your attempt at "damage control" is a bit too late, however.

What you should do, is just post your posts that are trying to deny the Trinity.
Just stick with that redundant obsession that you like to post on every forum you are found on, posting.
Ok?
Am i coming through, clearly?
I like to be really clear..

Listen, you are out of your depth on this Thread, regarding what im revealing about that person...., ... So, , trying to sound as if you know what you are talking about has failed again. @APAK

 

[amigo de christo]

And if any man have not the spirit, he is none of His........wrote the apostle by that same Spirit.

Jesus said in John 3 "Ye MUST be born again." "Except ye be born again you cannot see the Kingdom of God." "Except ye be born again of water and of the spirit you cannot enter the kingdom of God."

Reading further in that same chapter John 3…..some are fond of quoting v. 17 to make a case that the whole world will be saved after death, while they ignore the very next verse 18……Jesus doesn’t need to condemn anyone because if they believe not on Him they are condemned already.

Jhn 3:17-19

For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.


Jhn 3:36

He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.



Being born of the spirit by faith and belief in Christ is the rule, and I don’t see how that can be disputed when Jesus Himself said it so clearly.



But IF the Lord sometimes makes exceptions to this rule, then I’m open to considering that IF it can be shown in scripture, which so far nobody seems willing or able to show by the word of God in a coherent way. We are supposed to search the SCRIPTURES to see if anything be so, aren’t we? I’m not afraid of the word of God - if it’s true I want it, and if it isn’t true I don’t want it, simple as that – I have no vested interest.

(And IF the Lord makes exceptions to this rule, then seems to me the exception surely shouldn’t be taught as a rule, because that would be misleading and dangerous doctrine.)

I would also like to learn whether or not there is a difference between the spirit being saved and the soul being saved, because I wonder if possibly that might speak to some of this…? I have no problem with looking into that as well. Like where it says to “hand that one over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh that his spirit might be saved”….? Does that mean as opposed to his soul being saved? (since soul and spirit are two different words in the Greek.)

Anyway, these are questions I'm bringing to the Lord.

If we examine what JESUS said and what he even called the unbelieving jews
if we examine how paul and others went about and also what they warned those who believed not
Then we know .
They went about making sure to say WHO would be saved and who would be condemned .
JESUS even told them to shake the dust off their feet as a testimony against those who had rejected .
The bottom line is condemnation , damnation awaits those who refused to believe on JESUS the CHRIST .
Now that is a hard line fact .
Our message must be the same . ETERNAL LIFE to those who DO BELIEVE , condmenation and wrath unto the soul
who rejects Christ Jesus .
It is not our duty to figure out what every detail of damanation . God will do as HE DO .
BUT the message remains FIRM . YE MUST BELIEVE , continue to the end ,
The apostels knew the TERROR OF GOD , aka HIS WRATH was and IS REAL .
And therefore knowing the TERROR of GOD they persauded men , YEAH TO BELIEVE ON JESUS THE CHRIST .
HE is who they pointed too . HE is who they all pointed too .
In these last days upon earth , we were warned that many would be given over unto fables
that by them the WAY of TRUTH would be evil spoken of ..
We were warned . No apostle , no not even CHRIST , ever went about trying to simply preach
another love and to find common ground . IT was BELIEVE ON JESUS the CHRIST or perish .
That was the message . And JESUS taught many things and thus we ought to teach all things HE did say and teach .
Yet many today only teach a part of what HE said while omtting the DIRE NEED TO BELIEVE ON HIM .
They go about teaching this love thy neighbor stuff , saying to love GOD etc
and yet GUESS WHO KEEPS GETTING DENIED . JESUS DOES , THUS GOD DOES .
We cant pick only certain parts and omit the others . Stephen and scores of others
were killed and had been also warned TO STOP PREACHING in that NAME . THEY DID NOT stop
BECAUSE THEY KNEW HE ALONE was the ONLY NAME that could save . They often did shake the dust
off their feet as a testimony against those who refused to believe .
And yes many of them spent nights n days in prison . and anytime one asked HOW may i be saved
THEY DIDNT PREACH COMMON GROUND and say HEY it dont matter what you beleive JUST DO GOOD .
NOPE it was BELIEVE YE ON JESUS CHRIST and then of course they would teach HIS teachings .
But they did not omit the DIRE NECESSITY TO BELIEVE ON HIM . yet many today DO just that .

 

[APAK]

Yeah we may differ here as well. I believe every believer is on the journey to sainthood, only a few are called So Someone who is in Spiritual infancy is still a brother and sister in Christ, even someone like @Behold who perpetuates this spiritual infancy by denying the high calling of God in Christ.... for me the saints become a part of God's end time army while the faithful are the bride, so my ultimate conclusion of the matter is eschatologically based.... There is no elitism when the choice of who becomes a saint is of God's choosing.

Actually I do not differ with that assessment of yours, in the way you presented it. And I may not, or most probably do not agree in whole from an Eschatological view on all matters. Even we may differ on if we are in the Kingdom today or in some future time. I believe we are as believers in the Kingdom today and many do not realize it. Paying attention to scripture and its context bears this out.

I believe though Epi has an extreme point of view regarding sainthood and the Bride concept, the infant and mature in Christ and especially WHAT that means. He speak as if he alone is a saint at times. And that he was a saint at one time because of his personal spiritual experience. He bases much of his thoughts on this experience. I'm not exaggerating in this matter. And I think this experience has skewed his view of the main elements regarding especially the gospel. Skewed elements I call such, as who is a saint, and only a few that meet Epi's criteria, when and how we are in the Kingdom, how we must go INTO Christ to be in the Kingdom according to him. Who is carnal and part of the apostate church etc. And then there is the bias in the view of the nature of God and his Son. I'm a unitarian of the biblical type, and he is a Binitarian. You may be different again.

So, I will not overstate or minimize my view about this thread and others he has generated. They all have this personal doctrine intertwined in these threads.

I'm not usually an apologist on this grave and serious subject. I may see that in you, and that's ok with me. I still have open ears and learn.

And yes, there is no elitism regarding sainthood when only God can choose and not any man can dictate these rules to others.

 

[Ritajanice]

Jesus had to die on the cross, so that we can receive the forgiveness of sins from God, we must be Born Of The Spirit to be right with God/ forgiveness of our sins, .of course there is much more to it than that, being drawn to Jesus by God,etc,etc,...we receive his Spirit when we become Born Again, Spirit gives birth to spirit.....without the Spirit, he doesn’t recognise us , we are none of his, once you are Born Again you are then in Gods Spiritual realm...we have those spiritual eyes and ears, that will develop as we are led by the Spirit to understand the word of God.

Of course those who are still carnal in their thinking wouldn’t understand this.

 

[APAK]

Well, you said that "we" are both right..

He posted that "The Cross is not about Forgiveness"...

So, that OFFENDS Jesus who died on it for your SIN so that your sin can be forgiven,,

I guess you are not use to hearing Blasphemy.
I am.

So, i appreciate that you would realize what you've done and come and talk to me about it.
Your attempt at "damage control" is a bit too late, however.

What you should do, is just post your posts that are trying to deny the Trinity.
Just stick with that redundant obsession that you like to post on every forum you are found on, posting.
Ok?
Am i coming through, clearly?
I like to be really clear..

Listen, you are out of your depth on this Thread, regarding what im revealing about that person...., ... So, , trying to sound as if you know what you are talking about has failed again. @APAK

There was no damage control done by me Behold. I just told you the truth on the matter.as I see it

 

[Behold]

And yes, there is no elitism regarding sainthood when only God can choose and not any man can dictate these rules to others.

God does not choose who is a Saint.

A Saint is chosen by being "in Christ"

Who is that?

That is ALL the Born Again.

 

[Behold]

There was no damage control done by me Behold. I just told you the truth on the matter.as I see it

You agreed with the one who said that "The Cross is NOT ABOUT Forgiveness"..

You said.. "yes they are BOTH right'..

So, You still have not corrected yourself.

So, have thine on way. @APAK

Welcome to Freewill.

 

[amigo de christo]

lol...meant lots of love, sorry you took it the wrong way, and may I just say also,,,whatever I believe the “ Spirit “ places on my heart to say, it will be posted.

I can not deny the Living word of God, if he relays a message to my heart to be posted, .as I’m “ Born Again “...what I believe is from the Lord is always checked out with scripture......I’m also here to Glorify God and his resurrection power,....The Spirit of the one who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in believers,The power of God's Spirit is such that even the inevitable deaths of our bodies cannot deny the life of God's Spirit. God's Spirit will give life to our bodies in the same way as God's Spirit did to Christ's body.

Romans 8:11​

“But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.”



Anything you think I post is “ skewed” please challenge me on it and I will try and explain what I mean using scripture....

Ps...next time we interact instead of posting lol, I will post lots of love or xxx, so as not to be misunderstood.

A friendly reminder to us all .
On the day of the LORD the goats will be on the left hand and His sheep on the right
the goats had also said , BUT LORD didnt we do many good works in your name
But they were goats and workers of inquity who KNEW HIM NOT .
the sheep were born again .
GUESS who the sheep pointed too
was it , oh it dont really matter what one believes as long as they had love ..................
I TROW NOT .
DIDNT we do MANY GOOD WORKS ............
The goats did not point to the dire need to BELEIVE ON JESUS the CHRIST
the goats did not truly BELIEVE HIM when HE said Ye must believe .
The goats sought to attain it by their own merits under the guise of another love .
The goats did not the ONE WORK that was required for salvation , for to do the works of GOD .
THIS IS THE WORK of GOD , THAT YE BELIEVE IN HE WHO GOD DID SEND .
The born again KNOW THIS , for they have THE SPIRIT . and no man calleth JESUS accursed by the SPIRIT
THEY CALL HIM LORD BY THE SPIRIT . the born again KNOW THIS .
The true sheep KNOW HIM and HEED HIS VOICE . THE TRUE sheep will not believe nor allow a lie that cannot save
to be believed . the born again KNOW GOD IS LOVE and THIS IS LOVE , that YE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS .
And what are HIS commandments , TO BELIEVE , yeah , TO BELIEVE JESUS IS THE CHRIST and to love one another .
The goats omit and dont believe the BELEIVE PART , rather they just try and love one another , WHICH AINT LOVE EITHER .
because if you examine their version of love your neighbor as yourself
YOU WILL SEE IT ALLOWS SIN UPON ITS NEIGHBOR .
YE SHALL DIE IN YOUR SINS if YOU BELIEVE NOT that I AM HE .
It wont correct but rather will gather with false religoins .
And it wont correct certain sins either .
SOMETHING has went amiss my dear friend . But the sheep wont be heeding that voice . for the sheep HEED THE SHEPARD KING JESUS .

 

[APAK]

God does not choose who is a Saint.

A Saint is chosen by being "in Christ"

Who is that?

That is ALL the Born Again.

Same thing Behold if you seriously review the subject. God still is the ultimate decider.....he moved you to him did he not? And I do not want this to turn into a Calvinistic talk either, because it is not.

 

[Ritajanice]

Same thing Behold if you seriously review the subject. God still is the ultimate decider.....he moved you to him did he not? And I do not want this to turn into a Calvinistic talk either, because it is not.

Absolutely, I 100% agree on this.....he was the one (God )who drew me to Jesus,etc,etc, it was all of God and I will never take any credit for becoming Born Again.....Born Again by the will of God, I too won’t be arguing over this...

How can we draw our self to Jesus, Gods Spirit draws us to Jesus,100%.."..through his Living Spirit, Gods Spirit is Alive And Active...100%....

 

[APAK]

You agreed with the one who said that "The Cross is NOT ABOUT Forgiveness"..

You said.. "yes they are BOTH right'..

So, You still have not corrected yourself.

So, have thine on way. @APAK

Welcome to Freewill.

Epi is right from the atonement, the cleansing, holiness perspective that you neglected to mention, and he did not emphasize the sin part that compliments what you kinda said and I understand. I was trying to be kind here and you come off as being offensive in the matter...man..

Now enough of beating this dead horse into the ground.

 

[David H.]

He said that "The cross is NOT ABOUT Forgiveness of Sins".


So, That's a Cross Denying Lie, that Offends Jesus, God, and The Holy Spirit.

But it pleases the Devil that a "christian" would teach that on a "christian" forum.


Try not to believe their Lie , @David H.

He was making the point that the cross is more than just the forgiveness of sins. It’s about regeneration, making us holy to restore our communion with God. When it’s only about forgiveness of sins it is a crutch used to remain in sin. Like going to confession and saying the holy rosary… go to the cross in repentance and you will see this too.

 

[David H.]

Jesus made it very clear . thus we shall stick to the simple message .

What verse is that? Don’t remember that from the kjv

 

[Ritajanice]

He was making the point that the cross is more than just the forgiveness of sins. It’s about regeneration

I agree with this, whereas I said Born Again, which is the same thing as regeneration....so, both on the same page here.

 

[Behold]

Same thing Behold if you seriously review the subject. God still is the ultimate decider...

The Cross moved me to God.

No Cross = No Salvation.

So, what you are trying to say, is ... "why did you go to the Cross, behold".

A.) Jesus said..."if i be lifted up (on The CROSS)... I will DRAW ALL PEOPLE TO ME".


Do u understand " Draw"

Can you comprehend the word...>"ALL"

Read John 3:16 for the DEFINITION of ALL being Drawn.

That is the "conviction of the Holy Spirit, that is always Drawing everyone who is not born again ::::= to FAITH in Christ

How?

"Faith comes by HEARING" the GOSPEL.

What is the Gospel?

A.) THE CROSS OF CHRIST

What happened there?

Jesus forgave your SIN..

Epi said that didnt happen.

wake up....
you have to think.

 

[Ritajanice]

We must have the cross ,we must also be regenerated/ Born Again..".the forgiveness of sins comes from the Living Holy Spirit.....when we become Born Again, for that to happen Jesus had to die on the cross, so that we can receive his Spirit into our spirit/ heart.

 

[Behold]

He was making the point that the cross is more than

You need to stop trying to retranslate what he said.

Dont defend Cross denying Lies.

Understand?

See, if you say that The Cross is not about forgiveness of sin, then you just Denied the Cross and that blasphemes the Holy Spirit.

Dont do that, and do not follow anyone who does that.. @David H.

Listen little one..

Do not pick sides.
Do not be that shallow mentality.

Pick TRUTH instead...always.

Think on that.