Premillennialism contradicts scripture (1 Corinthians 15:50-54) by having mortal flesh and blood inheriting the kingdom of God when Jesus returns.

[Spiritual Israelite]

LOL. This is happening now. How many times do I need to say it? Your reading comprehension is as good as your theology. Start by reading the Scriptures and the commentary above one by one. This will help you. He is reigning on His Father's throne. His Father has given Him all authority in heaven and on earth. I have furnished you with multiple Scriptures that proves that.

Jesus promised the obedient Laodiceans of Asia Minor in Revelation 3:21, “To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame [speaking of His victorious life, death and resurrection], and am [present tense] set down with my Father in his throne.”

Here you have it! This is a current ongoing reality. There is no getting away from this. From this passage we explicitly see:

1 Peter 3:22 says, that Christ, “who is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God (now!!!); angels and authorities and powers being (currently!!!) made subject unto him.”

Because in Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily” He now is “the head of all principality and power" (Col 2:9-10).

You see, “by him all things consist” – that is “all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers” (Col 1:16-17).

Without a doubt, Christ is reigning over His enemies since the resurrection, waiting for their final predetermined put down.

Now:

1. Do you believe that Christ “is the head of all principality and power” (Colossians 2:10)?
2. When are “angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him,” (1 Peter 3:22 says) now or in the age to come?
3. When was/does Christ become ruler over the kings of the earth, now only or also in the future (Revelation 1:5)?
4. When does Christ reign? After His enemies are subdued or until His enemies are subdued (1 Corinthians 15:25-28)?
5. 1 Corinthians 15:25-28 and Ephesians 1:20-23 tells us that Christ “hath put (aorist active indicative) all things under his feet” and Hebrews 1:8 tells us that “thou hast put all things in subjection’ (aorist active indicative) under his feet.” How could anyone therefore deny He is sovereignly reigning now over His enemies now? How could anyone then relate this fulfilment to an alleged future age after the second coming?
6. When did/does Christ become the ruler of God’s creation (Revelation 3:14)?
7. Do you believe that Christ currently has “the keys (or authority) of hell and of death” (Revelation 1:18)?

@CadyandZoe Are these questions too difficult for you to answer? You can't even answer one of them? Why do you avoid answering so many of our questions? I can only assume it is because you know you that the answers to these questions disprove your false doctrine. So, it's not surprising that you would not want to answer them.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Yes, the 2 Witnesses will be testifying of Jesus the Messiah, and in the millennium, people will go up to Jerusalem to learn the ways of the LORD God. (Micah 4: 1 - 4)

Why would they need to go to Jerusalem to learn the ways of the LORD God when they can do so while at home wherever they are by reading the Bible?

 

[CadyandZoe]

You don't understand what it means for Jesus to reign. It has nothing to do with being a dictator and dictating what everyone does.

What is your scriptural basis for that?

Do you think He has no authority and no control over what is happening on the earth?

Look around. What do you see?

 

[WPM]

Have you counted them?

They have and do reject Jesus the Messiah. Do you disagree? You must be the only one inside or outside Israel that disagrees.

 

[CadyandZoe]

@CadyandZoe Are these questions too difficult for you to answer? You can't even answer one of them? Why do you avoid answering so many of our questions? I can only assume it is because you know you that the answers to these questions disprove your false doctrine. So, it's not surprising that you would not want to answer them.

As I said, answer my question first. Do you see a worldwide theocracy headed by Jesus Christ or not?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

So, when does God`s word say that King Jesus rules over His enemies?

`The LORD (Father) says to my Lord, "Sit at My right hand TILL I make your enemies your footstool.`

The LORD (Father) shall send the rod of your strength out of Zion. Rule in the midst of your enemies!` (Ps. 110: 1 & 2)

Has the Father brought the Lord`s enemies to His footstool yet?

He rules over His enemies at the right hand of the Father UNTIL all of His enemies have been made His footstool. You act as if it says He doesn't begin to rule until His enemies are made His footstool, but that is not what scripture teaches!

1 Corinthians 15:24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. 25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

This passage clearly says that He reigns UNTIL all enemies have been put under His feet, including the last enemy, which is death. At that point, He will deliver the kingdom He has been reigning over since His resurrection to the Father.

Ephesians 1:19 And what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power, 20 Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places, 21 Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come:
22 And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,

Can you see here how He reigns while at the right hand of His Father with "all things under his feet" while being "ar above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named"? Why do you act as if Him being at the right hand of the Father means He is not reigning yet? No, Him being at the right hand of His Father means He has all power in heaven and earth like the Father does (Matt 28:18) and it means He is reigning while at the right hand of the Father. To claim that He is not reigning now would be like saying He is not the head of all things in the church right now and I'm sure you would not try to claim that.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

As I said, answer my question first. Do you see a worldwide theocracy headed by Jesus Christ or not?

LOL. Yes, answer your question first after you avoid answering many of our questions. LOL. Get out of here with your nonsense.

 

[CadyandZoe]

Thank you for admitting that you are just intending to play games. And, yes, I will strongly consider not playing your game any longer. I would prefer to talk to serious adults.

As I say, this isn't my game, it is yours. You and WPM resort to insults and intimidation. You and WPM resort to baiting and gotcha questions. You and WPM, well, you know.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

You don`t get `second chances` however, as long as a person is alive they can turn to God. If they know of Jesus then they need to turn to Him.

Can you show me where the following passage indicates that some will get more opportunities to turn to God after Jesus comes?

2 Thessalonians 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, 8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: 9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; 10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

As I say, this isn't my game, it is yours. You and WPM resort to insults and intimidation. You and WPM resort to baiting and gotcha questions. You and WPM, well, you know.

I'm not playing games. I'm exposing your false doctrine. Your avoidance of answering questions says it all. You have formed a doctrine from cherry picked scriptures, but when we show the scriptures that your doctrine contradicts, you just ignore them or try to twist those scriptures.

 

[CadyandZoe]

This is another one of your strawman arguments.

Where in the New Testament does it say that nations were going to become theocracies?

Did I say that nations would turn into theocracies? No. I said that God would defeat Jesus' enemies and establish him as head over the entire Earth. God the Father will rule through God the Son and establish a theocracy.

Psalm 110:2 The Lord (God the Father) will stretch forth Your (God the Son) strong scepter from Zion, saying, “Rule in the midst of Your enemies.”​

Do we see that today? No. Until you grasp reality as it is, you won't be able to understand what you are reading.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

What is your scriptural basis for that?

Look around. What do you see?

LOL. You are a robot, just repeating the exact same things over and over again. I have shown my scriptural basis for what I believe to you MANY times and you still ask that question. LOL! We obviously have a very different understanding of what it means for Him to reign. You have somehow decided that if He allows bad things to happen it means He is not reigning. But, how can it be that He's not reigning if those things can only happen with His permission?

You said you don't think God wasn't reigning over the earth in Noah's day. Yes, He most certainly was. None of what happened then or any time before or since happens without His permission. Part of Him reigning is controlling things that He wants to control and part of it is allowing things that He wants to allow. He reigns the whole time.

 

[CadyandZoe]

I'm not playing games. I'm exposing your false doctrine.

You have yet to expose my doctrine because as soon as I prove my case, your rhetoric falls into the pit of insults.

Your avoidance of answering questions says it all.

I know. But what does it mean? You haven't got a clue.

You have formed a doctrine from cherry picked scriptures, but when we show the scriptures that your doctrine contradicts, you just ignore them or try to twist those scriptures.

On the contrary, you are accusing me of the very thing that you are doing. How many times do you think I pointed out your use of proof texts, single verses taken out of context?

I have read many of your posts where you discuss "spiritual" realities, but in fact, you mean "imaginary" realities. You say that Jesus is ruling on earth right now, but it's all in your head. And you are insulted when I point it out. Simply saying something is true doesn't make it true.

Didn't you read John's first epistle, where he places a high value on empirical evidence? His claims about Jesus are based on what he (John) saw with his eyes, heard with his ears, and personally witnessed.

If Jesus is ruling the earth right now, show me.

 

[WPM]

As I say, this isn't my game, it is yours. You and WPM resort to insults and intimidation. You and WPM resort to baiting and gotcha questions. You and WPM, well, you know.

This is delusional!

 

[CadyandZoe]

LOL. You are a robot, just repeating the exact same things over and over again.

I am persistent. Your insult is noted.

I have shown my scriptural basis for what I believe to you MANY times and you still ask that question.

Yes. I ask you to prove your interpretation is correct.

LOL! We obviously have a very different understanding of what it means for Him to reign.

Of course we do. In my view, when Jesus is ruling on earth, we will be able to see it, hear it, touch it, and witness it. In your view, you are allowed to pretend.

You have somehow decided that if He allows bad things to happen it means He is not reigning. But, how can it be that He's not reigning if those things can only happen with His permission?

Where is your evidence that he gave his permission? You make a lot of claims about reality that aren't real.

You said you don't think God wasn't reigning over the earth in Noah's day. Yes, He most certainly was.

No, he wasn't. Paul said he wasn't. Anyone who reads the book of Genesis can see that he wasn't ruling over anyone. If he was, then he had no excuse for destroying the world.

None of what happened then or any time before or since happens without His permission. Part of Him reigning is controlling things that He wants to control and part of it is allowing things that He wants to allow. He reigns the whole time.

Again, where is your proof that "allowing" evil is the same thing as ruling over it?

 

[CadyandZoe]

This is delusional!

Prove your accusation. Or are you so accustomed to insults that you are unable to control yourself?

 

[Davidpt]

Christ is king over all the earth. Can I remind you He reigns over His enemies now as sovereign king?

There are two aspects to the kingship of Christ. The first is the whole sphere of Christ’s providential rule over all creation. Revelation 1:5 reveals that Christ is the Sovereign archon or “Prince (or ruler) of the kings of the earth.” Christ currently rules over His enemies. The second aspect is the whole realm of Christ’s spiritual reign over all His new creation – the blood-bought Church. Revelation 15:3 tells us that He is the “King of saints.” It is only this second domain that is incorporated within the spiritual confines of the kingdom of God.

Isn't context important to Amils, such as yourself? Do you not see in Revelation that the kings of earth meant in Revelation 1:5 are not meaning the same kings of the earth meant in Revelation 6:15, Revelation 16:14, Revelation 17:2, Revelation 17:18, Revelation 18:3, Revelation 18:9, and Revelation 19:19? That they are only meaning the kings of the earth meant in Revelation 5:10 and Revelation 21:24?

You cannot apply this universally like you are attempting to do here---the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood

You would have us believe, the way you are interpreting Revelation 1:5 universally rather than in context, that the woman meant in Revelation 17:18 is meaning Christ?

Revelation 17:18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.


Can you not see what the text plainly says? The text says that the woman, not Christ, is the one that reigneth over the kings of the earth meant here. Except you want to contradict that and have us believe that Christ is the one that is reigning over the kings of the earth meant in Revelation 17:18. It can't be both. Either Christ is reigning over the kings of the earth meant in Revelation 17:18 or the woman is.

Who should we agree with? The text itself? Or someone that is contradicting the text by applying Revelation 1:5 universally rather than in context? Someone that can't even discern that the kings of the earth meant in Revelation 1:5 are not meaning the kings of the earth meant in Revelation 6:15, Revelation 16:14, Revelation 17:2, Revelation 17:18, Revelation 18:3, Revelation 18:9, and Revelation 19:19, but are meaning the kings of the earth meant in Revelation 5:10 and Revelation 21:24. IOW, there are two sets of the kings of the earth in Revelation, and that they are in opposition to each other, not the same kings of the earth instead. And that Christ rules over one set of kings of the earth while the woman rules over the other set of kings of the earth.

IOW, the following In Zechariah 14 which is also pertaining to the millennium, has not been fulfilled yet.

Zechariah 14:9 And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one

And that Revelation 17:18, for one, undeniably proves it, the fact the woman reigning over the kings of the earth presently does not presently equal the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Isn't context important to Amils, such as yourself? Do you not see in Revelation that the kings of earth meant in Revelation 1:5 are not meaning the same kings of the earth meant in Revelation 6:15, Revelation 16:14, Revelation 17:2, Revelation 17:18, Revelation 18:3, Revelation 18:9, and Revelation 19:19? That they are only meaning the kings of the earth meant in Revelation 5:10 and Revelation 21:24?

You cannot apply this universally like you are attempting to do here---the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood

You would have us believe, the way you are interpreting Revelation 1:5 universally rather than in context, that the woman meant in Revelation 17:18 is meaning Christ?

Revelation 17:18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.


Can you not see what the text plainly says? The text says that the woman, not Christ, is the one that reigneth over the kings of the earth meant here. Except you want to contradict that and have us believe that Christ is the one that is reigning over the kings of the earth meant in Revelation 17:18. It can't be both. Either Christ is reigning over the kings of the earth meant in Revelation 17:18 or the woman is.

Who should we agree with? The text itself? Or someone that is contradicting the text by applying Revelation 1:5 universally rather than in context? Someone that can't even discern that the kings of the earth meant in Revelation 1:5 are not meaning the kings of the earth meant in Revelation 6:15, Revelation 16:14, Revelation 17:2, Revelation 17:18, Revelation 18:3, Revelation 18:9, and Revelation 19:19, but are meaning the kings of the earth meant in Revelation 5:10 and Revelation 21:24. IOW, there are two sets of the kings of the earth in Revelation, and that they are in opposition to each other, not the same kings of the earth instead. And that Christ rules over one set of kings of the earth while the woman rules over the other set of kings of the earth.

You never look at the big picture. You only ever look at part of the story. Scripture teaches that Satan is the "god of this world" (lowercase "g" - 2 Corinthians 4:4), but does that mean God is not at the same time the God of this world (capital G)? I doubt you would claim that. Jesus and the woman, Babylon, rule over the same kings of the earth in different ways.

Name one king of the earth that Jesus does not have authority over and does not need permission from Jesus to do what he does?

 

[WPM]

Isn't context important to Amils, such as yourself? Do you not see in Revelation that the kings of earth meant in Revelation 1:5 are not meaning the same kings of the earth meant in Revelation 6:15, Revelation 16:14, Revelation 17:2, Revelation 17:18, Revelation 18:3, Revelation 18:9, and Revelation 19:19? That they are only meaning the kings of the earth meant in Revelation 5:10 and Revelation 21:24?

You cannot apply this universally like you are attempting to do here---the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood

You would have us believe, the way you are interpreting Revelation 1:5 universally rather than in context, that the woman meant in Revelation 17:18 is meaning Christ?

Revelation 17:18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.


Can you not see what the text plainly says? The text says that the woman, not Christ, is the one that reigneth over the kings of the earth meant here. Except you want to contradict that and have us believe that Christ is the one that is reigning over the kings of the earth meant in Revelation 17:18. It can't be both. Either Christ is reigning over the kings of the earth meant in Revelation 17:18 or the woman is.

Who should we agree with? The text itself? Or someone that is contradicting the text by applying Revelation 1:5 universally rather than in context? Someone that can't even discern that the kings of the earth meant in Revelation 1:5 are not meaning the kings of the earth meant in Revelation 6:15, Revelation 16:14, Revelation 17:2, Revelation 17:18, Revelation 18:3, Revelation 18:9, and Revelation 19:19, but are meaning the kings of the earth meant in Revelation 5:10 and Revelation 21:24. IOW, there are two sets of the kings of the earth in Revelation, and that they are in opposition to each other, not the same kings of the earth instead. And that Christ rules over one set of kings of the earth while the woman rules over the other set of kings of the earth.

IOW, the following In Zechariah 14 which is also pertaining to the millennium, has not been fulfilled yet.

Zechariah 14:9 And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one

And that Revelation 17:18, for one, undeniably proves it, the fact the woman reigning over the kings of the earth presently does not presently equal the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one.

This is more waffle from you. You need to hear yourself speak for once. The text is very clear in what it says. I refer you back to the post you are responding to.

 

[WPM]

Prove your accusation. Or are you so accustomed to insults that you are unable to control yourself?

Read your allegations again.