Is Church Discipline Applicable to us today?

[MatthewG]

Some assert that discipline should be enforced in cases of disobedience, even within religious communities. This raises an important question: Is God limited in capability, requiring human effort to carry out His will—as though the teachings of Jesus and the Apostles were insufficient for their time?

In today’s era, exclusion from spiritual fellowship can result from perceived nonconformity, with discipline often determined by internal leadership. Yet we have established societal institutions—law enforcement, judicial systems, supervisors—meant to address misconduct and hold individuals accountable.

Church communities are not exempt from serious moral and legal violations, including drug use, infidelity, and—in more disturbing instances—criminal behavior involving exploitation or abuse. These acts warrant legal attention, not just internal handling. Crimes must be reported to the appropriate authorities to ensure justice and protection.

However, there is sometimes a tendency within certain communities to contain these matters, dismiss them, or delay reporting in favor of internal resolution. This raises ethical concerns—especially when dissenting voices or theological disagreements result in exclusion from the group. Such responses not only suppress meaningful dialogue but may also prevent accountability.

Ultimately, the question remains: Should spiritual communities operate in isolation when serious matters arise, or should they work in tandem with legal and ethical standards to uphold justice?

 

[JohnDB]

Some assert that discipline should be enforced in cases of disobedience, even within religious communities. This raises an important question: Is God limited in capability, requiring human effort to carry out His will—as though the teachings of Jesus and the Apostles were insufficient for their time?

In today’s era, exclusion from spiritual fellowship can result from perceived nonconformity, with discipline often determined by internal leadership. Yet we have established societal institutions—law enforcement, judicial systems, supervisors—meant to address misconduct and hold individuals accountable.

Church communities are not exempt from serious moral and legal violations, including drug use, infidelity, and—in more disturbing instances—criminal behavior involving exploitation or abuse. These acts warrant legal attention, not just internal handling. Crimes must be reported to the appropriate authorities to ensure justice and protection.

However, there is sometimes a tendency within certain communities to contain these matters, dismiss them, or delay reporting in favor of internal resolution. This raises ethical concerns—especially when dissenting voices or theological disagreements result in exclusion from the group. Such responses not only suppress meaningful dialogue but may also prevent accountability.

Ultimately, the question remains: Should spiritual communities operate in isolation when serious matters arise, or should they work in tandem with legal and ethical standards to uphold justice?

If a married woman or man begins an tawdry affair with another married man or woman....and is public about it all....they gotta be expelled from the membership.

Not much choice in the matter.

If someone in the congregation begins promoting homosexuality, recreational narcotic use (including Marijuana) , unrestrained alcohol abuse, unrestrained gambling in casinos, sexism, racial prejudice, abortion, or pornography....again same thing.

They may attend services but membership is prohibited. Just the way things are.

Now if they repent of their sin....ok...allow them back in. But not in leadership.

That's the limit. That's what we got.

 

[MatthewG]

Thoughts of a religious zealot, concerning the death of homosexuals.

 

[MatthewG]

If a married woman or man begins an tawdry affair with another married man or woman....and is public about it all....they gotta be expelled from the membership.

Not much choice in the matter.

If someone in the congregation begins promoting homosexuality, recreational narcotic use (including Marijuana) , unrestrained alcohol abuse, unrestrained gambling in casinos, sexism, racial prejudice, abortion, or pornography....again same thing.

They may attend services but membership is prohibited. Just the way things are.

Now if they repent of their sin....ok...allow them back in. But not in leadership.

That's the limit. That's what we got.

Hello JohnDB,

Thank you for commenting and sharing what you think concerning Church Discipline.

Do you think that in the post I shared, with the religious zealot a good way to handle things?

 

[JohnDB]

I didn't watch the video....if I get time I might do it in a few hours.

But,
I see no need to be vicious or especially cruel to sinners no matter what type of sin they commit. God will execute justice and I believe his justice is very fitting every time.

I'm not law enforcement for man or God.
My concern is me and my household's behavior when it comes to sin. How men or women sin, behaving as mere beasts instead of as people, is not my concern.

 

[MatthewG]

Just sharing for anyone who may be interested. I watched this video last night, some of the wording can be a bit weird at times but over all I found it to be informative to some degree! Thank you.

 

[MatthewG]

I didn't watch the video....if I get time I might do it in a few hours.

But,
I see no need to be vicious or especially cruel to sinners no matter what type of sin they commit. God will execute justice and I believe his justice is very fitting every time.

I'm not law enforcement for man or God.
My concern is me and my household's behavior when it comes to sin. How men or women sin, behaving as mere beasts instead of as people, is not my concern.

Hello JohnDB,

I totally understand that. Since I do not go to church, I don't personally have to worry about Church Discipline in the first place.

What I do get, is that their are abuses that go on in the church itself, and there doesn't seem to be a pure,blameless,holy church on earth today.

Anyway, thank you for sharing some of your thoughts on the matter. It's definitely something I do not have to worry about, but when it comes to Parental guiding my encouragement is for people to be emotionally supportive, but allow for people to be themselves, of course I am not telling you that directly, I just know that if my child grown up and became Gay.

I couldn't wish death upon him... that is just really messed up. I have a nephew who is gay, but I hope the best for him in his life and believe that God loves him.

 

[Windmill Charge]

Is Church Discipline Applicable to us today?​

As Christians who follow the teachings of Christianity as found in the bible, we belong to a local church and are subject to the discipline of that church.

That does not mean we are not subject to the laws of the land nor that we are servants of the church leadership.
Rather that if are behaviour breaks the 10 commandments the church leaders can rebuke us, if we don't seek to change they can refuse permission to take communion and sack from any church possition and in extreme cases refuse admission to the church.

Where church leaders become aware of a members actions that break national laws they should report them to the relevent authorities.

A question one should ask of any church leader, when concidering joining that church is:-
A child reports that the ministers son has touched them inapropriatedly. How would the church leaders proceed?

There is only one answer. The matter is reported to the police, with the minister, his son and the parents of said child all going.

 

[Berean]

Ultimately, the question remains: Should spiritual communities operate in isolation when serious matters arise, or should they work in tandem with legal and ethical standards to uphold justice?

Matthew 18:15-18 is what the church uses as their guide to discipline members. However, such discipline has limits. By that I mean, if some violates church rules, teach doctrines not accepted by the church, then the church has the right to discipline them. If they are a member with responsibilities, then those responsibilities can be stripped.

If there is sin, as in the case of homosexuality, fornication and adultery. They can be removed as was the case in Corinth. Until they show some repentance. Authorities do not need to be involved.

However, if the sin(s) are more egregious, sexual abuse, child molestation, since we can't drag them out and stone them, we need to contact the authorities, as well as having this individual removed from the congregation.

 

[PS95]

Some assert that discipline should be enforced in cases of disobedience, even within religious communities. This raises an important question: Is God limited in capability, requiring human effort to carry out His will—as though the teachings of Jesus and the Apostles were insufficient for their time?

In today’s era, exclusion from spiritual fellowship can result from perceived nonconformity, with discipline often determined by internal leadership. Yet we have established societal institutions—law enforcement, judicial systems, supervisors—meant to address misconduct and hold individuals accountable.

Church communities are not exempt from serious moral and legal violations, including drug use, infidelity, and—in more disturbing instances—criminal behavior involving exploitation or abuse. These acts warrant legal attention, not just internal handling. Crimes must be reported to the appropriate authorities to ensure justice and protection.

However, there is sometimes a tendency within certain communities to contain these matters, dismiss them, or delay reporting in favor of internal resolution. This raises ethical concerns—especially when dissenting voices or theological disagreements result in exclusion from the group. Such responses not only suppress meaningful dialogue but may also prevent accountability.

Ultimately, the question remains: Should spiritual communities operate in isolation when serious matters arise, or should they work in tandem with legal and ethical standards to uphold justice?

Recently in a church I attend we had a woman who decided to leave her husband and three children, so she could marry another woman.
The church had multiple meetings with her, but she refused their counsel. She said she wanted to be happy and only by marrying her girlfriend would she be happy. She was asked to leave when she went through with her plan. I agree with that.
None of that should involve the authorities since gay marriage is legal.

As to whether the authorities should be called for a crime committed? We do have laws for that. We are to obey the laws of the land.
Child sexual abuse should be reported.

 

[Berean]

Recently in a church I attend we had a woman who decided to leave her husband and three children, so she could marry another woman.
The church had multiple meetings with her, but she refused their counsel. She said she wanted to be happy and only by marrying her girlfriend would she be happy. She was asked to leave when she went through with her plan. I agree with that.
None of that should involve the authorities since gay marriage is legal.

As to whether the authorities should be called for a crime committed? We do have laws for that. We are to obey the laws of the land.
Child sexual abuse should be reported.

In one of our sister congregations. There was a couple who left the area. 10 years later, the sister returned, married to another man and with a son. One of the members in the church began to question her, and as it turned out, she and her husband had divorced and eventually remarried other people. She told the brethren there that she didn't want to cause any problems, that she would sit in the back and just listen in, and during intermission, she would step outside. This didn't seem agreeable to some; they wanted to disfellowship her. They wanted her to divorce this man and return to her husband. I stated, "Two wrongs don't make a right, and where does forgiveness come in?"

I remember one weekend I was asked to serve the class, and during the intermission I jokingly said, "You know, it could get worse." I was asked how, I said, her husband could convert, then what do you do?" Well, that's exactly what happened. They eventually left the group and joined a sister group, which did nothing.

In the end, we all answer to the Lord, everything will be revealed.

 

[Prycejosh1987]

Uphold justice everytime. Gods justice comes in time, but discipline is important. Sadly alot of churches are carefree when it coems to misconduct, they play the forgiveness card. I think it is good to discipline the case and execute order.