Is it possible to lose salvation?

[GodsGrace]

The NT says that Mary is "blessed among women"....... not above them.

The MaryCult decided she was in charge of Helping Jesus, save souls........."co author of Salvation".
No Bible agrees with this, or even suggests it.
So, that is an outrageous demonic misrepresentation of a SINNER, who was MARY, who needed Salvation from Her Son, same as any other sinner.
Mary's Parents were sinners, and she came from THEM...........a part of the Adamic Line, so, she was born, "Adamic".
Now, the MaryCult could not allow that truth to exist, as it destroys the entire Mary Cult's reason to exist.
Therefore THEY created this false theology of "Marian"......that has her perpetually a virgin, a co-author of Salvation, and they even have her flying to heaven, in her dead body....and they call this "mary's acension"., and they celebrate this day, that was created in about 1950, by a Pope who decided it was a good idea to create a brand new lie regarding "the Virgin".

All of this is MARYCULT delusion, and they have deluded Billions of People with this man made religious Scam, that is nothing more then "Goddess Diana" worship, that became "MaryCult" church.

No Apostle in the NT, has anything to do with Mary......nothing., other then John who was told to see about her after Jesus died.
No Apostle prays to Mary.
They dont give Mary any authority......zero.

So all of Mary's preeminence, comes from The CULT of Mary. = A man made religious opera.





Then this Pope is a hell bound fool, as He owes His Life to JESUS.......if he has eternal life.
Mary can't save Him, and........ what kind of religious fool prays to a Plastic Statue of Mary?

A.) "The Cult of Mary"
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View attachment 67958

Nice posters!
Where do you get them?
check out her outfit!

Behold....
You really should stop.
You know you'd get banned for this on the heretical forum.

Degarding another's faith, even if you don't agree, is most unchristianly of you.

Luke 1:28
28And coming in, he said to her, “Greetings, favored one! The Lord is with you.”

That's the NASB...FAVORED ONE.
Sounds pretty serious.

Mary is THE FAVORED ONE.
God chose MARY to be the mother of HIS SON.

Let's give her the honor she so deserves.

Luke 1:42
“Blessed are you among women,

The correct translation is: YOU are blessed among women.
IOW,,,among all women...Mary is the most blessed.
Check it out.


Strong's 5487: Luke 1:28
riginal Word: χαριτόω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: charitoó
Pronunciation: khar-ee-TOH-o
Phonetic Spelling: (khar-ee-to'-o)
KJV: make accepted, be highly favoured
NASB: favored, freely bestowed
Word Origin: [from G5485 (χάρις - grace)]

1. to grace, i.e. indue with special honor

also see

no. 5485
Original Word: χάρις
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: charis
Pronunciation: khar'-ece
Phonetic Spelling: (khar'-ece)
KJV: acceptable, benefit, favour, gift, grace(-ious), joy, liberality, pleasure, thank(-s, -worthy)
NASB: grace, favor, thanks, credit, gracious work, thank, gracious
Word Origin: [from G5463 (χαίρω - rejoice)]

1. graciousness (as gratifying), of manner or act
2. (especially) the divine influence upon the heart, and its reflection in the life
3. (also) gratitude
{abstract or concrete, literal, figurative or spiritual}


FULL OF GRACE is not off the mark....

 

[BreadOfLife]

Stop being dishonest..... or people will think the MaryCult wants you to do it.

1 Peter 3:21​

21 ""The like FIGURE whereunto even baptism doth also now save us"""​

This is the type of beginner's blunder that happens when ignorant people rip verses OUT of their proper context.

Here is the verse in CONTEXT . . .
1 Pet. 3:18-22
For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive in the Spirit. 19 After being made alive,[d] he went and made proclamation to the imprisoned spirits— 20 to those who were disobedient long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water, 21 and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from the body but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God.[e] Ii (baptism) saves you by the resurrection of Jesus Christ, 22 who has gone into heaven and is at God’s right hand—with angels, authorities and powers in submission to him.

The water that Noah and his family were saved through symbolizes BAPTISM, which actually SAVE you now.
We are saved AT Baptism - THOUGH the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ.

This is Christianity 101 . . .

 

[Behold]

] Ii (baptism) saves you by the resurrection of Jesus Christ, 22

That is Spiritual Baptism.........not water baptism.

See, we are "Spiritually" born again.......so that is the "baptism"........its Spiritual.
How do you know?
Its because Its God's Holy SPIRIT that causes this new birth, that is to become "a new CREATiON".... "In Christ".

So, water is just water....and to be water baptized, is to symbolically (A Figure, as Peter teaches)......be risen with Christ.

 

[GodsGrace]

You're stuck on I dulgences as if that was the entirety of the looney little monks delusional rant. He opposed the selling of them. The looney little monk was properly calling for reform not reformation but the church leaders were stubborn. Luther was as well. What Luther ended up creating was millions of mini popes who all got to decide what scripture says.

The Little Monk.
You're funny.

Well, there are other problems with the CC.
I have often posted that the Reformation was necessary,,,
but it created a mess.

I think indulgences really bothered the Little Monk and also salvation by works.

The Early Fathers believed that we had to do good works.
But I do believe the church got a "bit" carried away with this idea.

As I said,,,,after Nicea...the church changed.

 

[nedsk]

Agreed.
It's not a sin.
It just seems to be less reverential.

I think using the altar would also be nice, instead of making a line...
like someone is giving out candy or something.

I also used to teach the catechism kids to wear proper clothing to Mass...
but the priest said I shouldn't insist too much -- it was enough that they were going to Mass.
Guess I'm too conservative for him!
I know him well. He's very pastoral, but lacks regarding the sacraments.
No one's perfect. He's retired now but still does Friday evening Mass.

I would like to see a return to the altar rail and kneeling. We have lost some of the reverence we once had for the mass but it seems to me that's a result of the warped way in which vatican 2 was rolled out.

I'd like to say I'm surprised to hear about a priest laking regarding the sacraments but I'm not. The newer guys are much more conservative especially the ones coming out of Poland and Africa.

 

[GodsGrace]

The NT says that Mary is "blessed among women"....... not above them.

The MaryCult decided she was in charge of Helping Jesus, save souls........."co author of Salvation".
No Bible agrees with this, or even suggests it.
So, that is an outrageous demonic misrepresentation of a SINNER, who was MARY, who needed Salvation from Her Son, same as any other sinner.
Mary's Parents were sinners, and she came from THEM...........a part of the Adamic Line, so, she was born, "Adamic".
Now, the MaryCult could not allow that truth to exist, as it destroys the entire Mary Cult's reason to exist.
Therefore THEY created this false theology of "Marian"......that has her perpetually a virgin, a co-author of Salvation, and they even have her flying to heaven, in her dead body....and they call this "mary's acension"., and they celebrate this day, that was created in about 1950, by a Pope who decided it was a good idea to create a brand new lie regarding "the Virgin".

All of this is MARYCULT delusion, and they have deluded Billions of People with this man made religious Scam, that is nothing more then "Goddess Diana" worship, that became "MaryCult" church.

No Apostle in the NT, has anything to do with Mary......nothing., other then John who was told to see about her after Jesus died.
No Apostle prays to Mary.
They dont give Mary any authority......zero.

So all of Mary's preeminence, comes from The CULT of Mary. = A man made religious opera.





Then this Pope is a hell bound fool, as He owes His Life to JESUS.......if he has eternal life.
Mary can't save Him, and........ what kind of religious fool prays to a Plastic Statue of Mary?

A.) "The Cult of Mary"
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View attachment 67958

You know Behold...I'm not Catholic in theology and dislike having to defend doctrine I may not even agree with...
however, you do post stuff that just makes no sense.

I'll reply to the above after dinner.

 

[GodsGrace]

I would like to see a return to the altar rail and kneeling. We have lost some of the reverence we once had for the mass but it seems to me that's a result of the warped way in which vatican 2 was filled out.

I'd like to say I'm surprised to hear about a priest laking regarding the sacraments but I'm not. The newer guys are much more conservative especially the ones coming out of Poland and Africa.

Agreed.

But I don't know if he's lacking....
he just likes to let everyone in and doesn't want to step on toes.

The church SHOULD STEP ON TOES!

 

[nedsk]

That is Spiritual Baptism.........not water baptism.

See, we are "Spiritually" born again.......so that is the "baptism"........its Spiritual.
How do you know?
Its because Its God's Holy SPIRIT that causes this new birth, that is to become "a new CREATiON".... "In Christ".

So, water is just water....and to be water baptized, is to symbolically (A Figure, as Peter teaches)......be risen with Christ.

And if you werent water baptized you have nothing

Tertullian
“Happy is our sacrament of water, in that, by washing away the sins of our early blindness, we are set free and admitted into eternal life. . . . [But] a viper of the [Gnostic] Cainite heresy, lately conversant in this quarter, has carried away a great number with her most venomous doctrine, making it her first aim to destroy baptism—which is quite in accordance with nature, for vipers and.asps . . . themselves generally do live in arid and waterless places. But we, little fishes after the example of our [Great] Fish, Jesus Christ, are born in water, nor have we safety in any other way than by permanently abiding in water. So that most monstrous creature, who had no right to teach even sound doctrine, knew full well how to kill the little fishes—by taking them away from the water!” (Baptism 1 [A.D. 203]).

“Without baptism, salvation is attainable by none” (ibid., 12).

“We have, indeed, a second [baptismal] font which is one with the former [water baptism]: namely, that of blood, of which the Lord says: ‘I am to be baptized with a baptism’ [Luke 12:50], when he had already been baptized. He had come through water and blood, as John wrote [1 John 5:6], so that he might be baptized with water and glorified with blood. . . . This is the baptism which replaces that of the fountain, when it has not been received, and restores it when it has been lost” (ibid., 16).

Look at the date. About 2,000 years prior to pope beholden showing up

 

[nedsk]

Agreed.

But I don't know if he's lacking....
he just likes to let everyone in and doesn't want to step on toes.

The church SHOULD STEP ON TOES!

Oh ok you used word lacking but I think it's lacking not to want to step on toes. It's hard to do but it's necessary. We all need it from time to time and if our spiritual leaders won't do it who will? The God loves you message is wonderful but people have confused that to mean God loves me no matter what you do. That's a horrible message and not what Jesus taught. That's why we have threads like this one.

 

[Behold]

You know Behold...I'm not Catholic in theology and dislike having to defend doctrine I may not even agree with...
however, you do post stuff that just makes no sense.

What i post about the MaryCult makes sense to Catholics and to Protestants who understand the CC's obession with Mary.

Here is what you might have missed.

All of the teachings that the MaryCult have as their Marian Theology, are NOT found in a New Testament.

Try to find in a NT, where Apostles prayed to Mary.
Try to find in a NT, where Apostles stated that Mary ascended to Heaven.
Try to find in a NT, where Apostles stated that Mary is a "co-author" of Salvation with Jesus.

See, none of this , and so much more of the Mary Theology that is Catholic Cult created, is not found in a Bible.

Now what is the Catholic Answer to this situation?

"well, we believe that the Bible is unfinished so, we add to it, according to our Traditions".
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[nedsk]

What i post about the MaryCult makes sense to Catholics and to Protestants who understand the CC's obession with Mary.

Here is what you might have missed.

All of the teachings that the MaryCult have as their Marian Theology, are NOT found in a New Testament.

Try to find in a NT, where Apostles prayed to Mary.
Try to find in a NT, where Apostles stated that Mary ascended to Heaven.
Try to find in a NT, where Apostles stated that Mary is a "co-author" of Salvation with Jesus.

See, none of this , and so much more of the Mary Theology that is Catholic Cult created, is not found in a Bible.

Now what is the Catholic Answer to this situation?

"well, we believe that the Bible is unfinished so, we add to it, according to our Traditions".
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View attachment 67963

Show us where osas is in the bible. Oh that's right it's not.

 

[nedsk]

The Little Monk.
You're funny.

Well, there are other problems with the CC.
I have often posted that the Reformation was necessary,,,
but it created a mess.

I think indulgences really bothered the Little Monk and also salvation by works.

The Early Fathers believed that we had to do good works.
But I do believe the church got a "bit" carried away with this idea.

As I said,,,,after Nicea...the church changed.

Slight correction....looney little monk

Indulgences were abused reform was necessary the reformation wasn't. As you properly noted it created a mess and I think even Luther realized it was a mess.

As to works properly understood it shouldn't create a problem for anyone. Works merely complete our faith. Scripture is clear that without doing good for others you have a dead faith. Works alone don't save anyone and only the works in the service of faith complete that faith to make that faith salvific. It's presumptuous for someone to think they're saved simple because they "believe". As James says even the demons believe.

 

[Marymog]

Don't wate yout time with this guy (Behold). He is an ignorant Catholic-hater of the FIRST degree.
He rejects ALL Scripture that dels with Water Baptism, the Eucharist, etc.

He makes up his OWN doctrines like every other Lone Ranger . . .

I have behold blocked and he/she is the only person I have blocked. I can't remember what the final straw was but he/she is a very confused person who, to the best of my memory, makes vile/disgusting comments. I sometimes wonder if he/she isn't and atheist (or worse) troll.

 

[BreadOfLife]

That is Spiritual Baptism.........not water baptism.

See, we are "Spiritually" born again.......so that is the "baptism"........its Spiritual.
How do you know?
Its because Its God's Holy SPIRIT that causes this new birth, that is to become "a new CREATiON".... "In Christ".

So, water is just water....and to be water baptized, is to symbolically (A Figure, as Peter teaches)......be risen with Christ.

No, my ignorant friend.

Peter says that the water of the FLOOD that they were saved through was the “SYMBOL”
It was the symbol that prefigured the REALITY of Baptism that save us.

Ummmm, this is why Jesus tells the Apostles the following:
Matt. 28:19
(YOU) Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit

The ONLY way a man can baptize another man is by pouring WATER over them, and proclaiming the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

Those are the instructions oof Jesus Christ . . .


LOVE that Biblical prophecy . . .
Ezek. 36:25-28
I will sprinkle clean water upon you, and you shall be clean from all your uncleanness from all your idols I will cleanse you. A new heart I will give you, and a new spirit I will put within you; and I will remove from your body the heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh. I will put my spirit within you, and make you follow my statutes and be careful to observe my ordinances. Then you shall live in the land that I gave to your ancestors; and you shall be my people, and I will be your God.

 

[GodsGrace]

I have behold blocked and he/she is the only person I have blocked. I can't remember what the final straw was but he/she is a very confused person who, to the best of my memory, makes vile/disgusting comments. I sometimes wonder if he/she isn't and atheist (or worse) troll.

@Behold is not an atheist and he's not a troll.
He happens to be a nice fella.
He's allowed to believe what he will regarding what the NT teaches...

However, he brings his hatred for the CC to the front all the time and he's very confused about what
the CC teaches.

I've had several convos with him through the years...
but, of course, it makes no difference.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

The dilemma is yours not mine. James doesn't say a man is justified by works. You really need to learn to read with comprehension. Try reading what james wrote again but instead of thinking like a robot use the brain God gave you and see if you can decipher what James actually said. If you need help let me know. I'll be right here.

The juvenile insults are tiresome. James said faith plus works. Paul says faith alone (not exact but that is the meaning) You choose faith plus works because of poor exegesis and hermeneutics.

 

[nedsk]

@Behold is not an atheist and he's not a troll.
He happens to be a nice fella.
He's allowed to believe what he will regarding what the NT teaches...

However, he brings his hatred for the CC to the front all the time and he's very confused about what
the CC teaches.

I've had several convos with him through the years...
but, of course, it makes no difference.

Therein lies the problem..as Fulton sheen said there aren't 100 people who hate the Catholic Church but millions who hate it for what they think it is. Beholden is one of the millions. I have little patience for people who are repeatedly told that something they believe is wrong but ignore that and continue believe in their error. It's willful ignorance at best and lying at worse.

 

[GodsGrace]

The NT says that Mary is "blessed among women"....... not above them.

Actually, the NT states that Mary is the most blessed among all women.
We're all blessed Behold.
If someone states that a person is blessed among all,,,
it means he's blessed the most.
It's a way of speaking...we in the West really miss a lot.

The MaryCult decided she was in charge of Helping Jesus, save souls........."co author of Salvation".
No Bible agrees with this, or even suggests it.

Mary participates in salvation because she's the mother of Jesus.
She is NOT the co-author of salvation.
The CC does NOT teach that Mary is a co-redemptrix...although some seem to believe this.
Jesus needs no help.

What it DOES teach is that Jesus can be discovered THROUGH Mary.
This could very well be since we each come to Jesus in a different way.
IOW,,,Mary brings one to Jesus...
She would not keep that person to herself.

So, that is an outrageous demonic misrepresentation of a SINNER, who was MARY, who needed Salvation from Her Son, same as any other sinner.
Mary's Parents were sinners, and she came from THEM...........a part of the Adamic Line, so, she was born, "Adamic".

I truly doubt that God would place His Son...free from the sin nature...
into the body of a human person riddled with the sin nature..
LET ALONE A SINNER.

Mary needed a Savior.
And a Savior she received...
God made her immaculate before she was even born.

How do you doubt this?
Can the creator of the universe not do as He pleases for His Son?
Why insist that SHE had to be a sinner because her parents were sinners?
Could God not do a miracle and make her sin free?

YOU are the one always stating how God could save anyone,,,
even sinners...

So why could He not decide to do the opposite and have Mary be born immaculate?

Speaking of Adamic...
Who is the person in Genesis 3.15?

Now, the MaryCult could not allow that truth to exist, as it destroys the entire Mary Cult's reason to exist.
Therefore THEY created this false theology of "Marian"......that has her perpetually a virgin, a co-author of Salvation, and they even have her flying to heaven, in her dead body....and they call this "mary's acension"., and they celebrate this day, that was created in about 1950, by a Pope who decided it was a good idea to create a brand new lie regarding "the Virgin".

The ascension may or may not be true...
it does not deny any other information we have about Mary.
She was not, BTW, the only person to be taken up alive.
Do you believe that Enoch was?
Due to his great faith, God took him to heaven withut dying.
Was Mary's faith not good enough for you?
She believed Gabriel.
She said YES to God's plan of salvation.

Why would you believe re Enoch and not re Mary?
Your hatred of the CC always shows itself...

You should learn to forgive any mistakes...as Jesus has taught.
These mistakes do NOT change the nature of God or pose any threat to a believer (as some wrong doctrine does).

All of this is MARYCULT delusion, and they have deluded Billions of People with this man made religious Scam, that is nothing more then "Goddess Diana" worship, that became "MaryCult" church.

The CC teaches the gospel just as Protestants do.
I've always said that Catholics give to much prominence to Mary
and Protestants do not give enough.

There is no "Marycult".

No Apostle in the NT, has anything to do with Mary......nothing., other then John who was told to see about her after Jesus died.
No Apostle prays to Mary.
They dont give Mary any authority......zero.

So all of Mary's preeminence, comes from The CULT of Mary. = A man made religious opera.

Absence of evidence
is not evidence of absence.

The NT is about Jesus...
it's not about Mary.

However, there are many writings about her.
She was respected and venerated and was even believed to have been perpetually virgin by some.

Then this Pope is a hell bound fool, as He owes His Life to JESUS.......if he has eternal life.
Mary can't save Him, and........ what kind of religious fool prays to a Plastic Statue of Mary?

A.) "The Cult of Mary"
-
-

Nobody prays to a plastic statue.
If some need a statue to concentrate their prayers, so be it.
God will not mind if some pray to HIS MOTHER.

You really should stop this nonsense.
The CC teaches that we should venerate Mary...
NOT worship her.

Learn to love the Mother of our Lord.

Luke 1:43
43“And how has it happened to me, that the mother of my Lord would come to me?

 

[nedsk]

The juvenile insults are tiresome. James said faith plus works. Paul says faith alone (not exact but that is the meaning) You choose faith plus works because of poor exegesis and hermeneutics.

Irrelevant. No James doesn't say faith plus works he says faith is completed by works. Not the same thing. You actually have the nerve to say poor exegesis and hermeneutics to me and write, "Paul says faith alone (not exact but that is the meaning)" I can't even fathom how nonsensical that is. That is YOUR meaning. Paul never says faith alone you can only read that into the text. I'm merely repeating what James put onto paper. You need a car better argument then this one. I had this terrible thing happen to me when I was a kid. I learned to read with comprehension.

 

[nedsk]

Actually, the NT states that Mary is the most blessed among all women.
We're all blessed Behold.
If someone states that a person is blessed among all,,,
it means he's blessed the most.
It's a way of speaking...we in the West really miss a lot.


Mary participates in salvation because she's the mother of Jesus.
She is NOT the co-author of salvation.
The CC does NOT teach that Mary is a co-redemptrix...although some seem to believe this.
Jesus needs no help.

What it DOES teach is that Jesus can be discovered THROUGH Mary.
This could very well be since we each come to Jesus in a different way.
IOW,,,Mary brings one to Jesus...
She would not keep that person to herself.

I truly doubt that God would place His Son...free from the sin nature...
into the body of a human person riddled with the sin nature..
LET ALONE A SINNER.

Mary needed a Savior.
And a Savior she received...
God made her immaculate before she was even born.

How do you doubt this?
Can the creator of the universe not do as He pleases for His Son?
Why insist that SHE had to be a sinner because her parents were sinners?
Could God not do a miracle and make her sin free?

YOU are the one always stating how God could save anyone,,,
even sinners...

So why could He not decide to do the opposite and have Mary be born immaculate?

Speaking of Adamic...
Who is the person in Genesis 3.15?



The ascension may or may not be true...
it does not deny any other information we have about Mary.
She was not, BTW, the only person to be taken up alive.
Do you believe that Enoch was?
Due to his great faith, God took him to heaven withut dying.
Was Mary's faith not good enough for you?
She believed Gabriel.
She said YES to God's plan of salvation.

Why would you believe re Enoch and not re Mary?
Your hatred of the CC always shows itself...

You should learn to forgive any mistakes...as Jesus has taught.
These mistakes do NOT change the nature of God or pose any threat to a believer (as some wrong doctrine does).


The CC teaches the gospel just as Protestants do.
I've always said that Catholics give to much prominence to Mary
and Protestants do not give enough.

There is no "Marycult".


Absence of evidence
is not evidence of absence.

The NT is about Jesus...
it's not about Mary.

However, there are many writings about her.
She was respected and venerated and was even believed to have been perpetually virgin by some.

Nobody prays to a plastic statue.
If some need a statue to concentrate their prayers, so be it.
God will not mind if some pray to HIS MOTHER.

You really should stop this nonsense.
The CC teaches that we should venerate Mary...
NOT worship her.

Learn to love the Mother of our Lord.

Luke 1:43
43“And how has it happened to me, that the mother of my Lord would come to me?

Well done