Is the "free gift" of salvation really free? - Honestly?

[Jack]

How ironic.
That's what they say about us.

I've always thought...
If they really want hell, we should give it to them. - LOL

[

Hell will be filled with people who don't believe in Hell!!!

Matthew 5:22 Whoever says, 'You fool!' shall be in danger of hell fire.

Jesus said so!

 

[Jack]

How do you respond if someone claims your view of hell is unbiblical?
I certainly get that complaint a lot.

Yeah, you have a big problem with Jesus!

Matthew 5:22 Whoever says, 'You fool!' shall be in danger of hell fire.

 

[pandaflower]

This is the evangelical bait-and-switch.
Where's the ethics in that? Should people be tricked into the kingdom?

Do we lead someone to Christ and then cut them loose? Nope.
They need to be discipled, right?

So we pile on the expectations.
- Daily Bible reading and prayer.
- Regular church attendance and tithing.
- Sharing the Gospel.
- Discipling others.
- Good works.

So much for a free gift.
It's a free gift... it will cost you everything.

To anyone who may be insulted by this post, consider this...
Jesus said to count the cost, to take up the cross daily and follow.

When we lead with the "free gift" of eternal life, are we being completely honest?
"Here's your free gift; goodbye; see you in heaven."

Or if someone isn't interested in our "free gift",
we warn them that eternal hell fire awaits those who refuse the "free gift".

What sort of "free gift" is that? (extortion)

Is it really free?
Well,Jesus had to suffer and die so to be the random paid for our fallen souls. And all we have to do after he calls into his grace that set the whole thing in motion is to believe.

So no,it wasn't exactly free. It was unimaginably excruciating. But,God thought we were worth it.
So,here we are.

 

[Jack]

Maybe we can pull stevie out of the fire!

 

[Aunty Jane]

Hell will be filled with people who don’t believe in Hell!!!

This is “Gehenna” which in Greek meant....“the place of the future punishment called "Gehenna" or "Gehenna of fire". This was originally the valley of Hinnom, south of Jerusalem, where the filth and dead animals of the city were cast out and burned; a fit symbol of the wicked and their future destruction.” (Strongs)

Please note that the future of the wicked is “destruction”.....Once something is destroyed, it is out of existence.....what was once in existence, is no longer.

Matt 25:46 speaks about the “sheep and the goats”....the sheep are granted everlasting life, but the “goats” are punished with “kolasis” which Strongs describes as ....

1. “correction, punishment, penalty”....(Strongs)

What is the opposite of everlasting life?....it’s everlasting death. The “second death” is not a correction, but a penalty or punishment that never ends. Those in Gehenna will never see life again.

Matthew 5:22

Those who accuse others of being “fools” will end up “destroyed”......you have to be alive eternally to suffer....the wicked are not alive, because only the righteous will live eternally. You have a conundrum. Your definition is fighting with actual Scripture. What kind of “fool” ignorantly argues with Scripture?

 

[Jack]

This is “Gehenna” which in Greek meant....“the place of the future punishment called "Gehenna" or "Gehenna of fire". This was originally the valley of Hinnom, south of Jerusalem, where the filth and dead animals of the city were cast out and burned; a fit symbol of the wicked and their future destruction.” (Strongs)

Please note that the future of the wicked is “destruction”.....Once something is destroyed, it is out of existence.....what was once in existence, is no longer.

Matt 25:46 speaks about the “sheep and the goats”....the sheep are granted everlasting life, but the “goats” are punished with “kolasis” which Strongs describes as ....

1. “correction, punishment, penalty”....(Strongs)

What is the opposite of everlasting life?....it’s everlasting death. The “second death” is not a correction, but a penalty or punishment that never ends. Those in Gehenna will never see life again.



Those who accuse others of being “fools” will end up “destroyed”......you have to be alive eternally to suffer....the wicked are not alive, because only the righteous will live eternally. You have a conundrum. Your definition is fighting with actual Scripture. What kind of “fool” ignorantly argues with Scripture?

Belief in Hell is not required for EVERLASTING residency!

From the JW bible: Rev 20 They will be tormented day and night FOREVER ...

Soon no more JW's!

 

[St. SteVen]

Is it really free?
Well,Jesus had to suffer and die so to be the random paid for our fallen souls. And all we have to do after he calls into his grace that set the whole thing in motion is to believe.

So no,it wasn't exactly free. It was unimaginably excruciating. But,God thought we were worth it.
So,here we are.

Right.
I think it is only free in the sense that it cannot be bought.
But who was confused on that point?

[

 

[pandaflower]

Right.
I think it is only free in the sense that it cannot be bought.
But who was confused on that point?

[

I'd say the confused ones are those who insist they have to labor,work,to stay saved.

 

[St. SteVen]

I'd say the confused ones are those who insist they have to labor,work,to stay saved.

Agree.
Reminded me of this.

Romans 4:4-5 NIV
Now to the one who works, wages are not credited as a gift but as an obligation.
5 However, to the one who does not work but trusts God who justifies the ungodly,
their faith is credited as righteousness.

[

 

[Jack]

Agree.
Reminded me of this.

Romans 4:4-5 NIV
Now to the one who works, wages are not credited as a gift but as an obligation.
5 However, to the one who does not work but trusts God who justifies the ungodly,
their faith is credited as righteousness.

Why do you quote the Bible if you don't believe it's God's Word???

 

[St. SteVen]

Is the "free gift" of salvation really free? - Honestly?​

This is the evangelical bait-and-switch.
Where's the ethics in that? Should people be tricked into the kingdom?

Do we lead someone to Christ and then cut them loose? Nope.
They need to be discipled, right?

So we pile on the expectations.
- Daily Bible reading and prayer.
- Regular church attendance and tithing.
- Sharing the Gospel.
- Discipling others.
- Good works.

So much for a free gift.
It's a free gift... it will cost you everything.

To anyone who may be insulted by this post, consider this...
Jesus said to count the cost, to take up the cross daily and follow.

When we lead with the "free gift" of eternal life, are we being completely honest?
"Here's your free gift; goodbye; see you in heaven."

Or if someone isn't interested in our "free gift",
we warn them that eternal hell fire awaits those who refuse the "free gift".

What sort of "free gift" is that? (extortion)

 

[Brakelite]

Is the "free gift" of salvation really free? - Honestly?​

This is the evangelical bait-and-switch.
Where's the ethics in that? Should people be tricked into the kingdom?

Do we lead someone to Christ and then cut them loose? Nope.
They need to be discipled, right?

So we pile on the expectations.
- Daily Bible reading and prayer.
- Regular church attendance and tithing.
- Sharing the Gospel.
- Discipling others.
- Good works.

So much for a free gift.
It's a free gift... it will cost you everything.

To anyone who may be insulted by this post, consider this...
Jesus said to count the cost, to take up the cross daily and follow.

When we lead with the "free gift" of eternal life, are we being completely honest?
"Here's your free gift; goodbye; see you in heaven."

Or if someone isn't interested in our "free gift",
we warn them that eternal hell fire awaits those who refuse the "free gift".

What sort of "free gift" is that? (extortion)

Being a gift does not mean that it comes without conditions. The first and foremost is to believe in Jesus. Faith. That does not mean to believe He exists. But to trust in Him implicitly every day of your life, and act on that faith. Then we exercise that faith by dying. Not physically, but mentally. Dying to sin and self. You hit on an important text. Taking up our cross and following Jesus. Following Him where? To the place of self sacrificial love.
“37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. 38 And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me. 39 He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it. ”
Matthew 10:37-39 KJV

Unfeigned Bible

Unfeigned Bible

www.unfeignedbible.app

Yep, eternal life is freely given, in the sense we cannot earn it, yet it costs us everything, inasmuch as we cannot receive or live in the kingdom in our current sinful state. We must change. Eternal life is conditional.

 

[St. SteVen]

Yep, eternal life is freely given, in the sense we cannot earn it, yet it costs us everything, inasmuch as we cannot receive or live in the kingdom in our current sinful state. We must change. Eternal life is conditional.

My whole point is about the way that we present Christ to unbelievers as a free gift.
It seems dishonest. Should they not count the cost?

 

[Brakelite]

My whole point is about the way that we present Christ to unbelievers as a free gift.
It seems dishonest. Should they not count the cost?

Later. The cost comes not from receiving Christ, but from walking as He walked.

 

[St. SteVen]

Later. The cost comes not from receiving Christ, but from walking as He walked.

Fair enough.
What is our responsibility on presenting salvation in Christ as a free gift?

 

[Lambano]

Is the "free gift" of salvation really free? - Honestly?​

TANSTAAFL = "There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch".

 

[St. SteVen]

Is the "free gift" of salvation really free? - Honestly?​

TANSTAAFL = "There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch".

If it sounds too good to be true...

 

[Lambano]

I think the "free gift" (Romans 5:15-16, Greek χάρισμα, "charisma") is the fact that God didn't have to give it and we didn't earn it.

Do we "earn" it later after we receive it? Most post-Reformation theology would say no, but I wouldn't vouch for that.

 

[Lambano]

After receiving the "free gift", do we change ourselves, do we cooperate with the Spirit to change ourselves, or does God change us unilaterally? Monergism or Synergism?

What if we don't change (or don't change much)?

 

[St. SteVen]

I think the "free gift" (Romans 5:15-16, Greek χάρισμα, "charisma") is the fact that God didn't have to give it and we didn't earn it.

Do we "earn" it later after we receive it? Most post-Reformation theology would say no, but I wouldn't vouch for that.

My understanding is that it is a free gift because we can't "purchase" it. (earn it in any way)