Nebuchadnezzar's Statue vs. Heads of the Beast - How Would You Link Them?

[ewq1938]

Now, as a matter of fact, the persecution by Nero began in November A.D. 64, and ended with his death in June A.D. 68, that is as nearly as possible three years and a half.

That is 43 months but the fire of 64 happened in the summer, and immediately Nero had Christians arrested and tortured so that was when the persecution happened which was well over 42 months so there is no match to Rev 13.

 

[HealthyShape]

That is 43 months but the fire of 64 happened in the summer, and immediately Nero had Christians arrested and tortured so that was when the persecution happened which was well over 42 months so there is no match to Rev 13.

The initial blame and some arrests began soon after, but major, widely recorded public and imperial-directed persecutions of Christians are best attested from late 64 into 65 and then episodically until Nero’s death in June A.D. 68.
Counting from November A.D. 64 to June A.D. 68 gives about 42–43 months, which matches “three and a half years” if you count 12‑month years or use 30‑day prophetic months.

Scholars note a difference between (a) the fire and local arrests/rumors in the summer of 64 and (b) the systematic, notorious public spectacles and executions (e.g., the circus, Nero’s theatrical punishments) that characterize the widely remembered “Neronian persecution,” which are concentrated in the months after and into the following years.

 

[ewq1938]

The initial blame and some arrests began soon after, but major, widely recorded public and imperial-directed persecutions of Christians are best attested from late 64 into 65

No, history records severe persecution starting right away so Nero could shift blame for the fire to Christians. It simply is no match to the 42 months of Rev 13.

 

[HealthyShape]

No, history records severe persecution starting right away so Nero could shift blame for the fire to Christians. It simply is no match to the 42 months of Rev 13.

Most reliable ancient and modern evidence indicates only limited arrests and local abuses began soon after the fire, while organized, empire-directed persecutions (and large-scale executions) are best documented for late 64 into 65.

• Tacitus — our chief contemporary source — says Nero blamed Christians and that “they were convicted, not so much of the crime of setting fire as of hatred against mankind,” describing scattered arrests, public executions, and brutal displays in Rome, but does not describe an immediate, empire-wide, systematic purge starting the night of the fire. Tacitus places the notable public spectacles in the months after the fire (late 64 into 65).
• Other near-contemporary sources (Suetonius, Cassius Dio—later but drawing on earlier material) likewise report Nero’s scapegoating and punishments, but describe punishments directed in Rome and enacted over a period rather than a sudden, large-scale campaign that began the instant the fire started.
• Archaeology and epigraphy show no clear contemporaneous record of an empire-wide roundup or massive legal campaign against Christians in 64. Provincial governors continued their usual business; legal reforms or imperial edicts targeting Christians en masse are not attested for that year.

So the pattern is local/urban repression in Rome beginning shortly after the July fire, with wider, more systematic measures and awareness across the empire developing over the subsequent months rather than an instantaneous, empire‑wide crackdown.

Source: AI

 

[ewq1938]

Most reliable ancient and modern evidence indicates only limited arrests and local abuses began soon after the fire, while organized, empire-directed persecutions (and large-scale executions) are best documented for late 64 into 65.

• Tacitus — our chief contemporary source — says Nero blamed Christians and that “they were convicted, not so much of the crime of setting fire as of hatred against mankind,” describing scattered arrests, public executions, and brutal displays in Rome, but does not describe an immediate, empire-wide, systematic purge starting the night of the fire. Tacitus places the notable public spectacles in the months after the fire (late 64 into 65).
• Other near-contemporary sources (Suetonius, Cassius Dio—later but drawing on earlier material) likewise report Nero’s scapegoating and punishments, but describe punishments directed in Rome and enacted over a period rather than a sudden, large-scale campaign that began the instant the fire started.
• Archaeology and epigraphy show no clear contemporaneous record of an empire-wide roundup or massive legal campaign against Christians in 64. Provincial governors continued their usual business; legal reforms or imperial edicts targeting Christians en masse are not attested for that year.

So the pattern is local/urban repression in Rome beginning shortly after the July fire, with wider, more systematic measures and awareness across the empire developing over the subsequent months rather than an instantaneous, empire‑wide crackdown.

Source: AI

The persecution happened before November making it far longer than 42 months. The GT has not started yet. Full Preterism is heresy.

 

[Wish-it]

In Daniel 7, we are told the 10 horns come out of the 4th beast kingdom and only then does the little horn come out after them.

If the 4th beast kingdom is pagan Rome, and the 10 horns represent a new symbol for the 10 toes in the 4th kingdom of iron in Daniel 2, then who do they represent?

If the 4th beast kingdom is indeed pagan Rome, and pagan Rome was slain (Daniel 7:11), and that time was 476 AD, then both the little horn and the 10 horns must have arrived on the scene before pagan Rome's demise.

Psalm 83 seems to list the 10 toes. But Rome is probably unrelated to the 4th Kingdom, look at the make up of the beasts all muslim nations. The same ones looking to knock Israel off the land.
Coincidence, unlikely.

 

[Wish-it]

Most reliable ancient and modern evidence indicates only limited arrests and local abuses began soon after the fire, while organized, empire-directed persecutions (and large-scale executions) are best documented for late 64 into 65.

• Tacitus — our chief contemporary source — says Nero blamed Christians and that “they were convicted, not so much of the crime of setting fire as of hatred against mankind,” describing scattered arrests, public executions, and brutal displays in Rome, but does not describe an immediate, empire-wide, systematic purge starting the night of the fire. Tacitus places the notable public spectacles in the months after the fire (late 64 into 65).
• Other near-contemporary sources (Suetonius, Cassius Dio—later but drawing on earlier material) likewise report Nero’s scapegoating and punishments, but describe punishments directed in Rome and enacted over a period rather than a sudden, large-scale campaign that began the instant the fire started.
• Archaeology and epigraphy show no clear contemporaneous record of an empire-wide roundup or massive legal campaign against Christians in 64. Provincial governors continued their usual business; legal reforms or imperial edicts targeting Christians en masse are not attested for that year.

So the pattern is local/urban repression in Rome beginning shortly after the July fire, with wider, more systematic measures and awareness across the empire developing over the subsequent months rather than an instantaneous, empire‑wide crackdown.

Source: AI

Also Ai:
The problem is Rome plays no role in the the pattern of scripture, which appears to be based on the family of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob?


You raise a valid point about the pattern in Scripture often centering on the family of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, and their role in God's redemptive plan. If we approach Daniel 2 with this lens, the identification of the fourth kingdom as Rome can indeed seem disconnected, as Rome lacks a direct covenantal tie to the lineage of Israel. Let’s explore this in light of the biblical pattern you’ve highlighted.In Daniel 2, the statue’s four kingdoms (gold, silver, bronze, iron/clay) are typically interpreted as a sequence of empires: Babylon, Medo-Persia, Greece, and a fourth kingdom. The traditional view, as I mentioned, identifies the fourth as Rome due to its historical dominance and the timing of its rule over Judea. However, your observation suggests the kingdoms might align more closely with the covenantal narrative tied to Abraham’s descendants or those directly interacting with Israel’s story.

 

[ewq1938]

Psalm 83 seems to list the 10 toes. But Rome is probably unrelated to the 4th Kingdom, look at the make up of the beasts all muslim nations.

No nation is named so not all muslim in fact no naming of any muslim nation.

 

[Wish-it]

No nation is named so not all muslim in fact no naming of any muslim nation.

Some are named with may represent future nations or groupings as suggested in Rev 17.12 ten kings who have not received a nation, and three of those future nations are named in Dan 11.41 Edom, Ammon and Moab. Two of these are area settled by Lots family. And one of the ten is Assyria, part of which has recently become a developing nation under a leader who was recently in Isiscand Al Queda. Notice the 10 heads in Rev 13,17 are now seven, after the three were subdued then delivered in Dan 7.24, Dan 11.41.

 

[CTK]

Wrong. It's the other way, that one must understand Rev in order to understand Daniel.

You continue to refuse to answer my question on chapter 7..... so, if Revelation is necessary to understand Daniel - which is backwards, tell me who are the 10 horns, the little horn, when did they arrive, who are the other enigmatic entities in Revelation - the 4 horsemen, the woman, the child and the dragon, who are the 144,000 and when do they arrive, who represents the 7 heads or the 7 mountains, who is the beast, who is the 8th in Revelation 17... I could go on and on ... so, if you understand who these entities are then you should have no problem bringing them straight back to Daniel. But that would be utterly impossible because they are first mentioned and identified in Daniel and will be carried forward to Revelation. And since you have no idea who they are in Daniel, you cannot possibly interpret Revelation. Do you really believe God planned on us understanding Daniel only after we interpreted Revelation?


You don't have to answer any of this because you still refuse and cannot answer the previous question I posed regarding who and when the 10 toes and the little horn came from and when....

 

[CTK]

Psalm 83 seems to list the 10 toes. But Rome is probably unrelated to the 4th Kingdom, look at the make up of the beasts all muslim nations. The same ones looking to knock Israel off the land.
Coincidence, unlikely.

Daniel or Revelation has absolutely nothing to do with the Muslim nation or current events found in today's newspapers. Once again, God gave us the identities and timing of the little horn, the 10 horns in Daniel. They are not end time events, however, He does tell us the little horn will CONTINUE UNTIL THE END - he does not arrive at the end. Read Psalm 83 - it has nothing to do with the 10 toes... it is a 10 member confederacy that is fighting agains Israel .... then.