Rapture ... soon?

[David in NJ]

Just this morning I was looking into this. I started talking about this on another forum. I almost forgot to come back to this thread.

So you must have seen the video too? The 21 day delay? Or did you get the 21 day delay idea yourself? The reason for the delay is complicated, it's hard to explain. Jesus can beat Satan in a fight now, but Satan has held some of the saints hostage. I think we're still waiting for some new babies being born, ones that would have been here already if they could have overturned Roe/Wade sooner.

But with this new deal, Joshua can still be right. It's like all the Fall Feasts are the same Feast event of 2025. That video where he shows we had two Feasts on the same day, on the day of a full moon. One Feast on the Julian date, the other on the Gregorian. And the both of them connected to the last day Feast, the 8th day feast, Shemini Atzeret.

The guy shows how two Feasts, on the two different calendars, both fell on the same full moon. I hesitate to post it. The way things are going now he might remove the video by this evening. But it does tie in with the 8th day, and a way old Joshua could still be right. A way where all the Feasts are happening, or connected together at once. In that way it did begin with the Feast of Trumpets. You can add a 21 day delay to the Gregorian Trumpets, and it counts to the last day Feast, the 8th day, Shemini Atzeret. And that's next Tuesday October 14.

In the new video he posits an explanation for Joshua's confusion. He quotes what Joshua said, claiming Jesus told him he would come for His church on the Feast of Trumpets. He's not going to get them, He will come at that time, He will embark on, or initiate, the expedition.

There's a bunch of detail. Joshua was not Moses. Only Moses would God speak to directly, face to face, without riddles. Anybody else just gets dreams and visions, and riddles. God is basically saying, unless it's Moses He's talking to, anyone else might be getting riddles to figure out. Joshua had enough trouble figuring out his cell phone. The video guy can explain it for anyone still following along.

"And he said, “Hear my words: If there is a prophet among you, I the Lord make myself known to him in a vision; I speak with him in a dream. Not so with my servant Moses. He is faithful in all my house. With him I speak mouth to mouth, clearly, and not in riddles, and he beholds the form of the Lord. - Numbers 12:6-8​

Maybe all Calendars belong to God. He made the space time continuum which makes that measurement required. Without time, the Creation of a physical universe, calendars would not be required. This new deal is not impossible, I'd give it a 35% chance of success.

Holy Spirit Prophecy: "No one will be pre-trib raptured in October 2025"

Holy Spirit Prophecy: "No one will be pre-trib raptured in the Year 2025"

God only speaks Truth = Matthew chapter 24 , 1 Thess 4:13-18 , 2nd Thess ch2

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Here we go! More nonsense. Just as I predicated. No humility. No integrity. No honesty. No repentance. No apologies. Just move the goal posts and keep perpetrating more false prophecies. More justifying of a false prophet. Typical Pretrib. Move the goal-posts every time your error is exposed as a lie. This is typical Cult behavior. Read the JWs and Mormons. Study all the false prophets in history. How are you and Joshua any different?

You have zero credibility now. Why would anyone listen you and those who are playing these religious games?

It wasn't my prediction so no apologies are necessary, just reporting first hand what ended up being wide spread news. You're the arrogant one with your flawed Amillennialist view.
I just moved the goalposts a few weeks and think
Jesus can easily kick that field goal. Trouble is, you're not even watching the game, you went to a different field and nothing is going on there ... just living your day to day uneventful life that you think will apparently continue on for quite some time. In that field you're watching the world from lies a disconnect between current events and the Prophetic Word.
Things happen for a reason. All these events going on especially in the Moddle East have meaning and purpose and are part of this priohetic puzzle that God has ordained. The last 77 years are filled with prophetic pieces of that puzzle. I guess yo momma never got you a puzzle to put together as a kid? Start with a small 6 piece puzzle and then work up to bigger ones ... you'll get eventually.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Holy Spirit Prophecy: "No one will be pre-trib raptured in October 2025"

Holy Spirit Prophecy: "No one will be pre-trib raptured in the Year 2025"

God only speaks Truth = Matthew chapter 24 , 1 Thess 4:13-18 , 2nd Thess ch2

You just claimed God spoke to you and said there will be no pre-trib rapture in October or in 2025. I don't believe you - you're a false prophet!

 

[HealthyShape]

That you do not sense His soon return may just mean you aren't ready and it may be that when He does come soon, you will be left behind?

Esoteric nonsense. Completely unbiblical.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

... whether you are rrrrrrrrrrrready or not rrrrrrrrready ...

Are you rrrrrrrealy sure about that? So you rrrrrrrejected the Prophecy, rrrrrrrreject my opinions - nnnnnno problem. I got that from you a llllllllong time ago.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Esoteric nonsense. Just stop it already.

No, it's my thread. Hey, let me give you a tip: If you all of sudden hear a load cruise ship horn sound, don't pay any attention to it, go back to sleep - probably just dreamt it or someone next door is watching the Love Boat on TV.

 

[HealthyShape]

No, it's my thread. Hey, let me give you a tip: If you all of sudden hear a load cruise ship horn sound, don't pay any attention to it, go back to sleep - probably just dreamt it or someone next door is watching the Love Boat on TV.

If you believe that the condition for being "raptured" was being physically awake or to "sense" it before, you do not read your Bible much.

What mattered was being ready.

Therefore stay awake, for you do not know on what day your Lord is coming. . . . You also must be ready, for the Son of Man is coming at an hour you do not expect.
Matthew 24:42-44

Jesus told His disciples, that because they did not know when He was to come, they were supposed to be always ready. For us today, the same applies for our hour of death of which we do not know.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

If you believe that the condition for being "raptured" was being physically awake or to "sense" it before, you do not read your Bible much.

What mattered was being ready.

Therefore stay awake, for you do not know on what day your Lord is coming. . . . You also must be ready, for the Son of Man is coming at an hour you do not expect.
Matthew 24:42-44

Jesus told His disciples, that because they did not know when He was to come, they were supposed to be always ready. For us today, the same applies for our hour of death of which we do not know.

That was tongue in cheek, playing along that since you seem to be spiritually asleep and ignoring signs, might as well ignor a loud unusual trumpet blast too. I doubt that you would.

 

[WPM]

It wasn't my prediction so no apologies are necessary, just reporting first hand what ended up being wide spread news. You're the arrogant one with your flawed Amillennialist view.
I just moved the goalposts a few weeks and think
Jesus can easily kick that field goal. Trouble is, you're not even watching the game, you went to a different field and nothing is going on there ... just living your day to day uneventful life that you think will apparently continue on for quite some time. In that field you're watching the world from lies a disconnect between current events and the Prophetic Word.
Things happen for a reason. All these events going on especially in the Moddle East have meaning and purpose and are part of this priohetic puzzle that God has ordained. The last 77 years are filled with prophetic pieces of that puzzle. I guess yo momma never got you a puzzle to put together as a kid? Start with a small 6 piece puzzle and then work up to bigger ones ... you'll get eventually.

You are in denial. You are promoting this false prophet and this circus. The whole thing is a joke and brings shame on the Gospel.

Your puzzle is faulty . It doesn't fit together.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Truth

Whoever teaches/preaches a pre-trib rapture is NOT abiding under the Holy Spirit.

pre-trib rapture does not exist in Scripture for it never came out of the mouth of God

pre-trib rapture is from the spirit anti-christ for it opposes Christ's Prophecy

LORD JESUS CHRIST says: “Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other

As I said and have been posting _ for years _ I am an adherent to the Mid-Trib/ Pre- Wrath view. Been saying the last trumpet is the Seventh ( Rev
11:15 for years. I am just open to the Pre-Trib view because many brilliant Pastors like John MacArthur, (who was one of my go to theologians for answers). My Pastor was Post-Trib. On every other subject I would agree with them, just not in this area.
The multitude seen in heaven by John were taken out of the Great Tribulation ( Rev. 7:9), which means they were in it or at least on earth during the "beginning of sorrows" ( Matt. 24). But the key here is the GT is not over yet, so they are taken out in the middle. The Book of Revelation is not chronological. If you can get that than maybe you'd see things differently.
"Immediately after those days" simply means the ones just discussed which were wars, rumors of wars, earthquakes, famines, pestilence, etc, which are the beginning of sorrows that we are experiencing now - but there is more to come. You see at that moment, immediately after thise days, He shows up and His WRATH COMES - MEANING MORE DAYS, MANY! But the beginning of sorrows is tribulation as we now see in Russia, the Middle East, but not extreme yet. We saw pestilence worldwide didn't we with Covid-19? Famines, earthquakes, etc., etc.
In Rev. 3, God promises to take the faithful out of the hour of trial, His wrath and judgment period.
The Bible states in 1 Thessalonians 5:9 that God has not appointed Christians to wrath, but to obtain salvation through Jesus Christ. This verse, along with 1 Thessalonians 1:10 and Romans 5:9, emphasizes that believers are saved from God's wrath by Jesus' sacrificial death and are destined to live with Him.
Key Verses:

• 1 Thessalonians 5:9 (KJV): "For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ".
• 1 Thessalonians 1:10 (KJV): "...and to wait for His Son from heaven, whom He raised from the dead—even Jesus, who delivers us from the wrath to come".
• Romans 5:9 (NIV): "Since we have now been justified by his blood, how much more surely will we be saved from God’s wrath through him!".

So, the wrath of God comes in the Seven Bowls at the sound of the Seventh Trumpet.
Still, with the timing which is difficult to understand because I do believe the Revelatiln is not all chronilogical, the prophetic mysteries still unsolved, and that Heaven is outside our time domain, it is possible for a Pre-Trib scenario if the trumpets were blown quickly up there, but down here the events related to them were manifest gradually, accumulate and overlap throughout the 3.5 year period.
I am open to being wrong about my view and would lean towards a Pre-Trib rather than a Post -Trib thank you very much.

 

[WPM]

As I said and have been posting _ for years _ I am an adherent to the Mid-Trib/ Pre- Wrath view. Been saying the last trumpet is the Seventh ( Rev
11:15 for years. I am just open to the Pre-Trib view because many brilliant Pastors like John MacArthur, (who was one of my go to theologians for answers). My Pastor was Post-Trib. On every other subject I would agree with them, just not in this area.
The multitude seen in heaven by John were taken out of the Great Tribulation ( Rev. 7:9), which means they were in it or at least on earth during the "beginning of sorrows" ( Matt. 24). But the key here is the GT is not over yet, so they are taken out in the middle. The Book of Revelation is nit chronological. If you can get that than maybe you'd see things differently.
"Immediately after those days" simply means the ones discussed which were wars, rumors of wars, earthquakes, famines, pestilence, etc, which are the beginning if sorrows that we are experiencing now. But is it not extreme yet. In Rev. 3, God promises to take the faithful out of the hour of trial, His wrath and judgment period.
The Bible states in 1 Thessalonians 5:9 that God has not appointed Christians to wrath, but to obtain salvation through Jesus Christ. This verse, along with 1 Thessalonians 1:10 and Romans 5:9, emphasizes that believers are saved from God's wrath by Jesus' sacrificial death and are destined to live with Him.
Key Verses:

• 1 Thessalonians 5:9 (KJV): "For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ".
• 1 Thessalonians 1:10 (KJV): "...and to wait for His Son from heaven, whom He raised from the dead—even Jesus, who delivers us from the wrath to come".
• Romans 5:9 (NIV): "Since we have now been justified by his blood, how much more surely will we be saved from God’s wrath through him!".

So, the wrath of God comes in the Seven Bowls at the sound of the Seventh Trumpet.
Still, with the timing which is difficult to understand because I do believe the Revelatiln is not all chronilogical, the prophetic mysteries still unsolved, and that Heaven is outside our time domain, it is possible for a Pre-Trib scenario if the trumpets were blown quickly up there, but down here the events related to them were manifest gradually, accumulate and overlap throughout the 3.5 year period.
I am open to being wrong about my view and would lean towards a Pre-Trib rather than a Post -Trib thank you very much.

Yes, that's the end. That is it.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

You are in denial. You are promoting this false prophet and this circus. The whole thing is a joke and brings shame on the Gospel.

Your puzzle is faulty . It doesn't fit together.

Joshua is not a prophet, didn't claim to be one, just claimed a vision and maybe he was deceived or confused about it. I wasn't sure so played along. You submitted your vote again and again - it's getting redundant. I'm just a reporter, a watcher ... it was news. Got everyone stirred up didn't it - ruffled your feathers. We look at articles all the time and choose which ones we want to read, believe in or discard. The Eschatology forum is just an opinion forum, since there is no confirmed definite view, we just toss ideas around, some stick and others we discard.
I discard all Amil views and would really prefer that all Amils would please go away, get off my thread, it's futile to converse with such a warped view of prophecy.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

First, you clearly do not understand who the spirit of Satan truly is — nor the meaning of the so-called “angels.” You’ve been indoctrinated by traditional church teachings that twisted Scripture into the belief that Satan and angels are “created celestial beings” from the beginning. That entire concept is built upon a false interpretation of passages like Ezekiel 28 (Lucifer) and others. I’m not going to open that subject here, but I will address your so-called “proof texts” involving Christ in the wilderness.

Mat 4:1
(1) Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.

The word you keep calling tempted is actually the word tested or tried. Jesus was NOT tempted to sin as you seem to imagine - - as if He had sinful desires, feelings, or wanted to sin. That alone would imply sin in His thought, which is impossible! You should know better. Christ NEVER desired sin, NEVER entertained it, and NEVER had a single thought toward it. Rather, He was tested by the devil, and yet remained completely without sin. In other words, He passed the test flawlessly — in thought, word, and deed. Look the word up yourself — it means tested or tried. That’s a major difference! As it is written:

Heb 4:15
For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities (tempted); but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

Christ was tried in all points as we are, but unlike us, He did not fail the test. Again, the word means tried or tested. It’s the same word used here:

Heb 11:17
By faith Abraham, when he was tried, offered up Isaac: and he that had received the promises offered up his only begotten son,

That word tried is the same word as tempted! But Abraham wasn’t tempted to sin — he was tested by God. Selah! Same word, same meaning. And you know perfectly well that no one can tempt God with sin — neither can Satan. Christ was tested, and He passed the test. Get it?!

Yet despite all this, you stubbornly cling to the notion that Jesus was having a literal one-on-one conversation with some “spirit being” called the Devil in the wilderness. That’s a shallow, carnal understanding of the passage. The account is not about some external spiritual creature whispering in Christ’s ear — just as the incident with Eve and the serpent was not what you’ve been taught to imagine!

Selah!

LOL. You actually expect me to take you seriously about this? You are delusional. Your beliefs are foolish. You are deceived. Satan would like nothing better than for people to not believe he exists. All the easier to deceive people that way.

Matthew 4:1 Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil. 2 And when he had fasted forty days and forty nights, he was afterward an hungred. 3 And when the tempter came to him, he said, If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread. 4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

So, if Jesus was not actually talking to an evil spirit being called "the devil" and "Satan" when He said to the devil: "It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God." as well as the other things He was recorded as saying around that time, you think He was just talking to no one? LOL. And when it says the devil came to Him and said "If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread", no one actually said that? LOL. Give me a break. Stop making things up in your imagination while making yourself look foolish.

So, I guess you think that Jesus was not actually talking to anyone when He said the things He was recorded as saying while in the desert?

 

[WPM]

Joshua is not a prophet, didn't claim to be one, just claimed a vision and maybe he was deceived or confused about it. I wasn't sure so played along. You submitted your vote again and again - it's getting redundant. I'm just a reporter, a watcher ... it was news. Got everyone stirred up didn't it - ruffled your feathers. We look at articles all the time and choose which ones we want to read, believe in or discard. The Eschatology forum is just an opinion forum, since there are no confirmed definite view, we just toss ideas around, some stick and others we discard.
I discard all Amil views and would really prefer that all Amils would please go away, get off my thread, it's futile to converse with such a warped view of prophecy.

You cannot wash your hands of this. You promoted this circus and are still doing so. This is classic Pretrib.

Also, you have no answer to Amil - none. You prefer these false prophets with their outlandish and unbiblical claims. That explains why you will not see it.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Being tested/tried by the tempter does not mean Christ was tempted to sin. The testing/trials are all to prove that Christ is indeed the Son of God, come in the flesh.

Do you deny that He was tested in the desert for 40 days and nights by a spirit being called "the devil" or "Satan" as TribulationSigns does? Do you think He was just talking to Himself in the desert rather than to an actual spirit being who was testing Him, as TribulationSigns thinks?

 

[WPM]

You just claimed God spoke to you and said there will be no pre-trib rapture in October or in 2025. I don't believe you - you're a false prophet!

Let us see who is the false prophet then. If i was you i would keep your mouth shut after this debacle. No humility. No integrity. No honesty. No repentance. No apologies.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Just this morning I was looking into this. I started talking about this on another forum. I almost forgot to come back to this thread.

So you must have seen the video too? The 21 day delay? Or did you get the 21 day delay idea yourself? The reason for the delay is complicated, it's hard to explain. Jesus can beat Satan in a fight now, but Satan has held some of the saints hostage. I think we're still waiting for some new babies being born, ones that would have been here already if they could have overturned Roe/Wade sooner.

But with this new deal, Joshua can still be right. It's like all the Fall Feasts are the same Feast event of 2025. That video where he shows we had two Feasts on the same day, on the day of a full moon. One Feast on the Julian date, the other on the Gregorian. And the both of them connected to the last day Feast, the 8th day feast, Shemini Atzeret.

The guy shows how two Feasts, on the two different calendars, both fell on the same full moon. I hesitate to post it. The way things are going now he might remove the video by this evening. But it does tie in with the 8th day, and a way old Joshua could still be right. A way where all the Feasts are happening, or connected together at once. In that way it did begin with the Feast of Trumpets. You can add a 21 day delay to the Gregorian Trumpets, and it counts to the last day Feast, the 8th day, Shemini Atzeret. And that's next Tuesday October 14.

In the new video he posits an explanation for Joshua's confusion. He quotes what Joshua said, claiming Jesus told him he would come for His church on the Feast of Trumpets. He's not going to get them, He will come at that time, He will embark on, or initiate, the expedition.

There's a bunch of detail. Joshua was not Moses. Only Moses would God speak to directly, face to face, without riddles. Anybody else just gets dreams and visions, and riddles. God is basically saying, unless it's Moses He's talking to, anyone else might be getting riddles to figure out. Joshua had enough trouble figuring out his cell phone. The video guy can explain it for anyone still following along.

"And he said, “Hear my words: If there is a prophet among you, I the Lord make myself known to him in a vision; I speak with him in a dream. Not so with my servant Moses. He is faithful in all my house. With him I speak mouth to mouth, clearly, and not in riddles, and he beholds the form of the Lord. - Numbers 12:6-8​

Maybe all Calendars belong to God. He made the space time continuum which makes that measurement required. Without time, the Creation of a physical universe, calendars would not be required. This new deal is not impossible, I'd give it a 35% chance of success.

You came back. Good, was thinking I was all along in a Amillennial/ Post- Trib nightmare. I will PM you. We can discuss this privately, no one else is interested.
And for me, this thread is finished.

 

[TribulationSigns]

You actually expect me to take you seriously about this?

No, I don’t expect you to take me seriously — only those enlightened by the Spirit of God will. Your tone and mockery simply confirm that truth.

Satan would like nothing better than for people to not believe he exists.

Satan does exist — but not as a single, created being roaming the universe. He is a spirit, the very spirit of disobedience that works within mankind. Scripture shows that he operates through the fallen nature of man — the same corrupt will that opposes God.

Satan is not omnipresent, so he cannot personally inhabit billions of people at once. Therefore, what is called “Satan” in each person is their own rebellious spirit — the nature inherited from Adam’s fall. It is not “one great red dragon” controlling everyone, but the collective manifestation of human depravity.

When people say, “The devil made me do it,” they reveal their misunderstanding. The real enemy is within — our own spirit of rebellion against God. Anything less than this truth contradicts Scripture itself. Selah.

So, I guess you think that Jesus was not actually talking to anyone when He said

According to Matthew 4:1–11, your conclusion stems from a flawed traditional doctrine — one that assumes a literal, personal conversation between Jesus and a supernatural being called “the devil.” The deeper question you overlook is what or who the devil actually is.

When you examine the original language, both “devil” (diabolos) and “Satan” (satanas) simply mean “accuser,” “adversary,” or “opposer.” In fact, Jesus called Peter “Satan” in Matthew 16:23 — not because Peter became a cosmic being or being possessed by spiritual being, but because his human spirit opposed God’s plan. That alone exposes the error of treating Satan as one distinct creature.

Satan is the spirit of opposition and disobedience that works within mankind — the very nature inherited from the fall of Adam. That’s why Scripture calls unbelievers “children of disobedience” (Ephesians 2:2). The temptation account in the wilderness teaches us how Christ overcame that spirit for our learning, not how He debated with a literal fallen angel.

Your mockery only reveals an unwillingness to go beyond surface-level tradition and examine Scripture with spiritual discernment. If you’re content with doctrines built on assumption rather than revelation, then there’s nothing further I can add. Selah.

 

[TribulationSigns]

Do you deny that He was tested in the desert for 40 days and nights by a spirit being called "the devil" or "Satan" as TribulationSigns does? Do you think He was just talking to Himself in the desert rather than to an actual spirit being who was testing Him, as TribulationSigns thinks?

Congratulation for agreeing with me that Christ was not "tempted to sin" but tested or trailed.

Do you know what the number 40 signifies in Scripture? Doesn't it represents a period of testing or trail? It specifically parallels the 40 years of Israel in the wilderness - - showing how Christ fulfilled what Israel failed! It is all spiritually discerned but you depends on a literal encounter when the spiritual meaning reveals something far deeper. It is the result of the lens of traditional theology due to inherited belief that Satan is a personal fallen angel named Lucifer so he must be a created being by God. Unfortunately this is how the natural mind reads Scripture, taking the narrative literally, while overlooking the spiritual truths behind the spirit of disobedience - a rebellious spirit of man!

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

No, I don’t expect you to take me seriously — only those enlightened by the Spirit of God will.

I am proof that is not true.

Your tone and mockery simply confirm that truth.

If tone and mockery determined that, does that mean all of the many times you mocked others beliefs confirmed their beliefs to be true?

Satan does exist — but not as a single, created being roaming the universe. He is a spirit, the very spirit of disobedience that works within mankind. Scripture shows that he operates through the fallen nature of man — the same corrupt will that opposes God.

So, you are saying you think that "the spirit of disobedience that works within mankind" was talking to Jesus in the desert for 40 days and nights? How does that work exactly?

Satan is not omnipresent, so he cannot personally inhabit billions of people at once.

LOL! Who made that claim? No one. Talk to me, not your straw man.

Therefore, what is called “Satan” in each person is their own rebellious spirit — the nature inherited from Adam’s fall. It is not “one great red dragon” controlling everyone, but the collective manifestation of human depravity.

That is not taught in scripture anywhere. You are just making things up in your imagination. The reality is that Satan and the other fallen angels try to take advantage of people's weak flesh to tempt them to rebel against God.

What do you think, that it was Job's own rebellious spirit that appeared in heaven before God and inquired about himself?

Job 1:6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them. 7 And the Lord said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the Lord, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it. 8 And the Lord said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? 9 Then Satan answered the Lord, and said, Doth Job fear God for nought? 10 Hast not thou made an hedge about him, and about his house, and about all that he hath on every side? thou hast blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land. 11 But put forth thine hand now, and touch all that he hath, and he will curse thee to thy face. 12 And the Lord said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the Lord.

How do you reconcile your understanding of Satan with this passage?

According to Matthew 4:1–11, your conclusion stems from a flawed traditional doctrine — one that assumes a literal, personal conversation between Jesus and a supernatural being called “the devil.” The deeper question you overlook is what or who the devil actually is.

When you examine the original language, both “devil” (diabolos) and “Satan” (satanas) simply mean “accuser,” “adversary,” or “opposer.” In fact, Jesus called Peter “Satan” in Matthew 16:23 — not because Peter became a cosmic being or being possessed by spiritual being, but because his human spirit opposed God’s plan. That alone exposes the error of treating Satan as one distinct creature.

Satan is the spirit of opposition and disobedience that works within mankind — the very nature inherited from the fall of Adam. That’s why Scripture calls unbelievers “children of disobedience” (Ephesians 2:2). The temptation account in the wilderness teaches us how Christ overcame that spirit for our learning, not how He debated with a literal fallen angel.

Your mockery only reveals an unwillingness to go beyond surface-level tradition and examine Scripture with spiritual discernment. If you’re content with doctrines built on assumption rather than revelation, then there’s nothing further I can add. Selah.

You didn't answer my question. Are you afraid to do so? Do you think Jesus was not actually talking to anyone in the desert for 40 days and nights when he was answering questions by referring to scripture?