Choice of doctrine is driven by religious preconception - Spirituality is an individualized journey

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Behold

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1. They will know we are His disciples by our love

Its a fact that the Devil knows the scriptures, and knows that one you posted about "love", and will use His people to quote it, to fool Christians,.

Also take note that a person can be a "disciple" and not be a real Christian.....as a Christian is much more then just a "disciple"..they are become a born again : SON-Daughter of God.

2. The ONLY exclusivity we are to know and preach is God's holiness

What you posted is absolutely not true. @Episkopos
And that is 'YOUR Doctrine"

Whereas...Paul's doctrine says that we are to Preach "Christ Crucified", and our Ministry is the "Ministry of Reconciliation"... 2 Corin 5:19.. where we deal with sinners about their Sin, and show them their Need of Forgiveness and Salvation that is the "Gift of Salvation".. = Who is JESUS THE LORD.

So once again @Episkopos , your "my doctrine" has no CROSS in it, and has no Forgiveness of Sin in it and states something that you personally believe is to be preached, while The NT does not teach this at all.
So will you now post something confused regarding "The Cross" just to try to do some damage control, again?

Your theology is incredibly false and unrelated to The real : Gospel , according to your POSTS, THREADS, and Videos.

3. Until we all come to the unity of the faith??

The "unity of the Faith" is simply :

1.) the correct understanding of "Justification by Faith"

2.) that is the "imputed righteousness of God"

3.) that is Given to every BELEIVER, as "the GIFT of Righteousness".

A.) Paul's Theology : Bible 101

You dont have this understanding at all @Episkopos ..., and that is why what you teach tries to destroy "unity of faith" whereever you post.
 
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Brakelite

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Quote...Choice of doctrine is driven by religious preconception -

That's a very generalised opinion.
Here's some more explicit opinions...

Seems that biblical understanding
has more to do with religious upbringing and
environment than the content of the Bible.

A person's Theology is strictly realated to who taught them last, and they believed it

The reason that they are ALL blown about by "cunning doctrines of men".......is because they never went to the Origianal NT Teacher who wrote all the Church Doctrine and gave us the Gospel.
They never went to Paul., and that is what always happens when you dont. You end up theologiclly confused, deceived, and want to share it.
What if the last person who taught them was Jesus?
When I returned to the Lord 30 years ago, it was He Who said, "seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness...". I've been doing that ever since, but very few here agree with me on what righteousness actually is, how it's to be expressed, and whose it is. The modern church is like ancient Israel. Going about trying to establish their own righteousness, but without faith. Faith in what you may ask. Faith in the scriptures. They simply do not believe God word.
 
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David in NJ

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Quote...Choice of doctrine is driven by religious preconception -

That's a very generalised opinion.
Here's some more explicit opinions...






What if the last person who taught them was Jesus?
When I returned to the Lord 30 years ago, it was He Who said, "seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness...". I've been doing that ever since, but very few here agree with me on what righteousness actually is, how it's to be expressed, and whose it is. The modern church is like ancient Israel. Going about trying to establish their own righteousness, but without faith. Faith in what you may ask. Faith in the scriptures. They simply do not believe God word.
How have you expressed your righteousness to God?
 

Behold

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What if the last person who taught them was Jesus?Š
If they are learning Paul's doctrine then that would be true. They are being taught by Jesus, as Paul's dcotrine came from Jesus.

When I returned to the Lord 30 years ago, it was He Who said, "seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness...

Your verse says to "seek the KOG and HIS Righteousness",

Notice how the verse joins the KOG and God's Righteousnes as one..

So, God's Righteousness, is "The Gift of Righteousness"......and we are to seek that.. .vs.. trying to do righteousness.

Reader, if you are trying to "do righteousness" then you are pitting yourself and your self effort against ""God's Righteouenss".
Paul teaches that if you are doing that, then you are """IGNORANT of God's Righteousess and you are trying to establish your own""""......and that is = SELF Righteousness, and God wont accept it.
So STOP !


The verse says.......to seek "HIS" Righteoueness.......and that is God's Righteousness, and the only way to seek that is to receive it as "THe Gift of Righteousness".

Most Christians are trying to DO Christianity, and in fact Christianity is God righteousness, given as a "Gift".
Its God's Grace........and we are so seek it.

Its to be received, by faith.

"the righteousness of faith"....or the 'imputed righteousness".........Paul teaches.. = Its a "GIFT".
 
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David in NJ

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If they are learning Paul's doctrine then that would be true. They are being taught by Jesus, as Paul's dcotrine came from Jesus.



Your verse says to "seek the KOG and HIs Righteousness",

Notice how the verse joins the KOG and God's Righteousnes as one..

So, God's Righteousness, is "The Gift of Righteouenss"......and we are to seek that.. .vs.. trying to do righteousness.

The verse says.......to seek "HIS" Righteoueness.......and that is God's Righteousness, and the only way to seek that is to receive it as "THe Gift of Righteousness".

Most Christians are trying to DO Christianity, and in fact Christianity is God righteousness, given as a "Gift".
Its God's Grace........and we are so seek it.

Its to be received, by faith.

"the righteousness of faith"....or the 'imputed righteousness".........Paul teaches. Its a "GIFT".
@Brakelite

CHRIST, "the sabbath breaker" also known as The LORD of the sabbath= is the Righteousness of God

But what things were gain to me, these I have counted loss for Christ. Yet indeed I also count all things loss for the excellence of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them as rubbish, that I may gain Christ and be found in Him, not having my own righteousness, which is from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which is from God by faith; Philippians 3:8
 
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Behold

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CHRIST, "the sabbath breaker" also known as The LORD of the sabbath= is the Righteousness of God

Jesus is Salvaiton.
Jesus is Eternal Life.
Jesus is Redemption
Jesus is the Blood Atonement
Jesus is the New Covenant
Jesus is THE Truth
Jesus is THE Resurrection
Jesus is God's Grace
Jesus is our Sanctification

So, when we read....>>"'Seek FIRST God's Righteousness"......the we seek all those by Faith. We receive all those by FAITH as they are... all...... = "THe Gift of Salvation"

This is why Paul tells us that when we have received God's Grace,, then we are "complete IN HIM">.. "In Christ" because Jesus is "made unto us"....God's Salvation.

Colossians 2:10 (KJV)

1 Corinthians 1:30 (KJV)
 
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David in NJ

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I have none but that which He has given.
Hey, no sad faces as we rejoice in:

JESUS our SAVIOUR
JESUS our Righteousness
JESUS our High Priest
JESUS our KING
JESUS our Deliverer from the wrath to come
JESUS who purchased with His Blood = the Baptism of the HOLY SPIRIT for us
JESUS our REST

SHALOM Brakelite
 

Brakelite

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Jesus is Salvaiton.
Jesus is Eternal Life.
Jesus is Redemption
Jesus is the Blood Atonement
Jesus is the New Covenant
Jesus is THE Truth
Jesus is THE Resurrection
Jesus is God's Grace
Jesus is our Sanctification

So, when we read....>>"'Seek FIRST God's Righteousness"......the we seek all those by Faith. We receive all those by FAITH as they are... all...... = "THe Gift of Salvation"

This is why Paul tells us that when we have received God's Grace,, then we are "complete IN HIM">.. "In Christ" because Jesus is "made unto us"....God's Salvation.

Colossians 2:10 (KJV)

1 Corinthians 1:30 (KJV)
I mentioned that I was returning to the. Lord, this after a few years in a backslidden state. I previously had attended a number of Pentecostal churches, mainly Assembly of God, but a couple of independent ones also, all told over a period of about 15 years. Whether it was my fault or the church's fault, I don't know, but I need to ask the Lord a question. "What is your righteousness that I must have?" I asked, because when the Lord spoke to me so clearly to seek His kingdom and His righteousness, I was well aware, being in a state of pitiful humiliating repentance, that I had no righteousness to offer: no excuses: no credit to claim: I knew that in me was no good thing, including any biblical or experiential idea of what righteous is, which left me to ask a that question.

Notwithstanding yours and David's determination to follow your preconceived agendas, that being the impossibility for a Seventh Day Adventist to understand the gospel, I don't hold much hope of your coming to any realistic acceptance of my testimony, nor of my search and understanding and the leading of the Lord in answering that question. I know what Christ's righteousness is. I know I have none of my own. I am a sinner saved by grace, and any good thing I do or practise is not only by His leading, but by His mercy and His grace and His power alone.

And @David in NJ You are possibly wondering at my sadness to your response. My sadness is not that you quoted scripture, but that you, a mere mortal, could presume to question and put in doubt the righteousness of Christ in accusing Him of disobeying one of His Father's commandments, for the sole purpose of justifying your arguments against those who love Jesus enough to obey His commandments.


“My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments are righteousness. ”
Psalms 119:172 KJV

And @Behold, you said,

Reader, if you are trying to "do righteousness" then you are pitting yourself and your self effort against ""God's Righteouenss".
Paul teaches that if you are doing that, then you are """IGNORANT of God's Righteousess and you are trying to establish your own"""".

Why are you trying to make this about earning God's gift of salvation? Who in this forum has ever tried to make out that our own obedience earns brownie points with God? Who has ever dared suggest that by doing any works of any kind produces salvation? That being said however, there is this...
James 1:22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.
23 For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass:
24 For he beholdeth himself, and goeth his way, and straightway forgetteth what manner of man he was.
25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.

Righteousness is holiness; likeness to God, and God is love. (1 John 4:16) It is conformity to the law of God, for "all Thy commandments are righteousness" Psalm 119:72, and "love is the fulfilling of the law". Rom 13:10
Righteousness is love, and love is the true light and life of God. The righteousness of God is embodied in Christ, and we receive righteousness by receiving Him.
Jesus speaking...."But seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness"....(Matt 6:33)

Yes, it is only faith, but to what purpose? Just so we can get to heaven and that's it? We have this wonderful gift of faith and exercise it for just our benefit, for our own selfish eternal ends? Jesus said we must seek the kingdom of God yes, and we ought always be grateful for the salvation/redemption through the shed blood that makes that possible, but Jesus said that we , in equal importance to the kingdom, seek also God's righteousness.
I think we ought to know what precisely God's righteousness is.

1 Cor 1:30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

Rom.5:17 For if by one man’s offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.

It is evident that the righteousness which comes to us as a free gift by faith is the righteousness of God....so again, what is the righteousness of God?

Psalm 119:172 ¶ My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments are righteousness.

The commandments of God are righteousness...not just in the abstract, but they are the righteousness of God.

Isa 51:6 Lift up your eyes to the heavens, and look upon the earth beneath: for the heavens shall vanish away like smoke, and the earth shall wax old like a garment, and they that dwell therein shall die in like manner: but my salvation shall be for ever, and my righteousness shall not be abolished.
7 Hearken unto me, ye that know righteousness, the people in whose heart is my law; fear ye not the reproach of men, neither be ye afraid of their reviling.

They who know righteousness are those in whose heart is God's law, thus the law of God is the righteousness of God. We can prove this another way....

All unrighteousness is sin....1 John 5:17 and whosoever commits sin transgresseth also the law, for sin is the transgression of the law 1 John 3:4

Sin is the transgression of the law, and it is also unrighteousness, therefore sin and unrighteousness are the same. So if unrighteousness is transgression against the law, surely righteousness must be obedience to the law. Now we need to know "what law"?

It is the law which says "thou shalt not covet". because Paul tells us that it was that law which convinced him of sin. (Romans 7:7.) The law of ten commandments then, is the measure of the righteousness of God. Since it is the law of God, and is righteousness, it must be the righteousness of God. In fact, there really is no other righteousness. It is a written manifestation of the character and nature of God. God is also love, and Paul tells us that love is the fulfilling of the law. Thus if we are to seek God's righteousness, then we are to seek obedience, through faith, to God's law, by love. Thus rather than doing away with the law, (how can it be possible to do away with God's righteousness?) through love we establish the law. All by faith. Not our righteousness, but God's.

So Solomon was perfectly correct and agreed with the text of Matt 6:33 when he said:
"Let us hear the conclusion to the whole matter: fear God and keep His commandments; for this is the whole duty of man. For God shall bring every work into judgement, with every secret thing, whether they be good, or whether they be evil." Eccl 12:13, 14.
 
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MatthewG

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I mentioned that I was returning to the. Lord, this after a few years in a backslidden state. I previously had attended a number of Pentecostal churches, mainly Assembly of God, but a couple of independent ones also, all told over a period of about 15 years. Whether it was my fault or the church's fault, I don't know, but I need to ask the Lord a question. "What is your righteousness that I must have?" I asked, because when the Lord spoke to me so clearly to seek His kingdom and His righteousness, I was well aware, being in a state of pitiful humiliating repentance, that I had no righteousness to offer: no excuses: no credit to claim: I knew that in me was no good thing, including any biblical or experiential idea of what righteous is, which left me to ask a that question.

Notwithstanding yours and David's determination to follow your preconceived agendas, that being the impossibility for a Seventh Day Adventist to understand the gospel, I dung hold much hope of your coming to any realistic acceptance of my testimony, not of my search and understanding and the leading off the Lord in answering that question. I know what Christ's righteousness is. I know I have none of my own. I am a sinner saved by grace, and any good thing I do or practise is not only by His leading, but by His mercy and His grace and His power alone.

And @David in NJ You are possibly wondering at my sadness to your response. My sadness is not that you quoted scripture, but that you, a mere mortal, could presume to question and put in doubt the righteousness of Christ in accusing Him of disobeying one of His Father's commandments, for the sole purpose of justifying your arguments against those who love Jesus enough to obey His commandments.


“My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments are righteousness. ”
Psalms 119:172 KJV

And @Behold, you said,



Why are you trying to make this about earning God's gift of salvation? Who in this forum has ever tried to make out that or own obedience earns brownie points with God? Who has ever dared suggest that by doing any works out any kind produces salvation? That being said however, there is this...
James 1:22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.
23 For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass:
24 For he beholdeth himself, and goeth his way, and straightway forgetteth what manner of man he was.
25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.

Righteousness is holiness; likeness to God, and God is love. (1 John 4:16) It is conformity to the law of God, for "all Thy commandments are righteousness" Psalm 119:72, and "love is the fulfilling of the law". Rom 13:10
Righteousness is love, and love is the true light and life of God. The righteousness of God is embodied in Christ, and we receive righteousness by receiving Him.
Jesus speaking...."But seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness"....(Matt 6:33)

Yes, it is only faith, but to what purpose? Just so we can get to heaven and that's it? We have this wonderful gift of faith and exercise it for just our benefit, for our own selfish eternal ends? Jesus said we must seek the kingdom of God yes, and we ought always be grateful for the salvation/redemption through the shed blood that makes that possible, but Jesus said that we , in equal importance to the kingdom, seek also God's righteousness.
I think we ought to know what precisely God's righteousness is.

1 Cor 1:30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

Rom.5:17 For if by one man’s offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.

It is evident that the righteousness which comes to us as a free gift by faith is the righteousness of God....so again, what is the righteousness of God?

Psalm 119:172 ¶ My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments are righteousness.

The commandments of God are righteousness...not just in the abstract, but they are the righteousness of God.

Isa 51:6 Lift up your eyes to the heavens, and look upon the earth beneath: for the heavens shall vanish away like smoke, and the earth shall wax old like a garment, and they that dwell therein shall die in like manner: but my salvation shall be for ever, and my righteousness shall not be abolished.
7 Hearken unto me, ye that know righteousness, the people in whose heart is my law; fear ye not the reproach of men, neither be ye afraid of their reviling.

They who know righteousness are those in whose heart is God's law, thus the law of God is the righteousness of God. We can prove this another way....

All unrighteousness is sin....1 John 5:17 and whosoever commits sin transgresseth also the law, for sin is the transgression of the law 1 John 3:4

Sin is the transgression of the law, and it is also unrighteousness, therefore sin and unrighteousness are the same. So if unrighteousness is transgression against the law, surely righteousness must be obedience to the law. Now we need to know "what law"?

It is the law which says "thou shalt not covet". because Paul tells us that it was that law which convinced him of sin. (Romans 7:7.) The law of ten commandments then, is the measure of the righteousness of God. Since it is the law of God, and is righteousness, it must be the righteousness of God. In fact, there really is no other righteousness. It is a written manifestation of the character and nature of God. God is also love, and Paul tells us that love is the fulfilling of the law. Thus if we are to seek God's righteousness, then we are to seek obedience, through faith, to God's law, by love. Thus rather than doing away with the law, (how can it be possible to do away with God's righteousness?) through love we establish the law. All by faith. Not our righteousness, but God's.

So Solomon was perfectly correct and agreed with the text of Matt 6:33 when he said:
"Let us hear the conclusion to the whole matter: fear God and keep His commandments; for this is the whole duty of man. For God shall bring every work into judgement, with every secret thing, whether they be good, or whether they be evil." Eccl 12:13, 14.
Cool testimony.

Jesus is the one whom comes through us that causes us to do heavenly fruitly produce which are given to others which encourage, support, sometimes it's reporting to authorities the actions of others which are for the benfit of others...

It's tough living in this world, and it's good to let the resurrected Lord Yeshua whom lives with in you come through and let God work on your heart and mind as you abide in Yeshua.

Praise be to God and his Son for having done what we could never do, mr.
 

David in NJ

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I mentioned that I was returning to the. Lord, this after a few years in a backslidden state. I previously had attended a number of Pentecostal churches, mainly Assembly of God, but a couple of independent ones also, all told over a period of about 15 years. Whether it was my fault or the church's fault, I don't know, but I need to ask the Lord a question. "What is your righteousness that I must have?" I asked, because when the Lord spoke to me so clearly to seek His kingdom and His righteousness, I was well aware, being in a state of pitiful humiliating repentance, that I had no righteousness to offer: no excuses: no credit to claim: I knew that in me was no good thing, including any biblical or experiential idea of what righteous is, which left me to ask a that question.

Notwithstanding yours and David's determination to follow your preconceived agendas, that being the impossibility for a Seventh Day Adventist to understand the gospel, I dung hold much hope of your coming to any realistic acceptance of my testimony, not of my search and understanding and the leading off the Lord in answering that question. I know what Christ's righteousness is. I know I have none of my own. I am a sinner saved by grace, and any good thing I do or practise is not only by His leading, but by His mercy and His grace and His power alone.

And @David in NJ You are possibly wondering at my sadness to your response. My sadness is not that you quoted scripture, but that you, a mere mortal, could presume to question and put in doubt the righteousness of Christ in accusing Him of disobeying one of His Father's commandments, for the sole purpose of justifying your arguments against those who love Jesus enough to obey His commandments.


“My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments are righteousness. ”
Psalms 119:172 KJV

And @Behold, you said,



Why are you trying to make this about earning God's gift of salvation? Who in this forum has ever tried to make out that or own obedience earns brownie points with God? Who has ever dared suggest that by doing any works out any kind produces salvation? That being said however, there is this...
James 1:22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.
23 For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass:
24 For he beholdeth himself, and goeth his way, and straightway forgetteth what manner of man he was.
25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.

Righteousness is holiness; likeness to God, and God is love. (1 John 4:16) It is conformity to the law of God, for "all Thy commandments are righteousness" Psalm 119:72, and "love is the fulfilling of the law". Rom 13:10
Righteousness is love, and love is the true light and life of God. The righteousness of God is embodied in Christ, and we receive righteousness by receiving Him.
Jesus speaking...."But seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness"....(Matt 6:33)

Yes, it is only faith, but to what purpose? Just so we can get to heaven and that's it? We have this wonderful gift of faith and exercise it for just our benefit, for our own selfish eternal ends? Jesus said we must seek the kingdom of God yes, and we ought always be grateful for the salvation/redemption through the shed blood that makes that possible, but Jesus said that we , in equal importance to the kingdom, seek also God's righteousness.
I think we ought to know what precisely God's righteousness is.

1 Cor 1:30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

Rom.5:17 For if by one man’s offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.

It is evident that the righteousness which comes to us as a free gift by faith is the righteousness of God....so again, what is the righteousness of God?

Psalm 119:172 ¶ My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments are righteousness.

The commandments of God are righteousness...not just in the abstract, but they are the righteousness of God.

Isa 51:6 Lift up your eyes to the heavens, and look upon the earth beneath: for the heavens shall vanish away like smoke, and the earth shall wax old like a garment, and they that dwell therein shall die in like manner: but my salvation shall be for ever, and my righteousness shall not be abolished.
7 Hearken unto me, ye that know righteousness, the people in whose heart is my law; fear ye not the reproach of men, neither be ye afraid of their reviling.

They who know righteousness are those in whose heart is God's law, thus the law of God is the righteousness of God. We can prove this another way....

All unrighteousness is sin....1 John 5:17 and whosoever commits sin transgresseth also the law, for sin is the transgression of the law 1 John 3:4

Sin is the transgression of the law, and it is also unrighteousness, therefore sin and unrighteousness are the same. So if unrighteousness is transgression against the law, surely righteousness must be obedience to the law. Now we need to know "what law"?

It is the law which says "thou shalt not covet". because Paul tells us that it was that law which convinced him of sin. (Romans 7:7.) The law of ten commandments then, is the measure of the righteousness of God. Since it is the law of God, and is righteousness, it must be the righteousness of God. In fact, there really is no other righteousness. It is a written manifestation of the character and nature of God. God is also love, and Paul tells us that love is the fulfilling of the law. Thus if we are to seek God's righteousness, then we are to seek obedience, through faith, to God's law, by love. Thus rather than doing away with the law, (how can it be possible to do away with God's righteousness?) through love we establish the law. All by faith. Not our righteousness, but God's.

So Solomon was perfectly correct and agreed with the text of Matt 6:33 when he said:
"Let us hear the conclusion to the whole matter: fear God and keep His commandments; for this is the whole duty of man. For God shall bring every work into judgement, with every secret thing, whether they be good, or whether they be evil." Eccl 12:13, 14.
Brakelite, i rejoice when i think of you.

Please get it out of your head that i am against you in any way EXCEPT for this:
you, a mere mortal, could presume to question and put in doubt the righteousness of Christ in accusing Him of disobeying one of His Father's commandments
Here is where you err, sda and yourself exalt a OT/Mosaic commandment above the LORD = not pleasing to God

The Lord Jesus Christ intentionally broke the sabbath because it was the Will of his FATHER to do so on that particular day.
This HE did, so that you may know = JESUS is LORD over the sabbath

When you know that in your heart, then you will increase in understanding of the complete Righteousness of Christ.
ALERT - Christ's Righteousness did not come from the Law, even though He fulfilled it when no one could!!!
 
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